Thailand’s English proficiency is getting worse: study

[jaygino]

3 hours ago, poanoi said:

bs, just the 3 past year when i was away they learned a lot of english,

before i had to converse in thai, there was no way around that,

but now almost everyone speak passable english

Jeez, hope you're not an english teacher

[melvinmelvin]

Often I do not really understand all the focus on Thais and lack of command of English.

It is worth remembering that most people on the planet get by without speaking English.

 

Same applies to countries, the number of countries where English is not spoken is very very high,

and they get by.

 

[blinkers]

I taught in one of the largest private schools in the Bangkok region, at that stage they had 67 Foreign teachers and I have to say that the majority of the kids in the English program had reasonable English, however when it came down to exams I was told I couldn't fail anyone, well of course there were a few students who shall we say, were mentally challenged and had no hope of passing any test, so I asked what I was expected to do, and the reply "just get them to make you a coffee or something and give them a half score".

Moving on, my grandson is in a private catholic school attending the English Programme, this was fine up until Asean, the Foreign teachers (English, Australian and American) have all been let go, and have been replaced by Philli's, nice people but the ones I have met have woeful English skills. I could dam near write a book on the sad state of affairs regarding Education at this particular school, the academic level has dropped drastically, but the fees have remained the same. However this particular school cannot keep its staff, so they are now looking for anyone to teach and they will pay same as the philli's per year and no holiday pay. Now a qualified teacher does a fair time at Uni to gain his Bachelors or Masters degree, he is a native English speaker (I'm not talking about back packers or people who buy fake degrees) in a decent school they would be earning at least 60,000 per month, some a lot more, I have one friend earning 140,000 per month and that's as it should be, you get what you pay for.

In the area I live in, there is only one other private school with an excellent reputation, quite a way out of town, so we were thinking to move to the new school only to be told that they too have replaced all the native English speaking teachers with Philly's.

It's all about saving money, and while that mentality prevails there will be no progress at all.

 

 

[stanleycoin]

1 hour ago, balo said:

Some of the girls working in bars/restaurants in soi Bua Kaow , Pattaya speaks with a cockney accent. 

 

Some even have a Norwegian Sense of humor.  

You know that vacant look,  after someone tells a joke. 

[Kurtf]

5 hours ago, darksidedog said:

To be honest, I didn't think it was possible for it to get worse. Of all the places I have been, Thailand is the worst for ability to speak English even remotely well. Many years ago I tried to set up an office here and closed it after a year due to inability to recruit even a single individual who had the proficiency I was after, and I was offering 50K a month basic. Until such time as those doing the teaching can actually speak the language, given that most Thai English teachers simply cannot, it is difficult to see the situation improving either.

Until more English language teachers are required to get TEFL certificate as a requirement to teach English the situation in Thailand is unlikely to change.

[Pedrogaz]

What is needed is a Section 44 fire-ready-aim plan which cracks down on English speakers.

[Chang_paarp]

I would be interested to see the results if the "English Speaking" countries were included. Looking at the abuse of the language by people who are supposed to have learned English as a native language it could be very revealing.

[Bezdomny]

It is connected with Thai pride and brainwashing mornings and during the lunch break. I dont think that Cambodian education system is better, but they speaks fairly better English with Sir at the end.

[GinBoy2]

8 minutes ago, owl sees all said:

A somewhat light-hearted post.

 

A similar thing at my Daughters first school. It was a Catholic school but the nuns didn't teach. One day she brought home a letter from 'the school' in Thai. My wife read it and told me the good news. Mildred (daughter) has been selected for a special English class. The class ran from 3 to 4 in the afternoon. Now school finished at 3 but the bus didn't pick up to 4. So why not!? Only 500 Bhat a month. The misses was all for it. So the following day we went to the school to sort thing out.

 

I was parking the pick-up and the misses got out to gather info'. There were two ladies in conversation with the misses. I walked over and got a couple of wais. I spoke to one of the ladies; "who is going to teach English between 3 and 4?" They couldn't understand so Mrs Owl translated my question. They spoke back. The misses turned to me and said - wait for it - "they are."

 

Now I can see the humour in it but not at the time. These two English teachers could neither speak nor understand English. I've no idea who took up the offer.

 

Mildred was moved to another school at the earliest opportunity. And with my input she's doing OK.

This pretty much rhymes with my experiences. 

To expand on my previous comment. 

Now when I went to complain, good thing is I speak pretty fluent Thai, because the discussion with the English 'teacher' was almost incomprehensible when I'd tried to do it in English.

 

I'm not sure if they actually get the fact that they can't understand English, since in their heads they think they do.

 

I've lost count how many times I've been told "Oh he/she speaks English"...but of course they really don't.

 

Understanding a few words on a T Shirt, does not make you a proficient English speaker!

