Is it worth learning Thai

[namatjira]

It makes all the difference in the world to speak thai,

its worth it just to see the relief on the seven eleven attendants faces when they can clearly understand you.....

just like all languages there is a proper version and not so proper version...if you have learnt off an issan bar girl, Thais can pick that up very quickly......I have heard some farang speak pure Isaan bar slang down to perfection ..... this is not such a good idea.....

Take the time to speak the basics correctly and it will be in your favor......

[BritManToo]

3 minutes ago, namatjira said:

its worth it just to see the relief on the seven eleven attendants faces when they can clearly understand you.....

Why would you want to speak to a serving girl in 7-11?

It's self service.

[namatjira]

asking for things behind the counter, small bottle of rum, whisky, cigarettes , many things......being able to understand when they are asking you if you want the toasted sandwich heated up....do you want everything in a bag ?

many things...

[BritManToo]

2 minutes ago, namatjira said:

asking for things behind the counter, small bottle of rum, whisky, cigarettes , many things......being able to understand when they are asking you if you want the toasted sandwich heated up....do you want everything in a bag ?

many things...

Ridiculous ....... takes 2 seconds to learn 'wave kap'

The rest you just point at. 

[jgarbo]

On 5/11/2019 at 3:50 PM, OneEyedPie said:

For me it's a big, fat 'no'.  I really don't want to know what Thais think of me.  

They are usually polite about their distaste for farang, mainly the noise, smell and appalling manners. But the language is wonderful, efficient, few redundancies mean you must listen to every word from the start. Only 5 tones to six in English, but our tones convey feeling, while Thai conveys meaning. The big "problem" is vowels, 125 of them which must be perfect, against English's 21 or so. Two Bs and two Ds can cause trouble. I was lucky, having perhaps the best Thai teacher in the universe, Marvin Brown at AUA. 

The "alphabet" is a syllabary (one "letter" can be a word), very accurate and also showing etymological history (Pali, Thai, Sanskrit, Chinese origins). 46 consonants against English's 21. 

I passed a Por 6 years ago after 6 weeks study and 3 months of Thai language speaking instruction.  Hardest language I've learned. BTW speaking Chinese is a snack compared to Thai, agreed by Thai friends studying Chinese, though of course the Chinese writing system is hell, but then they have Pinyin, which you can learn in an hour and is everywhere in China.

To learn or not? Speak even scrappy Thai and doors will open, folks will smile, prices fall, snacks are free. The cops at Siam Square stop traffic after few words to help me across the road with my shopping. What else can I say. It's very hard but worth it if you want to understand Thailand. Or you can stay a "distasteful tourist who only has money."

HTH

 

[namatjira]

9 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

Ridiculous ....... takes 2 seconds to learn 'wave kap'

The rest you just point at. 

any relation to basil fawlty?

[TKDfella]

59 minutes ago, Antonymous said:

After studying Thai for a couple of months with the use of a Linguaphone before my first visit to LOS, I discovered to my dismay that Thai people didn’t actually speak in the way that I had learned. In everyday speech they used different vocabulary, phrases and pronunciation. I was put off by that early experience.

 

As a company owner in Thailand I quickly found that leaving Thai language communication to my bilingual senior managers had many distinct advantages for me when interacting with other staff, suppliers and particularly with any government officials. My managers also convinced me that helping them to become more fluent in English would be a far better use of my time than my learning to speak Thai! Thirty years on I have to agree that they were right.

 

If you live here for any length of time I’d say that it is hugely beneficial to have a Thai personal assistant who can communicate with you very well in your native language, whether that PA is your employee, close friend, GF or wife. And so long as you have such an asset, you really don’t need to speak, read or write Thai yourself, beyond mastering a small vocabulary and a few oft used phrases that suit your particular circumstances. But be sure to learn those choice words from an educated Thai and not from bargirls (or Linguaphones) if you want to be understood and respected.

Yes, I think you have a valid point. If you are a 'company owner' then I'm sure you will need to do what is best for the company and you made the right choice. I have had it experience in this but the other way round. A director of a large Thai civil engineering company became a friend of mine through my being friends with other members of his family. He could speak some English but really he was far too busy to continue learning English on a regular and in depth basis. I basically suggested the same as your employees did to you. He wanted me to work for him but that would have meant problems with immigration for me. In the end I helped some younger assistants and I was available at any time for talking (English) to reps in other countries regarding equipment. However this really wasn't enough and I suggested he employ native English speakers to work with his assistants. Although this director died (my involvement stopped at this time) the two chaps employed still work for the company several years on.

