Brexit bedlam - May's EU divorce deal crushed by 230 votes in parliament

[melvinmelvin]

5 minutes ago, aright said:

I disagree but want to add another perspective to the argument. What the EU is now is not static. I have made the point before, the Commission imo has plans to make the E27 the E1 and part of that process, of necessity, involves aligning all laws centrally. As evidence no one asked me if I wanted an EU anthem or flag but they exist and fairly soon we might be adding an EU Army.

EU Army. maybe.

 

This E27/28 --> E1, I am somewhat skeptical

I have worked intimately with the CEC for years and years, the Eurocrats are

not daft, they are not brainwashed - by and large quite jovial and likable and good thinkers

 

Among the Eurocrats, there is bound to be many many that are skeptical and not comfortable

with this E27/28 --> E1 process

 

can't see that process going swift and smooth

see some challenges here

 

In Europe, those who do not have the surname Verhofstadt, are plentiful

 

 

 

[vinny41]

8 hours ago, bomber said:

proves my point EU law doesnt affect 99.9999% of UK,folks as 0.0001% dont marry ex thai bargirls,in 50 years ive never come across anyone or heard of anyone i know at work,or in my town being affected by any EU law,other than the pounds and ounces thing 10-15 years ago,and that was no big deal.

I would love to know where you get your figures from or do you an your mates make them up when your down at spoonies

approx over 100,000 est UK passport holders are unable to bring their UK spouses to the UK

https://www.freemovement.org.uk/thousands-of-families-separated-by-the-immigration-rules-at-christmas/

[bomber]

8 minutes ago, vinny41 said:

I would love to know where you get your figures from or do you an your mates make them up when your down at spoonies

approx over 100,000 est UK passport holders are unable to bring their UK spouses to the UK

https://www.freemovement.org.uk/thousands-of-families-separated-by-the-immigration-rules-at-christmas/

100,000 less folks to drain the NHS,that was on of the main brexiteers points and why leave won the day,less immigrants is better for the UK,control of our own borders,surely you should be down spoonies with tommy celebrating,the goverment is acting even before brexit,just what you have wanted.

[vinny41]

8 hours ago, bomber said:

you talk of stupid EU law,i wonder what the germans/french  would make of the UK law my cousins are going through at the moment and a law i have also had friends affected by and may well be myself in the near future,the taking of all savings and selling of homes to pay for nursing home costs in old age,an EU citizen probably wouldnt believe it possible and would be even more shocked if you told them this UK law didnt apply to Scotland,and you want to see our govt come up with more of our own laws,UK law isnt even equal within in the UK,this is just one example there are more,iam surprised someone hasnt challenged this law in the european courts maybe they have i dont know,but it proves we are not at the mercy of EU law,what a shame as they would never of approved anything as barbaric.be careful what you wish for

I am fully aware of Nursing home/care home costs approx £1000-1500 per week in the UK

your cousins are more than likely fully aware if their parents spent spent and didn't save during their lifetimes didn't purchase property or investments and if their total savings/income including property were less than £23,000 their parents care home/nursing home fees would be paid for by the UK taxpayer

I think what your cousins are complaining about is their Potential inheritance pot is being eroded away with Nursing Home/Care Home costs , although I suspect if you were asked to pay another £5k each year in taxes so your cousins could retain their Potential inheritance pot you might declined to do so

And it seems you are totally unaware that many German families send their relatives overseas due to high care costs in Germany

Germany 'exporting' old and sick to foreign care homes

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2012/dec/26/german-elderly-foreign-care-homes

I assume you know that once you start taking your UK pension you will be come one of the many benefit scroungers that you love to knock so much

The pension paid out by these schemes is defined as a 'benefit'. State Pensionentitlement is based on having paid into the National Insurance scheme for a required number of years. ... Contributory benefits under Part II of that Act are listed, and the sixth is retirement pensions.Mar 4, 2016

[aright]

2 hours ago, melvinmelvin said:

EU Army. maybe.

