Leaving Thailand after 13 Years..

[LivinLOS]

On 7/21/2018 at 12:55 PM, possum1931 said:

Thailand over policed? Maybe your right, so why don't they enforce the laws?

Maybe not effectively, but just harrassed as income.. 

Chiang mai has constant road blocks, While my collection of bikes are all 100% functional they are all modified one way or another.. Every time theres a shit fight.. Boils down to license.. check.. tax check.. ok got your green book ?? Someone got fined for having his rear pillion pegs down.. Its annoying. 

Policing in the west is done differently, for actually laws being broken.. Here its just highway banditry to tax the population and pay salaries to the thin brown line. God forbid you actually have any dispute in Thailand, they run a mile from trying to assist enforcing a contract or petty theft. 

[JLCrab]

34 minutes ago, transam said:

37 minutes ago, weegee said:

For those who have packed up and left....Smart Move

For those about to pack and go....Smart Move

For those that are Staying....Good luck.

Thankfully she likes my...........

Good luck.

[transam]

3 minutes ago, JLCrab said:

Good luck.

Thank you...

[LivinLOS]

On 7/26/2018 at 6:50 PM, Poottrong said:

I never understood the argument that things are getting more expensive here. Anyone checked into the West lately? Money just goes way further here although I stick to local tucker and lead a simple life - by choice.

Really ?? 

2 cars here.. Back there I drive a nice beemer, fraction of the cost of a low quality farm truck here.. 

Clothes, shoes, electronics, etc etc etc.. If your not buying chinese 'broke in a year' junk almost everything is cheaper back there.. Sure someone cleaning your pool, doing your garden / ironing / etc is cheaper here, labour is cheaper.. But things ?? Of quality ?? 

 

[NoshowJones]

42 minutes ago, LivinLOS said:

Maybe not effectively, but just harrassed as income.. 

Chiang mai has constant road blocks, While my collection of bikes are all 100% functional they are all modified one way or another.. Every time theres a shit fight.. Boils down to license.. check.. tax check.. ok got your green book ?? Someone got fined for having his rear pillion pegs down.. Its annoying. 

Policing in the west is done differently, for actually laws being broken.. Here its just highway banditry to tax the population and pay salaries to the thin brown line. God forbid you actually have any dispute in Thailand, they run a mile from trying to assist enforcing a contract or petty theft. 

Very well said indeed, though when I talk about the law not getting enforced, I always emphasis the

tea money situation, that seems to be the majority of times where traffic is concerned.

[JLCrab]

20 minutes ago, transam said:

25 minutes ago, JLCrab said:

Good luck.

Thank you...

You're welcome -- you definitely are the best singer we've never heard.

[LivinLOS]

On 7/27/2018 at 1:09 PM, BradinAsia said:

It seems a lot of folks move to the other side of the world (Thailand, for example) and want

to duplicate the lifestyle they had back home. To me this is the greatest folly. After 31 years

in Asia (Japan, Thailand, Philippines), I'm glad that I never had any desire to do this.

 

How could anyone expect to enjoy all the richness of a different culture if they don't make

any reasonable attempt to immerse themselves in it? I think this is why so many punters on

TVF spend their lives whining and moaning.

I have zero desire to live like a local of a 3rd world country. 

I cannot understand why anyone from the developed world would 'want' to do that.. Be forced to, sure, but want to ?? 

[JLCrab]

I don't know to the above -- it seems in Thailand every major city has a BMW dealership catering to the Thai 'locals' living in a 3rd world country.

Edited August 4, 2018 by JLCrab

[LivinLOS]

On 7/28/2018 at 9:39 AM, ChidlomDweller said:

Another thing is what lies in one's past.  I left Belgium when I had barely turned 23 nearly 30 years ago, and the prospect of being back in a few years and making it my homebase to travel around Europe from, live in Gent, Antwerp or Brussels,... it seems quite appealing to me.  When I'm in Europe now, it's with the eyes of a tourist.  Now if I'd spent the past 40 years working in Belgium and were just retired, I would probably want to spread my wings and Thailand would at least initially seem attractive.