[stanleycoin]

2 minutes ago, Chang_paarp said:

I would be interested to see the results if the "English Speaking" countries were included. Looking at the abuse of the language by people who are supposed to have learned English as a native language it could be very revealing.

Are you talking about Bradford or Barnsley ? 

[BigC]

Because they are all learning Chinese it’s scary look what the Chinese have done to Cambodia they have taken over there hope that don’t happen here 

[BigC]

Isn’t new UK English Pakistani haha

[Kurtf]

5 minutes ago, melvinmelvin said:

Often I do not really understand all the focus on Thais and lack of command of English.

It is worth remembering that most people on the planet get by without speaking English.

 

Same applies to countries, the number of countries where English is not spoken is very very high,

and they get by.

 

It is that mentality that keeps a countries population from advancing and getting out of the third world economic situation. Just because there are stupid people in the world is no reason to not get educated.

[Chang_paarp]

1 minute ago, stanleycoin said:

Are you talking about Bradford or Barnsley ? 

Where?

[scorecard]

19 minutes ago, owl sees all said:

A somewhat light-hearted post.

 

A similar thing at my Daughters first school. It was a Catholic school but the nuns didn't teach. One day she brought home a letter from 'the school' in Thai. My wife read it and told me the good news. Mildred (daughter) has been selected for a special English class. The class ran from 3 to 4 in the afternoon. Now school finished at 3 but the bus didn't pick up to 4. So why not!? Only 500 Bhat a month. The misses was all for it. So the following day we went to the school to sort thing out.

 

I was parking the pick-up and the misses got out to gather info'. There were two ladies in conversation with the misses. I walked over and got a couple of wais. I spoke to one of the ladies; "who is going to teach English between 3 and 4?" They couldn't understand so Mrs Owl translated my question. They spoke back. The misses turned to me and said - wait for it - "they are."

 

Now I can see the humour in it but not at the time. These two English teachers could neither speak nor understand English. I've no idea who took up the offer.

 

Mildred was moved to another school at the earliest opportunity. And with my input she's doing OK.

 

Another one, my Thai granddaughter (native speaker level both Thai and English) attended a catholic school full English program for Primary, the school had a somewhat different approach to teaching/learning English.

 

First lesson every day (1hr 15m) English conversation with a  well qualified / experienced dedicated young guy from the UK.

 

The school old Thai female English teacher sits in the back of the room and takes copious notes and she then conducts the same lesson late every afternoon supposedly with some explanation in Thai, but the main programmed purpose is repetition / reinforcement of the conversation.

 

But she spends most of the time telling the kids that the farang teacher is stupid and he teaches them wrong grammar etc., etc.

 

Then suddenly she sent a note home to all parents, in Thai, on school letterhead announcing that she was about to start a new English program 'TINGLISH', because real English is too difficult for Thai people.

 

The headmistress was flooded with complaints, many parents saying 'this is an expensive school I expect my kids to learn proper English' etc.

 

Headmistress quickly sent out another note to all parents with an apology and saying there will never be a TINGLISH program.

 

However the Thai teacher started to use TINGLISH in her afternoon lessons and many kids were telling their parents about it.

 

Quickly the teacher disappeared and a verbal message, she has retired. 

 

 

[melvinmelvin]

Just now, Kurtf said:

It is that mentality that keeps a countries population from advancing and getting out of the third world economic situation. Just because there are stupid people in the world is no reason to not get educated.

I understand and agree with that,

but there are a lot of useful things, apart from English, that one could learn.

 

[hotchilli]

4 hours ago, darksidedog said:

To be honest, I didn't think it was possible for it to get worse. Of all the places I have been, Thailand is the worst for ability to speak English even remotely well. Many years ago I tried to set up an office here and closed it after a year due to inability to recruit even a single individual who had the proficiency I was after, and I was offering 50K a month basic. Until such time as those doing the teaching can actually speak the language, given that most Thai English teachers simply cannot, it is difficult to see the situation improving either.

And therein lays the problem, year upon year Thailand churns out more English teachers with less ability than their predecessors, so the downward spiral continues. Something Thai education ministers find hard to grasp !

[FritsSikkink]

25 minutes ago, robsamui said:

There are 18 people in the company I work for - five farangs and 13 Thais. The shortest time anyone has been with the company is four years. Six of the Thai staff have been with us more than 15 years. And yet every Christmas party, the Thais all separate out and sit in a group together, away from us farangs. I can only imagine this is instinctive and thus happens everywhere to a greater or lesser degree.

Doesn't happen in my company. Do the Thais separate or the farangs? How many farangs speak Thai?

