6 minutes ago, StayinThailand2much said:

And, do the Brexiteers really want to risk the breaking off of Scotland?

Not to mention re-igniting the troubles in Northern Ireland.

He’s avoided two debates other candidates were willing to attend.   

He is a coward for not adding them to schedule. 

 

He is a bag of hot air... Brits will be very sorry, if they decide to let him run the country. There may be re-elections after re-elections, with chaos in economy and financial markets. - Brits should prepare for a significant drop in their standard of living.

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On 6/26/2019 at 7:16 PM, jak2002003 said:

And what are the goods the EU will want from the UK, that they can't get from any other country?  I don't think we make much anymore do we?

Our financial & insurance services are still by far the largest in Europe - (taken as a whole in terms of revenue generated - 2nd only to the US) and deal with many international clients, but yes, sadly our manufacturing and industrial base has been decimated over the last 5 decades. However, this is not actually the point re: the EU imposing tarrifs. They know by doing so they would effectively be penalising the UK for leaving and if they did so that the UK would be well within its rights - and likely - to impose similar tariffs on EU manufactured goods, and as the bloc's largest market in the world by some way, this would be very bad news for a number of the EU's largest and most influencial industries and corporations. They would of course lobby their respective governments to end tariff restricted trade as it would very negatively affect their business, and this is the salient point! The EU - as a declining global market facing much unrest in the form of political, economic and social turmoil which looks set to get much worse and not much better, couldn't afford to take a hit in the way of 'effectively' losing access to their single largest market - not unless they could replace it very very quickly with another, and since the protectionist reforms of the EU trading bloc have meant that a great many of the industries that occupy it have become desperately uncompetitive - this seems nigh impossible. There is every possibility of a trade agreement (FTA) being signed and it wouldn't have to take years to do so either - because at the end of the day it would benefit BOTH parties, NOT just the UK - and anyone with any knowledge or understanding of the trade relationship between the UK and the EU knows this to be the case. The UK won't and shoudln't be granted 'special treatment' per se, but if the EU wants to retain tariff-free access to (and thus a competitive edge within it's largest global marketplace) then it will have to come to some agreement re: FTA with the UK in the long run.

30 minutes ago, Bluespunk said:

The country has no say at present, as only a tiny minority are involved in this vote to choose the next pm. 

Correction of fact: the Tory voters are voting for the leader of the Tory party, NOT the next PM.  Whether Johnson or Hunt can gain the majority vote in parliament remains to be seen, as it only takes a few Tory rebels to scupper that.

 

If whoever is Tory leader cannot gain the confidence of parliament, the PM post is open  - and if not resolved, a GE would be the most likely outcome. I would expect Corbyn to welcome Johnson or Hunt with a no-confidence vote in the government as soon as parliament returns from their summer break. And that would be the end of (a no-deal) brexit - and the Tory party.

 

Good riddance.

17 minutes ago, stephenterry said:

Correction of fact: the Tory voters are voting for the leader of the Tory party, NOT the next PM.  Whether Johnson or Hunt can gain the majority vote in parliament remains to be seen, as it only takes a few Tory rebels to scupper that.

 

If whoever is Tory leader cannot gain the confidence of parliament, the PM post is open  - and if not resolved, a GE would be the most likely outcome. I would expect Corbyn to welcome Johnson or Hunt with a no-confidence vote in the government as soon as parliament returns from their summer break. And that would be the end of (a no-deal) brexit - and the Tory party.

 

Good riddance.

He will probably end up as pm, unfortunately. 

 

In effect the minority who elect him party leader are voting in their choice on the majority, who will get no say on their choice of pm at this point. 

 

Hopefully you are right in some tory mps rebelling against the minority’s imposed choice. 

21 hours ago, Johnyo said:

You weren’t listening to the Brexit charlatans.

 

 

 

 

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Correct. And whatever they said wasn't on the ticket either.

1 minute ago, Bluespunk said:

He will probably end up as pm, unfortunately. 

 

In effect the minority who elect him party leader are voting in their choice on the majority, who will get no say on their choice of pm at this point. 

 

Hopefully you are right in some tory mps rebelling against the minority’s coup. 

I will repeat my view that the Tory government is solely promoting a loss-leader Brexit to save face, not because it would be best for Britain. That should be crystal clear to anyone with a bit of common sense. 

 

And it only takes a few rebels, some of whom would never support Johnson's aim for a no-deal brexit, even if it costs them their seat should the no-confidence vote be passed.   

