Retirees living abroad are not expats? So what are they?

[Bill Miller]

"Expat" is shorthand for expatriate.
 

ex·pa·tri·ate

noun

 

/ˌeksˈpātrēət/

1. 1.

   a person who lives outside their native country.

   "American expatriates in Londo

   •  

adjective

Isn't the dictionary definition sufficient? I swear, some of you guys would spend weeks arguing about how many angels can dance on the had of a pin. ????

[AYJAYDEE]

On 10/23/2018 at 4:42 AM, digger70 said:

Nah, an emigrant doesn't have to go all the shit we have to. I Emigrated from the Netherlands to Australia ,,, Never had to report or do an Extension of stay Every  year. Arrived in  AU that was it in 1972. Now an Aussie on paper an an Aussie Passport.Now Thailand and all it's Bullshit reporting and mountains of useless paperwork that could be avoided if they could use computers.

the definition of emigrant doesnt depend on the laws of the receiving country

[AYJAYDEE]

15 hours ago, Farang99 said:

That would only be correct if we were allowed to live  here permanently with no hassle.

nonsense.

[Katia]

10 hours ago, soalbundy said:

Not criticizing, just saying that it's pointless living in fear of what might be, my father had 3 heart attacks over 7 years, the last one killed him, should I worry ? no way.

Let's put it this way: I know for a fact I cannot afford a nursing home or home healthcare.  I couldn't afford it now while I'm working, so I won't be able to afford it when I'm old and unemployed (I don't know anyone who can cough up that kind of cash on a monthly basis).  I'm pretty sure I'll be lucky to afford my day-to-day bills when I'm old.  As such, I need to be somewhere I can receive help with paying for these things, since I will not have anyone to come take care of me for free.  Simple enough for you?  It's not worrying about what "might" happen, it's knowing what "will" happen, and I'm not willing to bank on the fact that I'll have acquired the cojones to off myself when that time comes or before so I don't need to worry about it.

[newnative]

'Expat' still works nicely for me. Should have nothing to do with one's working status.

[soalbundy]

3 minutes ago, Katia said:

Let's put it this way: I know for a fact I cannot afford a nursing home or home healthcare.  I couldn't afford it now while I'm working, so I won't be able to afford it when I'm old and unemployed (I don't know anyone who can cough up that kind of cash on a monthly basis).  I'm pretty sure I'll be lucky to afford my day-to-day bills when I'm old.  As such, I need to be somewhere I can receive help with paying for these things, since I will not have anyone to come take care of me for free.  Simple enough for you?  It's not worrying about what "might" happen, it's knowing what "will" happen, and I'm not willing to bank on the fact that I'll have acquired the cojones to off myself when that time comes or before so I don't need to worry about it.

Yes, I can understand that. In the West we are too concerned about prolonging life. In my village I have seen people sent home to die from the state hospital, it's not a big thing, they know and accept they are dying, the village doc calls in now and again to see they are comfortable and the people in the village rally round and hold bedside watches day and night. Once I was asked if I could supply a mattress that my great dane slept on for an old man who was dying but had no bed, I was somewhat disconcerted that a human being should use a dogs bed for his last hours but I was told that for him it was a luxury so I cleaned it as best I could and we moved him on to it, he was so grateful and died the next day in his sleep. When you're dead nothing happened.

[NanLaew]

On 10/22/2018 at 11:42 PM, kenk24 said:

I have been referring to them as "economic refugees" for a long time now.

I have been an expat since I chose to become oilfield trash over 40 years ago. A lawyer buddy in the US labeled me as 'international gypsy' although I think that was primarily because I was happy to crash on a couch if and when situation required it. In a similar way that plants and animals are scientifically categorized, I see expat as the genus and everything else that expands on that as simply species and sub-species. The refugee is just a species of expat withe economic, religious, etc.. being subs.

 

On 10/22/2018 at 11:42 PM, kenk24 said:

The idea of expatriates always held an aura of adventure, and curiousity, people who are open-minded interested in a different culture.

There's a fair amount of the xenophile in the early generation expat although I have to admit that Pamela Robertson's clamor for marriage, a family car, a big house with fitted carpets and place for her collection of Ladro fugurines was a fairly large influence on why I opted for a break from the Saudi desert in Bangkok instead of going back to Aberdeen. That and a cocked-up company leave schedule that would have had me heading to Scotland in February.. not a chance!

 

On 10/22/2018 at 11:42 PM, kenk24 said:

The new refugees tend to complain abt anything unfamiliar - the expatriates embrace it.

