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Russia completes delivery of S-300 system to Syria

 

FILE PHOTO - An S-300 air defense missile system launches a missile during the Keys to the Sky competition at the International Army Games 2017 at the Ashuluk shooting range outside Astrakhan, Russia August 5, 2017. REUTERS/Maxim Shemetov

 

MOSCOW (Reuters) - Russia has delivered an S-300 surface-to-air missile system to Syria, it said on Tuesday, in defiance of Israeli and U.S. concerns that the arms sale would embolden Iran and escalate the Syrian war.

 

Defence Minister Sergei Shoigu told President Vladimir Putin during a meeting broadcast by Rossiya 24 TV: "The work was finished a day ago," adding that the system would improve the security of Russian military personal in Syria.

 

Russia decided to supply the system after Moscow accused Israel of indirectly causing the downing of a Russian military jet near Syria in September.

 

Israel voiced regret at the deaths of 15 Russian air crew while saying Syrian incompetence was at fault and that it was compelled to continue taking action against suspected deployments of Iranian-backed forces across its northern border.

 

"We have not changed our strategic line on Iran," Israeli Education Minister Naftali Bennett, a member of Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu’s security cabinet, said on Tuesday.

 

"We will not allow Iran to open up a third front against us. We will take actions as required," he told Israel Radio.

 

In Washington, State Department spokeswoman Heather Nauert could not confirm reports that the S-300 had been delivered.

 

"I cannot confirm that that is accurate. I hope that they did not," she told a press briefing. "That would be, I think, sort of a serious escalation in concerns and issues going on in Syria, but I just can't confirm it."

 

(Reporting by Polina Devitt in Moscow, Dan Williams in Jerusalem and Lesley Wroughton in Washington; editing by Robin Pomeroy and James Dalgleish)

 

-- © Copyright Reuters 2018-10-03

[ezzra]

Give a monkey a razor, he either shave with it or cut people around him, S-300 in the hands of jittery Syrian army gunners and Russia wouldn't be surprise when more of its planes will be shot down, as for the Israeli air force, the S-300 are nothing new to the region and they're well trained to avoid them...

[Galactus]

3 hours ago, ezzra said:

Give a monkey a razor, he either shave with it or cut people around him, S-300 in the hands of jittery Syrian army gunners and Russia wouldn't be surprise when more of its planes will be shot down, as for the Israeli air force, the S-300 are nothing new to the region and they're well trained to avoid them...

 

you think s300 system will be used by Syrians? It will be operated by Russian soldiers.

I think these s300 system is great to curb the Israeli attacks in the region.

Due to the stupid move of Israeli air force which resulted on a downed Russian plane and 15 deaths, russia will be stronger in the region.

means we see more blood.

[DaddyWarbucks]

4 minutes ago, Galactus said:

 

you think s300 system will be used by Syrians? It will be operated by Russian soldiers.

I think these s300 system is great to curb the Israeli attacks in the region.

Due to the stupid move of Israeli air force which resulted on a downed Russian plane and 15 deaths, russia will be stronger in the region.

means we see more blood.

Agreed.

The Israelis brought this on.

Shot themselves in the foot again.

[connda]

We live in interesting times...

[friendofthai]

The story began in 2013 when the delivery was cancelled under pressure of Western countries. Happy to see that our tsar Vladimir Putin is ready to demonstrate his big balls in Syria. That's a good news, finally!

Edited October 3, 2018 by friendofthai

[saminoz]

4 hours ago, DaddyWarbucks said:

Agreed.

The Israelis brought this on.

Shot themselves in the foot again.

Not really.  I suspect that Israel will simply destroy the system in short order.

[Galactus]

2 hours ago, saminoz said:

Not really.  I suspect that Israel will simply destroy the system in short order.

 

destroying that system is not an east feat i tell you. and it will be supported with s200 and other missiles too.

good if they down some Israeli aggressors and give them a lesson. Israel acts like it is untouchable but in the first opportunity, Russians will down Israelis planes.

[Morch]

14 hours ago, ezzra said:

Give a monkey a razor, he either shave with it or cut people around him, S-300 in the hands of jittery Syrian army gunners and Russia wouldn't be surprise when more of its planes will be shot down, as for the Israeli air force, the S-300 are nothing new to the region and they're well trained to avoid them...