21 hours ago, petemoss said:

Causing a collapse in the economy with the loss of many jobs is better than my dream? Really?

 

Besides my dream has a good chance of becoming reality. Yours has none.

 

Thanks, but I'll stick to my dream. 

SOS. A mix of my dream's better than your dream AND Project Fear.

On 6/27/2019 at 6:15 PM, puipuitom said:

And which German / Japanese / Chinese car maker has to do that in the UK, as.. British car makers… hardly exist. Thanks to redicoulous demands of the Unions all went bankrumpt ( same attitude as now Brexit) and were sold to foreign car makes. See German Mini.. leaving for Borne-NL or Honda, returning to Japan. Even Bentley and Rolls Royce are German , see 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automotive_industry_in_the_United_Kingdom

 

The UK is still the engine manufacturer, till 31 Oct, when the WTO-import duty tariffs come in place, so + 10% = bye,  https://www.theguardian.com/business/2019/may/30/uk-car-production-plunges-amid-untold-damage-of-brexit-chaos and  https://www.theguardian.com/business/2019/jan/31/british-car-production-slumps-to-five-year-low  and 

https://ec.europa.eu/taxation_customs/dds2/taric/taric_consultation.jsp?Lang=en&Taric=8700000000&Expand=true&Area=&SimDate=20190627&GoodsText=&OrderNum=&StartPub=&EndPub=&Regulation=&LastSelectedCode=

 

What do you as manufacturer do, when you plant to leave a market = Br-exit? yes, you stop with investments. see 

https://www.ft.com/.../b02e7342-24a2-11e9-8ce6-5db4543da632

  and 

https://www.bbc.com/news/business-47055188

 

Just a few years, and there will be only capacity to make 2-horses carriages… 

 

Wow, the hate runs deep with this one. ☠️

 

How sad.

1 hour ago, StayinThailand2much said:

He is a bag of hot air... Brits will be very sorry, if they decide to let him run the country. There may be re-elections after re-elections, with chaos in economy and financial markets. - Brits should prepare for a significant drop in their standard of living.

Having just watched yesterdays Brexit rally I can see nothing whatsoever to be sorry about regardless of who wins.

On 6/27/2019 at 5:16 PM, vogie said:

That is very disrespectfull to all our families who lost loved ones, shame on you.

Quite right. It's totally unneccessary, very disrespectful, completely off-topic and moreover - plain WRONG. Shame indeed!

 

It also displays a profound lack of knowledge or understanding of the intricacies of Operation Overlord and its success which lead to the shift in the trajectory of proceedings in the latter half of the second world ward, of which - although the UK and it's commonwealth allies were a junior partner to the US and USSR in terms of manpower and firepower - were however - integral, especially when you consider the nation held on under intense bombardment to stand as the SINGLE opponent to fascism within Europe in those dark days - an irony that is not lost on many Brexiteers I suspect. Such nonsensical and obtuse revisionist histories are IMHO very comparable in their arrogance, ignorance and total misinterpretation of the facts to the multitude of claims and predictions regarding the UK and Europe's respective futures once we exit - incidentally these predictions are made ad-nausem by those who deem themselves 'smarter by default' than ANYONE who voted to Leave. I long to know where the sale on crystal balls was, the Remain lobby seemed to have all attended on the same day!

 

On 6/27/2019 at 4:54 PM, puipuitom said:

Thanks to the USA and the Soviet Union... 

The country has no say at present, as only a tiny minority are involved in this vote to choose the next pm. 

Well that is the British system and it is the responsibility of Parliament to impose its will if it so decides. The key for any PM is whether that PM can command a majority in the House of Commons.

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16 hours ago, bannork said:

A nation should not be held hostage to an unsophisticated question that offered no clear way forward if the answer was yes. 

But a similar binary choice was OK in 1975 when it was OK to stay in?  

I will repeat my view that the Tory government is solely promoting a loss-leader Brexit to save face, not because it would be best for Britain. That should be crystal clear to anyone with a bit of common sense. 
 
And it only takes a few rebels, some of whom would never support Johnson's aim for a no-deal brexit, even if it costs them their seat should the no-confidence vote be passed.   

Hard Brexiteerland doesn't do common sense. They are strapped in and going down.

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2 minutes ago, SheungWan said:

Well that is the British system and it is the responsibility of Parliament to impose its will if it so decides. The key for any PM is whether that PM can command a majority in the House of Commons.

