Video Trump threatens 'obliteration,' Iran calls White House 'mentally retarded'

[Morch]

11 minutes ago, Srikcir said:

Rising tensions exacerbated by the U.S.

https://news.yahoo.com/iran-shot-down-176-million-223144549.html

• Iranian Brigadier General Rahimzadeh said that Iran had sent the U.S. “several warning” before downing the drone, according to Iran’s semi-official news agency, Tasnim.
• Amirali Hajizadeh, head of the Revolutionary Guards aerospace division, said that a American Boeing P-8 Poseidon surveillance plane was in Iranian airspace at the same time as the drone, but Iran had decided not to shoot it down because Iran authorities did not want casualties, Tasnim reported, according to Reuters. 

 

And, of course, the Iranian version should be accepted without questions and doubts.

 

From the very same article:

 

Quote

 

Douglas Barrie, a senior fellow for military aerospace at the International Institute for Strategic Studies tells TIME that this kind of aircraft would be sent on missions to conduct maritime surveillance or to peer inside a country from outside its borders.

 

“The range of the sensors onboard would allow you to see, certainly, areas of Iran of interest, while you’re still in international airspace,” Barrie says.

 

[stevenl]

17 minutes ago, Srikcir said:

Rising tensions exacerbated by the U.S.

https://news.yahoo.com/iran-shot-down-176-million-223144549.html

• Iranian Brigadier General Rahimzadeh said that Iran had sent the U.S. “several warning” before downing the drone, according to Iran’s semi-official news agency, Tasnim.
• Amirali Hajizadeh, head of the Revolutionary Guards aerospace division, said that a American Boeing P-8 Poseidon surveillance plane was in Iranian airspace at the same time as the drone, but Iran had decided not to shoot it down because Iran authorities did not want casualties, Tasnim reported, according to Reuters. 

An indication of the changed perception is that I at the moment trust the Iranian version of events more than the American.

[wabothai]

45's Threat to kill over 80 million people should be met with his immediate removal from the WH.

[atyclb]

7 hours ago, ballpoint said:

7 hours ago, spidermike007 said:

Iran is home to one of the world's oldest continuous major civilizations, with historical and urban settlements dating back to 7000 BC.

But that's older than many Trump supporters think the world is!

likely true there but in all fairness much of the millennial sjw entitled snowflake generation have a piss poor concept of  things like basic geography, history, hard science

[Morch]

28 minutes ago, stevenl said:

An indication of the changed perception is that I at the moment trust the Iranian version of events more than the American.

 

And the World takes note, no doubt. But seriously, how is that a change?

[bristolboy]

7 minutes ago, atyclb said:

likely true there but in all fairness much of the millennial sjw entitled snowflake generation have a piss poor concept of  things like basic geography, history, hard science

So you're contending that trump supporters in that particular cohort are better educated and/or more knowledgeable?

[atyclb]

51 minutes ago, bristolboy said:

1 hour ago, atyclb said:

likely true there but in all fairness much of the millennial sjw entitled snowflake generation have a piss poor concept of  things like basic geography, history, hard science

So you're contending that trump supporters in that particular cohort are better educated and/or more knowledgeable?

 

no contention intended

[mikebike]

2 hours ago, Morch said:

 

Did Iran provide any such "detailed tracking and coordinates" that could be verified?

Why would they? They are not the ones threatening "obliteration".

[mikebike]

2 hours ago, Morch said:

is the Islamic regime of Iran in the habit of highlighting and glorifying the nation's past?

About as much as the current USA regime "highlighting and glorifying" theirs...

[mikebike]

2 hours ago, Morch said:

And as much as you tout Iran and Iranians' resilience to hardship, it reads more like an armchair view,

And yet, history is on Spidy's side... everyone thinks they have it hard. USA is way to young and iscolated to have experienced what ols cultures have.

Edited June 26, 2019 by mikebike

[Kasane]

One day he calls off strike so that 150 lives can be spared. Next day he want to obliterate. Schizophrenic.

[metisdead]

A post containing unsubstantial allegations has been removed as there was no supporting links to back up the allegations. 

 

Other off topic posts and replies have been removed. 

