Expats in Thailand considering moving to Latin America prompted by Thai visa changes

[Jingthing]

8 minutes ago, marcusarelus said:

So now might be a good time to buy a ranch.  Warren Buffet quotes make a great case on why now is the right time to bet on Venezuela real estate!  https://blog.realtyhive.com/buy-land-venezuela-now/#.XIPgMLhS_cA

OK, that's cool for a gonzo investing topic but that's different than MOVING there any time soon. I've said a similar thing about Nicaragua. In recent times, expats have fled. I think expats will come back someday so might be a good time to scoop up some prime buildings in Grenada if you can afford the risk and have the time to wait. 

Edited March 9, 2019 by Jingthing

[marcusarelus]

5 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

OK, that's cool for a gonzo investing topic but that's different than MOVING there any time soon. I've said a similar thing about Nicaragua. In recent times, expats have fled. I think expats will come back someday so might be a good time to scoop up some prime buildings in Grenada if you can afford the risk and have the time to wait. 

I didn't know Warren Buffet was a gonzo investor.  Thanks.  I'll keep that in mind.

[Andrew Dwyer]

Brazil suffered hyperinflation in the mid eighties right thru till 1994 , various currency changes caused absolute chaos for the population.

When, in 1994, they finally changed to their current currency ( real ) there was a brief period with the old currency ( cruzeiro ) and the real in circulation concurrently.

There was a huge difference in the currency value.
At one point $US 1 was equal to 1 real and 76,000 cruzeiros.

To have 2 currencies in your wallet caused mayhem, even despite the huge difference in zeros !! , the largest notes were 50 real and 500,000 cruzeiros.

Luckily the local population were honest people as a local bartender proved when he returned with a 50 real ( $US 50 ) tip I had mistakenly thrown in for a few beers with colleagues !!

[Jingthing]

I suppose the Switzerland of Central America Panama and dollarized Ecuador would be good bets if fear of hyperinflation is a top concern. 

[CaptainJack]

Update!

 

I will look closely at Latin America,  but if too hard, I will look to fly to Phenom Phen, get a one year visa for 300 dollars and hunker down and work at repairing my savings.  

 

I will use travel insurance for my medical insurance as long as legal. 

 

I will be looking for other expats in similar situations to possibly partner with. They have enough money to live, if sharing a flat, live really well and build some better savings. My savings is very little from several divorces and bad decisions.  I am lucky my pension is good.

 

The savings I have I will not risk putting in a Thai bank or will I live in Thailand again. 

 

I see my own circumstances as this simply.   I have cut too many ties already in the USA.   I am 66 and will not be able to afford medical insurance with preexisting conditions.   I do not want to live in the USA,  especially with limited savings,  now no car or home, no family and few friends. 

 

I am looking at options to improve my remaining life.

 

If there are others that may consider teaming up and trying Latin America or Cambodia, let me know. I will be traveling light and fast these next few months and will make a definitive decision soon.

 

FYI. I made a serious mistake and hired a visa company to fast track my retirement visa. I gave them my Embassy Letter.  I did not know until after the fact they had deposited 800k in my bank and withdrawn it the next day.  This involved me as complicit in bribery. 

 

I was advised by several expats that i stood a very high chance, because I needed to supply my previous bank records I was in risk of arrest and deportation and leave.  Do not consider trying to renew.  It was just to much risk.

 

PPS. Letting go of my Thai girlfriend was the hardest.  They are so easy to fall in love with.

Edited March 9, 2019 by CaptainJack
Better wording.

[Jingthing]

Capt. Jack -- if you've got a good pension as you say, I think I've already identified a quite easy Latin American nation to move to. Colombia. In fact it's visa possible with a very low pension but not practical for Medellin as it's not the cheapest. My information says from in country you can have your initial THREE YEAR retirement visa and cedula within a week or two and using a totally legit immigration lawyer and never have to even visit immigration, fill out a form, or go to Bogota. In Medellin where there is now a nexus of expat and expat support services so getting by without fluency in Spanish has become easier.   Go high end in Poblado, or more affordable in Envigado or Laureles. As far as health insurance for older with preexisting conditions in Colombia, that's something I want to understand as well. Perhaps contact this guy --

https://www.how-to-expat.com/

If you do find good information about that, please share it.