[TKDfella]

Well there is probably no impetus from the top who want to become the hub of this & that in the S.E. region. If they were really interested in English the man at the top would show his proficiency but he is always exhibiting the opposite. In fact the same may be said of other topics because it is always Thailand...Thailand. I found, several years ago, that Thai students knew a lot about Thai history and Thai dance but little about the history of other countries. The man at the top is always 'pushing' that Thai Culture must be taught regardless. With technology continually progressing and expanding foreign university curriculum is always having to update on the difficult topics. Culture has to be taught by other institutions but in Thailand it's a national necessity...at the expense of English etc. The whole Thai system would need a complete 'turn around' but I don't think that is going to happen.  

[rott]

3 hours ago, PatOngo said:

Very sad when bar girls are more proficient in English than local English teachers. Maybe Thai English teachers should spend more time in bars to improve their English!

I was just thinking exactly the same thing. A very sensible and practical idea, if wages were similar.

 

But now that all foreign teachers need degrees and TEFL certificates the problem is as good as solved.

[Eligius]

4 hours ago, thequietman said:

Creating English curriculum without asking the NES right there in their schools, is typical of Thai department heads here. The attitude of 'I can't lose face' means that they would rather get it wrong than ask for help from someone that speaks the language. It is purely a box ticking exercise here and everything and I mean everything, is all show and absolutely no substance.

 

In my Uni, there are incorrectly displayed documents and posters in incorrect English all over the place. When you mention it, you are seen as a trouble maker! Wow!

 

When they ask me is everything OK, I just tell them 'Yes.' That's all they want to hear and to say anything else, is as I said before, creating trouble for yourself.

 

It is all a shambles.

One of the truest postings I've read in a long while. Your experience matches my own to a T. Thais are all about appearance and pretence - not substance and reality.

 

Another weird thing here is that they seem to believe (it's almost a form of sympathetic magic) that simply writing a goal down or a desideratum and sticking it up in the office, company or university on the wall is the equivalent of having actually done the thing after which they allegedly aspire. Saying (or writing) something is (for the Thais) tantamount to having done it. Talk about out of kilter with reality!

 

It is all delusion, (self-)deception, deceit, all smoke and mirrors - and never more so than under the military autocracy.

[changside]

Did it ever occur to you that the reason that Thai people cannot understand people from English speaking countries is that these "English speakers" cannot speak correct English. Try understanding what many people from parts of the U.K. are saying.    

[BHW]

May be employing people that can TEACH and talk English might be a help, like from England, Australia, USA etc. A good Aussie friend of mine is a teacher in a school near here the school also employs 3 others from non speaking English countries he says very hard to understand what the talk about.

 

Also paying a decent wage may attract teachers from English speaking countries.

[Kiwiken]

4 hours ago, thequietman said:

Creating English curriculum without asking the NES right there in their schools, is typical of Thai department heads here. The attitude of 'I can't lose face' means that they would rather get it wrong than ask for help from someone that speaks the language. It is purely a box ticking exercise here and everything and I mean everything, is all show and absolutely no substance.

 

In my Uni, there are incorrectly displayed documents and posters in incorrect English all over the place. When you mention it, you are seen as a trouble maker! Wow!

 

When they ask me is everything OK, I just tell them 'Yes.' That's all they want to hear and to say anything else, is as I said before, creating trouble for yourself.

 

It is all a shambles.

Staying in a hotel here I rewrote their rules and regulations into more legible English. I showed it to the manger and she thanked me. But it was never redone as they considered it unimportant. And they wonder why English speakers do wrong things in their establishments.

[Orton Rd]

4 hours ago, Somtamnication said:

Wow, behind Ethiopia! 

 

What can I say. I have taught them as best I could. With corruption in schools and above and paying low wages and hiring backpackers, what did they expect/

 

Not just the staff it's the method. They will never learn to speak if they do not speak. Learning grammar from a book, which is mostly all School kids seems to do will never get anywhere apart from being able to read signs.

[melvinmelvin]

8 minutes ago, changside said:

Did it ever occur to you that the reason that Thai people cannot understand people from English speaking countries is that these "English speakers" cannot speak correct English. Try understanding what many people from parts of the U.K. are saying.    

bargirls are pretty good at that

scouse macker the patter geordie .- nee problem

 

[Derek B]

Spain, France & Italy well down the list.

[poanoi]

42 minutes ago, jaygino said:

Jeez, hope you're not an english teacher

i would do better than any monolingual english teacher in thailand

[alzack]

Its always been bad mate

" Whats your name"? "Im fine thanks"

 

walk into Mc Donalds and just Try to order a Big Mac just blank looks

 

Go into any Local Gov building and they have Zero English

 

Go into any office, Garage and they cringe at the sight of a Farang  " you do it, you see him all trying to hide in the Loo

Bad Bad and Thailand could never be part of this ASEAN crap, no official papers in English at all

Have a good day Thailand

[yellowboat]

Just one of many things since junta mania.  It is such non surprise