[attrayant]

10 hours ago, Lungstib said:

This is supposed to be a US President backed by Evangelical Christians.

 

 

I call them 'Salad Bar Christians' because they pick and choose the bits of the religion they like while ignoring the rest of it.

[meand]

10 hours ago, habanero said:

Iran is the world’s leading state sponsor of terrorism. Period. It has held that dubious distinction for many years now and shows no sign of relinquishing the title.

To the contrary, the regime in Tehran continues to provide hundreds of millions of dollars every year to terrorists across the world. It does this, despite ongoing economic turmoil that’s impoverishing many of its people. The beneficiaries of this misbegotten largesse range from Hezbollah in Lebanon, to Hamas in Gaza, to violent rejectionist groups in the West Bank, to the Houthis in Yemen, to hostile militias in Iraq and Syria.

So you all keep knocking what President Trump is trying to do. The big picture is not just to keep Iran from acquiring nukes. It is to basically break them of the ability to sponsor these terrorist programs.

 Let me give you some numbers. This may sound hard to believe, but Iran provides Hizballah alone some $700 million a year. It gives another $100 million to various Palestinian terrorist groups. When you throw in the money provided to other terrorists, the total comes close to one billion dollars.

 And who ultimately pays the price of this support? The Iranian people. The resources Iran uses to fund its global terrorist campaign come directly out of the pockets of ordinary Iranians. The regime robs its own citizens to pay its proxies abroad. This is not the behavior of a normal government. This is the behavior of a lawless regime that uses terrorism as a basic tool of statecraft.

No it is not. Saudi Arabia is the leading supporter of terrorists. 

 

If you listen to Iranian diplomats speak, they refer to the US sanctions on countries who do not comply with their every demand as a form of economic terrorism. I would absolutely agree with that characterization. The point here is, there is not "good" and "evil" here. That is a complete farce. The problem is, nobody is objective, and nobody seems to understand why the relationship between the countries is so bad. Iran certainly does not want a conflict. 

[meand]

3 hours ago, Morch said:

 

In your informed view, is the Islamic regime of Iran in the habit of highlighting and glorifying the nation's past? (As in including the parts preceding the ascent of Islam). Sounds like more of a talking point. I think the regime's focus in this regard is more to do with revisionism, but could be wrong.

 

And as much as you tout Iran and Iranians' resilience to hardship, it reads more like an armchair view, and a politically motivated one at that. Here, you're welcome to ignore it again:

 

Iranians say their ‘bones breaking’ under US sanctions

https://www.apnews.com/9390faa746294f628b93beea57ba1e07

 

Personally, I find it sickening that some have no issues with opining how others, less-well-to-do, and half across the globe, ought to face hardship in order to fulfill posters' political fantasies.

 

The USA would not collapse without Netflix, or even cornflakes. That's just your usual over-the-top baseless nonsense fare. But by all means, do go on about Trump having "no perspective".

 

I wouldn't know that Iran would be "easier than Iraq" (in what way?) or that "they" think that. Claiming a 30 year war etc., now that's quite a statement. Backed up by anything much? Doubt it.

 

And then we get the usual trademark scaremongering. Give it a rest. Iran isn't a superpower. It can do some damage, but lets not get carried away. Wouldn't know that anyone's underestimating Iran - and no support for such if offered, naturally - but I am sure, you're hyping Iran's capabilities.

What is our "record"? Do people really think we are "winning" wars such as Afghanistan and Syria? The only winners are war production companies. Taxpayers are losers. The inhabitants of the countries we invade are losers. 

 

Not to mention Vietnam. 

 

I do not know why on earth the US thinks they are so tough. They are not. Dropping a-bombs onto defenseless nations certainly does not make you tough. 

 

Wars are more complicated than dropping bombs and technology. Little five foot tall, untrained men beat up on the USA on the ground in Vietnam. That is where wars are won.

 

Do people really think with all the money to be made by the military industrial complex that we would not be in Iran already if it was such an "easy" winnable war? We would be in there already.

 

The fact is, we would suffer great loss. If we overplayed our hand and used atomic weapons then international attitudes would quickly turn. 

