SURVEY: Did the FBI and DOJ conspire on Russian collusion?

[Srinivas]

5 minutes ago, Becker said:

From main stream (AKA sane) sources:

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_interference_in_the_2016_United_States_elections

https://www.nytimes.com/news-event/russian-election-hacking

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/2018/08/03/russian-us-election-interference-donald-trump/878910002/

 

PS. I don't know why I bother because if it's one thing you man-child supporters couldn't care less about it's facts.

those are your sources,lol wmd comes to mind.

"newyork times effects on man"

 

[Jingthing]

51 minutes ago, KMartinHandyman said:

In your not so humble opinion,in my opinion.
How’s the “do you want trump to finish his first term” poll compare to this one percentage wise?

Not sure what you're on about, but similar.

Like I said the interest in these topics on this website is dominated by "trump" supporters, American and otherwise.

That doesn't actually reflect all Americans though. 

 

https://fivethirtyeight.com/features/how-were-tracking-donald-trumps-approval-ratings/

Edited September 23, 2018 by Jingthing

[KMartinHandyman]

I'm a white older male and I can tell you I see absolutely no way that the FBI and/or anyone in the Department of Justice would fabricate any type of evidence or narrative against Trump. I have known a few personally- and while they have their own personal opinions- this does not affect how they do their job. They are highly trained and totally professional.
 
The FBI is the unit that investigates the possibility that a foreign country spies on the US or in this case attempts to subvert the American election process by favoring one candidate over another. There is no doubt- none at all that the Russians tried to interfere in the election process.  There is no doubt that individuals who were connected to Trump in an official capacity have pleaded guilty to breaking US law.   There is no doubt that Donald Trump's son met with Russians  and is being investigated for possible collusion/
 
There is no doubt that President Trump knew his son and others were meeting with Russians.  He is being investigated for collusion among other things because that is what the FBI and Justice Department do when allegations come forward indicating a crime may have been committed and it becomes even more serious when that person is the President of the US and has access to every American agent posted anywhere as well as America's most top secret archives and activities.
 
According to some posters- the FBI and DOJ should do nothing- simply allow the Russians to continue to penetrate  American systems and elections because -according to them- Trump is good for America.  Anyone want the Truth?
 
Most people of good faith even those who do not like Trump want the truth of what happened-  IMHO-  if Trump colluded with the Russians or someone on his staff did- he is not fit to be President and his legitimacy is questionable. On the other hand- if Mueller  clears Trump- so be it- his legitimacy is proven and everyone moves on  to the political season of 2020.
 
Trump and his alt right insiders are clever- they keep trying to sell the American people the narrative that there is some massive conspiracy involving the Deep State to remove Trump from Office. They  know Trump is incompetent; they know Trump has been in bed with the Russians prior to becoming President but they are creating a false narrative to enable Trump to continue as president as they try and pass law after law based upon their  alt-right- ultra conservative view that seeks to isolate America from the rest of the World; establish America's military might and interventionist profile and control the American populace economically and psychologically.
 
It is essential the Mueller investigation continue because IMHO what they will find is the following:
 
-Donald Trump has been accepting Russian money for decades prior to becoming President when he was running  Trump Inc.  He has been laundering money for Putin and his oligarchs because he needed capital to continue his failing business enterprise.  Trump was bankrupt- could not borrow any money from Western sources and simply allowed the Russians to buy into the US property market at inflated prices and pocket the money. Why won't he show his tax returns as every other American President has done?
 
-Trump has been using the Presidency to enrich himself and is in direct violation of the emoluments clause of the Us Constitution. He has not placed his holdings in Trust.  He continues to travel almost every weekend to a Trump owned property in Florida or New Jersey and billed the Us Government for  rooms; food etc for his entourage.  Even when on official business in the Us and overseas- he watches over his business assets and encourages use of these facilities.
 
-Regardless of who commissioned the dossier- it is true and Trump knows it.  I would guess that the Mueller investigation has found the exact dates Trump's plane left the US- and when it returned and has placed him in Moscow at the exact time that the dossier indicates Trump was   with Russian prostitutes and having them piss on the same bed that President Obama once occupies.  Trump hates Obama simply because Obama is well respected by Americans in a way Trump will never be respected/ I am quite certain that Mr Putin even has tape of what Trump was doing but of course we are never going to see it.
 
