Brexit campaigner Boris Johnson to stand as next Conservative leader

[Baerboxer]

51 minutes ago, Loiner said:

The bus and its' sticker didn't and still doesn't matter. Some of you Wemainers won't wet it go though.

 

Ah the Farage approach.

 

It doesn't matter when Brexit politicians tell deliberate lies, turn about face, deny saying things they did say, say the complete opposite, and are total lying hypocritical gits. Mustn't ask them about the past, only what they say now is relevant.

 

The fairy tale world of the Brexiteers!

[geoffbezoz]

3 hours ago, stephenterry said:

Don't think the Tory party is invincible. In certain circumstances, historically speaking, they could be defunct like the Liberal party became by 1918. Current thinking is why the Tories need to get rid of May. 

Well here is hoping. As the anti christ Thatcher decimated the British manufacturing capabilities in the 1980's let's hope the British people decimate the Tory party if there is a GE if it comes to that. Every dog has its day and it looks like the Tory looney dogs have finally barked too loud and now need muzzleing for the good of the UK and the European Union

[Baerboxer]

4 hours ago, tebee said:

the problem with that is that it was only going to be +1 to because it was only an advisory referendum.

 

Referendums, if they are to be binding and effect major constitutional changes, need to have a supermajority of 10% or so. There needs to be a clear majority, not just 2%, otherwise  the country ends up split and divided. 

 

It's also very stupid to do expensive changes on the whim of a small majority. Suppose we voted by 51% to start driving on the right, then 5 year later, many people decide they don't like it, we have another referendum and  51% decide they preded driving on the left.

 

Trying to use a majority of 1.3 million to make a change in something as major as leaving the EU is a recipe for creating instability in a country, which is exactly what it has done. 

 

Referendums cannot be legally binding under the current UK constitution and constitutional law; under any circumstances. That would require massive constitutional change to alter. The whole point of a representative democracy, with parliament as sovereign, is to stop the situation we're now in. Parliament can take advise, consultations, hold referendums to see opinions, but have to make the decisions themselves, based on what they believe to be right for the country.

 

I agree though, not putting clear majority rules in any advisory referendum is stupid and begging for divisiveness.  But the arrogant myopic Cameron never envisaged a close result and certainly not Leaving winning.

 

 

[Baerboxer]

3 minutes ago, geoffbezoz said:

Well here is hoping. As the anti christ Thatcher decimated the British manufacturing capabilities in the 1980's let's hope the British people decimate the Tory party if there is a GE if it comes to that. Every dog has its day and it looks like the Tory looney dogs have finally barked too loud and now need muzzleing for the good of the UK and the European Union

 

Thatcher didn't decimate British industry. Labor and the Unions did that. Unproductive, inefficient, overpaid, ineffective, and unwilling to change.

Thatcher's crime was in putting them down rather than administering life saving actions for the ones worthy.

 

 

[billd766]

5 hours ago, Chomper Higgot said:

You are supporting an act of national self harm brought about by lies and electoral fraud.

 

I need know nothing else about you to draw a conclusion from that.

 

In one thing we agree, the Brexit debacle has resulted in a breakdown of trust between the electorate and politicians.

 

When we examine the connections between members of the Leave campaign and foreign governments/political organizations and factor in the knowledge that £millions of unaccounted foreign funding poured into the Leave campaigns it becomes a valid question to ask - was Brexit a means to break trust in the political process?

 

And then that other question:

 

 

cui bono?

That is only your point of view and not mine or that of millions of other UK citizens who actually DO have a say and a vote in the UK.

 

Do you?

 

The other question.

 

When Teresa May finally leaves the debacle that she has brought on the UK and the EU, there will be another Tory PM for a period of time until the next general election. At that time very few MPs in all parties will have no problems in getting re-elected but many more will  The Tories might make the #2 slot with Labour at #3 or the other way around. #1 who knows but it won't be the Lib/Dems or the Green party.

[Nanglon]

1 hour ago, Loiner said:

The bus and its' sticker didn't and still doesn't matter. Some of you Wemainers won't wet it go though.

