The EUSSR have made it plain they don't want normal trading arrangements with Britain. They just want to punish us for daring to leave their dictatorship. At the end of the day it will be a choice of hard brexit or total capitulation. Left to Mayhem of course it will be the latter.

2 minutes ago, Henryford said:

The EUSSR have made it plain they don't want normal trading arrangements with Britain. They just want to punish us for daring to leave their dictatorship. At the end of the day it will be a choice of hard brexit or total capitulation. Left to Mayhem of course it will be the latter.

 

 

Indeed, and the attitude of the EU officials only goes to confirm that is not an oligarchy that I want to be part of.

10 minutes ago, oilinki said:

UK can not afford hard brexit. They are simply not prepared for it. 

 

Norwegian model might be possible, but then it would be downgrade from current EU membership, where UK has seat on the deciding table.

 

I think UK will take EU's offer to grant further preparation time, which means that they need to have 2nd referendum vote. This means that UK will stay as part of EU, which is the best solution for both parties. It also likely means that now when UK and other EU member states have understood the great value of EU a bit better, UK will become more productive member of the Union.

 

 

 

you forgot to add that after this new understanding Cameron could come back and take over after pm tm

 

36 minutes ago, melvinmelvin said:

 

you forgot to add that after this new understanding Cameron could come back and take over after pm tm

 

Labour might want to find a less torpid leader who could take over the UK premiership for an while. 

26 minutes ago, oilinki said:

Labour might want to find a less torpid leader who could take over the UK premiership for an while. 

Are you serious that you think Jeremy Corbyn will stand down and let somebody else take over or you suggesting another leadership challenge. Labour has very little say in who runs the party, more to do with the left wing union led by the impressive Len McCluskey and the left wing membership. The only man Corbyn would stand down for is Karl Marx, and that is very unlikely to happen.

1 minute ago, vogie said:

Are you serious that you think Jeremy Corbyn will stand down and let somebody else take over or you suggesting another leadership challenge. Labour has very little say in who runs the party, more to do with the left wing union led by the impressive Len McCluskey and the left wing membership. The only man Corbyn would stand down for is Karl Marx, and that is very unlikely to happen.

vogie

 

What are you thinking about man / woman ?

 

All these non Brits, who are all over every Brexit thread like a dose of the skitters know the UK, know what is good for the UK better than anyone ??

 

It remainds me of the clownfish who once told me that he hoped the UK Green Party would be elected into Government ?? Needless to say, he was not a British clownfish ??

1 hour ago, oilinki said:

UK can not afford hard brexit. They are simply not prepared for it. 

 

Exactly. The UK public has been mislead from day one, and by day one I mean before the referendum act, in that the UK can just leave the EU. The PM has propagated the misinformation in her soundbite 'no deal is better than a bad deal'. The UK does not have  the regulatory systems in place to stand on its own 2 feet, whatever happens there will be deals with the EU leading to a certain amount of ECJ jurisdiction.

It has also been known since day one that brexit flies in the face of the Belfast agreement. You cannot have livestock on either side of an open border unless under the same regulations. As far as the Irish border is concerned it is single market or reunification, the latter probably being the government preference. 

17 minutes ago, vogie said:

Are you serious that you think Jeremy Corbyn will stand down and let somebody else take over or you suggesting another leadership challenge. Labour has very little say in who runs the party, more to do with the left wing union led by the impressive Len McCluskey and the left wing membership. The only man Corbyn would stand down for is Karl Marx, and that is very unlikely to happen.

Position of power is always taken, never given.

 

As an outsider, I feel that UK lack leadership as whole. Does it?

 

8 minutes ago, The Renegade said:

vogie

 

What are you thinking about man / woman ?

 

All these non Brits, who are all over every Brexit thread like a dose of the skitters know the UK, know what is good for the UK better than anyone ??

 

It remainds me of the clownfish who once told me that he hoped the UK Green Party would be elected into Government ?? Needless to say, he was not a British clownfish ??

Yes it's obvious they don't give a rats tail about us, it's all about the money that will not be going into the EU coffers. If it wasn't for our money they would all be doing cartwheels down the Champ Elysees, Whistling 'goodbyee'

2 minutes ago, vogie said:

Yes it's obvious they don't give a rats tail about us, it's all about the money that will not be going into the EU coffers. If it wasn't for our money they would all be doing cartwheels down the Champ Elysees, Whistling 'goodbyee'

Actually we do. I'm sure, as expats, we all have good British friends (who all are against Brexit). At least that is in my case. Why would we want them to suffer?