Edited March 9, 2019 by Jingthing

[CaptainJack]

12 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Capt. Jack -- if you've got a good pension as you say, I think I've already identified a quite easy Latin American nation to move to. Colombia. In fact it's visa possible with a very low pension but not practical for Medellin as it's not the cheapest. My information says from in country you can have your initial THREE YEAR retirement visa and cedula within a week or two and using a totally legit immigration lawyer and never have to even visit immigration, fill out a form, or go to Bogota. In Medellin where there is now a nexus of expat and expat support services so getting by without fluency in Spanish has become easier.   Go high end in Poblado, or more affordable in Envigado or Laureles. As far as health insurance for older with preexisting conditions in Colombia, that's something I want to understand as well. Perhaps contact this guy --

https://www.how-to-expat.com/

If you do find good information about that, please share it.

Thanks! This is good information.  I can turn several bad financial decisions around quickly with the right place to live and using the head on top of my head. 

[Jingthing]

4 minutes ago, CaptainJack said:

Thanks! This is good information.  I can turn several bad financial decisions around quickly with the right place to live and using the head on top of my head. 

You will need your social security benefits letter.

You can print this from a MySSA online account if you have one.

If not, contact social security directly to get you one.

If you're in the U.S. you might want to have that document prepared for Colombia immigration (official translation and state department apostille.) Of in Colombia it can be officialized by the U.S. embassy in Bogota either by yourself directly or through a lawyer. No need to show money in the bank. No need to import a specific amount. No address reports. 

Edited March 9, 2019 by Jingthing

[Mike Teavee]

2 hours ago, marcusarelus said:

So now might be a good time to buy a ranch.  Warren Buffet quotes make a great case on why now is the right time to bet on Venezuela real estate!  https://blog.realtyhive.com/buy-land-venezuela-now/#.XIPgMLhS_cA

When I was working in Kenya, there were serious troubles in one of the African countries & our Project Manager (local guy) was buying up big houses there for peanuts.

 

I caught up with him on another project a few years later & he told me that most of the properties had been "Repossessed" (i.e. stolen from him) by whoever won the "Debate", but they did let him keep a couple of the smaller ones which he estimated were worth 100+ x what he's spent on all of the properties put together.

 

Be greedy when others are fearful 

Edited March 9, 2019 by Mike Teavee

[Jingthing]

There may be, emphasis on may, a national health option in Colombia, similar to Ecuador, that may be available (or even required?) of foreign retired expats. It's called the EPS –

Quote

Entidadas Promotoras de Salud – the public healthcare insurance that is mandatory for everybody. The monthly premium is based on 12.5% of the monthly gross income that you declare to the EPS. 

I can't vouch for how accurate this link is but if it is accurate it could be either very good or very bad news for older retired expats.

It basically says private Colombia insurance is impossible after age 62. 

But what about international firms?

But it suggests the EPS is for everyone. 

Now the bad news. The cost being 12 percent of stated income. This is very similar to Ecuador. 
It's potentially reasonable for people on low pensions (you can qualify with 900 monthly) but if you have a high pension, like 4000 monthly, that would be a very high premium.

However, I saw another older source (similar to the controversy in Ecuador) that the premium is set quite a bit lower than by percentage.

But if, a big if, this info is accurate, I can see how it could be a deal breaker for many. 

Personally for me it's not. I have a lower pension so the premium would be OK, I would welcome older age acceptance on a decent nationalized system and would be happy to pay 12 percent of my pathetically small pension for it  (wish Thailand had that).

http://caliadventurer.com/health-insurance-in-colombia/

Wish I could be more definitive but it's a start. 

Edited March 9, 2019 by Jingthing

[Mike Teavee]

JT, obviously finances are a key part of this thread, as you've done so much research into LA, it would be great to get your view on the "Best" Country to move to (in terms of core living costs, rent, food etc...) if your income were:-

• < $500 per month 
• $500 - $1,000 per month
• $1,000 - $2,000 per month
• $2,000 - $3,000 per month
• $3,000 - $4,000 per month
• > $4,000 per month

... and at what point would you look elsewhere (maybe even back to Thailand)?

