Another new tax on wine?

[moontang]

2 minutes ago, Shouldhaveknownbetter said:

If you do not like the tariffs placed on Western goods such as California wine and French cheese,  Twit Trump.  I know, I know, Trump is this, Trump is that, but he is doing the tariff dance right now and it would be a good idea to let him know how Thailand is ripping off the United States on tariffs.  A three dollar bottle of California real wine but generic, costs about 900 baht at rim ping.  Twit him and keep on twitting.

true, and notice how the Thais have been nearly silent in the brewing trade war...they know damn well they aren't playing fair.  Allies tend to get a little charity, but they gotta start using a two way road.

[Thaidream]

58 minutes ago, dinsdale said:

ep. It was Thaksin. Be 15 yrs ago I guess and yes the reasoning was to stop school kids drinking. Absolute nonsense.

While not a fan of Thaksin- I can assure you he did not invent the drinking times law.  It waas during the 1960s and Field Marshall Thanom Kittachachorn was the Prime Minister. It was his regime that promulgated the law allegedly to 'protect' school age children.

 

The same law applies today- and actually bars/restaurants  should not sell any alcohol between 2-5 PM and after midnight. It used to be that way for awhile during the late 60's.  Nowadays- a 2-3000 donation to interested parties usually smooths the way.

 

The wine situation in Thailand is ludicrous- a 1.5 litre of Australian wine that I purchased 4 months ago for  367 Baht now sells for 467 Baht- which is about 27% increase.  I have purchased the same wine in the US for 200 Baht.  This is pure greed and an example of a real lack of fair trade.  Thailand and Australia have a fair trade agreement and I am most surprised the Australian Government doesn't complain regarding the prices on its goods sold in Thailand.

 

One more increase on wine an I refuse to purchase any of it...

 

 

[Get Real]

8 hours ago, KittenKong said:

one could buy 8 litres of Mont Claire for 1200B

I don´t know? Maybe I am misinformed, but didn´t it stand that it was another new tax on wine?

[CanuckThai]

Wife and I were at Pullman in Khon Kaen for a couple of days over the long weekend.  Wine prices on the menu jumped again, there was no wine bought to accompany meals, plain and simple.  A couple of cocktails and a few beer...no wine, a sad state.

[swerve]

Wine prices are too high.  I have trouble purchasing a drinkable bottle of wine here for under 600 baht. Someone in Thai business and government has gotten very greedy.  My Thai wine purchases have halved as a result.  

[garzhe]

8 hours ago, bankruatsteve said:

Don't know about the timing but two weeks ago we paid B980 for 5 liters of Mont Clair and now it is over B1500 for the same package.  Big C has the 3 liter box for B1009 but I have previously not seen that size.

3 Lt here in Pattaya is now 1175B

[Dmaxdan]

A double whammy if like me you enjoy a piece of Mainland cheese with your glass of vino.


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[ukrules]

12 minutes ago, garzhe said:

3 Lt here in Pattaya is now 1175B

Mar-Y-Sol has just come back on sale today in 2 Liter boxes by the looks of it - approximately 750 Baht per box where I buy it from.

 

The previous price was around 1000 Baht for 4 Liters.

 

Old price : 250 / Liter

New Price : 375 / Liter

 

I wonder how this will affect prices in bars and restaurants.

 

Mar-Y-Sol was always the 'better' alternative to the Mont Clare which was the cheapest and nastiest of all the boxed wines.

[rickudon]

These days, the wine section in the supermarket is now full again - absolutely full, because no-one buys it. I used to like my Castle Creek, but no more - i can buy a bottle of genuine scotch whisky for less than a flagon of cheap wine. Ridiculous.

 

Just need to find some sodium Metabisulphite and in a few months wine drought should be over!

[Lucky mike]

3 hours ago, GreasyFingers said:

If the wineos moved away from the air-con they would realise that it is too hot to drink a decent wine.

And too expensive ! Kill the golden goose ?

[The Theory]

Wine is luxery. Either farang or Thai upper class. 

I stoped drinking wine and ended this tax story.

