Help! Ripped Off

[peibol77]

Hey guys,

 

I would like to ask for some help/advice on dealing with a situation that has been extremely stressful and is still to this day unresolved.

 

6 weeks ago, being in Spain visiting my family, I decided I wanted to finally go ahead and buy a wonderful 2nd hand Benelli TNT300 that I had my eyes on (I saw it on Kaidee). I wanted it to be checked by a mechanic and delivered to my condo in Pattaya before I arrived there so I started to search for "bike mechanic" services on Facebook and came up with a service on Facebook. After a few days chatting with them they said they could handle the entire process: from inspecting and buying the bike for me, to getting the paperwork in place and transporting the bike to my condo in Pattaya before I even arrived. That seemed like a great idea. So before I wired them any money, I had a look at their website and Facebook. They had several good reports, with a 4.8/5 rating, so without looking any further I said OK, let's do this. That was 6 weeks ago.

 

What happened after that is so painful that I don't even want to think of it. Not only did they fail to even inspect any of the bikes I proposed that I saw in Kaidee (always with some excuse), but they constantly tried to sell me on other bikes that I didn't have an interest in. Eventually they showed me a TNT300 (not on Kaidee) that looked really good at a really good price, 65,000 baht. Saw pics and all looked awesome. Eventually I said, OK, let's buy it, and wired them the 65,000 baht. That was about 4 weeks ago now. After a week of them "trying" to get an appointment to inspect the bike, they tell me that "oh my buddha, the owner doesn't have a green book". So we ditch that one. I go look on Kaidee again, find a couple more to look at. Some more excuses when I tell them to go inspect another bike, they never actually inspect it. Another week goes by and suddenly they tell me "oh the old bike, he now has a green book!" At this point this smelled SOOO FISHY, but I already gave them the money and I was still in Spain, so I figured all I could do was play along. Then the saga of the DLT started. They never were able in 2 weeks before I arrived to Thailand to get the Green Book changed to my name or their name.

 

And eventually I came to Thailand. This was last week. My contact told me to meet him at the DLT in Chatuchak. So I go there, and while I wait for him, he tells me he had an accident and sends me some whatever pictures of a crashed bike. At this point there is no doubt in my head that I'm being played for a fool and these people are simply a bunch of criminals trying to rip me off. So I tell him to refund me or I will go to the police. He then says "he doesn't want problems and he will refund me". But one week later, I'm still waiting. He answers my messages once every 2 days with new excuses ("the accounting department has been notified, let me check with them", etc). 

 

The point where I need help is with what should my next steps be to effectively deal with this disgusting situation. Should I just go to the police in Bangkok and hand them all the evidence I have? Should I hire a debt collecting company? A Private Investigator? 

 

These people are clearly criminals, so I advice everyone else to stay clear of them. I've never had such a situation before in Thailand and I'm a little uncertain as to how to proceed. I don't like involving the Thai Police in this or any other matters, but maybe that's the only option.

 

If anyone here is willing to give me some advice on how to deal effectively with the situation, it would be greatly appreciated. I would like not only to get my money back, but to teach these criminals a lesson so that they don't take advantage of other well-intended people. 

 

Thanks in advance, guys.

Peibol77

Edited September 24, 2018 by metisdead
All caps removed from topic title.

[Happy Grumpy]

1) Don't send money for them to do something when you're not here.

2) Don't expect them to do anything unless you're observing.

[peibol77]

2 minutes ago, Happy Grumpy said:

1) Don't send money for them to do something when you're not here.

2) Don't expect them to do anything unless you're observing.

Yes thanks. I'm clearly establishing new policies in my mind when it comes to future potential situations like this one, these 2 will be there.

 

But now I want to deal with this one. If you have any advice, it'll be welcome.

[OmegaRacer]

And be careful to name them on the internet, the defamation laws are very strict here, even if you're in the right.

[Happy Grumpy]

Just now, peibol77 said:

If you have any advice, it'll be welcome.

Stop naming them online or you'll owe them another 65,000thb for defamation under the computer crimes act.  

[peibol77]

2 minutes ago, Happy Grumpy said:

Stop naming them online or you'll owe them another 65,000thb for defamation under the computer crimes act.  

Thanks for the heads-up. Incredible that I would still have to pay the <deleted>. That's what laws are for, I guess. To protect criminals.

 

Can anyone give me some actionable advice on how to proceed?

[jackdd]

I would go to their shop/office and have a talk with them in person

If they don't agree to give you the money back while you are there i would call the police and see if this helps.

If this does not help you can try to contact the consumer protection board, maybe they can help.

In case this all doesn't help anything you can decide if you want to get a lawyer involved, but the question will be if that's worth it

[peibol77]

4 minutes ago, OmegaRacer said:

And be careful to name them on the internet, the defamation laws are very strict here, even if you're in the right.

Thanks, OmegaRacer. Just adapted the text to avoid legal bs. Still I think people should know. Other people are in the risk of being ripped off. In the case that anyone sent me a private message and asked me who they were, I would feel compelled to give it to them. 

