TM30 mayhem and updates

[wobalt]

Your government's view is irrelevant. The Thai government's view is that you are not an immigrant, therefore you have no permanency in Thailand

In case of a diplomatic passport, maybe my government view Is a bit more relevant.


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[LivinLOS]

1 minute ago, wobalt said:

I replied to your post saying “ every time I would sleep somewhere I changed my address. I still believe that is BS. Nothing to discuss anymore.

 

To Thai immigration, that is the case.. They do not consider a 'home address' and a 'temporary or guest stay address' for non Thai nationals, because no address within Thailand is in thier system or mentality 'home'. To them you are not Thai, are not an immigrant to Thailand, and hence it is not home. 

 

Only after achieving PR or citizenship do you get registered in tabien baans and with the PR book, of where your 'home address' then is. 

 

This is thier system, that is thier mindset, that is the facts.. You can dislike it, but your dislike of it will not change it. 

 

To the system, and in turn th law, a night or a week in a hotel, is the same change of address, as changing back to a private home. Both are temporary, short stay, and anyone who thinks differently can test this by not extending at the end of thier permission of stay, going onto overstay, and see how much of a permanent address it is. 

[LivinLOS]

3 minutes ago, wobalt said:

In case of a diplomatic passport, maybe my government view Is a bit more relevant.
 

Ohh so your now on a smart visa inside a diplomatic passport are you ?? ????????

[Salerno]

14 minutes ago, wobalt said:

I replied to your post saying “ every time I would sleep somewhere I changed my address. I still believe that is BS. Nothing to discuss anymore.

What you believe is irrelevant.

Edited August 3, 2019 by Salerno

[wobalt]

Ohh so your now on a smart visa inside a diplomatic passport are you ?? ????????

I am on a 1 y Me Non O but approved for a smart visa, invited by the Thai government via my Government to assist them on their EEC projects


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[wobalt]

What you believe is irrelevant.

As yours


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[schlemmi]

On 7/30/2019 at 5:17 PM, crazygreg44 said:

As long as I travel inside Thailand, I never CHANGE my home adress!

I would say: As long i travel whereever, inside or outside thailand, if you return to the same address as before, well known by immi and additionally stated in the arrival/departurecard and already reported  by tm30 and all your belongings are still at this address, you not change anything. No need to re-report. They already know your address. 

[lopburi3]

13 minutes ago, schlemmi said:

No need to re-report. They already know your address

If in Bangkok and the last TM30 report is not the same as the address on your form it will not be accepted so any reported hotel stay would cause an issue.

[schlemmi]

On 7/31/2019 at 12:21 PM, Joe Mcseismic said:

. This kinda makes sense as your TM6 number will have changed and that is on the TM30 form.

I agree the tm6 ID has changed. But the address and the passport ID not has changed. Except you get a new passport, but than you have to transfer the stamps to the new one. In thith way they have a backtrace to the address. If you get your new passport outside TH than there is no stamp transfer but at least your name and the biometric data is the same. No real reason why the information chain YouAsIndividual <==> Address shold break.

[schlemmi]

On 7/31/2019 at 3:49 PM, LivinLOS said:

Unless you have PR or citizenship none of them are permanent addresses... They are merely where you stay as a non immigrant or tourist. 

Please explain this by referencing the the concerned textnodes in the actual thai law.

[Salerno]

12 minutes ago, schlemmi said:

Please explain this by referencing the the concerned textnodes in the actual thai law.

 

Quote

Section 38: The house – master , the owner or the possessor of the residence , or the hotel manager where the alien , receiving permission to stay temporary in the Kingdom has stayed , must notify the competent official of the Immigration Office located in the same area with that hours , dwelling place or hotel, within 24 hours from the time of arrival of the alien concerned. If there is no Immigration Office located in that area , the local police official for that area must be notified.

 

In case the house , dwelling place , or hotel where the alien has stayed under provision of Para.1 is located within the Bangkok area , such notification must be reported to the competent official at the Immigration Division.

 

Making notification , in reference to the Para 1 and 2 of this Section , must comply with regulations prescribed by the Director General.

 

Immigration Act, B.E. 2522

 

Note "where the alien , receiving permission to stay temporary in the Kingdom has stayed" i.e. you unless you have PR or citizenship.