 

Edited August 1, 2018 by The Theory

[Weasel100]

3 hours ago, Weasel100 said:

Look folks. I think I'm pretty typical of foreigners here although I seem to be more down on the Thais than most.
I am not short of money but, as anywhere else, even in my former home Australia, I will not allow myself to be screwed by people I wouldn't piss on for wine that's at best just passable as wine of a kind.
Decent bottled wine is ridiculously expensive in Thailand. $AUD45 or more for a French Bordeaux. Why? Because, by and large, Thais don't drink it. Most Thais drink beer or cheap shitty "Whisky" - I hesitate to call it that.
I will drink beer mainly as an alternative to incredibly over-priced wine. I will not play their stupid game and I will not let them rip me off. They are the ones who will suffer when importers stop importing wine altogether because it's too ***ing expensive to be saleable. The previous revenue that these stupid ****ers had from wine sales will then simply be gone and up will go VAT from 7% to 10%. Watch this space

 

[moontang]

I wouldn't trade a can of shave foam for a bottle of 400 thb fruit shiite, that's for sure..and the can of Barbisol was only a buck at the Dollar Tree.

Edited August 1, 2018 by moontang

[strikingsunset]

Do you think they are trying to tell us something?


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[KittenKong]

4 hours ago, Get Real said:

I don´t know? Maybe I am misinformed, but didn´t it stand that it was another new tax on wine?

1200B for 8 litres was the old price at Makro, until a few months ago when the new prices started coming in. Those 8 litre boxes were originally exclusive to Makro and had Makro printed on them, though someone said that they saw similar boxes in BigC or somewhere later on. All gone now though, as far as I know, and replaced by the much smaller boxes to avoid the price sticker shock.

[Suradit69]

12 hours ago, ChidlomDweller said:

Just one more nail in the coffin.

I've been hearing that silly comment for 20 years whenever some farang is feeling unloved and that his petty grievances are of an earthshaking magnitude.

 

Thailand has endured a Tsunami, severe flooding and civil disorder in the streets on Bangkok, but a tax on plonk in a box will be the tipping point. 

 

[ChidlomDweller]

39 minutes ago, Suradit69 said:

I've been hearing that silly comment for 20 years whenever some farang is feeling unloved and that his petty grievances are of an earthshaking magnitude.

 

Thailand has endured a Tsunami, severe flooding and civil disorder in the streets on Bangkok, but a tax on plonk in a box will be the tipping point. 

 

Enjoy being obnoxious from the safety if your keyboard, don't you?   Like I said, death by a thousand cuts, and FYI I'm leaving Thailand after 5 years later this month.  It's one of many things bigger and small that made me fed up with the place.  Won't miss low-quality expats like you either.

[Aussieroaming]

12 hours ago, 3421abc said:

I saw some low prices wine from Chile the other day. I would think since Thailand has a free trade agreement with then it should be cheaper.

Free trade agreement doesnt mean all goods are free of import tarrifs, but some are when there is mutual benefit. Alcohol imports listed from Australia and Peru into Thailand under their FTA's state the same import tarrif rates as alcohol from other countrys. Not sure about Chile's FTA if it has one.

[Get Real]

6 hours ago, KittenKong said:

1200B for 8 litres was the old price at Makro, until a few months ago when the new prices started coming in. Those 8 litre boxes were originally exclusive to Makro and had Makro printed on them, though someone said that they saw similar boxes in BigC or somewhere later on. All gone now though, as far as I know, and replaced by the much smaller boxes to avoid the price sticker shock.

Yeah, yeah! All good. It was just little irritating me that tried to throw a sinister joke. I meant that Mont Claire, could hardly represent anything a person would like the stick under the label wine. 

Guess I was hiding my evil intentions soo good, that you just couldn´t find them.

Edited August 1, 2018 by Get Real

[Weasel100]

9 hours ago, ChidlomDweller said:

Enjoy being obnoxious from the safety if your keyboard, don't you?   Like I said, death by a thousand cuts, and FYI I'm leaving Thailand after 5 years later this month.  It's one of many things bigger and small that made me fed up with the place.  Won't miss low-quality expats like you either.

I agree. I'm also thinking about leaving Thailand after living here for seven years. I'd go tomorrow were it not for two things; 1  my Thai partner who would not want to live where I intend to go and 2  the fact that I am heavily committed to Thailand financially with a house and two cars and all the things I possess in the world.

Making the break from Thailand would not be easy but I have become increasingly pissed off by the way in which foreigners are treated in this country. We are made to feel most unwelcome and I have come to the stage where I simply spend the very great majority of my time alone at home (except late afternoons and evenings when my partner's home).

 

My solitary life suits me fine, meaning as it does that I don't have to deal with people who don't like falangs and whom I myself neither like nor respect. I know, I know what some of you are going to say!! If I liked Thais more then they might like me more.