[peibol77]

1 minute ago, jackdd said:

I would go to their shop/office and have a talk with them in person

 If they don't agree to give you the money back while you are there i would call the police and see if this helps.

 If this does not help you can try to contact the consumer protection board, maybe they can help.

In case this all doesn't help anything you can decide if you want to get a lawyer involved, but the question will be if that's worth it

Thanks a bunch, jackdd. That seems a highly rational plan to follow. Thanks again!

[papa al]

if you bend over and spread your cheeks...

...what do you think will happen?

[worgeordie]

You are buying a motorbike in Thailand,without been here!!,

enough said.

regards worgeordie

[peibol77]

5 minutes ago, papa al said:

if you bend over and spread your cheeks...

 ...what do you think will happen?

Yeah, very helpful.

 

You know, some people actually think others will do what they say they will do, instead of running away with your money. I know I dropped the ball on this one, but if you have nothing helpful to say, keep these useless comments to yourself.

 

[peibol77]

2 minutes ago, worgeordie said:

You are buying a motorbike in Thailand,without been here!!,

 enough said.

regards worgeordie

Yeah, another helpful comment.

[peibol77]

3 minutes ago, worgeordie said:

You are buying a motorbike in Thailand,without been here!!,

 enough said.

regards worgeordie

By the way, I have been in Thailand more than 20 times. And spend a lot of time here. I was just 2 months back in Spain and thought why not get me a treat for when I come back.

 

But don't let my stupid comments spoil your self-righteousness and superior knowledge of life. Enjoy it in all its glory.

[LivinLOS]

8 minutes ago, peibol77 said:

Yeah, very helpful.

 

You know, some people actually think others will do what they say they will do, instead of running away with your money. I know I dropped the ball on this one, but if you have nothing helpful to say, keep these useless comments to yourself.

 

You are new here arent you !! 

Seriously.. at 65k its a cheap lesson.. 

[worgeordie]

Just now, peibol77 said:

By the way, I have been in Thailand more than 20 times. And spend a lot of time here. I was just 2 months back in Spain and thought why not get me a treat for when I come back.

 

But don't let my stupid comments spoil your self-righteousness and superior knowledge of life. Enjoy it in all its glory.

You should have waited till you got here and viewed the bikes yourself,

20 times here and you seemed to have learnt very little.

"your self-righteousness and superior knowledge of life. Enjoy it in all its glory."

A.K.A. common sense, if you had used it you would not be posting on TV, with HELP ripped off,

 

But I hope you learn from your mistakes,have a good day.

 

regards worgeordie

[mercman24]

sorry about your problems mate yes this site is full of smart asses, who take great joy out of ones plight, as suggested you need to meet up man to man as it were, as if you dont this will go on and on, best of luck

[peibol77]

1 minute ago, worgeordie said:

You should have waited till you got here and viewed the bikes yourself,

20 times here and you seemed to have learnt very little.

 "your self-righteousness and superior knowledge of life. Enjoy it in all its glory."

 A.K.A. common sense, if you had used it you would not be posting on TV, with HELP ripped off,

 

But I hope you learn from your mistakes,have a good day.

 

regards worgeordie

Committing mistakes is part of life, worgeordie. So I certainly plan on learning from this one.

 

It's not as much the money that worries me, I have enough. It's the principle. I want these dudes to give me the money back AND learn a lesson. Not sure how to do that yet, but I'll keep searching for options.

 

You have a nice day.

[mauGR1]

13 minutes ago, peibol77 said:

18 minutes ago, worgeordie said:

You are buying a motorbike in Thailand,without been here!!,

 enough said.

regards worgeordie

By the way, I have been in Thailand more than 20 times. And spend a lot of time here. I was just 2 months back in Spain and thought why not get me a treat for when I come back.

 

But don't let my stupid comments spoil your self-righteousness and superior knowledge of life. Enjoy it in all its glory.

Apparently your internet skills are bigger than your common sense.

Do you expect to be complimented for your business skills ?

Honestly, i find hard to believe that one can be so dumb

[Happy Grumpy]

Go there, bring a Thai with you. 

[peibol77]

12 minutes ago, mercman24 said:

sorry about your problems mate yes this site is full of smart asses, who take great joy out of ones plight, as suggested you need to meet up man to man as it were, as if you dont this will go on and on, best of luck

Thanks, man. I just looked up their site and I noticed they have only one address which is very fishy: Sukhumvit 101/1, Bangkok. Probably they just added a "generic" address in their Facebook and it's not even real.

 

I really should have done my due diligence before doing anything with these people. The funny thing is there is several people who have left positive reviews of them, even one here on TV, but mostly about their licensing services, which apparently they outsource to a nice lady.

 

I'll try and go to that address and see what I find...

Edited September 24, 2018 by peibol77

[peibol77]

1 minute ago, mauGR1 said:

Apparently your internet skills are bigger than your common sense.