 

Besides lacking good English humour and Scottish whiskeys would be serious downside for EU. 

3 minutes ago, The Renegade said:

All these non Brits, who are all over every Brexit thread like a dose of the skitters know the UK, know what is good for the UK better than anyone ??

I didn’t know it’s citizenship that enables people to participate in a discussion. (Wondering if that’s still your opinion next time a Thai politician complains about Westerners meddling in Thai affairs because “you Farang, you not know Thai”). 

 

Poor attempt to discredit people that you can’t fight with arguments. 

16 minutes ago, sandyf said:

Exactly. The UK public has been mislead from day one, and by day one I mean before the referendum act,

For sure.

 

Starting away back in January 1971

1 minute ago, oilinki said:

Actually we do. I'm sure, as expats, we all have good British friends (who all are against Brexit). At least that is in my case. Why would we want them to suffer?

 

Besides lacking good English humour and Scottish whiskeys would be serious downside for EU. 

I have many German, Danish and Norwegian friends (sorry no Finnish, will you be my friend) but the last thing I want to do is give them my money, so they can pay my bills, and in return they can give me some small change back.

 

I am sure that you are very sincere when you say, "why would we want them to suffer" Well just between you and I, we will be ok.

14 minutes ago, vogie said:

Yes it's obvious they don't give a rats tail about us, it's all about the money that will not be going into the EU coffers. If it wasn't for our money they would all be doing cartwheels down the Champ Elysees, Whistling 'goodbyee'

Nah, 

 

They will be giving us the fingers as they see OUR ( UK ) money disappearing over the hills??

 

 

27 minutes ago, The Renegade said:

 

All these non Brits, who are all over every Brexit thread like a dose of the skitters know the UK, know what is good for the UK better than anyone ??

 

It remainds me of the clownfish who once told me that he hoped the UK Green Party would be elected into Government ?? Needless to say, he was not a British clownfish ??

Continue down this path and face a suspension.   Anybody, regardless of nationality, is permitted to post.  

 

 

On 7/28/2018 at 9:42 AM, JAG said:

Frankly I don't think there are going to be any meaningful negotiations.

At the last moment we will be offered "terms". Terms which if accepted will result in the UK becoming an effective vassal state of the EU. 

 

More than likely.The EU laid out its position right at the beginning which is dictated by the EU treaties. However the UK thought they could take a different approach and ignore the treaties, and its got them nowhere. The UK will have to come sort of arrangement with the EU and the UK will be in a worse position than before this fiasco started. Apart from anything else the UK has already lost the notified bodies, EMA and EBA, not good moves for the UK

The sooner the leavers come to terms with it the better. 

6 minutes ago, vogie said:

I have many German, Danish and Norwegian friends (sorry no Finnish, will you be my friend) but the last thing I want to do is give them my money, so they can pay my bills, and in return they can give me some small change back.

 

I am sure that you are very sincere when you say, "why would we want them to suffer" Well just between you and I, we will be ok.

Friendships take years to develop, but who knows what happens in the Future.

 

Up north we tend to have more tendencies for co-operation. Probably because nobody can survive the harsh Arctic winters alone.

 

A nice story about Ubuntu, from Africa. "I am because we are".

 

Of course it must be fake news.

 

He suggested the UK proposals on single market regulations lacked “a certain balance between the rights and obligations” and urged Ms May to avoid “trying to find loopholes in the EU position”.

Sources familiar with the French position told the UK that officials in Paris were “puzzled” at why the EU would be expected to accept a British customs plan that was so complex, risky and burdensome for it and its businesses, to no benefit.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-no-deal-theresa-may-eu-member-states-final-say-latest-a8466716.html

4 hours ago, vogie said:

Are you saying that Corbyn, McDonnell and Abbott would be a satisfactory alternative government to the Tories?

I'm saying there is very likely going to be a socialist government.

 

I would definitely say this present administration is a shower.

1 minute ago, mommysboy said:

I'm saying there is very likely going to be a socialist government.

 

I would definitely say this present administration is a shower.

And just to clarify, you mean Corbyn, McDonnell and Abbott?

12 minutes ago, vogie said:

And just to clarify, you mean Corbyn, McDonnell and Abbott?

I just said that there is very likely going to be a Labour Government.  I didn't say it would be a good one, probably it will be good for poor people.  I suppose anything is better than this awful, hamstrung administration that has acted with no integrity whatsoever.

 

 

11 minutes ago, vogie said:

And just to clarify, you mean Corbyn, McDonnell and Abbott?