But, when I came to Thailand seven years ago I was the friendliest of people to the locals and I liked and respected them. However, after seven years of being lied to, misled, ripped off and extorted by Thai people, my patience is at an end and I think it likely that I will some time soon apply for a visa in another country where I am sure I'll live just as well and with people who appear to value foreigners and don't try to squeeze them for money in every single transaction or meeting. I have often said that Thais are interested in only three things in life - money, money and money. They're shameful about their greed and avarice for money and possessions and they really don't care how they get either. Theft, deception, lies, deceit, extortion. All national passtimes in this land of smiles. Yeah right! The Thais smile at us only because they're constantly going through our pockets.

The latest of a number of increases in the price of wine (even barely drinkable bloody boxed wine) is just another example of where the Thais haven't got the slightest clue that they are killing the goose that lays the golden eggs. They screw foreigners financially for wine, cheese and other "luxury" goods that are not generally consumed by Thais and they wonder why so many people refuse to allow themselves to be screwed and even leave Thailand in growing numbers. The Thais actively discriminate against foreigners in the most transparent way with dual pricing at tourist places and wonder why foreigners get upset about such blatant discrimination. They wouldn't call it racial discrimination no doubt because I dare say that 95 per cent of Thais have no understanding of that term and the offence that it causes now in what I like to call the "civilized" world.
 

Thailand is NOT a civilized country. It brazenly discriminates against foreigners, it is not at all serious about ending corruption in the Police Force or the Customs service, it turns a blind eye to blatant human trafficking, prostitution and drug dealing (in exchange for payment of graft), it fails deliberately to educate its own people because we all know that uneducated people can the more easily be controlled and lied to and it has little if any interest in doing anything that might help to reduce the death toll on Thai roads which should be a national disgrace but clearly isn't seen that way. 67 million people in Thailand - who cares about 34000 deaths as a result of road accidents (the true number including those who are not deliberately left off the total by the traffic authorities because they didn't die at the scene of an accident). It's all so dishonest and callous.

I've had enough.

[bankruatsteve]

While this thread is not about the wine container, I would just like to clarify some possible misconceptions...  The wine container, whether a bottle with/without a 'bump' in the bottom, or a bottle that is corked versus capped, or whether it is contained in a box has NO AFFECT on the taste.  The only difference is that boxed wines are not designed for long term (like years) storage.  Mont Clair red "Celebration" from RSA, for example, is sold in both bottle and box.  It is the same wine, the same taste from either.  I find it much more pleasing in taste than any of the cheap imports sold in bottles.  Yet the price for the box Mont Clair (before this latest tax craziness) is much lower per liter.  Again, bottled wine doesn't make it good and boxed wine doesn't make it bad; it's all in the wine itself.

[Weasel100]

30 minutes ago, bankruatsteve said:

While this thread is not about the wine container, I would just like to clarify some possible misconceptions...  The wine container, whether a bottle with/without a 'bump' in the bottom, or a bottle that is corked versus capped, or whether it is contained in a box has NO AFFECT on the taste.  The only difference is that boxed wines are not designed for long term (like years) storage.  Mont Clair red "Celebration" from RSA, for example, is sold in both bottle and box.  It is the same wine, the same taste from either.  I find it much more pleasing in taste than any of the cheap imports sold in bottles.  Yet the price for the box Mont Clair (before this latest tax craziness) is much lower per liter.  Again, bottled wine doesn't make it good and boxed wine doesn't make it bad; it's all in the wine itself.

With respect, I think it is true that bottled wines are often better wines than those sold in boxes.
My country Australia invented the box of wine as I understand it. Australia's greatest contribution to the welfare of humanity? I wonder??

But, here's the point. Boxed wine is (or should be in Thailand) cheap BECAUSE it's not terribly good, generally speaking. Some boxed wine is fine (I used to quite like the Castle Creek Dry White sold in Makro) but it was by no means a quality wine - wine and fruit juice yes but it was 12.5% alcohol so it did the job it was intended to do.

Similarly, not all wine in bottles is good either. The good wines sold in Thailand in bottles (here I will give the example of a good French Bordeaux) will cost you close to 1,000 baht a bottle these days. Perhaps more and that's just crazy ridiculous. And because of the heat in Thailand and sometimes a  lack of appropriate storage, such a wine that you might choose to buy even at that crazy price could well be off when it's opened. And good luck taking such a wine back to Villa Market or anywhere else that sells decent wines if it is off. Am I alone in always having to fight for my consumer rights in such a situation? 