I came here at 28, after making my money in the benelux (mostly Holland) and now again have a place in Brabant.. 

Europe through fresh eyes, travelling like a tourist, the amazing road trips that are possible without any border hassles.. The great cities / buildings / architecture.. My wife is getting to insta-jealous her mates, I am getting to explore places I skipped over in my 20s.. 

Yeah its real fun again !! 

[JTXR]

Everyone has his own personal list of pros and cons regarding living in Thailand.  Each person's list is different based on age, nationality, personal history, personal preferences, etc.  Most folks' list of pros and cons changes over time, I think.  That's only natural. 

My take is that if the pros still very much outweigh the cons, then stay.  If the cons come to very much outweigh the pros, then go.  It's simple.  Just go.  Why the need for a lot of hand-wringing or whining or Thai bashing?

Edited August 4, 2018 by JTXR

[LivinLOS]

On 7/28/2018 at 10:18 AM, Batty said:

 

So your calling me a cock.  Thanks.

 

You are analyzing with cliches and sound like an student physiologist and I dont mean to be rude in suggesting that error as many people do the same.  But I must be honest and say Its such a boring, well trodden reasoning to suggest "there is another guy, running from his problems, head buried in sand, scared to go home".  Christ mate its so dull and predictable and its almost always the first port of call when two chaps on a bar stool (or concrete table outside a maa paa shop) are blasting a fellow ex pat.  This guy has issues.  Clearly here to escape something.

 

Some of us just stumbled here through, I admit, absolute ignorance at worst and lack of planning at best.  I am here after 15 years because... it just happened.  Cant that be a reason?  Must I be a social misfit who didn't fair well back home with people?  Or a fat stinking mess with zero charm, unable to chat up the birds back home and bailed to Thailand heading straight to the go go bars?  Make sure to wai the mamasan on your way in you know, respect local culture.  Then see how many fingers you can get up number 32.  Go on lad.

 

I had a pretty good life back home, quite eventful and dam good fun.  I had a mobile phone dealership selling contract phones on-line from 2001 through 2003 and in July of that year the business imploded for reasons out of my control.  I walked away with 30 grand, a rented house (no ties) no kids, and a car.  I thought sod it, I am 30, lets do a bit of traveling, spend 20 of the 30 grand I have and then come back and start another business.  I needed a break.  America sounds fun and I had visited a few times as a kid.  And with very little planning I decided on flying to Los Angeles and starting there.  Only I didn't.  During my final customer credit check with Orange on the phone (cell/mobile phone company in UK) I got chatting to the agent about moving to America.  He had just come back from Thailand, and told me about the way of life there, the cheap villas on the beach you can rent.  Fried rice and chicken with a beer for a pound.  Friendly locals. The beautiful women who love westerners.  Amazing islands and adventurous mountain destinations. And all around it, you have these mad countries to explore like Vietnam, Loas, Malaysia, Singapore, Hong Kong. I randomly searched 'house for rent in Thailand' and this amazing 3 bed house popped up, surrounded by coconut trees, 5 minutes from a beach. 300 pounds a month.  I had spent that much the night before on a bender in London, I remember thinking.  300 pounds!  For a villa!  On an island!

 

I remember sitting on expedia website with two browser windows open, one for a L.A flight and one for flight to Koh Samui, undecided.  Eventually I chose koh Samui, booked a flight, put my furniture, car and electrical stuff in a lock up on a 6 month contract and buggered off to Thailand, telling my pals and family I would see them at the end of the year.  Everyone was surprised I was doing it, but pleased for me.  It was In hindsight looking back, totally random, deciding to travel.  I suspect if I had put more thought into it I would have stayed back home.

 

They call it chaos theory, dont they?  How a single small event can change the course of humanity?  I ponder that from time to time.  The Orange call center had 500 agents.  If I hadn't spoke to that one particular guy, at that very time, i would have never traveled to Thailand.  I wasn't even sure where it was to be honest.