It's good to hear that have made a success of the situation.

[TKDfella]

34 minutes ago, namatjira said:

asking for things behind the counter, small bottle of rum, whisky, cigarettes , many things......being able to understand when they are asking you if you want the toasted sandwich heated up....do you want everything in a bag ?

many things...

I agree. Looks like BritManToo is a 'wind-up merchant', Ha!

[utalkin2me]

I think the op did a good job.

 

To decide if something is worth it or not you need to tally up all the positives and negatives. And there are negatives. 

 

I will tell you what, let's say you have no interest whatsoever in Turkish History. What if you had to learn Turkish History however. It would be a huge pain, like going back to high school. That is what learning Thai is like.

 

That right there is enough to outweigh the positives in my opinion. 

[wilailuk]

41 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

Ridiculous ....... takes 2 seconds to learn 'wave kap'

The rest you just point at. 

 

- and "kop korp" - the tuna sandwich is yummy when crusty!

 

 

[utalkin2me]

43 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

Ridiculous ....... takes 2 seconds to learn 'wave kap'

The rest you just point at. 

That is actually another great point. 

 

Let's just say a guy in the UK did bear down and learn Thai. Would many of the most common phrases even be in the books? I cannot imagine "wave" is actually written down in a book, I could be wrong. 

[TKDfella]

3 minutes ago, utalkin2me said:

That is actually another great point. 

 

Let's just say a guy in the UK did bear down and learn Thai. Would many of the most common phrases even be in the books? I cannot imagine "wave" is actually written down in a book, I could be wrong. 

It is...and with variations too. Today there are many more books on 'colloquial' languages (including Thai) than there were a few years ago. It's just a matter of how much one wants/can deal with.

[namatjira]

I had an English friend, he had lived here many years, but just couldn’t be bothered learning Thai....he had an issan missus to do that for him, she could speak pretty good English....however , when he ventured out on his own into a seven eleven or a chemist it was point point point , anger.....the staff get easily confused at a 6 foot tall long haired Englishman grunting pidgin thai...he would often just walk out.....he used to buy cigarette papers and he did a Charlie Chaplin like impersonation of rolling a cigarette....god it was funny....frustrating for him and also for the staff...there’s this dude shuffling his fingers , sticks them up to his mouth like he’s preening a moustache..........so funny......

[1FinickyOne]

7 hours ago, ThaiBunny said:

Your intellectual milieu?

You like taking a shot at me? sure, you would say, just asking a question - but all bound in nastiness - 

 

And that is why I really like and prefer country Thai people. They aspire to enjoying life, to being friendly, they joke and laugh - AND - - they don't take shots at each other...

 

I have lived in intellectual circles - - I far prefer being with kind people... hopefully, you will realize that kindness and decency is more important. 

[uhuh]

45 minutes ago, TKDfella said:

It is...and with variations too. Today there are many more books on 'colloquial' languages (including Thai) than there were a few years ago. It's just a matter of how much one wants/can deal with.

Which book?

[LawrenceN]

1 hour ago, jgarbo said:

46 consonants against English's 21. 

 

Great post, good explanation. Please accept a friendly correction to above. English has 42 vowels, upper and lower case.

[Jonah Tenner]

On 5/11/2019 at 3:55 PM, Orton Rd said:

No, after 25 years it's still sometimes a struggle to get the cashier at Big C to understand the card number I give her, takes 3 or 4 goes sometimes. This is after adult education course, linguaphone, two Thai language Schools, assorted books and cd's and marrying a teacher of Thai language!

I have all my shopping card numbers written in notes in my phone, makes things much easier. I just show, and do not have to say a word.

[TKDfella]

43 minutes ago, kenk24 said:

You like taking a shot at me? sure, you would say, just asking a question - but all bound in nastiness - 

 

And that is why I really like and prefer country Thai people. They aspire to enjoying life, to being friendly, they joke and laugh - AND - - they don't take shots at each other...

 

I have lived in intellectual circles - - I far prefer being with kind people... hopefully, you will realize that kindness and decency is more important. 