And it's all because of greed and the fact that Thais are quite OK with their national game of screw the falang. Certainly the container (box or bottle) shouldn't affect the taste of the wine they contain if it's the same wine. But, generally speaking, the better wines come in bottles, not in boxes.

The Thais just DON'T understand that boxed wine is not the same as bottled wine and it necessarily has to be considerably cheaper than bottled wine to fulfill the purpose for which the wine box was invented, a cheap alternative to good bottled wines. A wine of which you can have a glass or two often without breaking the bloody bank. As with so much, Thais just don't get this basic piece of information. Wine is for foreigners whether in a box or a bottle so let's screw the foreigners. Only the foreigners like me will simply not buy ANY wine at extortionate prices and the income stream from sale of wine will dry up, as I suspect is happening in Thailand right now.

Edited August 2, 2018 by Weasel100

[moontang]

3 minutes ago, Weasel100 said:

With respect, I think it is true that bottled wines are often better wines than those sold in boxes.
My country Australia invented the box of wine as I understand it. Australia's greatest contribution to the welfare of humanity? I wonder??

But, here's the point. Boxed wine is (or should be in Thailand) cheap BECAUSE it's not terribly good, generally speaking. Some boxed wine is fine (I used to quite like the Castle Creek Dry White sold in Makro) but it was by no means a quality wine - wine and fruit juice yes but it was 12.5% alcohol so it did the job it was intended to do.

Similarly, not all wine in bottles is good either. The good wines sold in Thailand in bottles (here I will give the example of a good French Bordeaux) will cost you close to 1,000 baht a bottle these days. Perhaps more and that's just crazy ridiculous. And because of the heat in Thailand and sometimes a  lack of appropriate storage, such a wine that you might choose to buy even at that crazy price could well be off when it's opened. And good luck taking such a wine back to Villa Market or anywhere else that sells decent wines if it is off. Am I alone in always having to fight for my consumer rights in such a situation? 

And it's all because of greed and the fact that Thais are quite OK with their national game of screw the falang.
Certainly the container (box or bottle) shouldn't affect the taste of the wine they contain if it's the same wine.
But, generally speaking, the better wines come in bottles, not in boxes.

The Thais just DON'T understand that boxed wine is not the same as bottled wine and it necessarily has to be considerably cheaper than bottled wine to fulfill the purpose for which the wine box was invented, a cheap alternative to good bottled wines. A wine of which you can have a glass or two often without breaking the bloody bank. As with so much, Thais just don't get this basic piece of information. Wine is for foreigners whether in a box or a bottle so let's screw the foreigners. Only the foreigners like me will simply not but ANY wine at extortionate prices and the income stream from sale of wine will dry up, as I suspect is happening in Thailand right now.

I haven't bought a bottle here in more than 10 years, and I used to maintain a dedicated wine fridge in the Arizona desert...paying 3-5 for reds and letting them age at 16-17c, on their sides.

[owl sees all]

1 hour ago, Weasel100 said:

I agree. I'm also thinking about leaving Thailand after living here for seven years. I'd go tomorrow were it not for two things; 1  my Thai partner who would not want to live where I intend to go and 2  the fact that I am heavily committed to Thailand financially with a house and two cars and all the things I possess in the world.

Making the break from Thailand would not be easy but I have become increasingly pissed off by the way in which foreigners are treated in this country. We are made to feel most unwelcome and I have come to the stage where I simply spend the very great majority of my time alone at home (except late afternoons and evenings when my partner's home).

 

My solitary life suits me fine, meaning as it does that I don't have to deal with people who don't like falangs and whom I myself neither like nor respect. I know, I know what some of you are going to say!! If I liked Thais more then they might like me more.

But, when I came to Thailand seven years ago I was the friendliest of people to the locals and I liked and respected them. However, after seven years of being lied to, misled, ripped off and extorted by Thai people, my patience is at an end and I think it likely that I will some time soon apply for a visa in another country where I am sure I'll live just as well and with people who appear to value foreigners and don't try to squeeze them for money in every single transaction or meeting. I have often said that Thais are interested in only three things in life - money, money and money. They're shameful about their greed and avarice for money and possessions and they really don't care how they get either. Theft, deception, lies, deceit, extortion. All national passtimes in this land of smiles. Yeah right! The Thais smile at us only because they're constantly going through our pockets.