 

I had so much fun in koh Samui, 6 months turned into 2 years but I burnt out.  I had spent a lot of time on the beer and partying I needed to move on.  So I went to Bangkok for a year and did even more partying.  How does that make sense?  Burn out in Koh Samui, so move to Bangkok?  I have no idea what I was thinking in that decision. So, even more burnt out after a year living just off Soi 4 and now at 33, I decided to move to kanchanaburi where it is green, lush, laid back, and cute.  A perfect place to slow down a bit.  I stayed there for 5 years and played golf in the day, and set up an on line business that I worked on at night, which did very well.  During no point in this first 8 years did I ever think 'ok, what am I doing?' Is this my life now?'.  Family and friends always pestered me about coming home.  What are you doing out there?  Why are you still there? But I never had an answer.  Its honestly something I never thought about.  I took everything day by day and just figured one day I will go home, when I feel like it.

 

More years went past and eventually I met a great girl, moved North and got married, brought a house and settled down.  My dad died 3 years ago and during that time I went home 3 or 4 times a year while he was sick and it was at this point that I woke up a little a realized that I had pretty much abandoned my country and suddenly missed it.  I would land at Heathrow and there would always be 2 or 3 friends waiting for me, before we headed off to the pub to meet more friends and have a great night.  I would spend the days visiting my Dad and family and aimlessly driving around the countryside, remembering how nice it is back there, wondering why I abandoned it, and the nights in the pub with mates having a great laugh.  It just suddenly happened over those 2 or 3 years of visiting the UK - I became uber home sick - and every time I returned to Thailand I felt bummed out to be back.

 

I guess I just stumbled here through blind chance, failed to plan, and woke up 15 years later thinking bugger, I am still here?  I own a house and stuff?

 

I built an amazing on-line business through my time here and now it is over, I regret squandering the money I made from it.  I could have saved easily enough to buy a bloody huge house back home but I didn't.  I was an idiot. Business class flights everywhere, hotels always had to be Hiltons, Sheratons, Mariots.  Wardrobe after wardrobe of expensive clothes. Bikes, cars.  All the trappings. I had friends in Miami and over a 4 year period I would fly there, business class, three times a year for 3 weeks each visit, blowing money. I look back on all that now and think I guess I wasn't truly happy here and filled a void with crap that I didn't need.  I got jaded with the bar scene years ago, got fed up with golf and for a good few years didn't do very much here: just a quiet life with lavish holidays back home, Miami, Caribbean, and all over S.E.Asia mixed in.  I should have been honest with myself at the time and admitted I wasn't truly happy in Thailand, time to go home.  But for some reason I just figured everything would work itself out and plodded on, with no plan, spending money.  And when you have money, it is easy to use it to fudge over problems.  And for that reason, I wouldn't blame you for calling me a cock.  It was foolish and short sighted and now the business is over and I am making a modest living, I feel stupid.  For a bright guy, I made a dumb mistake of winging it in life with zero plan.  So fair enough - call me a cock for that, because I am.

 

But I am most definitely not a cock in the way you might imply.  I am not a social misfit, I can easily sit in a bar full of strangers and tell a few stories, get everyone laughing.  I do have some measure of charm, unlike some of the morons you meet sometimes here whose soul level of concern lies with the cost of Chang going up at Dream Girl bar, baked beans in Macro being too saucy, and how Davids wife is cheating on him with a Thai guy.  I just made the mistake of taking everything for granted, failing to plan: and now i miss home, dont realy want to live here anymore, but cant just 'go back' and sofa surf with my wife who I adore, watching her suffer with the same feelings I have now in being home sick for her country and family/friends.  If I had a good few hundred grand in the bank I would buy a house back there and spend the summers there with her.  Or leave her here and get my fix of England for 3 months a year.  Either of those scenarios would be fine for me and I would enjoy the other 9 months in Thailand quite happily.  Maybe one day it will happen, I do have a track record of getting back on top financially when chips are down so maybe I will make something else work and get the money together in a few years.  Or maybe crypto currency will go up ten fold and I can cash in and do it that way.  

 

But for the time being, here I am.  Just a bloke who didn't plan and stumbled here, for a long time.  Its not a bad life, dont get me wrong - I own a house, a couple of nice cars and bikes, owe no money to anyone and have potential to make a living.  I just feel a bit bored and lost here these days. It suddenly feels arbitrary, my living here.  I feel silly for not predicting this years ago, and stupid for not being wiser with my money. 