 

 

[tutsiwarrior]

2 hours ago, Jingthing said:

OK, that's cool for a gonzo investing topic but that's different than MOVING there any time soon. I've said a similar thing about Nicaragua. In recent times, expats have fled. I think expats will come back someday so might be a good time to scoop up some prime buildings in Grenada if you can afford the risk and have the time to wait. 

 

I heard that a lot of expats in Nicaragua live in Esteli and Matagalpa both of which are mountainous and cooler than Grenada that has the same climate as Managua which is not nice...quite miserable actually...Grenada has the colonial architecture which is nice and the other places are more rustic with fewer facilities for expats...but the property is is probably significantly cheaper...

 

 

 

 

 

Edited March 9, 2019 by tutsiwarrior

[tlandtday]

Congrats on defining some latin american options.  Personally I think Columbia is a good choice.  Has anyone looked into Buenos Aires?  I think not so expensive and a very interesting city with a decent climate.  If you are not a sex addict or alcoholic you will have an easier time transitioning away from Thailand lol.

[Jingthing]

12 minutes ago, Mike Teavee said:

JT, obviously finances are a key part of this thread, as you've done so much research into LA, it would be great to get your view on the "Best" Country to move to (in terms of core living costs, rent, food etc...) if your income were:-

• < $500 per month 
• $500 - $1,000 per month
• $1,000 - $2,000 per month
• $2,000 - $3,000 per month
• $3,000 - $4,000 per month
• > $4,000 per month

... and at what point would you look elsewhere (maybe even back to Thailand)?

 

 

Oh geez, that's hard.

 

 

Won't answer under 1000 as most will require more than that if pension based and if you don't have savings that's really not enough.

 

1000 to 2000 -- Ecuador, Mexico (must qualify based on show money abroad at that level), Peru. Colombia. Panama provincial. 

 

2000 to 3000 -- Uruguay, Chile, Argentina if you figure out their visa system, Brazil maybe in selected beach towns, Panama City and surroundings

 

4000 -- most anywhere and live it up, baby! But if it was me, I would probably stay in the USA, or Europe. 

 

 

 

Edited March 9, 2019 by Jingthing

[Jingthing]

10 minutes ago, tutsiwarrior said:

 

I heard that a lot of expats in Nicaragua live in Esteli and Matagalpa both of which are mountainous and cooler than Grenada that has the same climate as Managua which is not nice...quite miserable actually...Grenada has the colonial architecture which is nice and the other places are more rustic with fewer facilities for expats...but the property is is probably significantly cheaper...

 

 

 

 

 

Nicaragua these days is off all the mainstream lists. Political violence. Wait and see. Last time I checked the lowest level pension requirement for retirement visas in Latin America, maybe globally. 

Edited March 9, 2019 by Jingthing

[CaptainJack]

Instead of replying to the question of if my pension is good (no offense taken), let's get this outta the way.  I can provide bank statements if necessary. 

 

My pension before taxes and medical insurance is 5,000US a month. I have 18,000US dollars saved. My cost to rent a nice apartment,  replace all the furniture I donated and purchase a decent car destroys my financial planning.  

 

With that, please keep the suggestions coming.  I have a call in to a friend now who lives in North Carolina who was raised and lived in Colombia. 

Edited March 9, 2019 by CaptainJack
Better wording.

[CaptainJack]

11 minutes ago, tlandtday said:

Congrats on defining some latin american options.  Personally I think Columbia is a good choice.  Has anyone looked into Buenos Aires?  I think not so expensive and a very interesting city with a decent climate.  If you are not a sex addict or alcoholic you will have an easier time transitioning away from Thailand lol.

I like sex but have gone for long stretches with none. I drink, but not an alcoholic.  Thank god!

Edited March 9, 2019 by CaptainJack

[Jingthing]

2 minutes ago, CaptainJack said:

Instead of replying to the question of uf my pension is good (no offense taken), let's get this outta the way.  I can provide bank statements if necessary. 

 

My pension before taxes and medical insurance is 5,000US a month. I have 18,000US dollars saved. My cost to rent a nice apartment,  replace all the furniture I donated and purchase a decent car destroys my financial planning.  

 

With that, please keep the suggestions coming.  I have a call in to a friend now who lives in North Carolina who was raised and lived in Colombia. 

