CONFIRMED: Here is exactly what’s needed for retirement & marriage extensions (income method) from 2019

[mogandave]

Why would the bank know anything about TI policy just announced .

I was talking about the 400/800k.

Has that changed?

[Spidey]

2 hours ago, amexpat said:

Maybe you need to change banks or transfer methods.  As stated elsewhere, funds from Transferwise are identified as "International Transfer" on Bangkok Bank statements - I don't know about other banks. 

I am already with Bangkok bank. I withdraw my money from my CC, in the bank and deposit it in my account immediately. No fees and has the flexibility to put whatever money I need in my account, when I want it, ie immediately. Works for me.

[Wanderlust]

I don't really see why anyone is confused about these amendments. The financial rules now to get a one year extension, aside from any other paperwork required, are as follows:

For an extension based on marriage to a Thai, or being a parent of a Thai, you have to show either;

(i) evidence of at least 400,000 baht in a Thai bank account in your name only that has been there for at least 60 days; or

(ii) evidence of an average of at least 40,000 baht credited monthly to a Thai bank account in your name only from overseas for the previous 12 months (less than 12 months for this year only); or

(iii) an official letter from your Embassy or Consulate in Thailand confirming an income of at least 40,000 baht a month anywhere, with supporting documentation if requested.

 

For an extension based on being aged over 50 (retirement), you have to show either;

(i) evidence of at least 800,000 baht in a Thai bank account in your name only that has been there for at least 90 days (60 days on first application), or;

(ii) evidence of at least 65,000 baht credited monthly to a Thai bank account in your name only from overseas for the previous 12 months (less than 12 months for this year only), or;

(iii) an official letter from your Embassy or Consulate in Thailand confirming an income of at least 65,000 baht a month anywhere, with supporting documentation if requested, or;

(iv) evidence of a combination of savings and income in a Thai bank account in your name only that amounts to at least 800,000 baht, with the savings having been there for at least 90 days (60 days on first application), and the income for the previous 12 months (less than 12 months this year).

 

The evidence required in (i) and (ii) for marriage, and (i), (ii) and (iv) for over 50 (retirement) are a bank letter and statements for the relevant periods. 

 

If anyone other than @ubonjoe says this is incorrect, I'll be inclined not to believe them; however, whether this is how the various local immigration offices will actually interpret these amendments is another thing entirely!

 

One question does arise from this, that I have always had though - why is the combination method allowed for retirement extensions, but not for marriage/child ones? (an old query). Similarly, why are marriage/child extensions allowed average monthly income but retirement apparently not? (a new query!). I'm guessing the latter one could just be an oversight with new regulations, but the former?

[onera1961]

5 minutes ago, Wanderlust said:

why is the combination method allowed for retirement extensions, but not for marriage/child ones? (an old query).

May be the limit is already very low (40K/400K). 

 

5 minutes ago, Wanderlust said:

Similarly, why are marriage/child extensions allowed average monthly income but retirement apparently not? (a new query!). I'm guessing the latter one could just be an oversight with new regulations, but the former?

May be if somebody is working and he lost his job for a few months. So the average will work for him. Retirement does not allow work. So, no need for average.

[Wanderlust]

1 minute ago, onera1961 said:

May be the limit is already very low (40K/400K). 

 

May be if somebody is working and he lost his job for a few months. So the average will work for him. Retirement does not allow work. So, no need for average.

What about exchange rate fluctuations?

[mogandave]

What about exchange rate fluctuations?

What about them?

Just 3% over

Does anyone earn exactly 65k?

[OJAS]

40 minutes ago, Pib said:

49 minutes ago, OJAS said:

But is this solely a TransferWise issue, though? In other words might not potential international transfer coding problems also arise in the case of SWIFT transfers where your originating home country bank's agency bank in Thailand is not the same as your receiving Thai bank?
 
(As you are no doubt well aware but others reading this may not be, TransferWise's agency bank in Thailand is Bangkok Bank, which is why international transfer coding issues don't arise in the case of TransferWise transfers which end up in a Bangkok Bank account).

No. A SWIFT transfer will appear/be coded as an international transfer on your receiving Thai bank account even if your home country sending bank uses another Thai bank as an intermediary bank.

Appreciate the clarification, thanks.

 

Incidentally, on thumbing my way back through my BKKB passbook, I see that a TW transfer processed last May was coded SMT rather than FTT. I think that that particular coding had something to do with the fact that TMB were TW's banking partner for that particular transfer according to the TW confirmation PDF. Might you know what SMT stands for, please, since I can't find any reference to it on BKKB's website, nor is it included in the list of codes at the end of my passbook.

[Wanderlust]

3 minutes ago, mogandave said:

 

What about them?

Just 3% over

Does anyone earn exactly 65k?

 

No, that is the whole point - if they are actually on a pension and they are close to that figure then a sudden downturn as their funds are due to arrive could scupper them completely.