One often has to be careful with intellectual Thais for several reasons. My experiences with them are many and some very unpleasant indeed. 'A chip on the shoulder' phrase fitted quite well and I found that having a discussion where opinions or understanding conflict, remaining 'a friend' has not been possible. Country people seem much easier going and don't have many 'hangups'.

[Cheops]

On 5/11/2019 at 3:48 PM, robint said:

Only super educated thais can master that skill.

This post is full of bs. 

 

Super educated Thais? I guess my 2 kids are super educated in your view, since they could write Thai from about the 2nd grade in school (fluent in English and Thai actually). 

 

The question whether to speak the local language is of course stupid. If you plan to live here long term, there is no question if you should learn Thai, it's a must.

 

It's also bs that Thai hate it when foreigners can speak Thai. They actually like it and applaud you for taking the time to learn their language.

 

Before anyone asks, yes I can speak Thai. 

[Ireland32]

Yes , so you know when your GF is cheating, with her so called cousin , brother, uncle.....

[Cheops]

On 5/11/2019 at 3:55 PM, Orton Rd said:

No, after 25 years it's still sometimes a struggle to get the cashier at Big C to understand the card number I give her, takes 3 or 4 goes sometimes. This is after adult education course, linguaphone, two Thai language Schools, assorted books and cd's and marrying a teacher of Thai language!

I guess you are good at math then? 555

[Cheops]

On 5/11/2019 at 4:26 PM, Peterw42 said:

Yes, of course its worth learning, I just wish I was better at learning.

I still find it very difficult, I cant hear or reproduce the tonal differences, 5 minutes later I have forgotten the word anyway.

 

If some old Thai lady who left school at 12 years old can learn some of my language, makes me feel pretty stupid, that I cant learn some of her language. It would certainly be worth it.

 

I think its a cop out to say its not necessity, not worth it, I choose not to learn etc.

The natives should have never been allowed to join the empire club if you ask me, lol

Don't focus too much on the tonals. Learn Thai like a kid learning a language. Listen and repeat, over and over again. Kids can speak a language, before they know about grammar or tonals.

 

This is the way I taught myself Thai. Later on, when you have a huge vocabulary, you will see connections in the words and sentences and then you can try to throw in the tonals. 

 

When I speak Thai I often get compliments that I speak very clear Thai, although mostly I have no clue in how to pronounce a single word (well, I have a clue, but for adults trying to learn a new tonal language is simply physically difficult). It's like kids who learn a language. Now I can speak quite a lot, without having to think. It's becoming more natural. 

[Cheops]

On 5/11/2019 at 5:12 PM, BritManToo said:

Show them a photo of the item you want to buy on your smartphone.

No skills required in any language, also works with/for deaf/mutes.

You want to live the rest of your life like a deaf/mute during communicating? Sorry, but I don't. 

[utalkin2me]

6 minutes ago, Cheops said:

Don't focus too much on the tonals. Learn Thai like a kid learning a language. Listen and repeat, over and over again. Kids can speak a language, before they know about grammar or tonals.

 

This is the way I taught myself Thai. Later on, when you have a huge vocabulary, you will see connections in the words and sentences and then you can try to throw in the tonals. 

 

When I speak Thai I often get compliments that I speak very clear Thai, although mostly I have no clue in how to pronounce a single word (well, I have a clue, but for adults trying to learn a new tonal language is simply physically difficult). It's like kids who learn a language. Now I can speak quite a lot, without having to think. It's becoming more natural. 

I have been told my Thai is good a few times. I know two words of Thai. Please do not take it as an actual compliment... unless you really want to, I am just being realistic here. 

[BestB]

Of course its worth learning the language of the country you living in, instead of relying on "wife" or "gf" who of course is not a bar girl but well educated lady from a wealthy family who just madly fallen in love with an old westerners double her age, 

 

However besides self proclaimed fluent Thai speakers on Thai visa who mastered Thai at the age of 60 plus, it is a very hard language to learn being a tonal language.

 

One thing is to learn the words but then to learn the tones and remember and be able to recreate the correct tone.

 

Locals are NOT the most fast thinking people, and have no problem making faces or dumbfounded looks when you get a tone wrong. Even as silly as saying cola instead of colaaaaa, may get you the "huh" which does not make it any more encouraging to learn more or to speak more.

 

In tourist locations, even though locals can hardly string few words in English, they insist on responding in English even when you speaking with them in Thai, Most of the time their response is incoherent yet they will insist on speaking in English.