None of these countries will want to see your bank statements. They need official documents. Generally government pensions. There is sometimes another category (higher levels) for private company pensions. I assume you can qualify for most any Latin American nation based on government pensions. It might be in your interest to claim your lowest one only for the health insurance reasons alluded to. They don't need to overqualify. You just need to meet their levels which can be very low. With exceptions of Mexico, Brazil, Uruguay, and possibly Argentina if they ever officially update their number. 

[GinBoy2]

1 hour ago, CaptainJack said:

Update!

 

I will look closely at Latin America,  but if too hard, I will look to fly to Phenom Phen, get a one year visa for 300 dollars and hunker down and work at repairing my savings.  

 

I will use travel insurance for my medical insurance as long as legal. 

 

I will be looking for other expats in similar situations to possibly partner with. They have enough money to live, if sharing a flat, live really well and build some better savings. My savings is very little from several divorces and bad decisions.  I am lucky my pension is good.

 

The savings I have I will not risk putting in a Thai bank or will I live in Thailand again. 

 

I see my own circumstances as this simply.   I have cut too many ties already in the USA.   I am 66 and will not be able to afford medical insurance with preexisting conditions.   I do not want to live in the USA,  especially with limited savings,  now no car or home, no family and few friends. 

 

I am looking at options to improve my remaining life.

 

If there are others that may consider teaming up and trying Latin America or Cambodia, let me know. I will be traveling light and fast these next few months and will make a definitive decision soon.

 

FYI. I made a serious mistake and hired a visa company to fast track my retirement visa. I gave them my Embassy Letter.  I did not know until after the fact they had deposited 800k in my bank and withdrawn it the next day.  This involved me as complicit in bribery. 

 

I was advised by several expats that i stood a very high chance, because I needed to supply my previous bank records I was in risk of arrest and deportation and leave.  Do not consider trying to renew.  It was just to much risk.

 

PPS. Letting go of my Thai girlfriend was the hardest.  They are so easy to fall in love with.

I think kids are huge pull to go home.

Both my daughters from from previous marriage wanted me to go home. When my youngest daughter had a baby, I was actually distraught that I wasn't there for her

When my Thai son, who is a US citizen, graduated college in Chicago told us he was never coming back to Thailand, that was the tipping point for us

[CaptainJack]

4 minutes ago, GinBoy2 said:

I think kids are huge pull to go home.

Both my daughters from from previous marriage wanted me to go home. When my youngest daughter had a baby, I was actually distraught that I wasn't there for her

When my Thai son, who is a US citizen, graduated college in Chicago told us he was never coming back to Thailand, that was the tipping point for us

Makes sense for your circumstances.  I have no family.  Parents are dead, no siblings or children.  No reason to stay back here beyond 3 weeks unless I run out of other options. 

Edited March 9, 2019 by CaptainJack

[tutsiwarrior]

12 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Nicaragua these days is off all the mainstream lists. Political violence. Wait and see. Last time I checked the lowest level pension requirement for retirement visas in Latin America, maybe globally. 

not surprised, nica is the most miserable place in LA after Haiti and not much has changed since I was there in the 80s except that there's no contra war now like then...a lot of similarity between the chavistas in Venezuela and the sandinistas and neither will be giving up soon...

 

Esteli and Matagalpa were charming little towns back then as I remember...a big relief from the heat and squalor of Managua...Esteli had a timber industry and Matagalpa was the main coffee growing center...

 

 

[Cryingdick]

2 hours ago, Mike Teavee said:

When I was working in Kenya, there were serious troubles in one of the African countries & our Project Manager (local guy) was buying up big houses there for peanuts.

 

I caught up with him on another project a few years later & he told me that most of the properties had been "Repossessed" (i.e. stolen from him) by whoever won the "Debate", but they did let him keep a couple of the smaller ones which he estimated were worth 100+ x what he's spent on all of the properties put together.

 

Be greedy when others are fearful 

 

Nah buying in Venezuala is a great idea. What could possibly go wrong?

 

"Price is what you pay, value is what you get."