 

Feel free anyone to analyze all this but let me be clear - you can jazz this up however you like but I am telling you now, there is no underlying reason for 'bailing' on the UK.  It just happened.

 

 

You have started and run multiple businesses.. One of which by the sound of it was online and a decent earner.. 

Focus your energy and start another.. Theres so many routes to online income and if you have done it before you will know you can do it again.. 

I am a serial entrepreneur, had 9 days of employment in my entire life.. I coasted and messed about for years (similar ago to you, similar time incountry) in Thailand doing nothing much but lucky with investments. Now I am actively working again I realised how much I enjoy it, how much setting myself goals and waking up ready to fight for them is something I like doing. 

You speak like you have given up, but why ?? Build something, use it to enable your freedom again, remove that trapped feeling  psychology. 

[LivinLOS]

On 7/30/2018 at 8:44 PM, manjara said:

As a summary, I don't dislike Thailand as a place to visit, but living here is difficult for ME because of :

 - Lack of level playing field in business, and just general obstacles placed in the way of you earning a decent living here, rather than bringing one from outside. (btw, I would not NEED to work in Thailand, but it still irritates me)

 - Visa requirements, reporting etc

 - Excessive taxes/costs on non-Thai stuff (wine, cars, cheese etc) and complete lottery when importing anything!

 - Lack of Quality in most things you buy here (or see above)

 

But on the other hand, the things I love about Thailand:

 - Wonderful food available at very low cost, either buying the ingredients or the finished product from a street vendor

 - Hours of massage for the equivalent of the cost of a bottle of wine at home!

 - A lot of freedom from regulation (real or imagined) 

 - Friendliness of the people (at least on the surface level) , generally the poorer thais rather than the better off!

 - Amazing countryside, beaches, flora & fauna

 - Swimming year round without freezing!

 

All the benefits I can get from visiting on a regular basis, but if I live in thailand for 12 months a year, then the negatives start to dominate. 

The other point I'm trying to make here is that people who have lived in Thailand for many years should try their home country again, they may find that the things that brought them to Thailand in the first place are no longer true. 

I can live pretty cheaply in the UK if I want to, and have more fulfilling friendships than I have in Thailand. Ok, I will baulk at the cost of Somtam and pra-ra, but on balance, I'll be happier having my base in the UK (or somewhere else) than Thailand!

 

That finishes my input to this very entertaining thread!

Nails a lot of my thinking too.. 

I try to make the most of life where ever I am.. And Thailand has some strong upsides.. But developed world has strong upsides too. Its obvious many feel the need to justify one or another as to emphasise they made the 'right' choice... 

For me, better to stay fluid.. 

[LivinLOS]

25 minutes ago, JLCrab said:

I don't know to the above -- it seems in Thailand every major city has a BMW dealership catering to the Thai 'locals' living in a 3rd world country.

Of course.. The post was about apples to apples and people moving here and not going for trade offs. 

Someone saying how cheap apples to apples it is here ?? I can get a 997 porsche for 20k - 22k GBP thats what 900k to a mil thb.. A decent M sport 5 series beemer is like 200k... For the price of my toyota truck and her ford focus we can be in his and hers luxury. 

Yes Thailand has (terrible) BMW dealers.. But at the price you could be in an aston for in the west. Apples and oranges. 

[White Christmas13]

36 minutes ago, LivinLOS said:

Really ?? 

2 cars here.. Back there I drive a nice beemer, fraction of the cost of a low quality farm truck here.. 

Clothes, shoes, electronics, etc etc etc.. If your not buying chinese 'broke in a year' junk almost everything is cheaper back there.. Sure someone cleaning your pool, doing your garden / ironing / etc is cheaper here, labour is cheaper.. But things ?? Of quality ?? 