 

I would not write Iran off in a war for a second. I could not only see them winning, but I could also imagine the more probable scenarios of them outlasting and outmanuevering the USA like in Vietnam. That is why we aren't in there already. 

[sabyedee]

11 hours ago, habanero said:

Iran is the world’s leading state sponsor of terrorism. Period. It has held that dubious distinction for many years now and shows no sign of relinquishing the title.

To the contrary, the regime in Tehran continues to provide hundreds of millions of dollars every year to terrorists across the world. It does this, despite ongoing economic turmoil that’s impoverishing many of its people. The beneficiaries of this misbegotten largesse range from Hezbollah in Lebanon, to Hamas in Gaza, to violent rejectionist groups in the West Bank, to the Houthis in Yemen, to hostile militias in Iraq and Syria.

So you all keep knocking what President Trump is trying to do. The big picture is not just to keep Iran from acquiring nukes. It is to basically break them of the ability to sponsor these terrorist programs.

 Let me give you some numbers. This may sound hard to believe, but Iran provides Hizballah alone some $700 million a year. It gives another $100 million to various Palestinian terrorist groups. When you throw in the money provided to other terrorists, the total comes close to one billion dollars.

 And who ultimately pays the price of this support? The Iranian people. The resources Iran uses to fund its global terrorist campaign come directly out of the pockets of ordinary Iranians. The regime robs its own citizens to pay its proxies abroad. This is not the behavior of a normal government. This is the behavior of a lawless regime that uses terrorism as a basic tool of statecraft.

Are you sure you aren’t talking about the USA? Biggest military budget in the world, constantly at war, only developed country to not have universal health care, largest percent of citizens in jail, wreaking havoc on the world’s trade system, refuses to play by the rules and stamps its feet when it doesn’t get its way. And it’s citizens are suffering. Racism, poverty and overseas slavery of workers by some of the USA’s biggest company. 

[Kwasaki]

11 hours ago, sanemax said:

Well done to Trump for not retaliating for the drone being shot down , but if the drone was in Iranian airspace , Iran had every right to shoot it down and the USA cannot complain 

The US have already moved the goalposts on that, claiming it was in international airspace as of course they would say because the whole world is American airspace. ????

[stevenl]

3 minutes ago, Kwasaki said:

The US have already moved the goalposts on that, claiming it was in international airspace as of course they would say because the whole world is American airspace. ????

Yes, they have stated it was shot in international space. I don't think I have seen a statement though it had not entered Iranian space earlier.

[Kwasaki]

11 hours ago, habanero said:

Iran is the world’s leading state sponsor of terrorism. Period. It has held that dubious distinction for many years now

What load of baloney ???? maybe Iran likes the idea of beating the USA to number 1 spot.

[Kwasaki]

13 minutes ago, stevenl said:

Yes, they have stated it was shot in international space. I don't think I have seen a statement though it had not entered Iranian space earlier.

That's classified in the interests of US international security sorry. ????

[Pique Dard]

i say this, before talking of "obliteration", i've yet to see an iranian drone shot down along the american marine coastlines

[meand]

5 minutes ago, Pique Dard said:

i say this, before talking of "obliteration", i've yet to see an iranian drone shot down along the american marine coastlines

US shot down an Iranian plane with 290 people on it. All died. 

 

But, it is ok. It was an "accident". US I suppose feels privileged enough to get a mulligan or two over killing hundreds of innocents. 

 

That drone incident was another complete farce. US has even admitted it was a spy drone, obviously on a spy mission. What is there to debate on that topic?! 

Edited June 26, 2019 by meand

[scorecard]

12 hours ago, ballpoint said:

I've seen this movie before.  This will be the start of a beautiful relationship.  Trump and Khammy.

The word 'love' coming soon...

[meand]

55 minutes ago, stevenl said:

Yes, they have stated it was shot in international space. I don't think I have seen a statement though it had not entered Iranian space earlier.

Let's get real here. There is a potential war looming between Iran and USA, and even US has admitted it was a spy drone. I am not criticizing your statement, just saying it is fairly easy to discern what is probably going on here. Unless there is some international treaty saying you can't destroy an aircraft that is clearly spying on you right before a potential war, which seems ludicrous. 

 

Countries have the right to defend themselves. 