 

This E27/28 --> E1, I am somewhat skeptical

I have worked intimately with the CEC for years and years, the Eurocrats are

not daft, they are not brainwashed - by and large quite jovial and likable and good thinkers

 

Among the Eurocrats, there is bound to be many many that are skeptical and not comfortable

with this E27/28 --> E1 process

 

can't see that process going swift and smooth

see some challenges here

 

In Europe, those who do not have the surname Verhofstadt, are plentiful

 

 

 

I agree there are many Eurocrats who are not daft or brainwashed and looking at the latest election figures an increasing number of Eurocrats who disagree with the Europhiles.

In  50 years the EU has evolved from a trading organisation with 6 Member States to a continental scale political system with extensive executive, legislative and judicial powers. I didn't vote for this.

Had the EU been a British invention whatever the political persuasion of the day they would have said ……….This isn't working very well, the Member States to the East are refusing to cooperate  on migration, the Member States to the South are being forced into an economic backwater as well as being angry about migration and populist movements are running amok even in the member states that formed the Union; Let's see if we can find some changes that will make the system more acceptable to its members.

What has the EU done?

Europe has a tremendous sense of historic identity, inherited cultures and proud communal loyalties....and I love them for it however many members feel their values are under threat from an insensitive unaccountable authority whose reaction to their feelings on migration are the most obvious symbol of their contempt for public opinion.

 

 

 

 

[bomber]

25 minutes ago, vinny41 said:

I am fully aware of Nursing home/care home costs approx £1000-1500 per week in the UK

your cousins are more than likely fully aware if their parents spent spent and didn't save during their lifetimes didn't purchase property or investments and if their total savings/income including property were less than £23,000 their parents care home/nursing home fees would be paid for by the UK taxpayer

I think what your cousins are complaining about is their Potential inheritance pot is being eroded away with Nursing Home/Care Home costs , although I suspect if you were asked to pay another £5k each year in taxes so your cousins could retain their Potential inheritance pot you might declined to do so

And it seems you are totally unaware that many German families send their relatives overseas due to high care costs in Germany

Germany 'exporting' old and sick to foreign care homes

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2012/dec/26/german-elderly-foreign-care-homes

I assume you know that once you start taking your UK pension you will be come one of the many benefit scroungers that you love to knock so much

The pension paid out by these schemes is defined as a 'benefit'. State Pensionentitlement is based on having paid into the National Insurance scheme for a required number of years. ... Contributory benefits under Part II of that Act are listed, and the sixth is retirement pensions.Mar 4, 2016

the guardian ???? report states growing numbers,this could mean 10-10,000 but i doubt it will be very many,it does not state that the german govt go plundering the savings/houses of folks who have worked hard all/most of their lives,but iam sure they dont,iam sure care may well be expensive there also but not to the extent of downright thieving,and i also wouldnt class taking the state pension at 66.5 as benefit scrounging after claiming less than £200 in benefits in a lifetime,luckily i started my own private pension at 19 to take care of me from 55,if i reach the state pension at 66.5 all good and well,if not tough shit.i think your going to enjoy comrade corbyns time in power,luckily i will be gone????️

[bomber]

3 minutes ago, aright said:

I agree there are many Eurocrats who are not daft or brainwashed and looking at the latest election figures an increasing number of Eurocrats who disagree with the Europhiles.

In  50 years the EU has evolved from a trading organisation with 6 Member States to a continental scale political system with extensive executive, legislative and judicial powers. I didn't vote for this.

Had the EU been a British invention whatever the political persuasion of the day they would have said ……….This isn't working very well, the Member States to the East are refusing to cooperate  on migration, the Member States to the South are being forced into an economic backwater as well as being angry about migration and populist movements are running amok even in the member states that formed the Union; Let's see if we can find some changes that will make the system more acceptable to its members.

What has the EU done?

Europe has a tremendous sense of historic identity, inherited cultures and proud communal loyalties....and I love them for it however many members feel their values are under threat from an insensitive unaccountable authority whose reaction to their feelings on migration are the most obvious symbol of their contempt for public opinion.

 

 

 

 

the EU migrant problem has a lot to do with the US removing stable govts in the middle east and north africa with the help and backing of the UK.