 

Your analogy is off. This is more or less an electric razor machine. No cutting one-self in the morning etc. Operation is, to a large extent, automated, and Russia stated it would provide and install the required identification codes (which weren't in place up to now). Granted, systems can be disrupted and operators can always take charge with unpredictable results, but by and large, an improvement of capabilities.

 

The IAF had time to practice against variants of the system, but not necessarily a similar one. I would be surprised if relevant tactics and means were not prepared, but that doesn't necessarily mean dealing with these systems is a walk in the park.

[Morch]

10 hours ago, Galactus said:

 

you think s300 system will be used by Syrians? It will be operated by Russian soldiers.

I think these s300 system is great to curb the Israeli attacks in the region.

Due to the stupid move of Israeli air force which resulted on a downed Russian plane and 15 deaths, russia will be stronger in the region.

means we see more blood.

 

Considering that Syrian air defense personnel already received training on said systems, and that the elements previously provided are already operated by Syrians, your statement is probably incorrect. You're welcome to provide support for such, though.

 

You can think whatever you like, but the system is not quite the game-changer it might have been years ago. Still a capable piece of hardware, but not top of the line (that would be the Russian operated system deployed to their own base in Syria).

 

There was no "stupid move" on the IAF's side. Both Russian and Syrian were incompetent and things panned out the way they did. Also, the IAF does not make decisions as to whether to carry air raids, that would be the Prime Minister and the Minister of Defense.

 

Not expecting a whole lot of coherence, but if them systems will indeed "curb" Israeli air raids, how would that result in "more blood"?

Edited October 3, 2018 by Morch

[Morch]

6 hours ago, friendofthai said:

The story began in 2013 when the delivery was cancelled under pressure of Western countries. Happy to see that our tsar Vladimir Putin is ready to demonstrate his big balls in Syria. That's a good news, finally!

 

You mean the same Putin who basically agreed to Israel's ongoing air raids in Syria for the past few years? As in the Russians complaining the about the timing of the advance warning agreed upon with Israel?

[Morch]

3 hours ago, Galactus said:

 

destroying that system is not an east feat i tell you. and it will be supported with s200 and other missiles too.

good if they down some Israeli aggressors and give them a lesson. Israel acts like it is untouchable but in the first opportunity, Russians will down Israelis planes.

 

Not that I doubt your vast experience in the field of destroying air-defense systems, but the same was said in the past. Last time something like this was played out, Syrian air defense took a severe hit. If this was back when the system was produced/ordered, it would have been a more serious hurdle.

 

You can go on about how the Russians will down Israeli planes, but that's unlikely to happen. The cooperation (as in hotline) is still in place, and if Russia wanted to take action against the IAF, it could have done so before, during and after the incident. The system it deployed to protect its own base is a more advanced version, and yet...

 

Somehow doubt the Russian are in the business of fulfilling the extreme fantasies some posters entertain.

 

[SinCityGr8One]

The S-300 system is a potent and deadly accurate weapons system. The system has 6 launch vehicles each with 4 missiles. Plus the entire system is mobile. It utilizes multiple bands of radar. Also, stealth aircraft can be detected by it once the aircrafts weapon bay is opened. This will eliminate any incursions into Syrian airspace by Israeli aircraft. The system can also tell either friendly or foe aircraft. The system also has the capabilities to make Electronic Warfare countermeasures useless. I'm not sure what S-300 missile it will utilized as there are variants which have artificial intelligence built in the missiles guidance system. The Syrian air defence crew to man it has been thoroughly trained and is operational. Should Israel decide to do a commando raid to disable it, rather than to lose aircraft, however there are Spetsnaz units on the ground to defend the system. It is the perfect aerial denial system for Syria or other Countries to have. Plus the Russian bases in Syria and Tartrus have the stepped up S-400 system to defend them. 

[tifino]

 

the Russians and their denials of supplying Weapons of MAS Destruction...

Surprised if they didn't have the new one designated S-380!