[Morch]

5 hours ago, mikebike said:

Why would they? They are not the ones threatening "obliteration".

 

What does the threat have to do with it? Are you confused about the timeline? Following your "logic" - The USA needs to provide information regarding the drone incident, because a few days later Trump made a threat? How does that even begin to make sense?

[Morch]

5 hours ago, mikebike said:

About as much as the current USA regime "highlighting and glorifying" theirs...

 

Did you actually bother to read the post I was responding to or just out for a stroll?

[Morch]

5 hours ago, mikebike said:

And yet, history is on Spidy's side... everyone thinks they have it hard. USA is way to young and iscolated to have experienced what ols cultures have.

 

If you say so.

[ThaiFelix]

10 hours ago, meand said:

What is our "record"? Do people really think we are "winning" wars such as Afghanistan and Syria? The only winners are war production companies. Taxpayers are losers. The inhabitants of the countries we invade are losers. 

 

Not to mention Vietnam. 

 

I do not know why on earth the US thinks they are so tough. They are not. Dropping a-bombs onto defenseless nations certainly does not make you tough. 

 

Wars are more complicated than dropping bombs and technology. Little five foot tall, untrained men beat up on the USA on the ground in Vietnam. That is where wars are won.

 

Do people really think with all the money to be made by the military industrial complex that we would not be in Iran already if it was such an "easy" winnable war? We would be in there already.

 

The fact is, we would suffer great loss. If we overplayed our hand and used atomic weapons then international attitudes would quickly turn. 

 

I would not write Iran off in a war for a second. I could not only see them winning, but I could also imagine the more probable scenarios of them outlasting and outmanuevering the USA like in Vietnam. That is why we aren't in there already. 

Very good post thanks and I agree the US would have a major headache starting a war with Iran. 

 

Firstly the US has never fully grasped the affect determination can have in fighting a war.  Thats why they have a poor record in actually fighting a war.  US troops are not driven by determination but by propaganda and it is not long before they see through the propaganda, question why they are there and lose the desire to fight.  As in Vietnam and Afghanistan etc they merely fight to stay alive until they are allowed to go home.  On the other side their enemy is fighting for the long haul determined to fight to the death to protect their own country.

 

Secondly US troops dont really know how to fight.  They just send these poor immature kids out stumbling around chewing gum and smoking dope until they draw enemy fire.  Then they just run and hide and wait for air support to fight their battle by turning the place into rubble.  Victory is then declared because of some ridiculous indicator like "body count" lol!

 

I wonder how long it will be before they come up with a "rubble count" as an indicator of triumph. 

 

 

 

 

 

[stevenl]

9 hours ago, meand said:

Let's get real here. There is a potential war looming between Iran and USA, and even US has admitted it was a spy drone. I am not criticizing your statement, just saying it is fairly easy to discern what is probably going on here. Unless there is some international treaty saying you can't destroy an aircraft that is clearly spying on you right before a potential war, which seems ludicrous. 

 

Countries have the right to defend themselves. 

Please re-read the post I was replying to and my post. You're misinterpreting.

[bristolboy]

40 minutes ago, ThaiFelix said:

Very good post thanks and I agree the US would have a major headache starting a war with Iran. 

 

Firstly the US has never fully grasped the affect determination can have in fighting a war.  Thats why they have a poor record in actually fighting a war.  US troops are not driven by determination but by propaganda and it is not long before they see through the propaganda, question why they are there and lose the desire to fight.  As in Vietnam and Afghanistan etc they merely fight to stay alive until they are allowed to go home.  On the other side their enemy is fighting for the long haul determined to fight to the death to protect their own country.

 

Secondly US troops dont really know how to fight.  They just send these poor immature kids out stumbling around chewing gum and smoking dope until they draw enemy fire.  Then they just run and hide and wait for air support to fight their battle by turning the place into rubble.  Victory is then declared because of some ridiculous indicator like "body count" lol!

 

I wonder how long it will be before they come up with a "rubble count" as an indicator of triumph. 

 

 

 

 

 

I think you're having a vietnam flashback in regards to American soldiers' fighting skills. It's a volunteer military now and America has scarily good soldiers.