[nontabury]

1 hour ago, vinny41 said:

I would love to know where you get your figures from or do you an your mates make them up when your down at spoonies

approx over 100,000 est UK passport holders are unable to bring their UK spouses to the UK

https://www.freemovement.org.uk/thousands-of-families-separated-by-the-immigration-rules-at-christmas/

 You’ll find that many remoaners are more concerned with their own selfish lives, to consider the plight of their fellow citizens.

 

[nontabury]

1 hour ago, bomber said:

100,000 less folks to drain the NHS,that was on of the main brexiteers points and why leave won the day,less immigrants is better for the UK,control of our own borders,surely you should be down spoonies with tommy celebrating,the goverment is acting even before brexit,just what you have wanted.

Read his post again. He’s referring to British citizens, not immigrants, such as those from the E.u.

[bomber]

1 hour ago, nontabury said:

 You’ll find that many remoaners are more concerned with their own selfish lives, to consider the plight of their fellow citizens.

 

very odd remarks from a brexiteer,ive paid taxes and Ni for coming up to 35 years for the benefit of the UK,have you?

[nontabury]

1 hour ago, bomber said:

very odd remarks from a brexiteer,ive paid taxes and Ni for coming up to 35 years for the benefit of the UK,have you?

 

 Paid N.I for 44yrs. Tax much longer,and still paying.Will until I’m dead.

And my comment regarding some remoaners,still applies. Based on the remarks of some of the remoaners on these threads who are actually British.

[bomber]

remember i didnt vote,saw the damage coming after the vote.

[melvinmelvin]

Now that Westminster has concluded that they want changes to be made to the deal,

in the area of backstop and NI border:

 

have a nice trip to Brussels Ms May

 

fixing the deal can easily be done, the question is,

is there any political will to do it?

 

if EU should look into this issue,

what would be the correct procedure now that the Council of Ministers

has given the deal and cover the final nod?

 

would it require a nod from the same Council to start handling this?

 

what is the proper MO here?

 

[dick dasterdly]

6 hours ago, melvinmelvin said:

Now that Westminster has concluded that they want changes to be made to the deal,

in the area of backstop and NI border:

 

have a nice trip to Brussels Ms May

 

fixing the deal can easily be done, the question is,

is there any political will to do it?

 

if EU should look into this issue,

what would be the correct procedure now that the Council of Ministers

has given the deal and cover the final nod?

 

would it require a nod from the same Council to start handling this?

 

what is the proper MO here?

 

Our MPs have left us in a horrible position having voted that 'no deal' is unacceptable, but having also voted to go back and re-negotiate ????!

 

As far as I can make out, our MPs have no problem with the BRINO agreement or the unnecessary 39bn payment to the eu - and are hoping that the electorate will ignore these points, and focus entirely on the 'backstop'.....

 

Will the electorate be gullible enough to fall for this ploy?  I've no idea.

[Loiner]

Slipping back mostly ( plus a few rebels) into party lines, May has seen off the hardcore Remainers amendments for delaying Article 50 or ruling out a No Deal.

‘Leave Means Leave’ comment on this: “Parliament has told the PM to go back and re-negotiate what was the worst deal in history. If she can’t make material changes within a couple of weeks, then she must stick to her original word: no deal is better than a bad deal. The likelihood is that EU will reject further changes. A Managed no-deal WTO style Brexit will be fine for the UK to thrive and prosper. Let’s go for it.”


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[welovesundaysatspace]

1 hour ago, Loiner said:

 A Managed no-deal WTO style Brexit will be fine for the UK to thrive and prosper.

Will the people who say a no-deal can be managed actually manage it, or will they run away and hide again same as they did after they told everyone they would get the easiest deal in history? 

[Loiner]

Will the people who say a no-deal can be managed actually manage it, or will they run away and hide again same as they did after they told everyone they would get the easiest deal in history? 

Lets get out first and see shall we? The EU have shown it’s no good negotiating while they still have you in their clutches.