[Jingthing]

This seems to strongly confirm info about the Colombia health care system. Problems are mentioned but a specific recommendation is made. If over 60 or 62 you will be limited to EPS. Under that and you can add private insurance on top of the EPS. It sounds like the EPS program care can be good. Kind of sounds like a restrictive U.S. HMO. Bigger cities, better hospitals. Many are world class. I think learning Spanish would be essential not just for the medical care but for living in Colombia, period. That's definitely  a downside for many. As far as I'm concerned the required enrollment (and cover) of the EPS being over 60 with preexisting conditions is a massive feature for retiring in Colombia. I know Americans will say, but but but giving up Medicare. Yes, but but but bottom line Medicare isn't really free either, you pay for the extra parts and out of pocket expenses. 

https://medellinguru.com/health-insurance/

https://www.epssura.com/

https://www.eltiempo.com/vida/salud/ranking-de-las-mejores-eps-de-colombia-en-2018-196510

 

 

Edited March 9, 2019 by Jingthing

[CaptainJack]

9 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

This seems to strongly confirm info about the Colombia health care system. Problems are mentioned but a specific recommendation is made. If over 60 or 62 you will be limited to EPS. Under that and you can add private insurance on top of the EPS. It sounds like the EPS program care can be good. Kind of sounds like a restrictive U.S. HMO. Bigger cities, better hospitals. Many are world class. I think learning Spanish would be essential not just for the medical care but for living in Colombia, period. That's definitely  a downside for many. As far as I'm concerned the required enrollment (and cover) of the EPS being over 60 with preexisting conditions is a massive feature for retiring in Colombia. I know Americans will say, but but but giving up Medicare. Yes, but but but bottom line Medicare isn't really free either, you pay for the extra parts and out of pocket expenses. 

https://medellinguru.com/health-insurance/

https://www.epssura.com/

https://www.eltiempo.com/vida/salud/ranking-de-las-mejores-eps-de-colombia-en-2018-196510

 

 

Thank you times 1000.  I also just got off the phone with my friend from Colombia and it looks like that will be my target destination after some time in Merida. 

 

Oh, I'll keep paying my Medicare and supplemental insurance until I decide I'm in one place for good.  ????

[marcusarelus]

8 hours ago, CaptainJack said:

Update!

 

I will look closely at Latin America,  but if too hard, I will look to fly to Phenom Phen, get a one year visa for 300 dollars and hunker down and work at repairing my savings.  

 

I will use travel insurance for my medical insurance as long as legal. 

 

I will be looking for other expats in similar situations to possibly partner with. They have enough money to live, if sharing a flat, live really well and build some better savings. My savings is very little from several divorces and bad decisions.  I am lucky my pension is good.

 

The savings I have I will not risk putting in a Thai bank or will I live in Thailand again. 

 

I see my own circumstances as this simply.   I have cut too many ties already in the USA.   I am 66 and will not be able to afford medical insurance with preexisting conditions.   I do not want to live in the USA,  especially with limited savings,  now no car or home, no family and few friends. 

 

I am looking at options to improve my remaining life.

 

If there are others that may consider teaming up and trying Latin America or Cambodia, let me know. I will be traveling light and fast these next few months and will make a definitive decision soon.

 

FYI. I made a serious mistake and hired a visa company to fast track my retirement visa. I gave them my Embassy Letter.  I did not know until after the fact they had deposited 800k in my bank and withdrawn it the next day.  This involved me as complicit in bribery. 

 

I was advised by several expats that i stood a very high chance, because I needed to supply my previous bank records I was in risk of arrest and deportation and leave.  Do not consider trying to renew.  It was just to much risk.

 

PPS. Letting go of my Thai girlfriend was the hardest.  They are so easy to fall in love with.

Did you have any problems getting your money out of Thai banks when you left?  Why would an agency deposit 800k in an account if you had a embassy letter verifying your pension?  Get an O-A visa at home and fly back to Thailand.  Have an onward ticked to Cambodia.  You will know if you have any problems when you enter. 

 

Probably your best bet is to get health care from the VA in the States and stay home.  Trump liberalized the VA rules and you can receive care at a hospital of your choice if more than an hour or so away from a VA hospital.  You can look it up.  I think I read you have a $5.000 pension.  No problem renting a nice apartment and getting a car for that amount.

 

 

Edited March 10, 2019 by marcusarelus

[CaptainJack]

12 minutes ago, marcusarelus said:

Did you have any problems getting your money out of Thai banks when you left?  Why would an agency deposit 800k in an account if you had a embassy letter verifying your pension?  Get an O-A visa at home and fly back to Thailand.  Have an onward ticked to Cambodia.  You will know if you have any problems when you enter. 