Agreed. They seem to be much more xenophobic and complain a lot, mostly about stuff they cannot change. When it comes to the retirees here, maybe it's a case of what they retired from? For me, after pitching tents in all continents, I think I can put up with a fair bit of any of my chosen hosts cultural peccadilloes and still see the associated quaintness of some of it. The nouveau retiree probably worked mostly in their home country, possibly had their first holiday home in another country that beyond language and cuisine, wasn't too radically different than their own. The Brits in Spain would be a good example. When they see their Costa's filling up with regular weekend chavness, they think about somewhere nicer and quieter for the full retirement. Then they get their 2-storey or villa in a gated community here and for a few months, maybe a year or two, it's paradise. Then they have an idiot run a motorbike into their Fortuner, find that insurance here can be 'different' and are confronted for the first time with the concept of krieng jai. Or they realize that most of those pretty and friendly ladies they see at weekends are actually hookers. Or maybe the disappearance of the standalone 'From Britain' food stand at their local Tesco-Lotus is the tipping point. Scales fall from eyes, gild comes off the lily, etc, etc..

[NanLaew]

On 10/23/2018 at 12:42 PM, digger70 said:

Nah, an emigrant doesn't have to go all the shit we have to. I Emigrated from the Netherlands to Australia ,,, Never had to report or do an Extension of stay Every  year. Arrived in  AU that was it in 1972. Now an Aussie on paper an an Aussie Passport.Now Thailand and all it's Bullshit reporting and mountains of useless paperwork that could be avoided if they could use computers.

With all that whingeing, were there by chance any poms in your alleged Dutch ancestry?

 

Maybe you should ask your local IO if you can give up all that tedious annual paperwork and extremely difficult quarterly reporting and ask if they'll give you a shot at the very desirable, low-hassle, indeterminate length, no-income required, temporary aliens ID card that they hand out to the Burmese slave labour instead?

Edited October 25, 2018 by NanLaew

[digger70]

3 hours ago, NanLaew said:

With all that whingeing, were there by chance any poms in your alleged Dutch ancestry?

 

Maybe you should ask your local IO if you can give up all that tedious annual paperwork and extremely difficult quarterly reporting and ask if they'll give you a shot at the very desirable, low-hassle, indeterminate length, no-income required, temporary aliens ID card that they hand out to the Burmese slave labour instead?

I wasn't Whingeing , I was merely stating a fact. Eh as far as I know ,satan help me .no whingeing pom ancestors.

[Katia]

10 hours ago, soalbundy said:

Yes, I can understand that. In the West we are too concerned about prolonging life. In my village I have seen people sent home to die from the state hospital, it's not a big thing, they know and accept they are dying, the village doc calls in now and again to see they are comfortable and the people in the village rally round and hold bedside watches day and night. Once I was asked if I could supply a mattress that my great dane slept on for an old man who was dying but had no bed, I was somewhat disconcerted that a human being should use a dogs bed for his last hours but I was told that for him it was a luxury so I cleaned it as best I could and we moved him on to it, he was so grateful and died the next day in his sleep. When you're dead nothing happened.

It's not always as easy as being sent home to die.  Sometimes you're not dying, and they're not prolonging your life, your health just sucks and they merely send you home to be sick, sometimes for years.  And if you don't want to, don't have the stones to, physically can't (due to disability), whatever, kill yourself, then you're going to need a lot of medical care and possibly physical help with your daily living.  You might have dementia, you might have an injury or disability, you might have one or more chronic illnesses.  But you're not going to die; for that to happen, someone--whether it's your or your family-- is going to have to take decisive steps to make that happen.  You maybe don't want to or can't.  Your family/friends will face murder charges if they do.  You might just live with it.

 

Even if they do "send you home to die," that's not always instantaneous.  Hospice, for example, is for people who are expected to die "within 6 months."  6 months can be a long, expensive time.  Some people are on hospice for longer, even years.  They're dying.  No one is prolonging their life (you cannot be on hospice and receive any sort of care to treat whatever condition you're on hospice for.  This can be problematic in some cases, actually).  But they're not gone yet.  In the U.S., Medicare pays all hospice expenses (except a nursing home, and any home health care aides above the couple hours a week that hospice sends someone out, but Medicaid can pay for a nursing home, though not home health care)-- medications, doctors, a couple visits of a home health aide, spiritual support for person and family even past the time of the person's death.  Overseas?  I'm sure there's no Medicare or Medicaid help with these things... out of pocket for all of that, and no programs to help with food or any other bills if your medical expenses have now bankrupted you in your day-to-day life.  It's probably not as expensive in Thailand as the U.S., but still not something you're going to pull out of your couch.

[Jingthing]

I happened upon this article which is incredibly on point to this topic.

 

As far as why some groups of people are called migrants and others expats.

 

The issues in the article are not only about Americans retiring to Ecuador, but really about people from any "richer" nation migrating to any poorer nation to make economic quality of life in retirement possible or better. Including so many of our "lifestyle migrants" (a term used in the article) in Thailand.

 

Quote

 

Retirement in America? Too Expensive.

A new book examines the lives of expats in Ecuador and their struggle to stay in the middle class.

 

https://newrepublic.com/article/152336/retirement-america-expensive

 

Quote

 

Gringolandia

Lifestyle Migration under Late Capitalism

 

https://www.upress.umn.edu/book-division/books/gringolandia

Edited November 23, 2018 by Jingthing