But it unfortunately set the adversarial tone ….. "look at them thieving from us", vote out and we'll get it back for you. Wrong.

[billd766]

4 hours ago, Chomper Higgot said:

So where is the problem?

 

The Government have obtained the lousy deal Remain had predicted and that hardly anyone supports.

 

Now, only because ‘enemies of the people’ put an end to Theresa May’s attempts to govern by executive order, Parliament gets to have a vote on ‘the deal’.

 

’The Deal’ stinks, and rightly Parliament have rejected it.

 

Brexit is a crock.

 

Just like ‘project fear’ said it would be.

I agree with you about the lousy deal that the government and Teresa May obtained.

 

Hardly unexpected when the PN and the majority of parliament are Remainers, the majority of whom completely ignored the voters who elected them and did what they wanted.

 

And the people who were driving project fear are the same ones that screwed up Brexit.

 

Most of them will be gone after the next election.

[geoffbezoz]

29 minutes ago, Baerboxer said:

 

Thatcher didn't decimate British industry. Labor and the Unions did that. Unproductive, inefficient, overpaid, ineffective, and unwilling to change.

Thatcher's crime was in putting them down rather than administering life saving actions for the ones worthy.

 

 

Clearly you are not English as you would know that the UK do not have labor nor for that matter a Labor party, but Australia has. So hence you have no right to any input but keep to your delusions that the UK labour force was responsible for the downfall. Your demonstration of historical political ignorance is great asset when no other plausible argument  exists.

[Chomper Higgot]

2 hours ago, billd766 said:

That is only your point of view and not mine or that of millions of other UK citizens who actually DO have a say and a vote in the UK.

 

Do you?

 

The other question.

 

When Teresa May finally leaves the debacle that she has brought on the UK and the EU, there will be another Tory PM for a period of time until the next general election. At that time very few MPs in all parties will have no problems in getting re-elected but many more will  The Tories might make the #2 slot with Labour at #3 or the other way around. #1 who knows but it won't be the Lib/Dems or the Green party.

Whether or not I have a say and a vote in in the U.K. is:

 

a) none of your business 

b) irrelevant in respect to discussions here on TVF.

 

I may be mistaken but I thought these points had been firmly asserted.

 

 

Theresa May did not visit this debacle on anyone, the blame for that belongs to the leaders of the Leave campaign and those who voted for Brexit.

[Chomper Higgot]

2 hours ago, geoffbezoz said:

Clearly you are not English as you would know that the UK do not have labor nor for that matter a Labor party, but Australia has. So hence you have no right to any input but keep to your delusions that the UK labour force was responsible for the downfall. Your demonstration of historical political ignorance is great asset when no other plausible argument  exists.

I would agree Bareboxer is remarkably ignorant on matters relating to British and EU politics, but his nationality (regardless of what that is) has no bearing on his right to comment on this, or indeed any other, subject.

[sammieuk1]

4 hours ago, Loiner said:

The Remainers on the bus go on and on, on and on, on and on.

The Remainers on the bus go on and on, all <deleted>' day long. Have none of you learned anything yet? The sticker didn't matter.

unfortunately half the 52% of halfwits did believe the slogan how about you???? 

[Loiner]

6 minutes ago, sammieuk1 said:

unfortunately half the 52% of halfwits did believe the slogan how about you???? 

You think you're another Remainer reader of Leaver minds, but you've got the percentage wrong. It was only the 48% Remainer voters who took any notice of the bus sticker. To Leavers it didn't matter. 

[evadgib]

10 minutes ago, sammieuk1 said:

unfortunately half the 52% of halfwits did believe the slogan how about you???? 

'Owzat!' 

 

[Loiner]

3 hours ago, Baerboxer said:

 

Ah the Farage approach.

 

It doesn't matter when Brexit politicians tell deliberate lies, turn about face, deny saying things they did say, say the complete opposite, and are total lying hypocritical gits. Mustn't ask them about the past, only what they say now is relevant.

 

The fairy tale world of the Brexiteers!

"We will respect the result of the referendum." Brexit means Brexit........................and all the rest. The Remainer politicians are the deliberate liars in this matter.
The duplicitous world of Remainers!

