Major Change Eff 1 Apr 19 in Bangkok Bank ACH Transfers

[stargazer9999]

If the TransferWise rates are much better than BOA, Fidelity, Chase or whichever USA bank is used I guess I'm going to start using them.  If there's no way to automate the process that's a slight pain.

 

I know I can automate funds going into BOA and out via SWIFT to BKK Thailand monthly but I'll get burned on the exchange rate/fees.  

[lopburi3]

1 hour ago, stargazer9999 said:

If the TransferWise rates are much better than BOA, Fidelity, Chase or whichever USA bank is used I guess I'm going to start using them.  If there's no way to automate the process that's a slight pain.

 

I know I can automate funds going into BOA and out via SWIFT to BKK Thailand monthly but I'll get burned on the exchange rate/fees.  

Don't believe the two or three minute process to use Transferwise once a month should be much of an issue for most people as once you request the transfer everything is automatic.

[coccigelus]

Yesterday, I did a wire transfer of 1500$ from IB to Bangkok Bank US.  Today I got 44664.95 THB.  How You evaluate this conversion?  Edit: IB wire was free. 

Edited December 24, 2019 by coccigelus

[lopburi3]

25 minutes ago, coccigelus said:

Yesterday, I did a wire transfer of 1500$ from IB to Bangkok Bank US.  Today I got 44664.95 THB.  How You evaluate this conversion?  Edit: IB wire was free. 

Transferwise currently would provide 44,704.61 at the higher fees ($17.26) in use since December 12.

[Pib]

35 minutes ago, coccigelus said:

Yesterday, I did a wire transfer of 1500$ from IB to Bangkok Bank US.  Today I got 44664.95 THB.  How You evaluate this conversion?  Edit: IB wire was free. 

- $1500 sent

- $5 Bangkok Bank New York branch pass-thru fee

- $1495 arrives Bangkok Bank Thailand for exchange

- Today's 0830 opening TT Buying exchange rate was 30.01

- 1495 times 30.01 equals 44,864.95

- Bangkok Bank 0.25% (Bt200 min, Bt 500 max) receiving applied which results in Bt200 fee

- 44,864.95 minus 200 equals 44,664.95 posting to your acct

 

 

Edited December 24, 2019 by Pib

[coccigelus]

Thank You both for the details. I have recently planned to wire into Thailand once a month but I am not sure the idea make much sense on the light of the fee nicely listed by PIB. I was totally unaware of the 5$ applied by Bangkok Bank NY for instance. Once sent into Thailand I then use the Central Credit card which is in the name of my wife which bring a lot of points - promotions, especially If You do shopping at Central and Top.   Perhaps would make more sense use directly the TW debit card whenever is possible instead to wire so often into Thailand?

 

Another concerning I have is this strong THAI baht. Dollar is by no meaning a weak currency right now but THB became way stronger (especially) in the last year. ( The peak was ~ 32 THB this year and ~36 THB in 2016 )  And right now dollar doesn't look so well posed in the future, actually I believe very closed to a peak due to inflation, QE and Trump.  I wonder if It would be wise hedge a bit with precious metals as Thailand with all these public investments pumped no-stop into the economy, would be logical to think They are getting even a stronger currency. 

[Pib]

Bangkok Bank NY branch and in-Thailand fees for an international transfer via SWIFT/ACH.  Both fees are applied before posting to your acct....will not appear anywhere on your acct....this can fool some into thinking no Bangkok Bank fees were applied but indeed they were.  One minor error in the chart below where it says USD100.1 - 2,000.00....it's suppose to say USD100.01 - 2,000.00.

 

Below fees will also be applied if doing a "domestic wire" to Bangkok Bank NY.

 

https://www.bangkokbank.com/en/Personal/Other-Services/Transfers/Transferring-Into-Thailand/Transfer-money-from-US-to-Thailand-via-Bangkok-Bank-NewYork-branch

Edited December 24, 2019 by Pib

[lopburi3]

13 minutes ago, coccigelus said:

Perhaps would make more sense use directly the TW debit card whenever is possible instead to wire so often into Thailand?

