Must Read British cave diver slams Elon Musk’s submarine idea as nothing more than PR stunt

[harrry]

Whatever happens it is good they are out.

Edited July 15, 2018 by harrry

[Muzarella]

53 minutes ago, Timebandit said:

Do you actually think this thing when inflated is flexible enough to go around corners? Get real! Also, the issue of exhausting CO2 hasn't been brought up. A B.I.B.S. (built-in breathing system) would be needed. The ballast system would still be a issue not to mention the cave areas where climbing is required. Buoyancy changes as air is used. strapping on air tanks violates the required envelope.This is just the short list of problems with this system. The video showed a young man popping out successfully. How long had he been in there? The whole concept is B.S. and still so many of you still cling to your love of this PR stunt to save face.

How in the world you can know that Tesla engineers didn't look in all that??. Probably this "plastic condom" will be attached to a portable air thank, and can "wrap" a sedated body around, and those are just modest supossitions considering that I am not and expert...and probably you neither are.

[Elkski]

I'm not a EM fan.  But spaceships and subs are very similar.  How many of us wanted to do something to help?  EM felt the same I'm sure.  And he acted on it.  He had the means to do something and he tried.   Someone said they could design and build something like this in half a day!  That's real BS.  Sure there was some publicity angle here but how much we will never know.  How easy do you think it would be to get the exact cave geometry during this crisis? EM gave the command and tried.  He did produce two products that may have uses in the future.

I'm sure the worker bees had their doubts but in projects like these what the big man says goes and no time to waste.  I for one would love to see all the seal designs and redundant systems.  If you British are proud of your man telling someone who tried to help to "stick it where it hurts". You have lowered my opinion of you. How many Tesla cars did this PR event sell?  I'm not a Tesla fan boy but he has tried a whole new car concept from the dealers to the free charging stations to the new battery making factory in Nevada.  These batteries are really needed to help make solar more than a day time energy source.   It is a direct war against big power companies who have massive lobbying arms to restrict net metering prices.   Speaking of smells, I smell a bunch of ignorant bloks. 

[Muzarella]

1 hour ago, DekDaeng said:

Musk increased the chances of survival of the boys.

 

He don't need no free publicity.

Thank you. You are right....

[Get Real]

Nothing new. That´s what I said from start with dear Mr. Musk.

 

The only place that I have found Musk statisfying and doing a good work, is inside my deoderant.

Edited July 15, 2018 by Get Real

[Timebandit]

11 minutes ago, Muzarella said:

How in the world you can know that Tesla engineers didn't look in all that??. Probably this "plastic condom" will be attached to a portable air thank, and can "wrap" a sedated body around, and those are just modest supossitions considering that I am not and expert...and probably you neither are.

I would call it a body bag.

[jak2002003]

1 hour ago, Stuart21 said:

The more solutions available, the greater the chance of success. It was designed on the limited info he had, when the conditions became known, it turned out to be not suitable.

That's ok, 'pollygee accepted.

You are not the person who I quoted... so why are you accepting my 'pollygee' and answering for DekDaeng?

 

That poster says that Musk himself increased the boys chances of survival.

 

You seem to think that anyone who offers a 'solution '(but actually does nothing and the 'solution' is not even realistic or workable... and actually laughable), was increasing the chances of the boys survival!

 

If I told them my 'solution' was to send in trained dolphins with rescue dog puppies and bendy sleeping bags filled with oxygen to put the boys in to get them out... you would still say that I was 'increasing the boys chances of survival'?

 

 

[Stuart21]

The term 'monday morning quarterbacks' comes to mind -

 

[simon43]

ThaiVisa - hub of ignorant, glass-always-half-empty, non-entrepreneural, non-innovative, moaning, pessimistic losers.....

 

EM came up with a possible solution in a very short space of time.  In the end, his solution was neither required, nor would it (in it's 'mark 1' design) have worked.  But his innovative ideas might lead to a viable solution for future cave rescue scenarios.

 

Rather than kick the guy down, you should encourage him to improve on his mark 1 to a viable mark 2 or 3 or .......

 

In engineering, workable solutions don't come easy.

 

Many of you remind me of an early childhood memory that I have, when I helped my mum put up some shelves at home.  My older brothers refused to help.  It was the first time that I'd ever used a power drill.  I installed the shelves, stood back to admire my handiwork, and could see that they were not quite level.  My brothers mocked me for being unable to install these shelves level.