 

Probably your best bet is to get health care from the VA in the States and stay home.  Trump liberalized the VA rules and you can receive care at a hospital of your choice if more than an hour or so away from a VA hospital.  You can look it up.  I think I read you have a $5.000 pension.  No problem renting a nice apartment and getting a car for that amount.

 

 

Answer to your first question.  The visa company was a corrupt company.  They did what they do, bribe corrupt Thai IO's. They did not use my Embassy letter and did not tell me until it was too late.

 

Second question.  Absolutely not. I'll never set foot in Thailand again. I don't trust coming to Thailand even as a tourist. 

 

Third point. The Choice program is only good if you are disabled and it is free. I would pay for care at the VA at the same copayment rate as a Medcare Advantage plan, which I have.

 

Fourth point.  The Choice Program is under review by Congress and may be defunded because of ineffective results.  The 50 mile limit includes VA clinics. If there is an Outpatient Clinic within 50 miles, you cannot use the Choice Program.   

 

The program has been a disaster and will likely be scrapped. 

 

Fifth point.  Yes, absolutely on the car and apartment.  I'm just not ready to call that mark in.  Thailand did not work for me and my objectives.  Another country might. That is what I'm looking at now.

 

Thanks for the great questions and observations.   I hope I answered well.

[marcusarelus]

16 minutes ago, CaptainJack said:

Answer to your first question.  The visa company was a corrupt company.  They did what they do, bribe corrupt Thai IO's. They did not use my Embassy letter and did not tell me until it was too late.

 

Second question.  Absolutely not. I'll never set foot in Thailand again. I don't trust coming to Thailand even as a tourist. 

 

Third point. The Choice program is only good if you are disabled and it is free. I would pay for care at the VA at the same copayment rate as a Medcare Advantage plan, which I have.

 

Fourth point.  The Choice Program is under review by Congress and may be defunded because of ineffective results.  The 50 mile limit includes VA clinics. If there is an Outpatient Clinic within 50 miles, you cannot use the Choice Program.   

 

The program has been a disaster and will likely be scrapped. 

 

Fifth point.  Yes, absolutely on the car and apartment.  I'm just not ready to call that mark in.  Thailand did not work for me and my objectives.  Another country might. That is what I'm looking at now.

 

Thanks for the great questions and observations.   I hope I answered well.

Don't want to argue but you are wrong about the choice program.  You can look it up.  I got a message a couple of days ago by email.  I don't know what you mean about calling a mark in nor do I understand how an illegal visa agency would effect your view of Thailand. 

 

I don't think you will find less corruption than Thailand in your price range except USA. 

 

$5000 a month is more than enough to live most places in America. 

[CaptainJack]

1 hour ago, marcusarelus said:

Don't want to argue but you are wrong about the choice program.  You can look it up.  I got a message a couple of days ago by email.  I don't know what you mean about calling a mark in nor do I understand how an illegal visa agency would effect your view of Thailand. 

 

I don't think you will find less corruption than Thailand in your price range except USA. 

 

$5000 a month is more than enough to live most places in America. 

I've been working directly with Veterans Advocacy Groups since 2005.  I am on the VA early notice program.  You probably don't know, because very few do know, that only two years ago, the VA attempted to gut the financial compensation program for veterans diagnosed with PTSD to pay for the Choice Program.  I can share way more detailed information. 

 

I helped co-write an emergency bill in 2005 for legislation that was presented to a special Senate subcommittee hearing to stop the termination of certain veterans benefits under a proposal by the president to trim funds from the VA.

 

Need I say more?  Read this article. It helps explain what I referred to.

 

As to "mark". That is tapping into my savings to buffer repatriation.   Nothing more.

 

The fact that my visa was obtained illegally would potentially be revealed at my first renewal.  A renewal requires yiur old passbook and records.  Mine clearly shows 800k in one day and out the next.

 

If called on this point, I'm in trouble.   I'll not risk it.

 

https://www.military.com/daily-news/2019/02/27/va-asks-comment-proposed-access-rules-dav-gives-thumbs-down.html

 

And this one. 

