French minister calls for calm after night of violence in Nantes

[webfact]

French minister calls for calm after night of violence in Nantes

 

French Justice Minister Nicole Belloubet attends the questions to the government session at the National Assembly in Paris, June 13, 2018. REUTERS/Benoit Tessier/Files

 

NANTES, France (Reuters) - The French government on Wednesday called for calm after police in the western city of Nantes clashed overnight with protestors rioting over the death of a young driver who had tried to avoid a checkpoint and was shot by an officer.

 

The young man, in his early 20s, hit a policeman as he reversed his car away from the control point, prompting another officer to open fire, wounding him fatally, according to a police source.

 

Protestors burned cars and threw Molotov cocktails at police, and smashed shops and set fire to several buildings across Nantes. The riots ended in the early hours of Wednesday after police sent in reinforcements.

 

"I'm appealing for absolute calm, as the rule of law will be completely respected," France's Justice Minister Nicole Belloubet told RTL radio on Wednesday.

 

Police authorities were investigating the officer's actions and decision to use his firearm, the police source said.

 

(Reporting by Guillaume Frouin and Emmanuel Jarry; Writing by Sarah White; Editing by Sudip Kar-Gupta)

 

-- © Copyright Reuters 2018-07-04

[sweatalot]

If true what is reported then it was ok to shoot

and the perps rioting - I doubt they are native french?

may be merkels's guests, grateful to be saved  from violence and welcomed in a peaceful country?

Edited July 4, 2018 by sweatalot

[than]

24 minutes ago, sweatalot said:

If true what is reported then it was ok to shoot

and the perps rioting - I doubt they are native french?

may be merkels's guests, grateful to be saved  from violence and welcomed in a peaceful country?

Riot take place in  working-class neighborhood of Nantes, rioters are french paper citizen from north Africa (born in France with foreign parent), nothing to see with German immigration problem.

The suspect was killed after refuse a police control and try to hurt policemen with his car, after warning, police direct fire to the suspect car and unfortunately kill the suspect. 

The suspect is a well know drug dealer in Nantes

[sweatalot]

14 minutes ago, than said:

Riot take place in  working-class neighborhood of Nantes, rioters are french paper citizen from north Africa (born in France with foreign parent), nothing to see with German immigration problem.

The suspect was killed after refuse a police control and try to hurt policemen with his car, after warning, police direct fire to the suspect car and unfortunately kill the suspect. 

The suspect is a well know drug dealer in Nantes

thank you for the details, I understand this has nothing to do with merkel's action.

But the rioters seem to be of the same origin, so merkel could have known what to expect

[Sir Dude]

Well, the EU paradise rears it's head huh. The cops were OK to do that if the account is correct. Same thing happens in a lots of Europe...criminal scumbag thinks he can do as he will, endangers people/police and disobeys the law and authorities and then all his fellow criminal scumbags protest violently breaking the law further because they feel they are entitled to protest about the sanctions for breaking the law and think they are being interfered with so they can't carry on with their nefarious BS as they see fit. Liberals then bleat like bitches because most don't want law and order, police are slammed for doing their job, compensation is thrown around, entitlement rises amongst the morons, situation gets worse...rinse & repeat. 

 

Surprised the usual section of society there hasn't started looting.

 

 

[Opl]

The 22-year-old killed Tuesday night during a police check in a district of Nantes was under a warrant of arrest issued in June 2017 . He was wanted for organized robbery, concealment and criminal conspiracy;

[Anythingleft?]

I am afraid the whole of liberal Europe has the very worst yet to come and it is of their own making....

Sent from my SM-N950F using Tapatalk

[Baerboxer]

This has happened many times before. Areas of European cities with large immigrant communities, established over one or more generations, seeing a poor area becoming lawless as the community supports local criminals and resists attempts to enforce the law of the land.

 

Pandering to their whims, as the liberals and do-gooders have done simply fuels their resolve. It encourages rather than discourages them.

 

France, UK, Germany, Sweden etc are all tolerant countries with mostly tolerant populations. That tolerance is coming back to bite them as those they welcomed and their offspring have little tolerance or regard for those who helped them.

[candide]

Thi guy was not an angel, for sure. But from what was reported in French media, it seems to be a case of excessive use of force. The guy was not armed or threatening and apparently, hit one policeman with his car while running back trying to escape but was not particularly trying to hit him.