 

So, is it worth learning Thai yes it is, at least you can understand what is happening when your well educated "wife" or "gf" gets you into some trouble or unwanted situation.

 

It is a must if you work in Thailand, being able to at least understand most certainly helps.

 

My Thai is good enough to front the judge by myself, yet i do not consider myself being fluent or even good because i often get tones wrong. 

 

I have no problems communicating with lawyers or doctors or people with high education, but often find myself struggling with everyone else. 

 

Not only them understanding me, but me understanding them, as often they do not speak clear. 

 

To me its like when Irish or Scottish or Welsh speaking, they appear to be  speaking my native tongue, English, and yet i cannot understand a single word coming out of their mouth.

 

Why do y people say you must learn to read to be able to speak? because when you can read you actually know how to pronounce the words correctly instead of how it sounds to your ear. 

 

And to end the rant and to confuse even more, i can not read or write, yet i can spell each and every word correctly in 95% of the time. Now try to beat this kind of weird and crazy ????

[Damrongsak]

40 or so years ago, I did OK, thanks to about 6 weeks of intensive language training courtesy of the Peace Corps.  Met and married my wife, who didn't speak English then.  I was in Loei and there were very few English speakers then, hardly any foreigners.  It was learn Thai or keep quiet for a couple years.

 

I never got too far, especially with reading and writing.  Though I doubt the farmers I worked with did, either.  But I can manage traveling by myself, ordering food (I'm vegetarian ...) bargaining and making a bit of idle chit-chat. I can generally make myself understood, but don't understand a lot of people.  My in-laws will talk at me, thinking I understand more than I do.  It was great fun the other day trying to help my bro-in-law diagnose a transmission shifting problem with a BMW Mini and explain the various error codes.

 

I still have no clue when it comes to understanding old Isaan people with a mouthful of betel nut.  Or for that matter my wife and her siblings when they jabber in Isaan/Lao at a rapid pace. 

[stephen tracy]

I actually find the entire opening post a bit stupid. It begins by assuming every foreigner on Thai visa a western male with the obligatory “tilak”. I have never in all my years here met a Thai (male or female) that has ever discouraged me from learning or speaking the language. That’s an absurd claim, or perhaps the Thailand the OP inhabits in does not resemble the one I do. He makes the following equally absurd claim: “Remember that a facility with the language will not open doors for you. You will still be an alien and never ever be accepted”. It has opened MANY doors for me and most of my friends here are now Thai. I now only have two non-Thai friends. The post goes on to say that only educated Thais can learn to write Thai. Beyond absurd. Of course they can bloody write their own language. Even I can write it, albeit clumsily still as I have little need to do so. Using a Thai dictionary is as easy as using any dictionary for any language.

[utalkin2me]

I would hire an interpreter to follow me around Thailand far before I would sit down with a book or look at a damn language video. Since I have my pick I would choose a Thai woman too, about 5'1", 110 or so pounds, long black hair. I wont get into age, whoever is the most qualified. 

 

In all seriousness, keeping in mind how much i make when i work, I think it would be well far and beyond better cost wise to hire an interpreter. If speaking the language is actually important (which it is not), then an interpreter would make sense. I wonder why we do not see anyone with interpreters then... oh, because it is not actually important to speak Thai here unless you are in business or something like this. 

[Cheops]

On 5/11/2019 at 5:30 PM, OneEyedPie said:

Big difference is Thais can work in, for example, the UK but the majority of expats can't work in LOS.  

 

Further, LOS does not have a social security system for falang [there's barely one for the natives], but a Thai can claim social security in the UK.  The idea therefore is a Thai settling in the UK will require an elementary comprehension of English to improve their chances of finding gainful employment which reduces the burden on the taxpayer.

???

 

Foreigners can work in Thailand AND foreigners who do work also get the SAME social security benefits as a Thai who works. A Thai who doesn't work, also doesn't get any social security benefits.

 

AND if you go for a Thai PR, you will need to be able to speak Thai to get it. Similar as in many Western countries. 

[Cheops]

10 minutes ago, utalkin2me said:

I have been told my Thai is good a few times. I know two words of Thai. Please do not take it as an actual compliment... unless you really want to, I am just being realistic here. 

I'm not talking about bs compliments from Thai who compliment you after you say sawasdee krab 555. When I pick up the phone at work and a Thai is on the other side of the line, they do not know that I am a foreigner. I don't speak 2 words, but complete conversations.