Why so much negativity?

[murraynz]

On 9/29/2019 at 8:03 AM, geronimo said:

There are two types that use this forum, those who love to moan and complain and those who see life as a great adventure ......

And those who are seriously bored. 

[starky]

On 9/29/2019 at 6:25 AM, SteveK said:

I can fully understand why some people have become bitter about Thailand. When they first visited many years ago, it was welcoming, friendly and easy going, so much so that they decided to up sticks and move here and basically invested a huge amount of their life and finances into the country.

 

Slowly but surely, things have gradually shifted, so that any foreign income they once had has been massively eroded to the point where they can no longer qualify for a long term visa and are effectively being forced out by increasingly heavy handed and callous immigration policies, with constant, upsetting grillings from IOs, plus outrageous and draconian hoops to jump through for anyone who insists on staying.

 

The once carefree, friendly and cheap tropical paradise has thus become an expensive, xenophobic headache - if you came here and built a house, got married and had kids, immigration will still want to boot you out if you haven't got 400k in the bank. I can't imagine being separated from my wife and kids and being forced to go back to a country which is no longer your home because of Thai immigration policies, and can fully understand how awful that must be, and don't blame anyone for being bitter about the current state of things here.

 

For me, Thailand is still a paradise compared to my home country and being forced to go back would be devastating. Like you, I was lucky enough to have a little bit of money to start a new life and now live here with my Thai wife and her family, sure I don't like having to keep going to immigration all the time as it's a 200km round trip for me, but it's still worth it on the whole. I would say go for it, if you find no joy in your home country (sounds exactly like me), don't stay there, life is short, grinding away in a place you hate for years on end is not what I would call living. You get one chance at life, don't forget that.

 

One word of advice - make sure you read as much as you can about Thai immigration & visa policies and why people are being rejected. Also be cautious of the threads on here about people being refused entry, sometimes it seems like there are other factors which influenced the IO's decision which were not mentioned in the post, but obviously it's impossible to be sure. If you are from Chile/Argentina/Uruguay, they aren't going to be the most well-known places to Thai IOs so make sure you get yourself the correct visas and do everything you can to make sure you don't get refused entry - for you it's a long way home. For long-term stay your best options are Elite visa or to get married to a Thai lady. Good luck!

 

 

How is it Thailand's fault that the baht is strong? Or their fault all these blokes expect eke out a living on their subsistence wage. And why would anyone live somewhere they can't afford to live or even support their family. Maybe you should boot off if you can't raise a lousy 400000 a year! Jesus that's embarrassing. And did so many really think that exchange rates never change and you would be able to live here supporting a family forever on a few thousand a year? What a ridiculous concept. Well actually you can if you live like a Thai in a shack in the jungle and eat sticky rice and som Tam with you missus you could probably stay here forever. Good luck! 

[geronimo]

10 hours ago, murraynz said:

And those who are seriously bored. 

Yeah, I forgot about that group ....

[JAFO]

5 hours ago, starky said:

How is it Thailand's fault that the baht is strong? Or their fault all these blokes expect eke out a living on their subsistence wage. And why would anyone live somewhere they can't afford to live or even support their family. Maybe you should boot off if you can't raise a lousy 400000 a year! Jesus that's embarrassing. And did so many really think that exchange rates never change and you would be able to live here supporting a family forever on a few thousand a year? What a ridiculous concept. Well actually you can if you live like a Thai in a shack in the jungle and eat sticky rice and som Tam with you missus you could probably stay here forever. Good luck! 

To your point (which I agree with mind you), It all boils down to planning. I would suspect that many moved here on a whim with little money back in a time that things were a lot less stringent and the baht was weak so their money worked for them. But as noted, times change. You couple that with the increased riff raff that washes up here I do not blame the Thai govt for putting stakes in the ground and start enforcing rules. Is it uncomfortable....Sure. I left the states as I was tired of being over governed for everything. Here the requirements are minimal. For the folks that moved way out in rural Thailand that have to travel far to check in that again all goes back to long term planning. Location is everything. 

 

For me, living here has been great and I have been here for quite a few years. Its not perfect but its easy. 