-Then there is the final nail- the Russian involvement attempting to subvert the US election of 2016- and one asks why would the Russians like Trump over Clinton.  Easy answer- Putin hated Clinton because of her leading a coalition against Putin's attempt to take over Ukraine and his actual  aggression against Crimea which succeeded.  Putin knows he has a friend in Trump- simply because of business dealings for decades using the oligarchs as fronts; the dossier; and realizing Trump has no experience in foreign affairs and Putin knows he has enough on Trump to subtly blackmail 
 
And if the above is not enough to be suspicious of Donald Trump and his actions how about the following:
 
-He has praised White Nationalists and angered the African American community showing a tendency towards racism
-He has called the media the 'enemy of the people' because he doesn't like  their reports
-He is amoral and immoral- proven by his own words and actions
-He has mocked the disabled and is vulgar.
-He has gone overseas and criticized the allies of America and weakens the  positron of the United States. He has pulled out of the  Climate Treaty; cancelled the agreement with Iran and creating a possible war situation; moved the Us Embassy to Jerusalem- against the wishes of his advisers;  created a 'Trade War' with China which will cost billions in lost income for American consumers; and threatened to shut down the US government in order to force funding a useless border wall.
-He  lies; exaggerates and fabricates .His own lawyer  called him a serial liar.
 
Yet, after all of this- Donald Trump would have you and I believe that there is a conspiracy to get him out of the Presidency.  Everyone is against him.  Everyone else is wrong.  Only he is right....The majority of people see Trump for what he is...even some of the Republicans..
 
He is a narcissistic meglomaniac who cannot accept the truth and thinks only he is right and that makes him a clear and present danger.   It will be interesting to see what conspiracy theory Trump comes up with when in November 2018- the Democrats control the House and the Senate..... Oh yes.... it must be because all those illegals  were allowed to vote...
 
God help us all!!!
 

Do you think we’ll get to see pictures of your claim of the Russian prostitutes pissing on the bed Obama occupied?

[mcambl61]

9 minutes ago, Becker said:

From main stream (AKA sane) sources:

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Russian_interference_in_the_2016_United_States_elections

https://www.nytimes.com/news-event/russian-election-hacking

https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/2018/08/03/russian-us-election-interference-donald-trump/878910002/

 

PS. I don't know why I bother because if it's one thing you man-child supporters couldn't care less about it's facts.

You mean your version of facts from all those credible msm articles that could not possibly have an agenda. 

 

And still no verified information connecting to the campaign 

[Thaidream]

4 minutes ago, mcambl61 said:

Wow that is a long winded emotional irrational rant. Do you need a safe space or a therapy pet? 

Not irritation or emotional or any of the things you accuse me of.   I do not hate Donald Trump.  I originally accepted his election and hoped he would be an exemplary President that worked well for America. He has been incompetent; a divider of people and a person who is such a bad example for our youth that I would not want my children to be around him or emulate him.

 

Throw aside the Mueller investigation or any collusion narrative.  There is ample evidence that Trump has placed America in a situation in which the majority of the World  looks at America with derision simply because Trump's  actions . The man is a racist; he panders to people who hate people of color; gays and lesbians; Latinos; and everyone else who is different from his alt right; ultra nationalist agenda.

 

How can anyone support a President that  refuses to believe 3,000 people died in the Puerto Rico hurricane and separates children from their parents- then deports the parents and now cannot reunite these children with their parents  when a court of law has ordered that it be done.

 

You can continue to support him if you desire- but come November- when the Democrats take over the House and Senate  because the American people have voted them in and Trump's agenda has been repudiated- you will have to accept that as fact.   Or as I mentioned will the Trump supporters blame everything on  illegals voting; the deep state or the media.  Probably so!!

[Odysseus123]

3 minutes ago, Thaidream said:

Not irritation or emotional or any of the things you accuse me of.   I do not hate Donald Trump.  I originally accepted his election and hoped he would be an exemplary President that worked well for America. He has been incompetent; a divider of people and a person who is such a bad example for our youth that I would not want my children to be around him or emulate him.