 

Well, many of you on this forum are like my brothers, willing to criticise others, but unwilling to lift a finger to help.

 

I learnt from my error, and I'm sure EM will also learn.  You know the saying 'If at first you don't succeed, try, try, try again'.

 

I hope EM tries again, for future rescues.

 

As for you moaners, you know where you can shove your finger ?

 

[Cake Monster]

The Elon Musk " capsule " really was a nonsense.

Anybody at all that has been Potholing will tell you that the thing would not work.

As useful as an ash tray on a Motorbike

[AlGoRhythm]

Seems ole Vern has let his 15 mins of fame get to his head.

[Thaidream]

-Sorry Vern- while I admire what you did- your comments about Elon Musk were rude and disparaging.  There was no need to speak like that about a person who tried to find a solution in a very short period of time.  It may not have worked but had the water levels risen and forced the boys to remain longer- the sub could have been  redone and made pliable.  EM does not need publicity- he already has plenty.

 

Is it so hard to fathom that the man simply tried to do something out of the goodness of his heart,

[johnnyonesock]

theres an interesting interview in the Daily Mail with  British cave divers Jason Mallinson  and Chris Jewell where the following points came out

 

• Plans to leave the boys in the cave until the end of the four-month monsoon season would have ended in certain death;

• An attempt to lay an oxygen pipe was never completed, making a dive rescue inevitable;

• On his final run, Jewell, while guiding a boy to safety, lost his grip on the rope guideline for four terrifying minutes in zero visibility;

• The safety and equipment protocols of the Thai Navy SEALs were ‘completely wrong’ for cave diving and the tragic death of one of them made the authorities realise they were ‘out of their depth’.

 

contrary to media reports the football coach was not the last person of the 13 out, but the ninth.

 

 

dont think posting the link is allowed so u will have to google the following if you wish to read the full interview

 

'We'll get them all out but there's a good chance some will die': British diver heroes feared the worst during Thai cave rescue and got LOST underwater

 

[Thaidream]

Just read the Mail interview- just unbelievable what these men were able to do.  Without these British Divers- the result may have been much different. 

 

The word Hero is tossed about , sometimes randomly, but these men are the closest thing to a hero there is.  A mere thank you doesn't seem enough but thank you for making the seeming impossible- possible.

[tifino]

The ElonM idea seemed almost surgical, in it's perceived precision

 

But, where being available at the right time and place, would either Make or Break it...

 

 - the possibility of an extended stay, meant all/any alternative ideas put forwarded;

 needed merit analysis before being cast off arbitrarily.

 

 

EM's ED-treating-like looking idea still had a place, if the diving option caved in.

The cavernosal-looking cylinder stands out in the photo,! - enough to give a sense of deja vu to anyone who's been treated!

 

It was inflatable, pliable; could easily made to suit whatever desired length and girth

 

 

maybe he is also a medical explorer in his spare time?

[Hummin]

2 hours ago, johnnyonesock said:

theres an interesting interview in the Daily Mail with  British cave divers Jason Mallinson  and Chris Jewell where the following points came out

 

Thanks for the heads up about the article. What these brits executed in this operation is extraordinary and outstanding. No words can describe what they did for the kids. 

[Stuart21]

3 hours ago, AlGoRhythm said:

Seems ole Vern has let his 15 mins of fame get to his head.

Vern (& others) owes Musk an apology, IMO. Musk was asked on Twitter if he could do whatever he could to help save the boys - he did.

[473geo]

3 minutes ago, Hummin said:

Thanks for the heads up about the article. What these brits executed in this operation is extraordinary and outstanding. No words can describe what they did for the kids. 

I think there were many others including an Australian doctor who played a crucial part in the evacuation process, this was not a few men being brave and performing heroics, it was a whole raft of people, some never underwater, who were pushed into tough choices.  They all came through, that is common denominator and why credit goes to the whole team.

[55Jay]

It was the timing of his entry into this. 

 

The divers had already gotten some of the boys out and were actively engaged in the operation by the time he showed up with an untested solution that didn't seem practical - all the while divers were continuing the extractions.  

 

Think it put the folks there in a tough spot.  It must have been awkward to say thank you, we appreciate it a lot but.... we're a bit busy right now. 

 

I was pleased with Elon's magnanimous attitude and comments at first, suggesting he acknowledged reality and was happy to leave his kit here in the event it could be used.  Now or in the future.  