Well the current mob are going to make a mess of brexit.

 

Neither leavers or remainers will be satisfied with whatever happens - in my view no deal is most likely outcome.

 

I can't see no deal being a short term success  - and I can't see the leavers being happy if we remain.

 

So I would put money on  the government collapsing post-brexit 

 

I don't see the tories getting voted back in anytime soon.

 

I don't see any sign of the internal Labour revolution that would be needed to overthrow Corbyn et al. 

 

So expect to see a socialist republic in the UK soon - remember they will inherit Henry 8th powers....  

12 minutes ago, tebee said:

Well the current mob are going to make a mess of brexit.

 

Neither leavers or remainers will be satisfied with whatever happens - in my view no deal is most likely outcome.

 

I can't see no deal being a short term success  - and I can't see the leavers being happy if we remain.

 

So I would put money on  the government collapsing post-brexit 

 

I don't see the tories getting voted back in anytime soon.

 

I don't see any sign of the internal Labour revolution that would be needed to overthrow Corbyn et al. 

 

So expect to see a socialist republic in the UK soon - remember they will inherit Henry 8th powers....  

Brexit is an opportuity we must all embrace, Corbyn et al are a terrible disgrace.

13 minutes ago, tebee said:

Well the current mob are going to make a mess of brexit.

 

Neither leavers or remainers will be satisfied with whatever happens - in my view no deal is most likely outcome.

 

I can't see no deal being a short term success  - and I can't see the leavers being happy if we remain.

 

So I would put money on  the government collapsing post-brexit 

 

I don't see the tories getting voted back in anytime soon.

 

I don't see any sign of the internal Labour revolution that would be needed to overthrow Corbyn et al. 

 

So expect to see a socialist republic in the UK soon - remember they will inherit Henry 8th powers....  

 

 

 

I will be satisfied with No Deal, in the absence of a negotiated deal.

1 minute ago, Jip99 said:

 

 

 

I will be satisfied with No Deal, in the absence of a negotiated deal.

The problem with Brexit in a nutshell

 

In the two years since the Leave campaign unexpectedly won, nobody, from the prime minister to Mr. Johnson to the Labour Party, has been able to come up with a plan for exiting the European Union that can satisfy both a majority in Parliament and the expectant public. Why? Because fulfilling the false promises peddled by Mr. Johnson during the campaign is impossible.

 

The gulf between the easy, prosperous, productive Brexit that its voters are impatiently expecting, and the grim, complicated cost of disentangling economies that have been intertwined for decades has poisoned and paralyzed British politics.

 

Source : https://www.nytimes.com/2018/07/10/opinion/boris-johnson-resignation-brexit.html

This guy sum's it up what people voted for :

 

 

10 minutes ago, alfieconn said:

This guy sum's it up what people voted for :

 

 

 

And he is completely wrong on it being the cause of his problems.....

42 minutes ago, mommysboy said:

I just said that there is very likely going to be a Labour Government.  I didn't say it would be a good one, probably it will be good for poor people.  I suppose anything is better than this awful, hamstrung administration that has acted with no integrity whatsoever.

 

 

administration - no integrity ?

 

its not only the administration, in the no integrity bit you should also include the MPs and the rest of the political party

what a bunch, no integrity, stabbing front figures constantly, not following official party policy, cabinet not able to stick to unity

 

underperformers they are running UK to the dungeons, and many of them are comfortable with that, they have sterling enough

 

time to try smth different from the Tory mafia

Labour ? good?/bad? nobody knows, could be tried

 

2-party systems ain't healthy (like in UK and even worse in US),

yes there is UKIP and a few other bits and pieces

4-5 parties of significant size would change the climate in my view

coalition governments/cabinets ain't that bad, it is very educational and enlightening for politicians to be forced to cooperate in order to rule

11 minutes ago, melvinmelvin said:

2-party systems ain't healthy (like in UK and even worse in US),

yes there is UKIP and a few other bits and pieces

4-5 parties of significant size would change the climate in my view

coalition governments/cabinets ain't that bad, it is very educational and enlightening for politicians to be forced to cooperate in order to rule

One benefit of multi-party system is that it prevents partisanism, which is currently seen in USA. One party can't behave like an arse towards others, as it never knows if it will share the cabinet with other parties in the future.

 

There is need for compromises, which is both good and bad. Good as the decisions are better thought over. Bad as it slows down the progress. 

52 minutes ago, vogie said:

Brexit is an opportuity we must all embrace, Corbyn et al are a terrible disgrace.

A poet! Marvellous!