 

Throw aside the Mueller investigation or any collusion narrative.  There is ample evidence that Trump has placed America in a situation in which the majority of the World  looks at America with derision simply because Trump's  actions . The man is a racist; he panders to people who hate people of color; gays and lesbians; Latinos; and everyone else who is different from his alt right; ultra nationalist agenda.

 

How can anyone support a President that  refuses to believe 3,000 people died in the Puerto Rico hurricane and separates children from their parents- then deports the parents and now cannot reunite these children with their parents  when a court of law has ordered that it be done.

 

You can continue to support him if you desire- but come November- when the Democrats take over the House and Senate  because the American people have voted them in and Trump's agenda has been repudiated- you will have to accept that as fact.   Or as I mentioned will the Trump supporters blame everything on  illegals voting; the deep state or the media.  Probably so!!

Not to question your views but..never ever say that an election (or elections) is/are a sure thing..

 

Look what happened last time.?

[Bluespunk]

Over 51% believe the fbi and doj conspired to make up the Russian collision claims?

 

Wow!

Edited September 23, 2018 by Bluespunk

[mcambl61]

5 minutes ago, Thaidream said:

Not irritation or emotional or any of the things you accuse me of.   I do not hate Donald Trump.  I originally accepted his election and hoped he would be an exemplary President that worked well for America. He has been incompetent; a divider of people and a person who is such a bad example for our youth that I would not want my children to be around him or emulate him.

 

Throw aside the Mueller investigation or any collusion narrative.  There is ample evidence that Trump has placed America in a situation in which the majority of the World  looks at America with derision simply because Trump's  actions . The man is a racist; he panders to people who hate people of color; gays and lesbians; Latinos; and everyone else who is different from his alt right; ultra nationalist agenda.

  

How can anyone support a President that  refuses to believe 3,000 people died in the Puerto Rico hurricane and separates children from their parents- then deports the parents and now cannot reunite these children with their parents  when a court of law has ordered that it be done.

 

You can continue to support him if you desire- but come November- when the Democrats take over the House and Senate  because the American people have voted them in and Trump's agenda has been repudiated- you will have to accept that as fact.   Or as I mentioned will the Trump supporters blame everything on  illegals voting; the deep state or the media.  Probably so!!

So in your ridiculous irrational emotional rant you call him a racist. The same racist given awards from Jesse Jackson for his support of the black community. 

 

 

Hmmmm, something is a bit off here.... I wonder what it could be.... 

[KMartinHandyman]

Not irritation or emotional or any of the things you accuse me of.   I do not hate Donald Trump.  I originally accepted his election and hoped he would be an exemplary President that worked well for America. He has been incompetent; a divider of people and a person who is such a bad example for our youth that I would not want my children to be around him or emulate him.
 
Throw aside the Mueller investigation or any collusion narrative.  There is ample evidence that Trump has placed America in a situation in which the majority of the World  looks at America with derision simply because Trump's  actions . The man is a racist; he panders to people who hate people of color; gays and lesbians; Latinos; and everyone else who is different from his alt right; ultra nationalist agenda.
 
How can anyone support a President that  refuses to believe 3,000 people died in the Puerto Rico hurricane and separates children from their parents- then deports the parents and now cannot reunite these children with their parents  when a court of law has ordered that it be done.
 
You can continue to support him if you desire- but come November- when the Democrats take over the House and Senate  because the American people have voted them in and Trump's agenda has been repudiated- you will have to accept that as fact.   Or as I mentioned will the Trump supporters blame everything on  illegals voting; the deep state or the media.  Probably so!!

Even Puerto Rico doesn’t believe 3,000 people died in the hurricane like you apparently do and stated such. They state near that number from an outside statistical assumption of the deaths as a result associated with the hurricanes disruption of the status quo prior to Maria.

[Thaidream]

3 minutes ago, KMartinHandyman said:

Do you think we’ll get to see pictures of your claim of the Russian prostitutes pissing on the bed Obama occupied?

Who knows- maybe the Russian KGB saved them and is holding them for ransom and  will trade them for the release of Russians held in Us prisons. Mueller is sending Russian speaking operatives to Moscow to interview the room maids who had to change the sheets. It could be the room maids used their Smart Phones to take pictures of the soiled sheets because they knew a famous American was sleeping there.  Then again-  maybe Mueller is sending Russian speaking operatives to Bangkok and Pattaya to interview the Russian hookers plying their trade in the hopes  that one of them were the actual pissers.