Do you expect to be complimented for your business skills ?

 Honestly, i find hard to believe that one can be so dumb

Thanks, very helpful you too. Enjoy your higher intelligence and rejoice at my dumbness. Be my guest.

[peibol77]

2 minutes ago, Happy Grumpy said:

Go there, bring a Thai with you. 

Thanks!

[The Deerhunter]

It is remotely possible that some of the things they told you are true but once having got your money and quite possible having "borrowed" some of in it expectation of finding you a cheaper bike etc etc, they are reluctant to, or now find it impossible to, give it back to you.     Never diagnose enemy action where sheer stupidity will suffice to explain.   Lots of people in Thailand are not good at handling money that is not theirs.   I know this is true, in many places, but particularly so here in LOS!.    Do not involve the police unless you are prepared to pay them, possibly up to 10% or even 50% of the missing 65,000 or they will assuredly do nothing or worse, side with their countryman over you.

[Kwasaki]

 

14 minutes ago, Happy Grumpy said:

Go there, bring a Thai with you. 

I would say more than one and looking like this.

 

[peibol77]

7 minutes ago, The Deerhunter said:

It is remotely possible that some of the things they told you are true but once having got your money and quite possible having "borrowed" some of in it expectation of finding you a cheaper bike etc etc, they are reluctant to, or now find it impossible to, give it back to you.     Never diagnose enemy action where sheer stupidity will suffice to explain.   Lots of people in Thailand are not good at handling money that is not theirs.   I know this is true, in many places, but particularly so here in LOS!.    Do not involve the police unless you are prepared to pay them, possibly up to 10% or even 50% of the missing 65,000 or they will assuredly do nothing or worse, side with their countryman over you.

Thanks The Deerhunter (great movie, by the way!)

 

I totally understand what you say. This was my first instinct with them. I assumed they were simply inefficient, and what you say ("borrowed" some of it and then finding it impossible to give it back, etc) is exactly what I think has happened. So interesting what you say: "Never assume enemy action where sheer stupidity will suffice to explain". I think you are so right there!

 

Thanks again for taking the time to share your two cents with me. You have been most helpful, sir. Even from a philosophical standpoint! ☺

[The Deerhunter]

5 minutes ago, peibol77 said:

Thanks The Deerhunter (great movie, by the way!)

 

I totally understand what you say. This was my first instinct with them. I assumed they were simply inefficient, and what you say ("borrowed" some of it and then finding it impossible to give it back, etc) is exactly what I think has happened. So interesting what you say: "Never assume enemy action where sheer stupidity will suffice to explain". I think you are so right there!

 

Thanks again for taking the time to share your two cents with me. You have been most helpful, sir. Even from a philosophical standpoint! ☺

P.S.  I never have seen the movie.  but have shot my share and a few other peoples' of deer in three countries.    Shhhh  Don't tell anyone but I'm not even American....

Edited September 24, 2018 by The Deerhunter

[4evermaat]

28 minutes ago, peibol77 said:

By the way, I have been in Thailand more than 20 times. And spend a lot of time here. I was just 2 months back in Spain and thought why not get me a treat for when I come back.

 

But don't let my stupid comments spoil your self-righteousness and superior knowledge of life. Enjoy it in all its glory.

 

If you have been to thailand so often, you could have communicated with people that you trust to make a contract for the bike on your behalf with a small deposit.  Then when you arrive you would pay the remaining funds.

 

Or if you trust your Thai/Foreigner friend that much, you could buy it in full in their name, and then they transfer it into your name later when you arrive.

 

Of course when you are scammed you can think of all the things that you could have done with that money.  But the best prevention is to consider ways to avoid or minimize getting caught in a scam in the first place.  Otherwise, history will repeat itself.

[DILLIGAD]

First thought is expect to have to pay the police to help with this ‘domestic’ problem.
2nd thought, play them at those own game. Tell them have decided to buy a newer/dearer bike and see what they suggest. Arrange a meeting to view another bike but bring with you an off-duty(paid off) Police man to deal with negotiations/threats for you.
3rd thought. Do not trust people you do not know, especially 1) in Thailand 2) on internet.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[peibol77]

52 minutes ago, DILLIGAD said:

First thought is expect to have to pay the police to help with this ‘domestic’ problem.
2nd thought, play them at those own game. Tell them have decided to buy a newer/dearer bike and see what they suggest. Arrange a meeting to view another bike but bring with you an off-duty(paid off) Police man to deal with negotiations/threats for you.
3rd thought. Do not trust people you do not know, especially 1) in Thailand 2) on internet.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Good advices, thanks. 

 

I do tend to be a bit naive. Mostly because I never intend any harm and always intend to honor my word no matter what, so I (naively) expect others to extend me the same courtesy. Funnily enough, in my 40 years of life I've done pretty good assuming goodness in others, but this is not the first time I'm caught off side. I definitely should be less lenient in my due diligences.

 

Thanks again for the actionable advice!