 

He should have just left it at that, but he didn't.  His later comments played like adolescent sour grapes.  So I get why plain talking Vern would be annoyed by the interruption.

 

Anyway, onto Phase 2.  Making the movie fast enough to cash in before the world forgets about it - which will be roughly next week sometime. 

[Stuart21]

2 minutes ago, 473geo said:

They all (nearly) came through,

 

[Hummin]

3 minutes ago, 473geo said:

I think there were many others including an Australian doctor who played a crucial part in the evacuation process, this was not a few men being brave and performing heroics, it was a whole raft of people, some never underwater, who were pushed into tough choices.  They all came through, that is common denominator and why credit goes to the whole team.

You are absolutely right, but still there is som keyholders who made it possible. However everyone one in each position was also a key to the success. 

 

And also sad to read how some other key members was pushed on their safety, what I understand, and also believed was the reasons for the dead hero. He/they pushed their limits on their equipment and knownledge about what they was doing. Also sad that he was seeking attention before he left home to go to the cave, and he had to pay the ultimate price. 

[473geo]

2 minutes ago, Stuart21 said:

 

It appears the casualty played a crucial part in the grand scheme of things, he gave his life, and deserves recognition for the part he played. But he was part of a team that came through.

 

Don't split hairs no person was overlooked in my statement.

[AdamTheFarang]

On 7/14/2018 at 3:20 PM, connda said:

Nothing like being slapped in the face with reality. "Ouch!" 
And exploding self-driving cars. "Ouch!"
And self-serving PR. "Ouch!"

Yeah but I think you wish you had 1 millionth of the money he has !

[JerseytoBKK]

Musk just went completely unhinged. He called Vern "pedo guy".

 

I know that the progressive / socialist members of TV think he's a demi-god, but with that latest comment by him, I think he's gone from being a con man to a total piece of excrement.

 

Also tweeted: " Water level was actually very low & still (not flowing) — you could literally have swum to Cave 5 with no gear, which is obv how the kids got in. "

[IamNoone88]

Shooting a Telsa into space with a dummy inside it, $500 flame flowers to "raise capital" and then the life saving mini-sub. I said in this forum from day1 - its all good global hi profile PR and costs very little. He's got more PHD's at his control than NASA and they came up with a "rigid design" that would never work - go figure. The PR on the other hand certainly did work ...... very well. Mission accomplished.

[hhinhh]

Big mouth Musk wanted to make a gain out of the poor situation of a few boys. The submarnie was totally useless which he either knew but perhaps he is stupid enoungh not to know. This ugly guy takes every advantage to get reputation but here it showed as in many cases that he is nothing like a big foolish mouth. Hope he builds his village on Mars soon and stays there forever.

[JerseytoBKK]

 

1 hour ago, IamNoone88 said:

Shooting a Telsa into space with a dummy inside it, $500 flame flowers to "raise capital" and then the life saving mini-sub. I said in this forum from day1 - its all good global hi profile PR and costs very little. He's got more PHD's at his control than NASA and they came up with a "rigid design" that would never work - go figure. The PR on the other hand certainly did work ...... very well. Mission accomplished.

With just a couple of tweets, Musk just severely damaged his reputation. Tweeter is exploding with criticism. Some entertaining comments in addition to lots of extremely negative posts.

 

" When they make the movie about this I hope there's a side story of you making the sub, arriving too late to really help much, then throwing a tantrum because you're not the big hero, 'cause that's how it's going down now. "

" Calling the diver a paedophile was the last straw. What a petty little man. I guess all the money in the world can never buy class and human decency. "

 

 

 

Edited July 15, 2018 by JerseytoBKK

[473geo]

Guys you can't have it both ways, was Musk genuinely trying to assist, is Musk genuinely calling Vern, or are you falling for yet another PR stunt ?

 

 

[JerseytoBKK]

1 hour ago, 473geo said:

Guys you can't have it both ways, was Musk genuinely trying to assist, is Musk genuinely calling Vern, or are you falling for yet another PR stunt ?

 

 

You seem to be confused and equating the events when they're vastly different. Yes, Musk tried to pull a PR stunt and get lots of positive press for coming to the rescue. Unfortunately for him he was called out by Vern.

 

Then he made an incredibly stupid mistake and tweeted that Vern was a pedo and insinuated that the rescue was no big deal. The 2nd event is not a PR stunt but a mistake that will cost him.

[dirtynomad]

He might be able to sue Musk for the pedo comments.