 

To the OP, while I drop by TVF from time to time honestly the best approach is use it as a tool for things you need help with then go on about your day. If you make this or any other forum your daily entertainment you will quickly find that most people typically use forums to voice grievances and like to deflect issues to everyone else but themselves for the choices they made. Plus I have also noticed that the majority of the posters that complain are later on in years. so its the "Bitch because I am bored" program. 

[rumak]

On 9/29/2019 at 11:20 PM, 4evermaat said:

Many times TV is the only way for a foreigner to vent their issues about cultural differences as they may not live very close to foreigners where they are.

 

I strongly suggest interacting with local foreigners offline.  Much different experience.

translation please.   i have tried but can not understand what you are saying

[BritManToo]

6 hours ago, starky said:

........... and you would be able to live here supporting a family forever on a few thousand a year?

Why not Thais manage to do it.

[rumak]

13 hours ago, murraynz said:

On 9/29/2019 at 8:03 AM, geronimo said:

There are two types that use this forum, those who love to moan and complain and those who see life as a great adventure ......

And those who are seriously bored. 

OK you guys.   SO,,,,,,, which group do you belong to ?     

[BritManToo]

Just now, rumak said:

OK you guys.   SO,,,,,,, which group do you belong to ?     

I'm in the group that doesn't give a damn about locals, wherever I live in the world, and just wants to be left alone.

[rumak]

Just now, BritManToo said:

I'm in the group that doesn't give a damn about locals, wherever I live in the world, and just wants to be left alone.

Well, you do seem to like the "online companionship" ,   which offers you the chance to interact and express your ideas .   Of course i do remember that you like it because you don't actually have to meet or know any of the other members in person.    I don't believe (if you were to say) that you don't care what others think of you.   That is a common disclaimer. 

I  admit to enjoying this form of  anonymous stimulation .  And the ignore option is so much easier than in real life   ????

[villagefarang]

15 minutes ago, rumak said:

On 9/29/2019 at 11:20 PM, 4evermaat said:

Many times TV is the only way for a foreigner to vent their issues about cultural differences as they may not live very close to foreigners where they are.

 

I strongly suggest interacting with local foreigners offline.  Much different experience.

translation please.   i have tried but can not understand what you are saying

I believe he is stating his belief that face to face communication with other foreigners is much different and preferable to online banter.  Personally I think what people say online reveals much more about a person than face to face communication does.  People are afraid to speak their minds in person.

[thaibeachlovers]

On 9/29/2019 at 6:07 AM, Iren1cuss said:

Back to my original question. Has it always been like this? I was so pumped about the idea of spending more time in Thailand but the amount of negativity surrounding the idea on these forums has me thinking twice about it. Maybe that's a  good thing, who knows. Some genuine input would be really helpful. Thanks!

No. Back in the early days of tourism LOS was a rather quiet and undeveloped place, the people smiled a lot and were apparently happy with their lot ( except the students that got shot by the military for complaining/ protesting ).

Since then, a lot of infrastructure has been built, a few people got very rich, corruption was ( and is ) endemic, the smile left the building, people argue in public, scams are prevalent, and the cheap and cheerful places have been taken over by big business.

However, none of that will probably be evident to tourists that visit for a few weeks or months.

Visiting LOS and living there are ying and yang- two different worlds. 

IMO, the worst impediment to enjoying LOS was the few days a year that I had to go to immigration to comply with their anti resident farang policies, irrational rules and the contempt with which they treated us. Having said that, it was just a few days a year and an agent took care of the worst of it. None of that affects someone that doesn't have to go to an immigration office.

[thaibeachlovers]

2 minutes ago, villagefarang said:

I believe he is stating his belief that face to face communication with other foreigners is much different and preferable to online banter.  Personally I think what people say online reveals much more about a person than face to face communication does.  People are afraid to speak their minds in person.

Indeed. If I could say what I really think to some of the <deleted> farangs I met in town I'd have a very different facial profile than I do.

However, we still can't say what we really think on TVF for the obvious reason.

[thaibeachlovers]

19 minutes ago, rumak said:

OK you guys.   SO,,,,,,, which group do you belong to ?     

I'm in the group that wants to be loved unconditionally by lovely Thai maidens- wants being the operative word. It didn't work out so well in practice.