 

I know where you coming from I went back to the west after many years in Thailand

came back broke now I am living just on the pension I receive AUD $ 1030 per fortnight

pay rent 480 electricity 70-80 for 2 months food 80 (including good cheese) petrol 20

wine 30 don't buy a lot of clothes since I have plenty go out for a meal ones a week

real restaurant no street food pay nothing for medical just a small amount for medication

and still have about $ 300 left every fortnight so don't tell me it is expensive in the west

I agree the rent is higher in big cities I am quiet happy where I live and can afford a 

holiday some times just came back from Bangkok a few weeks back yes I went to

Bangkok because my girl lives there I don't regret moving back to the west

[Rimmer]

Many off topic posts leading to bickering have been removed

[Poottrong]

20 hours ago, LivinLOS said:

Really ?? 

2 cars here.. Back there I drive a nice beemer, fraction of the cost of a low quality farm truck here.. 

Clothes, shoes, electronics, etc etc etc.. If your not buying chinese 'broke in a year' junk almost everything is cheaper back there.. Sure someone cleaning your pool, doing your garden / ironing / etc is cheaper here, labour is cheaper.. But things ?? Of quality ?? 

 

From my earlier post in this thread

 

"Rent - I pay less in a month than what I would pay in a week in Aus. Granted it's a smaller, cheaply made house but I'd happily live in the same back home if they were available. On top of that I can walk to the beach here. Renting or buying a house near the beach in Aus is only for the well off these days.

 

Utilities - way cheaper in Thailand

 

Fresh fruit, veg and meat - way cheaper in Thailand except for beef and lamb. I eat home cooked Thai food daily and doing the same in Aus costs a small fortune, which is what I would want to do.

 

Internet - way cheaper and faster in Thailand

 

Imported electronics and other imports - cheaper in Aus

 

Cars - cheaper in Australia although a "cheap ass toyota" is fine with me.

 

Petrol - about the same price I think?

 

Public transport / taxis - way cheaper in Thailand

 

So all in all Thailand is WAY cheaper for me than Australia. Not even close."

 

Mind you I'm not trying to duplicate a western lifestyle here which makes all the difference. Also, I haven't been to the US but I understand it can be a very affordable country.

[Nemises]

“Utilities - way cheaper in Thailand” ...yep, to the extent that air conditioning is no longer affordable to most Australians. Electricity is about 50% cheaper in Thailand than Aus.

[JLCrab]

2 hours ago, Poottrong said:

Also, I haven't been to the US but I understand it can be a very affordable country.

Yes. US can be a very affordable country if you stay a way from major urban areas. So can Thailand. For now, I like Thailand better.

[xylophone]

3 hours ago, Poottrong said:

So all in all Thailand is WAY cheaper for me than Australia. Not even close."

Same as NZ for me...……..some NZ prices as follows:

 

Petrol 52 b  litre

Rent 42 sq m studio apt 34,000 b pm 

Internet 1640 b pm

Basic pub dinner for 2, 1,485 b total

Chicken breast (500 gm) 180 b

 

Don't want to go through a long list (can if you want https://www.expatistan.com/cost-of-living/auckland) but the big items are way cheaper here. 

 

Having said that the quality of the fruit and veges in NZ and OZ is WAY better and in many cases simply outstanding.

 

As have said before, leaving to go home is an option, but why give up an easy life, warm weather, easily affordable cost of living, friends, nightlife and vibrancy, to go back to working friends, higher cost of living, cold weather and living the life of a pensioner...…...when I don't here!

[LivinLOS]

3 hours ago, Poottrong said:

From my earlier post in this thread

 

"Rent - I pay less in a month than what I would pay in a week in Aus. Granted it's a smaller, cheaply made house but I'd happily live in the same back home if they were available. On top of that I can walk to the beach here. Renting or buying a house near the beach in Aus is only for the well off these days.

 

Utilities - way cheaper in Thailand

 

Fresh fruit, veg and meat - way cheaper in Thailand except for beef and lamb. I eat home cooked Thai food daily and doing the same in Aus costs a small fortune, which is what I would want to do.

 

Internet - way cheaper and faster in Thailand

 

Imported electronics and other imports - cheaper in Aus

 

Cars - cheaper in Australia although a "cheap ass toyota" is fine with me.

 

Petrol - about the same price I think?