[sammieuk1]

8 minutes ago, Loiner said:

You think you're another Remainer reader of Leaver minds, but you've got the percentage wrong. It was only the 48% Remainer voters who took any notice of the bus sticker. To Leavers it didn't matter. 

Think you have exhausted the pipe on that bus by the sound of it????

[david555]

On 5/17/2019 at 7:30 AM, welovesundaysatspace said:

Not a bad idea. When you have a circus, you should have a clown on top. 

Honestly do the U.K. really expect to be taken serious by the world  as a country next decades …??? 

[Loiner]

3 hours ago, Nanglon said:

But it unfortunately set the adversarial tone ….. "look at them thieving from us", vote out and we'll get it back for you. Wrong.

Nothing unfortunate about it, the UK public needed to know how the EU rips us off, to the tune of 8 to 9 Billion per year. We are now 2 years over time to get out of the corrupt and wasteful bloc.

[Loiner]

8 minutes ago, sammieuk1 said:

Think you have exhausted the pipe on that bus by the sound of it????

Looks like it's all you've got to go on though, doesn't it? 

[sammieuk1]

4 minutes ago, Loiner said:

Looks like it's all you've got to go on though, doesn't it? 

Not so grasshopper plenty more like Dominic Cummings "take back control" slogan like anyone has had or will have any control other than the rich elite that sold it to the gullible or the even hotter chestnut of immigration sold to the north to rid the Pakistani immigrants   ????

[Loiner]

1 minute ago, sammieuk1 said:

Not so grasshopper plenty more like Dominic Cummings "take back control" slogan like anyone has had or will have any control other than the rich elite that sold it to the gullible or the even hotter chestnut of immigration sold to the north to rid the Pakistani immigrants   ????

First things first. We need to get out of the EU, before we can look at who goes. Who's to say the rich elite won't be gotten rid of before some of the others?

[Chomper Higgot]

1 minute ago, Loiner said:

First things first. We need to get out of the EU, before we can look at who goes. Who's to say the rich elite won't be gotten rid of before some of the others?

This rich elite of yours, is this the tax shy Billionaires, Multimillionaires and Hedge Fund managers who funded the Brexit Leave campaign.

 

Or are you referring to Farage and his ‘grace and favour’ £450,000 a year lifestyle and free Chelsea home?

[nontabury]

7 hours ago, tebee said:

Bad referendums create more uncertainty, rather than clarifying the wishes of the electorate.

 

Here we have exactly that - everyone know what their own leave vote ment - problem is not everyone concept of that is the same. If you going to have a vote on something, you need to vote on a specific proposal, not. a woolly concept that is open to interpretation.

 

Otherwise you end up with brexit means brexit  - and we all know that that means don't we ? 

 

 

But it was’t just the referendum. At the 2017 General Election, parties who put it in their manifesto, that they would respect and honour the referendum result,obtained 80% of the votes. What you seem to be saying is that Democracy is irrelevant.

 

 

 

 

[nontabury]

4 hours ago, Baerboxer said:

 

Ah the Farage approach.

 

It doesn't matter when Brexit politicians tell deliberate lies, turn about face, deny saying things they did say, say the complete opposite, and are total lying hypocritical gits. Mustn't ask them about the past, only what they say now is relevant.

 

The fairy tale world of the Brexiteers!

 

 

 Mustn’t ask the remoaners about their past statements, as it’s very embarrassing.

 

 

[Loiner]

24 minutes ago, Chomper Higgot said:

This rich elite of yours, is this the tax shy Billionaires, Multimillionaires and Hedge Fund managers who funded the Brexit Leave campaign.

 

Or are you referring to Farage and his ‘grace and favour’ £450,000 a year lifestyle and free Chelsea home?

As your rich elite contribute proportionately more tax, I'd probably leave most of them. Start with the political elites and work down to the chattering classes in the South. Next would be TVF Remainers. 

[stephenterry]

12 hours ago, Loiner said:

You think you're another Remainer reader of Leaver minds, but you've got the percentage wrong. It was only the 48% Remainer voters who took any notice of the bus sticker. To Leavers it didn't matter. 