The guy who shot also probably did not kill the young guy on purpose, as it seems things happen quite quickly and he reacted rather instinctively. It should be also noted that the members of this particular police body he belongs to, the CRS, are known for not being the smartest ones.

[Opl]

In summary: an offender known to police services using multiple identities, dozens more serious crimes ... still free tried to escape control,  whose death federated several neighborhoods and dozens of others rioters to break, destroy, set fire for a supposed revenge.

Rioters react as a distinct community with its special rules, the hatred of France and the state apparatus, regularly assault and target policemen, servicemen, firefighters... 

Dissident communities that do not recognize themselves as French in France and put into practice the customary tribal principles of "revenge and tribal justice" help to understand the huge problem posed by immigration when communities live apart, outside the national community and without any desire to integrate / assimilate to the Republic.

 

When asked to stop and decline one's Identity at a police check point, just do as told.  Other behavior must be considered as an act of aggression and the authors must assume the subsequent risks
 

Edited July 5, 2018 by Opl

[ivor bigun]

Thi guy was not an angel, for sure. But from what was reported in French media, it seems to be a case of excessive use of force. The guy was not armed or threatening and apparently, hit one policeman with his car while running back trying to escape but was not particularly trying to hit him.
The guy who shot also probably did not kill the young guy on purpose, as it seems things happen quite quickly and he reacted rather instinctively. It should be also noted that the members of this particular police body he belongs to, the CRS, are known for not being the smartest ones.

The one good outcome is that he was a bit of drug dealing scum and he wont be breaking the law again

Sent from my SM-A720F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[sirocco]

POST N°9

 

Of course, in France, it is customary not to stop when the police force orders you to do so.
It is true that in France, it is customary to rush in the crowds or on the public force.
It is true that in France, it is customary, while the police are threatened, to ask the poor little guy or woman:
1 / if he has a weapon (knife or revolver or kalachinkov) and if this weapon is true
2 / if he intends to use it.
If so, there is consultation between the police, otherwise, they refer to the Prefect who passes the info to the government that passes the information to King MACRON 1st who passes the info to the workers who make his pool etc. ....

In summary, in your opinion, backtracking, to escape a "justified" control, in a neighborhood where even firefighters are stoned while they help this population that has its own codes, its own customs, which forbids any foreigner, in particular, the police to enter it, it is normal.
Hey! yes, it is better to be killed, without retaliating, and leave, "AGAIN" a murderer in freedom.
As for the sensitive attention you have had for the CRS, you will be happy to see them defend you.
 

[candide]

21 minutes ago, sirocco said:

POST N°9

 

Of course, in France, it is customary not to stop when the police force orders you to do so.
It is true that in France, it is customary to rush in the crowds or on the public force.
It is true that in France, it is customary, while the police are threatened, to ask the poor little guy or woman:
1 / if he has a weapon (knife or revolver or kalachinkov) and if this weapon is true
2 / if he intends to use it.
If so, there is consultation between the police, otherwise, they refer to the Prefect who passes the info to the government that passes the information to King MACRON 1st who passes the info to the workers who make his pool etc. ....

In summary, in your opinion, backtracking, to escape a "justified" control, in a neighborhood where even firefighters are stoned while they help this population that has its own codes, its own customs, which forbids any foreigner, in particular, the police to enter it, it is normal.
Hey! yes, it is better to be killed, without retaliating, and leave, "AGAIN" a murderer in freedom.
As for the sensitive attention you have had for the CRS, you will be happy to see them defend you.
 

You can rant as much as you want, I merely exposed the facts as they were reported. Of course there is the restriction that further investigation may possibly contradict (or not) what is exposed in French media. If what was reported is true, there is excessive use of force according to the usual definition of the term. According to the law, and also internal police regulation, you don't kill someone who is merely trying to escape unless he is a dangerous criminal or dangerous threat (i.e. he is a terrorist, madman, or has killed someone). It is not "my opinion" that defines what is excessive use of force or not. If further investigation shows that the guy actually acted in a threatening way, then the assumption of excessive use of force drops, of course.

 

As for the shooter concerned, my comment was not particularly incriminating as I perfectly understand that anyone, when confronted with an emergency situation, may not always react in the best possible way.

[nahkit]

11 minutes ago, candide said:

You can rant as much as you want, I merely exposed the facts as they were reported. Of course there is the restriction that further investigation may possibly contradict (or not) what is exposed in French media. If what was reported is true, there is excessive use of force according to the usual definition of the term. According to the law, and also internal police regulation, you don't kill someone who is merely trying to escape unless he is a dangerous criminal or dangerous threat (i.e. he is a terrorist, madman, or has killed someone). It is not "my opinion" that defines what is excessive use of force or not. If further investigation shows that the guy actually acted in a threatening way, then the assumption of excessive use of force drops, of course.