 

https://www.military.com/daily-news/2018/03/12/veterans-doctors-alike-stranded-vet-choice-fails-pay-its-bills.html

Edited March 10, 2019 by CaptainJack

[Jingthing]

Well, I can see that for now at least this thread has become rather Colombia-centric. 

That's fine with me as my current thinking is that Colombia presents an unusually beneficial expatriation opportunity. Recovered from narco violence and civil war, a strong constitution, a very pro free trade government, very favorable dollar exchange rate, modern infrastructure, wonderful destinations with a wide variety of climate/geography/culture choices, seemingly relatively "easy" visa system, can drink water from the tap in most expat attractive cities (other than the beach ones), no instant path to permanent residence but still there is a three year initial retirement visa and definitely a path to citizenship, very very low financial requirements for retirement, low cost public transport and taxis (location dependent you won't need a car), a distinctive vibrant social culture that you'll probably either love or hate but worth checking out, the national health care system as I've described.

 

Negatives? Of course. 

The local food isn't the most interesting coming from anywhere in Asia or compared to other more culinary draw nations in Latin American such as Peru, Argentina, Brazil, and Mexico. But probably better than Central American food. Lack of very wide international food choices outside of the bigger cities. The capital city Bogota no doubt a great city but more of a draw to working and business expats than retired ones, and not featuring wonderful weather. Murders and violent crime way way down from the bad old days, but in general, yes, people would need to be more security aware in Colombia than in Thailand. It's Latin America so there is bureaucracy and rules can change, but overall it seems the trend there is to more modernization and efficiency. You need to learn Spanish there much more than you need to learn Thai in Thailand (but of course Spanish is much easier than Thai, you can at least read the words). The rental culture is a major pain. There will be gringo pricing. It may take you a long time to get into the culture to get closer to a local price for a rental (or you could pay "expat helpers" to give you an edge from the start). They generally require one or two (OMG) cosigners to rent housing (called fiador). There are ways around the cosigner thing. Going direct to owners rather than agencies and sniffing out the more desperate ones. Then negotiate. Without cosigners, could be as much as a year's deposit for example but then maybe you can negotiate it down to three months. But think about it, if your rent is 400, that's 2400 dollars for 12 months deposit, compare that to locking up 800K baht in a Thai bank account that you can't spend down under 400K. In that context, even a 12 month deposit is trivial. Anyway not to gloss over this as it's a common very big complaint. Go to Medellin and you will probably find it initially hard to find cheap enough rents for the type of housing in the type of neighborhood you as a foreigner will probably want to live in. That can be solvable over time but people looking for super easy and super cheap right from off the plane are coming and going after short periods. Or you could reduce this issue by not trying to move to the most famous and popular expat magnet Medellin. Air pollution, traffic congestion in the most popular expat city, Medellin. Food overall not as cheap as the cheapest food options in Thailand. Tropical Caribbean beach options will be hot and humid, and subject to tropical diseases. No bum guns and plumbing may be poor, so toilet paper buckets (yuck).

 

I'm sure there are many more positives and negatives that can be discovered. 

 

Keep in mind it's not only about Medellin.

Medellin is the obvious choice but it depends what you want and what you're going for. 

 

In the coffee region, the smaller less air polluted cities of Pereira, Manizales and even smaller Armenia have their attractions. More of an expat pioneer there which will appeal to some and scare others. 

 

Cali. What can I say? Not much. 

 

Bogota of course for those that need to be in the center of it all.

 

Santa Marta and world famous Cartagena on the Caribbean coast. Keeping it hot. 

 

Other big city for the expats pioneers -- Baranquila and Bucaramanga

 

I think those are the top of the list but of course just scratching the possibilities if you want to go more local there. 

 

A look at the diversity WITHIN Colombia. A lot to discover!

 

Edited March 10, 2019 by Jingthing

[Jingthing]

Ooops! 

Big math error above.

Obviously 12 x 400 is 4800, not 2400.

I guess in my head I was thinking 6 not 12, and if a landlord won't even negotiate down to 6 months deposit from 12, then probably it's time to walk unless you really gotta have that particular apartment. 
 

Quote

But think about it, if your rent is 400, that's 2400 dollars for 12 months deposit, compare that to locking up 800K baht in a Thai bank account that you can't spend down under 400K. In that context, even a 12 month deposit is trivial.