After the referendum result, a statistical breakdown and analysis of the reasons why swathes of voters (mainly from high unemployment areas north of the Watford gap and Wales), chose 'Leave the EU' as their option, was, in the main, caused by the Tory government austerity measures. That had a huge influence on the result.  

 

This section of the unemployed population resented EU citizens entering the UK and taking the low-paid jobs like fruit picking, cleaners, hospital workers, etc. As one guy outside a job centre in Middlesboro said, 'I voted Leave because it must be better than what I have now'.

 

Move to the Council estates, and their reasons added, 'well we never trust the EU ever since the war, so better to get out of it'. 

 

That is not to say the only reason why Leavers voted the way they did, but it was enough to swing the result in their favour. And the real issue is just the same. The Tory government is incapable of governing the country for the benefit of all. MP's know - by now - that Brexshit is just that, and there must be better solutions than blindly adhering to the referendum vote. 

 

It would be interesting to find out May's next move to force through her deal. After undoubtably being heavily defeated at the EU elections, she'll possibly request parliament to consider a short list of indicative votes, e.g. pass her deal, leave the EU without a deal, or remain. A confirmatory vote could be opened to the electorate. 

 

This is high voltage politics, that could finally crush the government and the Tory party...  

 

 

    

[Loiner]

5 hours ago, stephenterry said:

After the referendum result, a statistical breakdown and analysis of the reasons why swathes of voters (mainly from high unemployment areas north of the Watford gap and Wales), chose 'Leave the EU' as their option, was, in the main, caused by the Tory government austerity measures. That had a huge influence on the result.  

 

This section of the unemployed population resented EU citizens entering the UK and taking the low-paid jobs like fruit picking, cleaners, hospital workers, etc. As one guy outside a job centre in Middlesboro said, 'I voted Leave because it must be better than what I have now'.

 

Move to the Council estates, and their reasons added, 'well we never trust the EU ever since the war, so better to get out of it'. 

 

That is not to say the only reason why Leavers voted the way they did, but it was enough to swing the result in their favour. And the real issue is just the same. The Tory government is incapable of governing the country for the benefit of all. MP's know - by now - that Brexshit is just that, and there must be better solutions than blindly adhering to the referendum vote. 

 

It would be interesting to find out May's next move to force through her deal. After undoubtably being heavily defeated at the EU elections, she'll possibly request parliament to consider a short list of indicative votes, e.g. pass her deal, leave the EU without a deal, or remain. A confirmatory vote could be opened to the electorate. 

 

This is high voltage politics, that could finally crush the government and the Tory party...  

 

 

    

Another Remainer mind reader, falling into the same political & elitist mode of telling the masses the whys and what for. Based on more  anecdotal quotes that suit the Remain and Leftist agenda, they got it wrong again. Anything will do, just spin it to keep us in the EU and attempt to get LAB into power. 

[evadgib]

20 hours ago, david555 said:

Honestly do the U.K. really expect to be taken serious by the world  as a country next decades …??? 

Maggie had turned us around in just 3 years.

Farage has mobilized an EU election winning party in less time than the 35 day flash-to-bang of the most recent GE.

[david555]

1 hour ago, evadgib said:

Maggie had turned us around in just 3 years.

Farage has mobilized an EU election winning party in less time than the 35 day flash-to-bang of the most recent GE.

Of course .....Farage want to get finally his golden pension on your coming suffering cashing in …..

And Thatcher would kick your asses for be so blunt stupid …. but she would & could probably get better conditions even when staying in the E.U. …… but she is no more ,and seeing across the channel it looks hopeless there 

[RuamRudy]

2 hours ago, evadgib said:

Maggie had turned us around in just 3 years.

Farage has mobilized an EU election winning party in less time than the 35 day flash-to-bang of the most recent GE.

But he is a one trick pony - the Brexit Party has been shown wanting when it came to policies other than Brexit. As there are surely supporters from across the political spectrum, how do you think he will manage to keep them all united behind him if he achieves their single shared goal? Take away Brexit and he has nothing to offer the country.

[tebee]