 

As silly as the above is- is it any more ridiculous than the accusations  that the Trumpeters would have us believe?

[candide]

3 hours ago, thaipo7 said:

You have to be kidding me that 50% of those that have voted believe there was collusion.  The only collusion was with Hillary and the Russians.  She paid to have the phony dossier written up.  If there were any proof on this Trump would have been gone long ago.  The 50% comes from the media who is calling the shots on thing talking about this for hours each day, day after day.  The more the Left repeats this the More the fringe Left believes it.  Very sad is the state of American politics.  The Left can't stand not being in power.

 

Right! She also paid Comey to sabotage her campaign and keep silent about Trump before elections. ?

[Becker]

15 minutes ago, Srinivas said:

those are your sources,lol wmd comes to mind.

"newyork times effects on man"

 

And if you could string together a couple of semi-coherent sentences I might give you a proper reply.

[melvinmelvin]

18 minutes ago, Thaidream said:

Not irritation or emotional or any of the things you accuse me of.   I do not hate Donald Trump.  I originally accepted his election and hoped he would be an exemplary President that worked well for America. He has been incompetent; a divider of people and a person who is such a bad example for our youth that I would not want my children to be around him or emulate him.

 

Throw aside the Mueller investigation or any collusion narrative.  There is ample evidence that Trump has placed America in a situation in which the majority of the World  looks at America with derision simply because Trump's  actions . The man is a racist; he panders to people who hate people of color; gays and lesbians; Latinos; and everyone else who is different from his alt right; ultra nationalist agenda.

 

How can anyone support a President that  refuses to believe 3,000 people died in the Puerto Rico hurricane and separates children from their parents- then deports the parents and now cannot reunite these children with their parents  when a court of law has ordered that it be done.

 

You can continue to support him if you desire- but come November- when the Democrats take over the House and Senate  because the American people have voted them in and Trump's agenda has been repudiated- you will have to accept that as fact.   Or as I mentioned will the Trump supporters blame everything on  illegals voting; the deep state or the media.  Probably so!!

 

re November;

there are a number of rather sharp analysts predicting 2 republ. kindergartens after Nov

 

then next step will be re-election

 

[Srinivas]

7 minutes ago, Becker said:

And if you could string together a couple of semi-coherent sentences I might give you a proper reply.

I guess you don't know the song lyrics? sorry

id post the video link but might be considered,off topic by tptb 

youtube "staying alive bee gees lyrics"

[Thaidream]

3 minutes ago, KMartinHandyman said:

Even Puerto Rico doesn’t believe 3,000 people died in the hurricane like you apparently do and stated such. They state near that number from an outside statistical assumption of the deaths as a result associated with the hurricanes disruption of the status quo prior to Maria.

Look- I don't  believe everything I read nor accept everything I am told.  However, Donald Trump refuses to accept basic truths and he refuses to accept a higher death  toll because it would support the fact that  he did not provide enough support to Puerto Rico to recover.  I would rather have heard him say- I did the best I could with the info I was provided but it was not enough due to logistical issues etc etc. 

 

We can argue apples and oranges- but the way Trump speaks and conducts himself is totally unprofessional and a disgrace to the Presidency.

 

As I have said before- I could even overlook his vulgar comportment; his lack of empathy for the downtrodden and his immorality if he was actually helping America become great again. He is doing the opposite.  He has divided us as a people- he articulates problems but his solutions are flawed and creates chaos.  He is disliked by a majority of our overseas allies and friends.Does anyone really believe America can survive in a polarized World where most of it is against us.

 

America needs a  foreign  and domestic policy that brings people together NOT the absurd and disjointed Trumps alt right  policies and plans that will place America at a disadvantage for generations and ultimately destroy our Nation..

 

I understand completely why someone may have voted for him 2 years ago but I cannot understand after watching this man's decent into chaos- one would support his failed agenda today.

 

 

[Becker]

11 minutes ago, melvinmelvin said:

 

re November;

there are a number of rather sharp analysts predicting 2 republ. kindergartens after Nov

 

then next step will be re-election

 

Links?

[TonyClifton]

I'm guessing the trend here wasn't what the OP expected.