Not sure what you mean as I don't have any TW debit card or account - I just use them to make money transfers and for income based retirement there is no option to use debit cards.  As for cost find TW cost effective and not much more expensive than best no fee/refund fee cards would offer.

[coccigelus]

Lopburi, You can open a borderless account with TW. I think Us nationals can open an account with them as well.  If You do that, which is free, You will get a nice multi-currency account + a debit card which is connected to the app of your mobile. 

 

https://transferwise.com/gb/borderless/

 

Pib thank You very much to provide further clarifications with the hidden cost. So in case of a transfer of let's say 2000$ We will incur in a 5$+6.63$(200THB) which mean a ~0.6% of fixed cost plus I guess other hidden fee from the currency conversion itself. Not bad, but not that good as well. 

 

 

[Pib]

Yea, the TW debit card is nothing to shout about, nothing to write home to Mom about, etc., due to pricing/fees/limits.  I don't have one....don't want one....got other US debit cards that like a Schwab debit card that are better....reimburse all fees...no fees of any kind.

https://transferwise.com/gb/borderless/pricing

[Pib]

8 minutes ago, coccigelus said:

 

Pib thank You very much to provide further clarifications with the hidden cost. So in case of a transfer of let's say 2000$ We will incur in a 5$+6.63$(200THB) which mean a ~0.6% of fixed cost plus I guess other hidden fee from the currency conversion itself. Not bad, but not that good as well. 

Yeap...and please note at $2000 "plus one penny" the NY fee goes to $10 just in case you wanted to regularly send a little over 2,000 as that seems to be an approx amount a lot of people send monthly.

 

Heck, after the fee dust settles if you sent $2005 or $2,000 you would receive exactly the same amount posting to your acct because a $2005 amount incurs a NY branch fee of $10 leaving $1995 to continue on and a $2000 amount incurs a $5 fee also leaving $1995 to continue on.  

 

And for an amount between 2,000.01 and 2.004.99 a person would receive less than a person sending 2,000 due to their sliding scale fee at that $2k trigger point. 

Edited December 24, 2019 by Pib

[coccigelus]

6 minutes ago, Pib said:

Yeap...and please note at $2000 "plus one penny" the NY fee goes to $10 just in case you wanted to regularly send a little over 2,000 as that seems to be an approx amount a lot of people send monthly.

 

Heck, after the fee dust settles if you sent $2005 or $2,000 you would receive exactly the same amount posting to your acct because a $2005 amount incurs a NY branch fee of $10 leaving $1995 to continue on and a $2000 amount incurs a $5 fee also leaving $1995 to continue on.  

 

And for an amount between 2,000.01 and 2.004.99 a person would receive less than a person sending 2,000 due to their sliding scale fee at that $2k trigger point. 

 

mmmhh. It seems reasonable wire into Thailand every 3-4 months instead of each month as I was planning to do. I am upset about that 5 dollars which I was totally unaware. Never mind less wires then into Thailand. 

 

I agree regarding Schwab being a superior option... Even though is a nice option ONLY for Us residents ..

[Pib]

35 minutes ago, coccigelus said:

 I am upset about that 5 dollars which I was totally unaware.

The Bangkok Bank transfer fees have always been posted on their website.  So, you can't really blame them...only blame yourself for not reviewing their website/fee schedules. 

 

The NY branch fee is kinda like a correspondence/intermediary bank fee and a Sending bank will always have a notice/some fine print stating that correspondence/intermediary bank and/or a receiving bank fee(s) may apply so don't blame the sending bank if a little less shows up than expected. 

 

The fact that neither fee will appear on your bank acct/statement is purely a Bangkok Bank business practice....many banks don't like pointing out their own fees too much.  The NY branch fee is sliced off before the funds even arrive you in-Thailand branch so I can understand that fee not be shown on your local branch statement, but personally I think your in-Thailand branch should show the receiving fee on your statement but they don't.

 

Now, Bangkok Bank will identify the receiving bank fee in the SMS they send you if you are signed up for their Free SMS Remittance service.  The SMS will show the funds arriving Thailand (it will be lite the NY branch fee) and it identifies the 0.25% (Bt200 min, Bt500 max) receiving bank fee.  