[mogandave]

No, that is the whole point - if they are actually on a pension and they are close to that figure then a sudden downturn as their funds are due to arrive could scupper them completely.

Given they’re retired, one would hope they’ve saved at least a little they can bump up a short month with.

[Wanderlust]

1 minute ago, mogandave said:

 

Given they’re retired, one would hope they’ve saved at least a little they can bump up a short month with.

 

Of course, but it would be easy, especially for some older retired folk, to miss that they hadn't had the required amount one month - you would hope that an IO would be sympathetic to this, but it does seem odd that the rules are not the same in that regard as the marriage/child ones; and equally you could say why are those on a marriage/child extension given this leeway, as you could say the same for them - why didn't they have savings to bump it up?

[Pattaya46]

2 hours ago, sumrit said:

6 hours ago, Pattaya46 said:

No. The OP is wrong.

The notice says that for those with letter you must show income no less than 65'000B,

but does not say that they have to Transfer it in Thailand !

Yes it does:

...........and bank statement showing money transfer from overseas every month for the past 12 months..............

No. Read the 3rd page of the notice again.

The part you quoted is in the 1) of "Procedures" while the Embassy Letter is in the 2), with a "or" between 1) and 2)

 

[stevo2]

Remember also that there are Expats on retirement extensions who not reside in Thailand for 12 months of the year.

 

Their annual income could be well in excess of 780,000 Baht p.a. but may only transfer money for 9/12 months.

[EL159]

This whole scenario regarding remittances of at least 65,000 PER MONTH is fraught with illogicality and nonsense. EXAMPLE: My Visa is due in April. In April ( after Visa obtained) I am going back to UK for a couple of weeks. If I bring cash money back with me amounting, say, to £10,000 for living expenses, it will count for NOTHING towards my Visa in 2020? ONLY money transferred via the banking system will count?

 

This is plain daft!!!

[stevo2]

47 minutes ago, Wanderlust said:

What about exchange rate fluctuations?

 

Irrelevant. Your job is to find the required amount of Baht.

 

The requirement is for XX Thai Baht........ whether that sum is derived from Sterling, Dollar or Euro matters not to Immigration.

[stevo2]

59 minutes ago, Wanderlust said:

Similarly, why are marriage/child extensions allowed average monthly income but retirement apparently not? (a new query!). I'm guessing the latter one could just be an oversight with new regulations, but the former?

 

 

Extracted from the OP:-

 

For retirement extensions of no more than 1 year evidence of average monthly income of B65,000 is required.
 

[Pattaya46]

// The evidence required in // (i), (ii) and (iv) for over 50 (retirement) are a bank letter and statements for the relevant periods. 

 

If anyone other than @ubonjoe says this is incorrect, I'll be inclined not to believe them; //

IMHO the evidence for the Combo method (iv) can still be an Embassy Letter :

The evidence for (iv) is an embassy letter; or a bank letter and statements for the relevant periods.

[Pattaya46]

4 minutes ago, stevo2 said:

Extracted from the OP:-

For retirement extensions of no more than 1 year evidence of average monthly income of B65,000 is required.

I can't see this sentence in the OP... 

and clearly no "average" for Retirement in the translation.

[elviajero]

55 minutes ago, Wanderlust said:

I don't really see why anyone is confused about these amendments. The financial rules now to get a one year extension, aside from any other paperwork required, are as follows:

For an extension based on marriage to a Thai, or being a parent of a Thai, you have to show either;

(i) evidence of at least 400,000 baht in a Thai bank account in your name only that has been there for at least 60 days; or

(ii) evidence of an average of at least 40,000 baht credited monthly to a Thai bank account in your name only from overseas for the previous 12 months (less than 12 months for this year only); or

(iii) an official letter from your Embassy or Consulate in Thailand confirming an income of at least 40,000 baht a month anywhere, with supporting documentation if requested.

 

For an extension based on being aged over 50 (retirement), you have to show either;

(i) evidence of at least 800,000 baht in a Thai bank account in your name only that has been there for at least 90 days (60 days on first application), or;

(ii) evidence of at least 65,000 baht credited monthly to a Thai bank account in your name only from overseas for the previous 12 months (less than 12 months for this year only), or;

(iii) an official letter from your Embassy or Consulate in Thailand confirming an income of at least 65,000 baht a month anywhere, with supporting documentation if requested, or;

(iv) evidence of a combination of savings and income in a Thai bank account in your name only that amounts to at least 800,000 baht, with the savings having been there for at least 90 days (60 days on first application), and the income for the previous 12 months (less than 12 months this year).

 

The evidence required in (i) and (ii) for marriage, and (i), (ii) and (iv) for over 50 (retirement) are a bank letter and statements for the relevant periods. 

 

If anyone other than @ubonjoe says this is incorrect, I'll be inclined not to believe them; however, whether this is how the various local immigration offices will actually interpret these amendments is another thing entirely!