[smotherb]

56 minutes ago, mcambl61 said:

And STILL not one sliver of evidence of collusion.... Unlike the fbi and doj 

And, how is it you know that? I don't believe that information has yet been released--but go ahead on that contard stupor.

 

However, what we do know is that Trump's associates have been convicted or plead guilty to charges of: Conspiracy to defraud the US, Obstruction of Justice, Making False Statements before the FBI, Tax Evasion, Tax Fraud, Bank Fraud, Money Laundering, Excessive Campaign Contributions, Making False Statements to a Financial Institution, Unlawful Corporate Contributions,  and Attempted Influence of an Election

[Kieran00001]

7 minutes ago, TonyClifton said:

I'm guessing the trend here wasn't what the OP expected.

 

Who wouldn't expect the TV trend to be in support of Trump?  Or do you mean they would have expected Trump support would have been even higher?

[Bluespunk]

11 minutes ago, TonyClifton said:

I'm guessing the trend here wasn't what the OP expected.

No accounting for trump derangement syndrome. 

[TonyClifton]

4 minutes ago, Kieran00001 said:

 

Who wouldn't expect the TV trend to be in support of Trump?  Or do you mean they would have expected Trump support would have been even higher?

Knowing the mentality of the majority here, I would have expected them to think the opposite of the results.

 

 

2 minutes ago, Bluespunk said:

No accounting for trump derangement syndrome. 

since the majority here think the FBI and DOJ colluded to conspire against Trump, I think you may have not seen the results.

[Goanna]

<deleted>. Just get over it. He won, andwill win again next election in a landslide. So many bitter childish boody sooks about.

[Kieran00001]

10 minutes ago, TonyClifton said:

Exactly.  This is what I expected but you, as usual, weren't clear in your statement.  Better luck next time.

Well, you lost me too, Tony.

[smotherb]

Just now, TonyClifton said:

Blah, blah, blah, blah ......

 

So much written and so little said.  Just wait until the declassifying of the documents.  Heads will roll in Washington.

Oh, you haven't heard my omniscient one;  declassifying the documents is just another victim of the continual back-tracking of the Great Orange Waffle-King 

[TonyClifton]

2 minutes ago, smotherb said:

Oh, you haven't heard my omniscient one;  declassifying the documents is just another victim of the continual back-tracking of the Great Orange Waffle-King 

Please keep your #FAKENEWS to yourself.

[smotherb]

Just now, TonyClifton said:

Please keep your #FAKENEWS to yourself.

You can't really be that . . . .maybe you are. Let me speak to you in your own language, parlez vous FOX News?

What role has Rosenstein played in decision to declassify? | Fox News

www.foxnews.com/.../09/.../what-role-has-rosenstein-played-in-decision-to-declassify.ht...

2 days ago - Trump is reportedly backing off decision to declassify key documents in Russia ... asked, when the president said he was going to declassify documents. ... Trump backtracked for some reason and I think that was a big gift to ...

[Bluespunk]

1 minute ago, TonyClifton said:

Please keep your #FAKENEWS to yourself.

https://apple.news/Al2aE0kzlQfiSF2uA-t0Ymw

[TonyClifton]

2 minutes ago, Bluespunk said:

https://apple.news/Al2aE0kzlQfiSF2uA-t0Ymw

Quote

Therefore, the Inspector General has been asked to review these documents on an expedited basis. I believe he will move quickly on this (and hopefully other things which he is looking at). In the end I can always declassify if it proves necessary. Speed is very important to me - and everyone!”

As usual, the entire story is not told.  Nice try obfuscating the truth. Better luck next time.

[TonyClifton]

1 minute ago, Bluespunk said:

Those who believe otherwise are deluding themselves. 

Perhaps you need to read it again:

Therefore, the Inspector General has been asked to review these documents on an expedited basis. I believe he will move quickly on this (and hopefully other things which he is looking at). In the end I can always declassify if it proves necessary. Speed is very important to me - and everyone!”

[Bluespunk]

1 minute ago, TonyClifton said:

Perhaps you need to read it again:

Therefore, the Inspector General has been asked to review these documents on an expedited basis. I believe he will move quickly on this (and hopefully other things which he is looking at). In the end I can always declassify if it proves necessary. Speed is very important to me - and everyone!”

As I say, back tracking on his earlier statement of intent. 

Edited September 23, 2018 by Bluespunk