[Morch]

21 minutes ago, SinCityGr8One said:

The S-300 system is a potent and deadly accurate weapons system. The system has 6 launch vehicles each with 4 missiles. Plus the entire system is mobile. It utilizes multiple bands of radar. Also, stealth aircraft can be detected by it once the aircrafts weapon bay is opened. This will eliminate any incursions into Syrian airspace by Israeli aircraft. The system can also tell either friendly or foe aircraft. The system also has the capabilities to make Electronic Warfare countermeasures useless. I'm not sure what S-300 missile it will utilized as there are variants which have artificial intelligence built in the missiles guidance system. The Syrian air defence crew to man it has been thoroughly trained and is operational. Should Israel decide to do a commando raid to disable it, rather than to lose aircraft, however there are Spetsnaz units on the ground to defend the system. It is the perfect aerial denial system for Syria or other Countries to have. Plus the Russian bases in Syria and Tartrus have the stepped up S-400 system to defend them. 

 

That sounds like how the brochure reads. But then one recalls this is not a new system, and that there are several variants. Very doubtful that Syria is getting the (formerly) top-of-the-line version (Russia largely refrains from exporting such). Quite a few of the features you excitedly cite are rather trivial, and exist with most modern systems.

 

As for the Syrian crews being "thoroughly trained" - these would be the same Russian trained Syrian air-defense personnel who managed to shoot down the Russia plane. In this context, the system's highlight is that it can be operated in largely automated manner.

 

The bit about Russian Spetsnaz guarding Syrian air-defense systems is rather amusing. Do provide a credible link if such exists.

 

The Russian operated S-400 system didn't seem to do such a great job detecting said Israeli air raid, and of course, there wasn't a Russian attempt to intercept - not in this case, nor many others. Posters may wish to be informed that a coordination mechanism is in place between Israel and Russia, with regard to such air raids.

[SinCityGr8One]

12 minutes ago, tifino said:

 

the Russians and their denials of supplying Weapons of MAS Destruction...

Surprised if they didn't have the new one designated S-380!

Where did you get the information that Russia is supplying Weapons of Mass Destruction, other wise known as WMD, and not MAS. That includes Biological, Nuclear, Radiological and Chemical weapons. Do you really know what you are posting about? S-380 or A-380 as in Airbus Jumbo Jet? Don't forget, Israel is NOT a signatory to The Nuclear Proliferation Treaty. And there was a leak that Israel has 400+ Nuclear Devices ready and available for use.

[tifino]

4 minutes ago, SinCityGr8One said:

Where did you get the information that Russia is supplying Weapons of Mass Destruction, other wise known as WMD, and not MAS. That includes Biological, Nuclear, Radiological and Chemical weapons. Do you really know what you are posting about? S-380 or A-380 as in Airbus Jumbo Jet? Don't forget, Israel is NOT a signatory to The Nuclear Proliferation Treaty. And there was a leak that Israel has 400+ Nuclear Devices ready and available for use.

 but i didn't write 'mass'

 

 

and I'll leave the leaks tasks to Wiki

 

 

and the 'S380' could have been denoted, to tell the world to not blame them for what can probably never be proven... (a sort of ideal taunt... in-their-faces)

[Galactus]

1 hour ago, Morch said:

 

Not that I doubt your vast experience in the field of destroying air-defense systems, but the same was said in the past. Last time something like this was played out, Syrian air defense took a severe hit. If this was back when the system was produced/ordered, it would have been a more serious hurdle.

 

You can go on about how the Russians will down Israeli planes, but that's unlikely to happen. The cooperation (as in hotline) is still in place, and if Russia wanted to take action against the IAF, it could have done so before, during and after the incident. The system it deployed to protect its own base is a more advanced version, and yet...

 

Somehow doubt the Russian are in the business of fulfilling the extreme fantasies some posters entertain.

 

 

sure not an expert of 'art of killing mankind'  but know a thing or two after seeing all these wars, deaths and destruction in my short life span unfortunately.

 

and why all these fuss and bitching and moaning followed by embargoes or sanctions or threats when russia wants to export s300 and s400 to other countries?

recently, chinese got sanctions from usa due to their purchase of s 400. looks like turkey will follow the case too.

s300 and s400 are advanced systems and depending on the agreement, they might be run or constantly supervised by russian personal. usually this way.

s300 system can lock down to an Israeli plane right after it takes off from its base due to close proximity of syria. hence israel is in shock now and crying.