The funds must be in a Thai bank account for 3 months, not 90 days, for the second and subsequent retirement extensions.

 

Quote

One question does arise from this, that I have always had though - why is the combination method allowed for retirement extensions, but not for marriage/child ones? (an old query).

It is simply because the amounts required for retirement extensions are much higher than marriage/child extensions; so they've made it easier to achieve by combining cash and income.

 

Quote

Similarly, why are marriage/child extensions allowed average monthly income but retirement apparently not? (a new query!). I'm guessing the latter one could just be an oversight with new regulations, but the former?

No idea why, I've never asked, it could be an error; but the original 2014 Police Order only specifies an average income for family based extensions, which they seem to be carrying on with the new instructions. It hasn't been an issue up to now.

 

We probably won't know the answer until cases are put before IO's and reports made. It seems a point that offices could diverge on. I don't see why, in either case, they couldn't use an average as long as there are 12 transfer amounts that do not vary too much. IMO 12 transfers will be what they will be concerned with.

[elviajero]

2 hours ago, pontious said:

6 hours ago, pontious said:

Can the 65,000 Baht per month be in a joint account?

I know the 4/8k has to be single account.

I says no - anyone confirm.

It's not specified. But it's safe to assume - as any cash in the bank used for a retirement extension must be in the sole name of the applicant - it will be the same for income.

[Maestro]

8 hours ago, DrJack54 said:

So the existing "money in Thai bank" 800/400, still continues and the changes only concern expats using "income, combo"?...

Yes.

[Maestro]

8 hours ago, Vacuum said:

...We are still presuming that the money in a bank account method remains the same.

We are not presuming; we know, because the Immigration Bureau Memorandum clearly states that it is only about changes regarding the documentary evidence of income for those people who use this method to qualify for the extension of stay.

[BertM]

56 minutes ago, stevo2 said:

Remember also that there are Expats on retirement extensions who not reside in Thailand for 12 months of the year.

 

Their annual income could be well in excess of 780,000 Baht p.a. but may only transfer money for 9/12 months.

They will now have to make the 12 xfers even if not here full-time or even if they spend less than the 65k per mth. The embassy letters & affidavits allowed expats who didn't have the 65k or who didn't xfer 65k over the option of getting their extensions anyway. Now, that is gone.

Edited January 7, 2019 by BertM

[Maestro]

8 hours ago, ocddave said:

...Is there a 2.XX that states the 400K/800K that would not be affected by this notice?...

No, there is not, just like there is no 2.xx stating that the price of eggs is not affected.

[elviajero]

3 hours ago, Kerryd said:

It is a "loose" term. It does not mean you have to be "retired" and no longer working anywhere.

 

It means you are old enough to qualify for the "Retirement" Visa (which does not allow you to work - in Thailand). They set the age at 50 no doubt to attract the younger generation of people who are able to "retire" at a much younger age than their parents.

It is not a "loose term". It is a specific term to describe someone that is not working. If it was just for over 50's they wouldn't refer to it as "retirement".

 

It was reduced from 60 to 50 to encourage more expats. The age could be set lower still, but the main reason for having an age limit is to control numbers.

Edited January 7, 2019 by elviajero

[scubascuba3]

I am already with Bangkok bank. I withdraw my money from my CC, in the bank and deposit it in my account immediately. No fees and has the flexibility to put whatever money I need in my account, when I want it, ie immediately. Works for me.

It sounds like you won't be able to use this method in future if using the income method

[ocddave]

5 minutes ago, Maestro said:

No, there is not, just like there is no 2.xx stating that the price of eggs is not affected.

The reason I asked, was I wasn't sure if the 400K/800K option was part of 2.xx, not 2.18 or 2.22

 

But hey, thanks for being a %&$#!

[BertM]

1 hour ago, Wanderlust said:

No, that is the whole point - if they are actually on a pension and they are close to that figure then a sudden downturn as their funds are due to arrive could scupper them completely.

They can always deposit pension in home country first then add a little more to it before transferring over to make sure they account for any short term fluctuations so they are not cutting it that close. Or, they can convert to THB in home country then send over exactly the amount needed after fees. Up to them.

[scubascuba3]

Anyone using Starling Bank (UK) for International payments? I'm trying to work out if they are coded as such at Kasikorn?

[Pattaya46]

11 minutes ago, elviajero said:

[Retirement] It is not a "loose term".

It is a specific term to describe someone that is not working. 

Hum... more to describe someone that is no working  in Thailand.

A lot of people on "Retirement Extension" are still working when in their country.

[BertM]

5 hours ago, bangsaenguy said:

I am sure this has been asked and answered. Will SSA deposit to a foreign bank? If not, does one set up a monthly transfer to a Thai bank from a US bank?

Yes, it can be set up your SS for deposit and transferred over, but if your SS amount is borderline you may want to deposit in US bank first and add a little more to it from savings to make sure you take into account for currency rate fluctuations.

Edited January 7, 2019 by BertM