[thaibeachlovers]

59 minutes ago, JAFO said:

But as noted, times change. You couple that with the increased riff raff that washes up here I do not blame the Thai govt for putting stakes in the ground and start enforcing rules.

?????????????????

I never noticed an increase in "riff raff" over my many, many years visiting and living in LOS. Just who are those "riff raff"?

IMO, there were always some riff raff around in places riff raff like to congregate, such as the "Dog's <deleted>" bar in Pattaya, but they were pretty easily avoided. I haven't seen an increase in their numbers though.

 

I see the TVF software has deleted the second word from the bar's name, which is unfortunate, but we are all familiar with the two items that a dog has in it's nether regions.

Edited October 2, 2019 by thaibeachlovers

[rumak]

1 minute ago, villagefarang said:

I believe he is stating his belief that face to face communication with other foreigners is much different and preferable to online banter.  Personally I think what people say online reveals much more about a person than face to face communication does.  People are afraid to speak their minds in person.

VF and I did have some "difference of opinions".... brought out on this forum.   I think that reasonable people can let some things go and appreciate the things we have in common and accept that there will be differences also.  I like the opinions and personalities one "meets"  on this forum.    I wish that more people in the world would not be so bent on just trying to prove that their way is the right way.

Anyway,  today is a clear day in the North (after some rain) so i am off to ride my bike (with the gf !)

VF  and i have an almost identical photo of the beautiful scenery out there if one lives in the country.

[thaibeachlovers]

6 hours ago, starky said:

How is it Thailand's fault that the baht is strong? Or their fault all these blokes expect eke out a living on their subsistence wage. And why would anyone live somewhere they can't afford to live or even support their family. Maybe you should boot off if you can't raise a lousy 400000 a year! Jesus that's embarrassing. And did so many really think that exchange rates never change and you would be able to live here supporting a family forever on a few thousand a year? What a ridiculous concept. Well actually you can if you live like a Thai in a shack in the jungle and eat sticky rice and som Tam with you missus you could probably stay here forever. Good luck! 

IMO you missed the point he was making by miles with your  negative post ( which is what the OP was asking about ).

[BritManToo]

1 hour ago, rumak said:

Well, you do seem to like the "online companionship" ,   which offers you the chance to interact and express your ideas .   Of course i do remember that you like it because you don't actually have to meet or know any of the other members in person.    I don't believe (if you were to say) that you don't care what others think of you.   That is a common disclaimer. 

I  admit to enjoying this form of  anonymous stimulation .  And the ignore option is so much easier than in real life   ????

I find almost everyone dreadfully dull and slightly stupid.

Online I can walk away, any moment I like.

These days, I only care about myself, can't be bothered with what anyone else wants or needs.

[BritManToo]

1 hour ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Indeed. If I could say what I really think to some of the <deleted> farangs I met in town I'd have a very different facial profile than I do.

However, we still can't say what we really think on TVF for the obvious reason.

I make frequent use of the 'ignore' button.

No need to say any more, I'll look for a white wall .........

Edited October 2, 2019 by BritManToo

[villagefarang]

I used to ride a mountain bike but switched to road a few years ago.

 

[JAFO]

1 hour ago, thaibeachlovers said:

I never noticed an increase in "riff raff" over my many, many years visiting and living in LOS. Just who are those "riff raff"?

Just the sheer number of tourists would increase the problems. As I travel around Thailand frequently and take in dinners with visiting colleagues on business I am seeing more drunks,  hearing more loud and rude foreigners from of all walks of life. Chinese tourists have taken over many locations and have little regard for basic common etiquette and smoke, spit, blow snot out of their nose and over run places thinking they own the place. 

 

As for Pattaya specifically, that area is what it is and because of it, it makes a lot of the news with foreigners doing stupid stuff ( stabbings, robberies, attacks, suicide, motorcycle accidents, drunk fights, scams, homelessness etc.) Just go pull up a bar chair and watch what walks, staggers on by on any given evening. Its free interesting entertainment that's for sure. As I have said before unfortunately its those behaviors that paint a picture that all foreigners are out of control which probably started the push to weed out foreigners by simply being diligent and enforcing the old laws that were being overlooked. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[villagefarang]

My previous bike photo went missing so here is a repost.????