 

Public transport / taxis - way cheaper in Thailand

 

So all in all Thailand is WAY cheaper for me than Australia. Not even close."

 

Mind you I'm not trying to duplicate a western lifestyle here which makes all the difference. Also, I haven't been to the US but I understand it can be a very affordable country.

And what about income ?? 

I put my toes back there 2 years ago, and am there maybe 6 or 8 months a year. I started a biz and have 40 - 50 guys working for me, I expect that to be 80 to 100 by xmas.. I am now making well over 100k EUR and will be closer to 250k by the end of the year. Theres no reason I cant get that to 400 or 500k per annum over a couple more years out. 

I am doing that working there only part of the year.. Flying back and forth.. Whose making 10 - 20 mil thb a year here part time ?? 

 

[transam]

On 8/4/2018 at 11:52 AM, LivinLOS said:

I have zero desire to live like a local of a 3rd world country. 

I cannot understand why anyone from the developed world would 'want' to do that.. Be forced to, sure, but want to ?? 

We are all different, like different stuff..No point in saying "you don't understand" because you are not other folk who like different stuff...

I have no interest in stamp collecting but l would never say l don't understand what someone likes to do....Unless it was naughty....

[JLCrab]

1 hour ago, LivinLOS said:

Theres no reason I cant get that to 400 or 500k per annum over a couple more years out. 

Great -- and be sure to let us know.

[LivinLOS]

13 minutes ago, JLCrab said:

Great -- and be sure to let us know.

 

Did it before when was only early 20s.. had +- 600 working for me then.. How I 'retired' here at 28.

Brexit could put the kibosh on that bis but theres loads of others just waiting to be taken.. Fact is you can make money in the west while half asleep, so all this 'cost of this v cost of that' seems wildly irrelevant where there money just flows in and here it just flows out. 

[LivinLOS]

1 hour ago, transam said:

We are all different, like different stuff..No point in saying "you don't understand" because you are not other folk who like different stuff...

I have no interest in stamp collecting but l would never say l don't understand what someone likes to do....Unless it was naughty....

People who claim to want to.. are simply justifying thier actions. 

If they wont the lottery, would they still live in a 5k a month room ?? They want to because thats what they tell themselves to sleep at night. 

[JLCrab]

5 minutes ago, LivinLOS said:

 

Did it before when was only early 20s.. had +- 600 working for me then.. How I 'retired' here at 28.

Brexit could put the kibosh on that bis but theres loads of others just waiting to be taken.. Fact is you can make money in the west while half asleep, so all this 'cost of this v cost of that' seems wildly irrelevant where there money just flows in and here it just flows out. 

WOW!

[transam]

7 minutes ago, LivinLOS said:

People who claim to want to.. are simply justifying thier actions. 

If they wont the lottery, would they still live in a 5k a month room ?? They want to because thats what they tell themselves to sleep at night. 

So you know how I/we think and what I/we want from life...You know what we are all thinking when we go to bed......?...............?

 

Did I read somewhere that you are earning bundles employing zillions yet spend a lot of time in a third world country with all it's risks that you don't like.....?

[LivinLOS]

18 minutes ago, transam said:

Did I read somewhere that you are earning bundles employing zillions yet spend a lot of time in a third world country with all it's risks that you don't like.....?

My wife likes it and I dont mind a few months a year.. Especially Euro winter time. 

I have had fun here.. But really its much easier to like Thailand when your at the slowing stages of life, doing it when your younger limits your potential I have realised. 

[JLCrab]

I agree -- one must not limit one's potential when one has such potential.

[transam]

13 minutes ago, LivinLOS said:

My wife likes it and I dont mind a few months a year.. Especially Euro winter time. 

I have had fun here.. But really its much easier to like Thailand when your at the slowing stages of life, doing it when your younger limits your potential I have realised. 

So you have past the slowing stages of life too realise LOS is OK for those like me ...?

[BritManToo]

3 hours ago, xylophone said:

Having said that the quality of the fruit and veges in NZ and OZ is WAY better and in many cases simply outstanding.

1

All from China, same as the fruit in Thailand.