 

 

[riclag]

6 hours ago, Pib said:

Yea, the TW debit card is nothing to shout about, nothing to write home to Mom about, etc., due to pricing/fees/limits.  I don't have one....don't want one....got other US debit cards that like a Schwab debit card that are better....reimburse all fees...no fees of any kind.

https://transferwise.com/gb/borderless/pricing

 I'm assuming you stay here like most of us  , using retirement or marriage option. Do you set travel alerts every year on your schwab debit ? 

[Pib]

11 hours ago, riclag said:

 I'm assuming you stay here like most of us  , using retirement or marriage option. Do you set travel alerts every year on your schwab debit ? 

No.  Live here full time...over a decade...have never setup travel alerts for Schwab card....use it several times per year.

[treetops]

On 12/24/2019 at 8:50 AM, coccigelus said:

plus I guess other hidden fee from the currency conversion itself.

Yes, Bangkok Bank will convert at their published rates which are usually about 0.5% below interbank.

[coccigelus]

13 minutes ago, treetops said:

Yes, Bangkok Bank will convert at their published rates which are usually about 0.5% below interbank.

So, ~ 1.1% total cost for a 2000$ wire transfer including other fix Bangkok fees and considering free US wire.  Unimpressed. 

[stargazer9999]

I didn't seem to get my first $10.00 Transferwise test transfer to BKK Bank successfully.  Transferwise said they were sending two micro deposits which I never saw in my local BKK account.  Now the transfer status is 'cancelled' after about a week.

 

I added BOA as a USA primary bank account and BKK Thailand as a primary bank account here.  It only wanted the bank account # for Bangkok Bank, no other international transfer information.  Was this correct?  I clicked on the BKK bank account and did 'Send Money' and said it was for long term stay in Thailand.  Any suggestions?

 

Thanks.

 

[Pib]

1 hour ago, stargazer9999 said:

I didn't seem to get my first $10.00 Transferwise test transfer to BKK Bank successfully.  Transferwise said they were sending two micro deposits which I never saw in my local BKK account.  Now the transfer status is 'cancelled' after about a week.

 

I added BOA as a USA primary bank account and BKK Thailand as a primary bank account here.  It only wanted the bank account # for Bangkok Bank, no other international transfer information.  Was this correct?  I clicked on the BKK bank account and did 'Send Money' and said it was for long term stay in Thailand.  Any suggestions?

 

Thanks.

 

Micro/trial deposits go to your US bank which will fund the transfer; not to your Bangkok Bank acct.  Once you see the micro deposits in your US bank acct you then use that micro deposit info to validate the acct with Transferwise...it a one time thing.

 

Since you didn't fund your transfer because apparently you got confused regarding the micro deposit validation process Transferwise cancelled the transfer.  Have you looked at your BoA acct?   You probably see two micro deposits posted to your BoA acct and maybe also pulled back/debited. 

 

In setting up Bangkok Bank as your primary recipient you would have needed to select Bangkok Bank from the pull down menu and enter your acct number at Bangkok Bank.  And when you do actually send some money selected the For Long Term Stay Thailand will help ensure the transfers coded at Bangkok Bank as an international transfer/FTT coding.

 

 

[snooky]

Do Transfers into your Thai Bank account via 
Western Union from abroad show up as 'Foreign Transfer' ?

[stargazer9999]

Hi Pib,

 

 Thanks for the clarification.  I thought it was the same procedure as I did with Vanguard -> BKK NYC a few years ago.  Vanguard did micro deposits and I had to look at my BKK Bank passbook to see them and confirm.  I remember worrying about the exchange rate to confirm Thai baht deposits as USD for Vanguard.  If I saw 17 baht as a micro deposit was that 5 cents or 6 cents?  I got the answers right and that was the last time I had to do this dance.

 

 I'll resend the $10.00 BOA->BKK Bank and check BOA for micro deposits this time.  I did choose this option on the test transfer: "For Long Term Stay Thailand".

 

Thanks!

[stargazer9999]

These are the options for payment:

 

 

I thought it should be Bank Debit but should it actually be a Wire Transfer?  My BOA bank debit requires two-step verification which TransferWise indicates is not supported.