The latest of a number of increases in the price of wine (even barely drinkable bloody boxed wine) is just another example of where the Thais haven't got the slightest clue that they are killing the goose that lays the golden eggs. They screw foreigners financially for wine, cheese and other "luxury" goods that are not generally consumed by Thais and they wonder why so many people refuse to allow themselves to be screwed and even leave Thailand in growing numbers. The Thais actively discriminate against foreigners in the most transparent way with dual pricing at tourist places and wonder why foreigners get upset about such blatant discrimination. They wouldn't call it racial discrimination no doubt because I dare say that 95 per cent of Thais have no understanding of that term and the offence that it causes now in what I like to call the "civilized" world.
 

Thailand is NOT a civilized country. It brazenly discriminates against foreigners, it is not at all serious about ending corruption in the Police Force or the Customs service, it turns a blind eye to blatant human trafficking, prostitution and drug dealing (in exchange for payment of graft), it fails deliberately to educate its own people because we all know that uneducated people can the more easily be controlled and lied to and it has little if any interest in doing anything that might help to reduce the death toll on Thai roads which should be a national disgrace but clearly isn't seen that way. 67 million people in Thailand - who cares about 34000 deaths as a result of road accidents (the true number including those who are not deliberately left off the total by the traffic authorities because they didn't die at the scene of an accident). It's all so dishonest and callous.

I've had enough.

What a post! Must be 2000 words long 

 

Stop all the whining and make your own wine in just 5 minutes and for as little as 50 bhat a litre.

Edited August 2, 2018 by owl sees all

[topt]

OP (and others) may want to see this observation here - 

https://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/639167-montclair-wine/?page=64&tab=comments#comment-13227696

and an earlier thread in General here -

https://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/1025409-wine-somethings-changing-and-its-starting-pretty-soon/?tab=comments#comment-12718887

 

or this one which was only in June...........

 

[bankruatsteve]

13 minutes ago, Weasel100 said:

With respect, I think it is true that bottled wines are often better wines than those sold in boxes.

Yes, that is true.  Because traditionally wines sold in a box are the blends and the lower grades.  There are a few "fine" wines sold in box including your French Bordeaux.  Again, it's not the box or the bottle that makes a wine bad or good, it's the wine.  IMO Mont Clair is a good enough wine and, along with the price, makes it my favorite drinking wine in Thailand.

[HAKAPALITA]

Remember when Taksin stopped the Alcohol sales in. Gas Stations . Mini Buses with Tourists left the Station , got up to Hi Way speed then did an Emergency Stop at the first mom n pops they came to so Tourists could buy a Beer for the Journey.Scared me a few time i must admit!.They still do but its a normal thing now.?[emoji481]


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[Dick Crank]

never got the attraction of wine in thailand

 

used to have a neighbor in cm who was very into wine. he sat in an aircon bungalow all day and went out in the evenings to expensive places with wine trying to pretend he was in another country. he also liked tennis, go figure

 

just not a good fit for those into wine culture which usually goes with the wine thing. but since your complaining about duties im not sure this applies to you, there are exceptions and maybe you just like wine, but thats rare

 

last i heard the neighbor relocated to portugal & paris and loves it there. the door kicked him in the arse on the way out!

Edited August 2, 2018 by Dick Crank

[dick dasterdly]

On 8/1/2018 at 10:44 AM, ChidlomDweller said:

Just one more nail in the coffin.  When people get tired of a country it's rarely one thing but death by a thousand cuts.  Then there's also the world's most idiotic law, the one regarding permitted alcohol buying times.  ?

"When people get tired of a country it's rarely one thing but death by a thousand cuts."

 

Agree entirely, so many of the people I have known here have either left, or are planning to leave ☹️.  It's never one thing, it's the accumulation of a number of things they dislike.

 

The taxes on wine are obviously ridiculous, but I suspect the wealthy Thais also drink wine?  Which makes me vaguely wonder if they aren't objecting to the outlandish taxes because it is a way to 'show off' their wealth?  i.e. 'I'm hi-so, and can afford to drink wine'?

[bankruatsteve]

13 minutes ago, Dick Crank said:

just not a good fit for those into wine culture which usually goes with the wine thing. but since your complaining about duties im not sure this applies to you, there are exceptions and maybe you just like wine, but thats rare

I have no idea what you are saying.  All I know is that my favorite happy hour beverage had a recent price increase of over 50%.  The dealer said "government tax".  Maybe it's just hitting where I live now because of FIFO?  I know many Thai who enjoy wine but most do not.  It seems wine is considered to be a farang thing and that is why I find such an outrageous price increase so repugnant.