 

 

[Max69xl]

1 hour ago, JAFO said:

Just the sheer number of tourists would increase the problems. As I travel around Thailand frequently and take in dinners with visiting colleagues on business I am seeing more drunks,  hearing more loud and rude foreigners from of all walks of life. Chinese tourists have taken over many locations and have little regard for basic common etiquette and smoke, spit, blow snot out of their nose and over run places thinking they own the place. 

 

As for Pattaya specifically, that area is what it is and because of it, it makes a lot of the news with foreigners doing stupid stuff ( stabbings, robberies, attacks, suicide, motorcycle accidents, drunk fights, scams, homelessness etc.) Just go pull up a bar chair and watch what walks, staggers on by on any given evening. Its free interesting entertainment that's for sure. As I have said before unfortunately its those behaviors that paint a picture that all foreigners are out of control which probably started the push to weed out foreigners by simply being diligent and enforcing the old laws that were being overlooked. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I have been living in Pattaya and Jomtien for many years, and there's no increase what so ever in bad behavior among tourists. I would say it was worse many years ago. Pattaya is Pattaya and if you don't like it,don't come here. Where I am going in South Pattaya when having fun,there are no Chinese tourists, they prefer North Pattaya and Naklua. 

[Max69xl]

3 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

IMO you missed the point he was making by miles with your  negative post ( which is what the OP was asking about ).

I think you don't get it. There are hundreds of posts from whiners who are complaining about the financial requirements,and just because they can't meet them, Thai Immigration is bad. The baht is strong, therefore Thai government is bad. Who forced them to stay here if everything is so bad? Go figure. 

[villagefarang]

On 9/29/2019 at 12:07 AM, Iren1cuss said:

Back to my original question. Has it always been like this?

No, it hasn't always been like this.  Things started down this path when Thailand was promoted as an ideal dumping ground for emotional and financial refugees.  Before that you encountered a different kind of person who was here for different reasons .  There were fewer of us back then and we weren't causing any problems, so things were much more relaxed and we were given the benefit of the doubt.  

 

Most of my generation left or died over the years and we were replaced by people who seem to go out of their way to be obnoxious and disrespectful.  To come uninvited into someone's home and act the way many do, it is a wonder the authorities are as tolerant as they are.  Trying to make this less of a safe haven for criminal elements and closing some long abused loopholes, from their point of view, seems reasonable.  It is not fair that everyone gets caught up in this cleanup attempt but I am hopeful things will level out at some point.  It always has in the past.????

[sidjameson]

On 9/28/2019 at 8:07 PM, Matzzon said:

There is nothing wrong with Thailand. Just a lot of bitter people that have to go home due to that they have started to enforce the rules and regulations that has always been there.

 

6 hours ago, villagefarang said:

I used to ride a mountain bike but switched to road a few years ago.

 

Great pic. Do you ride from your home to there or car then ride?

[observer90210]

People often get confused with free speech, free thinking, independant mind, non sheep attitude and negativity.

[villagefarang]

20 minutes ago, sidjameson said:

 

Great pic. Do you ride from your home to there or car then ride?

I do all my bike rides from home.  We do drive to the mountains for better hiking occasionally.

[AlexRich]

13 hours ago, BritManToo said:

I make frequent use of the 'ignore' button.

No need to say any more, I'll look for a white wall .........

Did you hide the back wheel in the shrubs so no one would see  the stabilisers?

[thaibeachlovers]

16 hours ago, JAFO said:

Just go pull up a bar chair and watch what walks, staggers on by on any given evening. Its free interesting entertainment that's for sure. As I have said before unfortunately its those behaviors that paint a picture that all foreigners are out of control which probably started the push to weed out foreigners by simply being diligent and enforcing the old laws that were being overlooked. 

Never been a crime to walk or stagger in LOS.

As for the Chinese that some don't like, easily avoided as they usually congregate together- go somewhere they ain't.

[quandow]

In truth, Thailand has been more and more difficult to live in as each year passes. I've often told the story of how, when I first came here in 2006, I could go out with 5k baht in my pocket, get laid, have a nice meal, then club until the sun came up. It's just gotten more expensive and the requirements for staying here became more stringent. Am I still here? Yup. Am I still happy? HELL yes! Am I now too old to club until the sun comes up? Hahahahaha . . .