[MaksimMislavsky]

40 minutes ago, tifino said:

but i didn't write 'mass'

You probably meant SAM (surface-to-air missile, which s300 is), but actually wrote MAS which is a sort of misleading

[Morch]

11 minutes ago, Galactus said:

 

sure not an expert of 'art of killing mankind'  but know a thing or two after seeing all these wars, deaths and destruction in my short life span unfortunately.

 

and why all these fuss and bitching and moaning followed by embargoes or sanctions or threats when russia wants to export s300 and s400 to other countries?

recently, chinese got sanctions from usa due to their purchase of s 400. looks like turkey will follow the case too.

s300 and s400 are advanced systems and depending on the agreement, they might be run or constantly supervised by russian personal. usually this way.

s300 system can lock down to an Israeli plane right after it takes off from its base due to close proximity of syria. hence israel is in shock now and crying.

 

There wasn't anything said about "art of killing mankind", the reference was with regard to air-defense systems. Not a whole lot to do with your claimed experience of war either, even if one believed it. Deflect away.

 

Back when objections were raised, the system was more of a "thing". Nowadays, it is still a formidable piece of military hardware, but not to the same extent. I'm certain that any air force would prefer facing less advanced and capable systems, regardless of whether they are top-notch or not.

 

As for them sanctions cited, they weren't specific to the s-400 purchase, but related to the US sanctions on Russia following the intervention in the 2016 elections. These would apply to a wide array of issues (such as purchase of advanced military systems from Russia) - https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-russia-sanctions/u-s-sanctions-china-for-buying-russian-fighter-jets-missiles-idUSKCN1M02TP

 

Syrian personnel were already trained using the system, and there was no suggestion (as far as I'm aware) that the systems would be operated or supervised by Russian personnel. That you assert it might be the case doesn't make it so. If Russia was actually interested in a confrontation with Israel, it would have happened by now. Instead, there's a rather effective coordination mechanism in place.

 

An s-300 system trying to lock down on an Israeli plane within Israeli airspace would be an open invitation for a justifiable attack. I hope the Syrians are better trained than that, and not as daft as the notion raised. As posted earlier and on previous related topics, the IAF had opportunists to train against such systems, and quite likely didn't seat idly by (in terms of coming up with means and strategy) since the issue was first raised.

 

Israel is not really "in shock now and crying", other than in your fantasy-heavy posts.

[Scott]

A conspiracy post has been removed.  

[Basil B]

13 hours ago, Galactus said:

you think s300 system will be used by Syrians? It will be operated by Russian soldiers

 

Just as scary

 

Quote

The missile launcher used to shoot down MH17 over Ukraine was part of the Russian armed forces, an international team of investigators has confirmed.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/mh17-missile-ukraine-2014-russia-military-netherlands-deaths-investigation-a8366721.html

[Jdiddy]

6 hours ago, Basil B said:

 

Just as scary

 

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/mh17-missile-ukraine-2014-russia-military-netherlands-deaths-investigation-a8366721.html

 

No flight corridors over Syria, even the s300 wont be able to reach the Iran-turkey flight corridor

[Ron19]

A post against forum rules has been removed.

[Thorgal]

14 hours ago, Morch said:

 

There wasn't anything said about "art of killing mankind", the reference was with regard to air-defense systems. Not a whole lot to do with your claimed experience of war either, even if one believed it. Deflect away.

 

Back when objections were raised, the system was more of a "thing". Nowadays, it is still a formidable piece of military hardware, but not to the same extent. I'm certain that any air force would prefer facing less advanced and capable systems, regardless of whether they are top-notch or not.

 

As for them sanctions cited, they weren't specific to the s-400 purchase, but related to the US sanctions on Russia following the intervention in the 2016 elections. These would apply to a wide array of issues (such as purchase of advanced military systems from Russia) - https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-russia-sanctions/u-s-sanctions-china-for-buying-russian-fighter-jets-missiles-idUSKCN1M02TP

 

Syrian personnel were already trained using the system, and there was no suggestion (as far as I'm aware) that the systems would be operated or supervised by Russian personnel. That you assert it might be the case doesn't make it so. If Russia was actually interested in a confrontation with Israel, it would have happened by now. Instead, there's a rather effective coordination mechanism in place.

