8 hours ago, balo said:

I have only been to Hanoi, Northern VIetnam and I went winter time , and to my surprise it's very cold up north , with temperatures down to 10 degrees C, and windy.   Anyway night life close early in Hanoi and it didn't really feel like a lively city after midnight.  

 

But the food is amazing , and plenty of restaurants and bars, museums to explore. I saw plenty of backpackers there too , but not same as in SR.  

 

I think most backpackers prefer Ho Chi Minh (Saigon) , its a real party town from what I've heard. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Hanoi really is far North, and maybe too cold to spend winter. But did you like it, other than colder than optimal temperatures?

 

I'm travelling to Saigon (HCMC) at end of this month, Saigon is south, of course, I imagine weather same as Pattaya. A bit too hot, but tolerable. Saigon is so easy to get to, an hour flight,  even a bus from Phnom Penh takes only 6 hours, and costs $9 to $20 depending bus company. While visiting Cambodia, 2 years on and off, I was planning, but always oo lazy to go and check out Saigon, really should have, it is no near, and so cheap to get to. 

 

If it is a good place to stay long term, I will stsy. So i just bought Bangkok Air 1 way.  The main issue will be how easy it is to rent monthly, what are the different neighourhoods, and overall feel of the city. If it is as good as many say, maybe stay until March, but as with any place, have to check it out myself.

 

Another good thing about Saigon, it is not far from coast, just a bus ride, and apparently beaches there are nice, and water is clean. Surfer friend of mine loved it, few years back, he was near Vung Tau, he liked the wind and beaches, but said town is very, very quiet after 8pm, if true, that's not so good.

 

So I'll probably grab a small  studio in Saigon, having been watching youtube walk around videos, Saigon has nice coffee shops, and that's high on my list. Apparently Viet street food is very tasty,  and all kinds of different offerings. Street food has always been main issue in Cambodia, not very tasty. Every expat I have met in Cambodia, mainly Sianoukville, has moved there from Thailand, and most often from Pattaya for one reason only, they are retired, and pension goes further in Cambodia. And it reall is incredibly cheap, from food to beer to cigarettes to other smoke related otions.

I like Pattaya, despite all its issues, i like the mess and seediness, alltho I slmost never participate in adult entertainment. But Pattaya feels home, and thats the reason of postponing a change from Pattaya,  been procrastinating several years now, partly laziness, partly cos I still like it enough. 

I'm very curious how Saigon compares, it may easily  turn out to be bye bye to Pattaya, after about 12 winters here.

Edited October 12, 20187 yr by whitemouse

On 8/13/2018 at 12:33 AM, Nyezhov said:

If UK tourism has been killed, why is it that most of the Falang i see have those silly accents? 

You mean they all come from Yorkshire or Birmingham? Or from Russia comrade?

On 8/7/2018 at 8:03 AM, Lungstib said:

Seems like streets full of cars is fine but streets full of people need banning. Weird.

Shops, the in-building type, are very welcome indeed.

Those bring in rent, percentage of sales, quality tourists.

The whole area seems to have morphed into some strange anti couple flash packer hostel zone. After traveling across the country seing how empty the resorts are, it all made me think that Thailand is punching above its weight when you consider how anti backpacker the place has become.

 

 

On 8/15/2018 at 11:59 PM, lamyai3 said:

Not for long. The city's natural preference for chaos and disorder will soon prevail again. 

This is my guess as well. Especially if at some point the military is no longer calling the shots. The people are still the same as before the military took control. Hopefully we get some leadership that will not be so forceful and controlling and let the city naturally progress. I think there is hope.

5 minutes ago, Freddy Krueger said:

This is my guess as well. Especially if at some point the military is no longer calling the shots. The people are still the same as before the military took control. Hopefully we get some leadership that will not be so forceful and controlling and let the city naturally progress. I think there is hope.

Doesn naturally progress mean Anarchy? ????

On 10/24/2018 at 2:58 AM, HamonRye said:

The whole area seems to have morphed into some strange anti couple flash packer hostel zone. After traveling across the country seing how empty the resorts are, it all made me think that Thailand is punching above its weight when you consider how anti backpacker the place has become.

Wow, just WOW. I've wondered what it has become, or being changed into. I never get down there any more. Actually I hope the Chinese come back because the impression I get up north is barren,  an empty zone. The powers that be did a good job getting rid of backpackers and westerners. Unfortunately the Chinese got a little of the treatment also, and decamped in force. Unless they can get them back, look out.   ????

Well Chinatown is nearby so they might as well just extend Chinatown and the military will be happy , let the Chinese invasion continue.

Edited October 27, 20187 yr by balo

I never cared for Khoa San. Just a smelly dirty place. Last time I was there was to only meet a date who lived nearby. I see the Thai's turn up their nose when they see the backpacker types walk by. I watch cheap Charlies huddle around watered down drinks and cheap street food. If they don't come back, no loss to Thailand at all. Thailand is growing up. As for country revenue, it would be a tough argument to say it is a loss.