 

[Pib]

13 hours ago, stargazer9999 said:

These are the options for payment:

 

I thought it should be Bank Debit but should it actually be a Wire Transfer?  My BOA bank debit requires two-step verification which TransferWise indicates is not supported.

 

Correct...use bank debit ACH.  

[Thailand J]

On 12/24/2019 at 4:16 PM, coccigelus said:

I am upset about that 5 dollars

If you transfer >$2000 it is $10, and >$50000 it is $20.

I am going to keep repeating this: From IB send  international wire to BBL BK (SWIFT code BKKBTHBK) , with JPMorgan Chase as intermediary bank ( default on IB) which only charges $2 flat rate. The usual BBL BK receiving fee (500B max ) applies.

Transferring to BBL BK ,Schwab's  intermediary bank is BBL NY, I have not find a way to change it on their website.

Edited December 30, 2019 by Thailand J

[mokwit]

2 hours ago, Thailand J said:

If you transfer >$2000 it is $10, and >$50000 it is $20.

I am going to keep repeating this: From IB send  international wire to BBL BK (SWIFT code BKKBTHBK) , with JPMorgan Chase as intermediary bank ( default on IB) which only charges $2 flat rate. The usual BBL BK receiving fee (500B max ) applies.

Transferring to BBL BK ,Schwab's  intermediary bank is BBL NY, I have not find a way to change it on their website.

Is the actual currency conversion into THB done at Thai end by BBL?

[Pib]

7 minutes ago, mokwit said:

Is the actual currency conversion into THB done at Thai end by BBL?

It is unless you allow the sending bank to accomplish the conversion on their end which is usually a bad idea due to western banks' exchange rates for Thai baht being several percent below the Thai bank TT Buying Rate given for international transfers.

[mokwit]

Just now, Pib said:

It is unless you allow the sending bank to accomplish the conversion on their end which is usually a bad idea due to western banks' exchange rates for Thai baht being several percent below the Thai bank TT Buying Rate given for international transfers.

How would you stop them doing this with IB - with abank you can specify "remit as currency" but in practice can be improperly force converted by a correpondent bank in the chain? IB are moving towards greater disclosure including conversion rate so that the real cost can be better determined.

 

'We recently introduced functionality to let clients track in real-time the progress of wire withdrawals from their IBKR account. In addition, this functionality will help you better understand the costs associated with wire transfers, including the fees taken during each leg of the transaction and, if applicable, foreign exchange rates.'

 

[Pib]

I've never seen any sending bank that would automatically accomplish the exchange without your permission...you are given choice during the sending process.  If a bank does offer both options to accomplish the exchange OR send in USD (i.e., no exchange) they offer those options to you during the sending process.   And the wording may be vague and enticing to allow them to accomplish the exchange....similar to how some ATMs will offer a DCC transaction.  Bottom line, do not allow the western bank to accomplish the exchange due to the lower exchange rate...send in USD. 

 

Like with a Schwab Int'l Wire....they start off by asking if you want to send USD or Foreign Currency.

 

Edited December 30, 2019 by Pib

[mokwit]

That part I know and if Schwab uses a bank with a global network you may be Ok but it could be you have no control over what happens with the USD sent and fees/conversion spread. It is for this reason that IB are becoming more transparent because if a correspondent uses a captive customer spread it can be material cost to you. Issues can arise if you use a bank that uses a correspondent bank - you may send as USD but the correspondent bank may convert at an unfavourable rate vs conversion onshore in Thailand.

 

My query with IB sent via JPM for $2 was a concern that JPM charged you $2 and made it up by converting it to THB themselves at their rate - the $2 being a seemingly low fee to entice you in. JPM have a reputation proven or unproven for doing just this.

 

I have been at loggerheads over one test amount of $100 transaction from IB to a HK broker where there was a cost of $14 that was unexplained. The broker couldn't/wouldn't get clarification from their bank HSBC but said they thought the fee was not at their end. Key point if it is a fixed fee of $14 it is not material in this instance, but as I cannot determine whether or not it is a PERCENT fee on total funds I am not sending  a further material amount as if it is % it is a huge gauge.

 

 

[mokwit]

From memory it was actually $4 or $14 on $300 but still a huge gauge.