Edited August 3, 2019 by Salerno

[schlemmi]

On 8/1/2019 at 12:10 PM, MikeN said:

"Registration for TM30 online"

Looking at the documents required for registration, as a foreigner I would need a copy of my passport and a copy of the house registration. Does the house registration have to be in the applicants name ? Because in that case the online registration would only be available to condo owners ? My sister in law owns the house, and I used her when registering my change of address and TM30 a few months ago. She is not computer literate though, anything more than Facebook on her phone is too hitech for her !

My wife is not much better, although she can manage Facebook and Youtube on her ipad, so it would be a lot more convenient if I could register in my name using the tabien baan with S.i.L's name as housemaster.

So, has anybody registered using the tabien baan in somebody elses name ?

Needs the housbook from the person is listed as housemaster (เจ้าบ้าน) TschauBaan of the house wher the foreinger starts living.

[schlemmi]

35 minutes ago, Salerno said:

 

 

Note "where the alien , receiving permission to stay temporary in the Kingdom has stayed" i.e. you unless you have PR or citizenship.

The original thai text is:

....ซึ่ง รับคนต่างด้าว ซึ่ง ได้รับอนุญาตให้อยู่ในราชอาณาจักรเป็นการชั่วคราว  เข้าพักอาศับ   จะต้องแจ้ง....

 

Translated:

The housemaster ... who receives a foreigner, who  is permitted to be in the kingdom temporary, enter to live (at his home)   has to report...

 

That does not tell anything about the alien does a temporary stay at this home.

 

Its only classifies the alien as a person with a temporary permit to stay at the kingdom.

 

 

[Salerno]

Not seeing your point here? Alien = foreigner.

[schlemmi]

27 minutes ago, Salerno said:

Not seeing your point here? Alien = foreigner.

The point is that the term "temporary" classifies or defines the propertie of the subject "alien or foreinger". It does not classifie the the property of of the how he lives.

It says he is allowed to be temporary in TH.

It does not say that his home is a temporary address. He has permanent permission from the housowner to stay there if he pays the monthly rent eg. This permission does not end if he leaves the country. 

[Salerno]

16 minutes ago, schlemmi said:

It does not classifie the the property of of the how he lives.

It says he is allowed to be temporary in TH.

Exactly ... a person who is allowed to stay in Thailand on a temporary basis has to have a TM30 filed wherever they stay overnight regardless of that place being his normal place of abode.

[LivinLOS]

2 hours ago, schlemmi said:

Its only classifies the alien as a person with a temporary permit to stay at the kingdom

 

Entirely my point.. People with PR and Citizenship are no longer 'temporarily' allowed to stay in the kingdom. 

Everything less than that have no permanent / fixed 'home' here in Thai bureaucracy, only places they stay. 

[LivinLOS]

1 hour ago, schlemmi said:

It does not say that his home is a temporary address. He has permanent permission from the housowner to stay there if he pays the monthly rent eg. This permission does not end if he leaves the country. 

Permission to stay there is not immigrations concern.. Permission to even be there is. 

 

To Thailand all permission is temporary, all addresses are temporary, up to when someone gets PR and citizenship. Then they can be put in a tabien baan / recieve the PR address book and have a fixed address. 

[Salerno]

1 hour ago, schlemmi said:

It does not say that his home is a temporary address. He has permanent permission from the housowner to stay there if he pays the monthly rent eg. This permission does not end if he leaves the country. 

 

Forgot this part in my previous reply.

 

They're not in the slightest way interested in your lease arrangement or if you own the accommodation. They are only interested in where you are at a given time. If you don't file a TM30 on your return they don't know where you are. The fact some Immi offices have decided to ignore the law for some people doesn't mean tomorrow they will do the same. So you can try and spin the law and bury your head in the sand or you can play their game and get a TM30 lodged.

[MRToMRT]

The more I read about this TM30 thing the LESS I understand.

 

The more I read TVF the more confused I get. Everytime someone writes something that make sense, an alternative opinion or a real experience seems to bugger up my understanding. 

 

I wonder if I have dementia?

Edited August 3, 2019 by MRToMRT
Forgotten already

[Peterw42]

12 minutes ago, MRToMRT said:

The more I read about this TM30 thing the LESS I understand.