It is sadly very unlikely that Khao San will again be like the Khao San of, say, pre-2010. I have always preferred Sukhumvit to Khao San, but there have been many times that I enjoyed my hanging out at Khao San; and of course, a lot of people used to really enjoy themselves there too.

 

 

I'm staying near Khao San right now. It's true Khao San is a shell of it's former self and has lost a great deal of it's life and charm. During the day there are few people there, no stalls or cheap shopping to speak of. It was pretty sad to see, the first day I got here.  My favorite used book store was even gone, and I planned to get a lot of reading done. Peachy Guesthouse was no more. That one was hard to swallow. I used to live there when I taught English in Bangkok in my early 20's, and I was quite fond of the place and the staff, who were very generous with their time and advice. All that being said, I am still having a great time here. I've foound a cheap guesthouse for 250 baht a night and its OK. Khao San is still really wild after midnight and sometimes it can be hard to navigate your way through the drunken crowds. Thier are actually far more hookers and ladyboys and even African Hookers than any yime ive been. It's true there are less backpackers and there are more Chinese and Japanese tourists here than before. The crowd on Khao San seems to be an all around wealthier crowd. There are definitely more families. People are bringing the kids along and walking about during the day. The area is cleaner and more 'upscale', I guess you could say. One positive is I'm not relentlessly harrassed to buy something now that the vendors got kicked out. Some of those guys could get very aggressive and annoying with their high pressure sales pitches. The Indian tailors are still here and still annoying, unless you are suit shopping on your holiday I suppose. I'm hoping that eventually the military won't be running the goverment and more of the life and soul and character will reemerge, but for now it's not all bad, it's still here and it's better than nothing.

 

And there are still a lot of backpackers staying here and coming through, just not as many. There are far more police and security guards. There is still really cheap and good street food here, though the restaraunts are a bit more expensive. 

 

 

On 10/27/2018 at 3:59 PM, Nyezhov said:

Doesn naturally progress mean Anarchy? ????

No. Anarchy is only desired by complete morons. True anarchists are idiots. Anarchy is idiotic.

On 8/7/2018 at 1:55 AM, sammieuk1 said:

We want our run down street with run down stalls on it now?

We want it now!

On 10/29/2018 at 4:07 PM, Freddy Krueger said:

I'm staying near Khao San right now. It's true Khao San is a shell of it's former self and has lost a great deal of it's life and charm. During the day there are few people there, no stalls or cheap shopping to speak of. It was pretty sad to see, the first day I got here.  My favorite used book store was even gone, and I planned to get a lot of reading done. Peachy Guesthouse was no more. That one was hard to swallow. I used to live there when I taught English in Bangkok in my early 20's, and I was quite fond of the place and the staff, who were very generous with their time and advice. All that being said, I am still having a great time here. I've foound a cheap guesthouse for 250 baht a night and its OK. Khao San is still really wild after midnight and sometimes it can be hard to navigate your way through the drunken crowds. Thier are actually far more hookers and ladyboys and even African Hookers than any yime ive been. It's true there are less backpackers and there are more Chinese and Japanese tourists here than before. The crowd on Khao San seems to be an all around wealthier crowd. There are definitely more families. People are bringing the kids along and walking about during the day. The area is cleaner and more 'upscale', I guess you could say. One positive is I'm not relentlessly harrassed to buy something now that the vendors got kicked out. Some of those guys could get very aggressive and annoying with their high pressure sales pitches. The Indian tailors are still here and still annoying, unless you are suit shopping on your holiday I suppose. I'm hoping that eventually the military won't be running the goverment and more of the life and soul and character will reemerge, but for now it's not all bad, it's still here and it's better than nothing.

 

Strange because I was there a couple of weeks ago for a night out on a Saturday and it was just as raucous as it's always been. Day time is bliss being able to walk down the road without fear of getting run over by a tuk tuk or taxi. 

 

The tat is still there being sold later on if it REALLY is what you define the area as being. Personally, I don't. It's just tat and bad food. The rest is exactly like it's always been. Everyone in my group agreed. 1 thai, 1 other farang. 

 

Are you sure you were in the right area? ????

R.I.P.  Khoasan Road..... 

 

Maybe, just maybe Khao San reminds visitors and BKK administrators of something they really want to change.....backpackers with low budgets for 'quality tourists' with full pockets.........a hippie like environment doesn't fit in their plans to attract the big fish. While my opinion is to recommend Khao San as world heritage listing site.............who DIDN'T came to Thailand and enjoyed the 'all together now' environment????

Shame really, i am afraid it is not going to happen.

Anything that has been changed can be easily reinstated. Growing pains are inevitable. When the forest burns new life soon begins. Khaosan 4.0 coulf be interesting. 

 

Thailand has the greatest most amazing cultural events in the world. Do a bit of research. 

 

 

 

Which are?
 

 

Check out the activities of Richard Barrow.