 

As for the shooter concerned, my comment was not particularly incriminating as I perfectly understand that anyone, when confronted with an emergency situation, may not always react in the best possible way.

You don't think that reversing your car into a person is in any way threatening then?

[Opl]

2 hours ago, candide said:

Thi guy was not an angel, for sure. But from what was reported in French media, it seems to be a case of excessive use of force. The guy was not armed or threatening and apparently, hit one policeman with his car while running back trying to escape but was not particularly trying to hit him.

The guy who shot also probably did not kill the young guy on purpose, as it seems things happen quite quickly and he reacted rather instinctively. It should be also noted that the members of this particular police body he belongs to, the CRS, are known for not being the smartest ones.

a vehicle used as a weapon may lead to an armed response by the CRS

who and how do you finally think is stupid in this case ? The offender or the CRS?     

[candide]

4 minutes ago, nahkit said:

You don't think that reversing your car into a person is in any way threatening then?

According to the circumstances that have been reported on this particular case (under condition that they are accurate), and to what I perceive (I may be wrong, I am not a specialist) as being the definition of excessive use of force by the judiciary and internal police regulation.

I have no particular opinion on reversing one's car in general, it depends on the specific circumstances (I.e. was it intentional or not).

[candide]

2 minutes ago, Opl said:

a vehicle used as a weapon may lead to an armed response by the CRS

who and how do you finally think is stupid in this case ? The offender or the CRS?     

That the "vehicle has been used as a weapon" is your personal interpretation of this case. It's not what has been reported in the French media. In case you can read French, you can easily check it by googling a bit.

[sirocco]

Apparently, you have very personal definitions of CRS and criminal or dangerous threats, to use your terms.
If, for you, driving with a car or a truck, on the police or a group, is just an act of great banality to "get out" intruders who block you, maybe you will have ask the survivors of Nice, France, what they think.
How many policemen in the world could have been saved if they had not hesitated.
Go to France, LYON, PARIS, NICE, MARSEILLE, in the warm neighborhoods, if you have the courage, get attacked, beat up, steal, rape, that we hit you with a car, and you you will see all these hilarious mouths which will not bring you any help.
Congratulations to the CRS, the police, they are not much helped with a government of total laxity.
 

[candide]

6 minutes ago, sirocco said:

Apparently, you have very personal definitions of CRS and criminal or dangerous threats, to use your terms.
If, for you, driving with a car or a truck, on the police or a group, is just an act of great banality to "get out" intruders who block you, maybe you will have ask the survivors of Nice, France, what they think.
How many policemen in the world could have been saved if they had not hesitated.
Go to France, LYON, PARIS, NICE, MARSEILLE, in the warm neighborhoods, if you have the courage, get attacked, beat up, steal, rape, that we hit you with a car, and you you will see all these hilarious mouths which will not bring you any help.
Congratulations to the CRS, the police, they are not much helped with a government of total laxity.
 

Please stop puting words in my mouth. If you are not able to understand and take into account what I precisely wrote, you can go on ranting endlessly, no problem for me.

Now if you happen to be documented on what defines excessive use of force in the French law and police regulation, what have been the precedents, etc.. you are welcome to share your knowledge and enlight (and even contradict) my modest understanding of it. I personnally have no ideological position to defend on this issue

Edited July 5, 2018 by candide

[Opl]

29 minutes ago, candide said:

That the "vehicle has been used as a weapon" is your personal interpretation of this case. It's not what has been reported in the French media. In case you can read French, you can easily check it by googling a bit.

my personal interpretation takes into account the elements of context :

- an environment promptly subject to violent riots proven by what happened next 

- the CRS are there fully equiped in a drug trafficking case

- the car driver is under arrest warrant

- and yes, a vehicle can turn into a weapon when driven by someone who is a criminal

- the CRS knew the driver was a criminal,  described by his neighbours as "une crème" (SIC)

 

So..  I admit my personal bias:  when in doubt, save the life of the good guy - 

 

Edited July 5, 2018 by Opl

[candide]

10 minutes ago, Opl said:

my personal interpretation takes into account the elements of context :

- an environment promptly subject to violent riots proven by what happened next 

- the CRS are there fully equiped in a drug trafficking case

- the car driver is under arrest warrant

- and yes, a vehicle can turn into a weapon when driven by someone who is a criminal

- the CRS knew the driver was a criminal

 

So..  I admit my personal bias:  when in doubt, save the life of the good guy - 

 

The statements by the prosecutor in charge of this case do not suggest that the guy tried to use his car as a weapon. I am sorry, it is in French, so you need to rely on me if you don't speak French.

https://www.bfmtv.com/police-justice/homme-tue-lors-d-un-controle-de-police-a-nantes-le-point-sur-l-enquete-1483574.html

[sirocco]

post19  CANDIDE??????