 

The more I read TVF the more confused I get. Everytime someone writes something that make sense, an alternative opinion or a real experience seems to bugger up my understanding. 

 

I wonder if I have dementia?

Its just the enforcement varies, the rule is basically the same for any foreigner staying anywhere in thailand, someone in charge of the property where the foreigner stays, reports the foreigner within 24 hours of staying.

Your local immigration office may/may not want proof you have been reported.

 

People confuse not being asked for tm30 proof as not being required

[ClearM1nd]

Guys, may be anybody knows an answer.

 

Last time i came back to Thailand, im pretty sure my landlord didnt report anything, it was on koh Tao. Now, im in BKK and need to make an extension of tourist visa. Basically if i rent a hotel, which is reporting, then on next day i can go to immigration and get an extension with a hotel address? Will i be fined for not reporting about where i stayed when i flew into a country? And also, can i do that at nontaburi immigration office instead of CW, if im staying at ladprao?

[wilailuk]

8 hours ago, LivinLOS said:

Permission to stay there is not immigrations concern.. Permission to even be there is. 

 

To Thailand all permission is temporary, all addresses are temporary, up to when someone gets PR and citizenship. Then they can be put in a tabien baan / recieve the PR address book and have a fixed address. 

 

Good point.. maybe some of the usual complainers here should take note of this?

 

You/we are NOT entitled to anything other than following the rules, even when we perceive them to be unfair, ever changing, enforced or not, from town to town and district to district, I don´t care, I´ve learned to be flexible like a bamboo, total Zen, it works, everywhere, try it, you old complaining entitled farts.

 

 

[lopburi3]

6 hours ago, ClearM1nd said:

Guys, may be anybody knows an answer.

 

Last time i came back to Thailand, im pretty sure my landlord didnt report anything, it was on koh Tao. Now, im in BKK and need to make an extension of tourist visa. Basically if i rent a hotel, which is reporting, then on next day i can go to immigration and get an extension with a hotel address? Will i be fined for not reporting about where i stayed when i flew into a country? And also, can i do that at nontaburi immigration office instead of CW, if im staying at ladprao?

Do not believe any issue if you stay hotel and then extend tourist visa (just be sure hotel makes a report first).  But if in Latphao you must use Chiang Watanna.  

[ChipButty]

So basically the immigration doesn't give flying #### who owns the property whether it be a villa. condo, as long as the said person reports a foreigner who is staying there?

[birddogger]

Is a TM30 report required twice on an internal trip in Thailand? Once by the hotel at my destination (1 week stay) and again by my landlord when I return home to my rented condo? In addition to the 90 day reporting and again for 3 month money still in the bank account after retirement extension? 

[Peterw42]

19 minutes ago, birddogger said:

Is a TM30 report required twice on an internal trip in Thailand? Once by the hotel at my destination (1 week stay) and again by my landlord when I return home to my rented condo? In addition to the 90 day reporting and again for 3 month money still in the bank account after retirement extension? 

Yes its "required" by law for each and every stay at a property. However, proof may or may not be asked for. Jomtien currently will not ask for TM30 proof if doing 90 day reports, 90 day seasoning report or retire extension.

Edited August 4, 2019 by Peterw42

[ChipButty]

My wife was talking with some friends they other day who own a nice hotel in Phuket Town and this is not a mickey mouse setup they are getting board with the visits from immigration almost everyday by the sounds of it they are coming team handed she said it doesn't look good in the reception area, that must look intimidating 4 or 5 guys in uniform milling around seeing where they can make money.

What is needed is for Thai people to start kicking off

[ThaiBunny]

21 hours ago, wobalt said:

I am on a 1 y Me Non O but approved for a smart visa, invited by the Thai government via my Government to assist them on their EEC projects

Surely you understand that "Non O" is an abbreviation for "Non-Immigrant O"? You are not an immigrant, you have no permanent residence in Thailand

[OJAS]

17 hours ago, LivinLOS said:

To Thailand all permission is temporary, all addresses are temporary, up to when someone gets PR and citizenship. Then they can be put in a tabien baan / recieve the PR address book and have a fixed address. 

Indeed. Foreigners who have not achieved PR or citizenship status here are classed as either non-immigrants (including those on annual retirement or marriage extensions) or tourists.