Kho San road was unique & was a world recognised venue for tourists & backpackers. It was full of the charm & cheerful street traders who added to the attraction of the street. The atmosphere & cafe's there were great fun & I personally have spent many days there shopping, chilling & enjoying all the fun that was once in this place. I have been back, but it's like any other street now ...... Bangkok has lost it's edge on all the other cities in Asia, which is a shame. I find everyone just wishes to escape now at weekends .......... mostly to coastal towns like Pattaya. I hope the Bangkok authorities take note that people are voting with their feet by not coming any longer ........ what a shame that is! I remember as a child in Singapore there was "change alley" & "arab street", which were lost years ago in "keeping Singapore clean" ....... in doing so they also lost their identity .......... com'on Bangkok wake up before it's too late! Bring back the life in the city that never sleeps!

 

I think 711 intentionally not having cold beers, so you can pay the dirty mobsters out front double for a cold one to walk down a crowded street and witness more bad tattoos and body odor than a medium security prison sums it up.  

I think 711 intentionally not having cold beers, so you can pay the dirty mobsters out front double for a cold one to walk down a crowded street and witness more bad tattoos and body odor than a medium security prison sums it up.  

Why should 7-11 not have cold beers?

6 hours ago, CLW said:

7 hours ago, moontang said:

I think 711 intentionally not having cold beers, so you can pay the dirty mobsters out front double for a cold one to walk down a crowded street and witness more bad tattoos and body odor than a medium security prison sums it up.  

Why should 7-11 not have cold beers?

So people will have to pay double to get cold ones, if they want to witness the ugliest tattoo and worst body odor contests, with a beer in their hands...or pay double at an unairconditioned bar, that seems to also be a mosquito farm.

On 12/5/2018 at 8:33 PM, moontang said:

So people will have to pay double to get cold ones, if they want to witness the ugliest tattoo and worst body odor contests, with a beer in their hands...or pay double at an unairconditioned bar, that seems to also be a mosquito farm.

Thats a lie and a slander.

 

I think it’s pretty plain to see that the Thai govt has decided backpackers and party animals are not the tourists they’re after. They want to court mainland Chinese new money travelers who will buy a ton of shit in shopping malls. Sure, they occasionally take shits on historical sites, but the bottom line is they leave a lot more money in Thailand than your average young backpacker does.

27 minutes ago, Dinobot said:

I think it’s pretty plain to see that the Thai govt has decided backpackers and party animals are not the tourists they’re after. They want to court mainland Chinese new money travelers who will buy a ton of shit in shopping malls. Sure, they occasionally take shits on historical sites, but the bottom line is they leave a lot more money in Thailand than your average young backpacker does.

However,as the Thai seem to hate the Chinese,Indians,backpackers,pensioners,English teachers and cheap charlies-as do a lot of the posters here-I would say that the tourists themselves have picked up on the vibe and are going elsewhere.

 

As for the poster who remarked that "what is lost can be re-instated"  I would be tempted to observe that what works for Tralfamadore does not necessarily work on planet Earth.In fact,it never does.

 

But there again-Tralfamadore never went experienced a 4.0 phase or,if they did,they have remained extremely quiet about it.

For tourists from developed countries in the west and Asia, Thailand's draw has historically been the fact is was a) cheap b) tropical c) tasty food d) chaotic and undeveloped e) pretty girls. 

 

It was the low quality people came for.

 

Now Thailand is trying to move up the quality spectrum, but the Thais don't understand at all how to provide a quality experience (for themselves or foreigners). Thais live on average very low quality lives and low quality experiences. 

 

So, the Thai solution to this is the Thai solution to most problems: they alter only superficialites and increase prices. The experience, however, is still very low quality - which is all the Thai really understand (or expect) 

On 12/16/2018 at 8:09 AM, Fex Bluse said:

For tourists from developed countries in the west and Asia, Thailand's draw has historically been the fact is was a) cheap b) tropical c) tasty food d) chaotic and undeveloped e) pretty girls. 

 

It was the low quality people came for.

 

Now Thailand is trying to move up the quality spectrum, but the Thais don't understand at all how to provide a quality experience (for themselves or foreigners). Thais live on average very low quality lives and low quality experiences. 

 

So, the Thai solution to this is the Thai solution to most problems: they alter only superficialites and increase prices. The experience, however, is still very low quality - which is all the Thai really understand (or expect) 

Yes it makes a lot of sense ,the way you’ve explained tourist to Thailand 

Couldn't run a bath !  In only four years Thailand's been turned from one of the best nights out in the world to the miserable experience it is now,  solely due to a tin pot bunch of boy scouts...... Oh dear me.....

44 minutes ago, SupermarineS6B said:

Couldn't run a bath !  In only four years Thailand's been turned from one of the best nights out in the world to the miserable experience it is now,  solely due to a tin pot bunch of boy scouts...... Oh dear me.....

I manage to have fun at night, even down in Suk Land. Its easier to walk.