David Davis the negotiator said “I never said it would be easy.” Fox did say that sometime in 2017, before May kicked out DD and overruled Rabb, then made her own deal with Merkel. Now that one must have been the easiest in human history.


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[welovesundaysatspace]

1 hour ago, Loiner said:

Lets get out first and see shall we?

Again? After you let everyone down once already? This time Boris and Jacob will manage? ???? 

[Liverpudlian]

Oh Enoch !  if only you were here now.

[vinny41]

17 hours ago, bomber said:

the guardian ???? report states growing numbers,this could mean 10-10,000 but i doubt it will be very many,it does not state that the german govt go plundering the savings/houses of folks who have worked hard all/most of their lives,but iam sure they dont,iam sure care may well be expensive there also but not to the extent of downright thieving,and i also wouldnt class taking the state pension at 66.5 as benefit scrounging after claiming less than £200 in benefits in a lifetime,luckily i started my own private pension at 19 to take care of me from 55,if i reach the state pension at 66.5 all good and well,if not tough shit.i think your going to enjoy comrade corbyns time in power,luckily i will be gone????️

Once again your numbers are way out in this report written in 2016 its states that Germany has over 13,000 nursing homes, its unlikely that there only 1 person for each care home

Germany does have a long term care insurance plan where its mandatory to pay 2% of your salary each month.

 Depending on the type of care that is needed, the costs can differ drastically between care levels. Typically care level three requires the most attention and can therefore be more expensive – on average costing more than 3000 Euro a month. About 50 percent of this has to be paid by the patients themselves.

https://correctiv.org/en/latest-stories/health/2016/06/09/issues-with-the-german-nursing-home-care-system

[bomber]

5 hours ago, vinny41 said:

Once again your numbers are way out in this report written in 2016 its states that Germany has over 13,000 nursing homes, its unlikely that there only 1 person for each care home

Germany does have a long term care insurance plan where its mandatory to pay 2% of your salary each month.

 Depending on the type of care that is needed, the costs can differ drastically between care levels. Typically care level three requires the most attention and can therefore be more expensive – on average costing more than 3000 Euro a month. About 50 percent of this has to be paid by the patients themselves.

https://correctiv.org/en/latest-stories/health/2016/06/09/issues-with-the-german-nursing-home-care-system

still nowhere near as barbaric as the UK system,another factor to remember is home ownership is not as common in Germany as the UK so less for the EU German govt to plunder.And at least its the same for everybody unlike the barmy UK

[tebee]

brexit explained as a british social taboo

 

[nauseus]

23 minutes ago, tebee said:

brexit explained as a british social taboo

 

The poison in our system is the EU. Should be plain for everyone to see that by now. 

[bomber]

1 hour ago, nauseus said:

The poison in our system is the EU. Should be plain for everyone to see that by now. 

in 50 years ive never been poisoned,and neither have you,you just think you have cos it sounds patriotic,similar claims you will hear down the local from these type of people.

[Loiner]

in 50 years ive never been poisoned,and neither have you,you just think you have cos it sounds patriotic,similar claims you will hear down the local from these type of people.

Nowt wrong with them folk.


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[melvinmelvin]

4 minutes ago, Loiner said:

Nowt wrong with them folk.


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no, nothing wrong at all,

 

they are just poisoned

 

 

[bomber]

12 minutes ago, melvinmelvin said:

no, nothing wrong at all,

 

they are just poisoned

 

 

alcoholic poisoning,usually resulting in benefits for life and many visits to hospitals at great expense,typical Brits really.

[baboon]

16 minutes ago, bomber said:

alcoholic poisoning,usually resulting in benefits for life and many visits to hospitals at great expense,typical Brits really.

Benefits for life? Good luck with that in austerity Britain...

[nauseus]

2 hours ago, bomber said:

in 50 years ive never been poisoned,and neither have you,you just think you have cos it sounds patriotic,similar claims you will hear down the local from these type of people.

Don't presume to tell me what to think or why. Is that you in the photo?

[bomber]

25 minutes ago, baboon said:

Benefits for life? Good luck with that in austerity Britain...

after the brexit destruction we will  have corbyn to continue the destruction,good luck