 

Perhaps, I could enlighten you on the French laws that are mostly applied, by and large, by the REAL FRENCH and, strangely, very little by the foreign populations, but this is not the place to give course of law nor to render a judgment.
I keep my sleeves flying for the courts.
As for the media, you do not have to know their ploys.
So, I let you go back to sleep.

[Jonmarleesco]

On 7/4/2018 at 2:21 PM, webfact said:

The young man, in his early 20s, hit a policeman as he reversed his car away from the control point, prompting another officer to open fire, wounding him fatally, according to a police source.

Tough. Sounds as though he was dealt with in the only feasible way. 

[Matt96]

And no mainstream media dared to publish the name of that driver - Aboubakar F.

 

and that those fighting with he police are also Muslims who consider themselves not French but members of Muslim tribe which is against the majority of "french infidels".

 

but nobody is saying this in the news - it would be politically incorrect to tell the truth. the same problem as everywhere in Europe - leftist political agenda is more important than the truth...

Edited July 5, 2018 by Matt96

[bristolboy]

1 hour ago, Jonmarleesco said:

Tough. Sounds as though he was dealt with in the only feasible way. 

Except that if you read the French media, there's a lot of doubt cast on whether he actually hit anyone or not. So it could be a case of 'testilying"   

[Bluespunk]

4 hours ago, Matt96 said:

And no mainstream media dared to publish the name of that driver - Aboubakar F.

 

and that those fighting with he police are also Muslims who consider themselves not French but members of Muslim tribe which is against the majority of "french infidels".

 

but nobody is saying this in the news - it would be politically incorrect to tell the truth. the same problem as everywhere in Europe - leftist political agenda is more important than the truth...

The alt-right political agenda espoused here has no resemblance to the trurh. 

[nahkit]

8 hours ago, candide said:

According to the circumstances that have been reported on this particular case (under condition that they are accurate), and to what I perceive (I may be wrong, I am not a specialist) as being the definition of excessive use of force by the judiciary and internal police regulation.

I have no particular opinion on reversing one's car in general, it depends on the specific circumstances (I.e. was it intentional or not).

I think if I was stopped at a checkpoint, reversed my car into a person manning the checkpoint and then tried to drive away, they would be justified is using force to stop me.

 

You don't think that any of this was intentional?

[candide]

9 minutes ago, nahkit said:

I think if I was stopped at a checkpoint, reversed my car into a person manning the checkpoint and then tried to drive away, they would be justified is using force to stop me.

 

You don't think that any of this was intentional?

I think that it is not my opinion nor yours that defines what is "use of excessive force". Up to my knowledge, it seems to fit in this category. If you are more informed than me into what constitutes use of excessive force according to the French law and to the police regulation, you are welcomed to share your knowledge. 

 

It is also not my opinion nor yours that specifies the facts that have so far been collected. If you understand French, I posted the link to the statement of the "Procureur de la République" that explains the current state of knowledge about this case. There is no mention that he could have intentionally hit the other policemen.

 

On top of it, if you want to drag me into an ideological or political debate like Sirroco tried to do, I have absolutely no interest in it. I have no ideological crusade to defend contrary to some poster who obviously don't care about the actual facts.

[The Deerhunter]

On 7/4/2018 at 3:20 PM, than said:

Riot take place in  working-class neighborhood of Nantes, rioters are french paper citizen from north Africa (born in France with foreign parent), nothing to see with German immigration problem.

The suspect was killed after refuse a police control and try to hurt policemen with his car, after warning, police direct fire to the suspect car and unfortunately kill the suspect. 

The suspect is a well know drug dealer in Nantes

Disappointed customers lost their dealer.

[candide]

Apparently several posters seem to benefit from privileged information on this case. For them, I remind that the French prosecutor has made a call for testimonial and I suggest that they send their privileged information to him.