 

An s-300 system trying to lock down on an Israeli plane within Israeli airspace would be an open invitation for a justifiable attack. I hope the Syrians are better trained than that, and not as daft as the notion raised. As posted earlier and on previous related topics, the IAF had opportunists to train against such systems, and quite likely didn't seat idly by (in terms of coming up with means and strategy) since the issue was first raised.

 

Israel is not really "in shock now and crying", other than in your fantasy-heavy posts.

 

Israel lost its air superiority in the region a while ago when at least one of their jets has been downed.

 

Spin it like you want, but the S-300's on Syrian soil is not a good deal for Israel.

Bringing in those Russian S-300's is justifiable after Israel perpetrated multiple times Lebanese and Syrian sovereign air space for illegal strikes.

 

What you call "strategy against such systems" can be defined in reality as flying by low altitude at night by nearing a French war ship and using a Russian plane as shield while making a last minute call for the planned strikes. Don't expect an ex-KGB colonel to believe such BS.

 

[Basil B]

11 hours ago, Jdiddy said:

 

No flight corridors over Syria, even the s300 wont be able to reach the Iran-turkey flight corridor

Plenty of Russian Military aircraft though...

 

A S300 hitting a helicopter full of barrel bombs would make a fine firework display... 

[Morch]

 

@Thorgal

 

That you declare Israel lost it's air superiority "in the region" is about as nonsensical as expected. A single airplane intercepted in decades doesn't change the balance of power. And, of course, you conveniently left out the response for that - which saw a whole lot of damage done to Syrian air-defenses. Same blind spot for the fact that Israeli air raids did not stop following the incident.

 

As for "spin" - there wasn't any claim made in my post that Syria being provided with the system is a "good deal" for Israel. I clearly stated it is a formidable obstacle. Similarly, no claims whatsoever made as to providing the systems being justifiable or not - just another bit of made up nonsense you toss in. And, as is routine - making that comment while ignoring Russia's long standing understandings with Israel regarding said air-raids.

 

Like the other poster, I doubt that you actually know much about tactics and means involved. Also, there's no particular obligation to fully embrace Russia's report on the incident - it's not as if it is an uninvolved side or that it doesn't have diplomatic interests and face to protect.

 

[Thorgal]

1 hour ago, Morch said:

 

@Thorgal

 

That you declare Israel lost it's air superiority "in the region" is about as nonsensical as expected. A single airplane intercepted in decades doesn't change the balance of power. And, of course, you conveniently left out the response for that - which saw a whole lot of damage done to Syrian air-defenses. Same blind spot for the fact that Israeli air raids did not stop following the incident.

 

As for "spin" - there wasn't any claim made in my post that Syria being provided with the system is a "good deal" for Israel. I clearly stated it is a formidable obstacle. Similarly, no claims whatsoever made as to providing the systems being justifiable or not - just another bit of made up nonsense you toss in. And, as is routine - making that comment while ignoring Russia's long standing understandings with Israel regarding said air-raids.

 

Like the other poster, I doubt that you actually know much about tactics and means involved. Also, there's no particular obligation to fully embrace Russia's report on the incident - it's not as if it is an uninvolved side or that it doesn't have diplomatic interests and face to protect.

 

 

Your quote: "Same blind spot for the fact that Israeli air raids did not stop following the incident."

 

Israel planes only operated outside Syrian airspace since at least a year. Having to launch attacks from Lebanese or Jordanian airspace is in itself an open admission to not having any kind of air superiority, but rather the contrary.

 

No need to reply on the other paragraphs as it was already classified as "spin". 

[Nyezhov]

I can guarantee that the USAF and the Israelis are working at planning  to take out the missiles, if necessary, with our Israeli improved F-35s......

[sandrabbit]

5 minutes ago, Nyezhov said:

I can guarantee that the USAF and the Israelis are working at planning  to take out the missiles, if necessary, with our Israeli improved F-35s......

watch all the documentaries on US wild weasels learning their trade during the Vietnam war, no other country in the world has a programme like this. I'm very sure the US, and maybe Israel if the US taught them wild weasels, will find a way to destroy the missile emplacements and/or avoid them or spoof them.