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In this case a bit premature. Johnson - or Hunt -as elected leader of the Tory party must be able to command a majority parliament, before becoming PM.  See my previous post that Corbyn will post a no-confidence vote in government first.

He will probably end up as pm, unfortunately. 
 
In effect the minority who elect him party leader are voting in their choice on the majority, who will get no say on their choice of pm at this point. 
 
Hopefully you are right in some tory mps rebelling against the minority’s imposed choice. 

The issue is less who the Tory leader is but rather whether that person can push Hard Brexit through Parliament.

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3 minutes ago, stephenterry said:

In this case a bit premature. Johnson - or Hunt -as elected leader of the Tory party must be able to command a majority parliament, before becoming PM.  See my previous post that Corbyn will post a no-confidence vote in government first.

And do you think the Labour Party will post a no confidence vote on Corbyn.

In this case a bit premature. Johnson - or Hunt -as elected leader of the Tory party must be able to command a majority parliament, before becoming PM.  See my previous post that Corbyn will post a no-confidence vote in government first.

So far Corbyn has been singularly unable to achieve anything to date.

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13 hours ago, SheungWan said:

The Brexiteer Ladybird Guide to Understanding Very Little At All Other Than Simplistic Nostrums.

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Just another slur. Not even a response.

12 hours ago, elliss said:

 

      Because it was not what the people wanted .

       Spin doctors , including farage and bonkers , the tower awaits you .

 

 

      'Because it was not what the people wanted'. Hilarious!

7 hours ago, SheungWan said:

Doesn't get away from Hard Brexit being less than 50%, then, now and next week.

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'Hard Brexit this, Hard Brexit that' - these weren't on the ticket either. 

And do you think the Labour Party will post a no confidence vote on Corbyn.

The odds are against.

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'Hard Brexit this, Hard Brexit that' - these weren't on the ticket either. 

That's right. Nothing about no-deal on the referendum ballot paper. In fact nothing about any deal. The implementation of Brexit left to Parliament which is where it sits today. Hard Brexiteers can spin around all they want but Parliament is still sovereign.

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      'Because it was not what the people wanted'. Hilarious!

What the people want re terms of Brexit is decided in Parliament. Hilarious that.

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2 hours ago, StayinThailand2much said:

"Brexit supporters say there would be short-term disruption but in the long-term the UK would thrive if cut free from what they cast as a doomed experiment in German-dominated unity that has led to Europe falling behind China and the United States..."

Really?? Perhaps, those supporters should study their own country's history. Britain in the early 1970s was considered to be a "failed state". Then it joined the EEC in 1973. - No-one wishes the UK to repeat her dismal (economic) history, but who knows with someone like Alexander Boris de Pfeffel Johnson at the helm...

And, do the Brexiteers really want to risk the breaking off of Scotland?

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1970's UK a "failed state"? no. An economic shambles? Yes. But this continued for a decade after joining the EEC, which was happy to assist in the decimation and relocation of UK heavy industry, which had already suffered from disruption due to communist influence and the resulting excessive and disruptive power of trades unions, which had been allowed by Labour governments in the 60's and 70's. 

 

History does not necessarily have to repeat itself. Your comments without substance and are typical of more Project Fear.

 

And I hope that the Union survives. Ultimately, we will all be better off out of the EU.  

 

37 minutes ago, stephenterry said:

In this case a bit premature. Johnson - or Hunt -as elected leader of the Tory party must be able to command a majority parliament, before becoming PM.  See my previous post that Corbyn will post a no-confidence vote in government first.

Have to post early for Christmas.

13 minutes ago, SheungWan said:

What the people want re terms of Brexit is decided in Parliament. Hilarious that.

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Terms terms terms.

33 minutes ago, vogie said:

And do you think the Labour Party will post a no confidence vote on Corbyn.

I do.

17 minutes ago, SheungWan said:

That's right. Nothing about no-deal on the referendum ballot paper. In fact nothing about any deal. The implementation of Brexit left to Parliament which is where it sits today. Hard Brexiteers can spin around all they want but Parliament is still sovereign.

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I don't think many present MP's will be part of a sovereign parliament for much longer unless they get their collective and democratic act together soon (excuse the pun).

1 hour ago, SheungWan said:

Well that is the British system and it is the responsibility of Parliament to impose its will if it so decides. The key for any PM is whether that PM can command a majority in the House of Commons.

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Yep, but I do like irony if the fact a minority of the country are getting a second vote to put a man into power who has said he will suspend a parliament elected by the majority of the country to impose a no deal brexit.