Britain to become "second rate" in the world after Brexit - EU's Tusk

[samran]

13 minutes ago, evadgib said:

Potato famine or old bailey?

 

(????)

Welcomed as hero’s after murdering a few soap dodging invaders.

[ratcatcher]

On 11/14/2019 at 8:50 AM, dimitriv said:

I am Dutch. We used to own half of the world.

Are you having a lach?  

 

              

               Dutch Empire                                                                                 British Empire

 

Edited November 17, 2019 by ratcatcher

[tomacht8]

On 11/16/2019 at 9:06 PM, kingdong said:

Has it occurred to you that the British people voted to leave because they,'re sick and tired of having to subsidise the eu?,anyway let's see what happens when we leave,there won,t be an eu in ten years time au revoir can,t say it's been a pleasure.

Ohh the UK subsidise the EU and get nothing back in return?

Then, in fact, all the British politicians of the last 40+ years must have been idiots then. Or is it possible that the free access to the largest domestic market in the world brings advantages and increases the GDP by multiple times as measured by the contributions for access?

 

But no, now we have here a new Einstein of economics, which puts all politicians of the UK from the last 40 years with his wisdom in the shade. Blessed are the spiritually poor.

 

Edited November 17, 2019 by tomacht8

[dimitriv]

10 hours ago, transam said:

55555555555, really, so how come the UK, 1 of 28, pays 13% into the EU coffers...?

 

Maybe because the UK is one of the bigger countries?  

 

The UK’s ‘net contribution’ is estimated at nearly £9 billion.  Which is a little bit more than 0,3% of GDP. Pocket change... The financial benefits are a much higher.

 

It is striking that Brexit is so connected with populism and is often based on statements without understanding the right context.

 

 

Edited November 17, 2019 by dimitriv

[nauseus]

1 hour ago, Victornoir said:

UK, "the sick man of Europe" when it was out of the EU.

Spectacular recovery of the economy following its entry to become the second largest European economy and 5th in world.

Everyone have an idea on what it will become after Brexit. I bet mine differs significantly from yours.

Links for your second line of rubbish please.

[nauseus]

1 hour ago, dimitriv said:

 

Maybe because the UK is one of the bigger countries?  

 

The UK’s ‘net contribution’ is estimated at nearly £9 billion.  Which is a little bit more than 0,3% of GDP. Pocket change... The financial benefits are a much higher.

 

It is striking that Brexit is so connected with populism and is often based on statements without understanding the right context.

 

 

Links to your "financial benefits", with all relevant data, please.

[dimitriv]

9 minutes ago, nauseus said:

Links to your "financial benefits", with all relevant data, please.

 

Why?  I am sure that you can also use google. But to give some hints: They expect GDP to fall by 7% in the next years, trade with the UK's biggest trading partner the EU (now at 45%) will go down. Know that if it goes down only for 1% the losses by Brexit will already be higher than the money saved on the contribution the UK pays to the EU. And I am sure that you can find more.

 

In The Netherlands, especially in the bigger cities, the prices of houses and rental prices are going up thanks to companies and people moving from the UK to NL. A lot of jobs in the Uk are lost.

 

The UK is a sinking ship. Honestly after seeing all the statements from pro Brexit people I can only smile. 

 

 

 

[3NUMBAS]

this twisted munchkin never gives up on the BS bile..its the other way round as he represents a failing ponzi scheme

[3NUMBAS]

On 11/14/2019 at 12:09 AM, Rookiescot said:

So because you cant refute what he says you simply dismiss it.

After Brexit gets done you guys are going to have a lot of explaining to do. If any of you can be found that is.

the monthly payments will cease and he will have problems financing his grandiose plans all over europe ..ie eu army

[tebee]

2 hours ago, 3NUMBAS said:

the monthly payments will cease and he will have problems financing his grandiose plans all over europe ..ie eu army

Those monthly payments are 0.0042% of EU GDP or about 0.05% of it on a yearly basis - if you think the EU is going to collapse because of this or even notice the loss then I think your economics education has failed you 

[transam]

16 hours ago, samran said:

Thankfully, none. Irish all the way, pal. 
 

The sooner the Union Jack is off my flag, and Betty is off the back of my coins, the better...

Are you going to replace it with an Aboriginal emblem...?

[nauseus]

9 hours ago, dimitriv said:

 

Why?  I am sure that you can also use google. But to give some hints: They expect GDP to fall by 7% in the next years, trade with the UK's biggest trading partner the EU (now at 45%) will go down. Know that if it goes down only for 1% the losses by Brexit will already be higher than the money saved on the contribution the UK pays to the EU. And I am sure that you can find more.

 

In The Netherlands, especially in the bigger cities, the prices of houses and rental prices are going up thanks to companies and people moving from the UK to NL. A lot of jobs in the Uk are lost.

 

The UK is a sinking ship. Honestly after seeing all the statements from pro Brexit people I can only smile. 

 

 

 

Brilliant. I wonder who "they" is? What if UK trade with other parts of the world increases? You are aren't proving anything.

[samran]

6 hours ago, tebee said:

Those monthly payments are 0.0042% of EU GDP or about 0.05% of it on a yearly basis - if you think the EU is going to collapse because of this or even notice the loss then I think your economics education has failed you 

Careful, you are also talking to the same lot of blokes who believe if it wasn’t for them and their state pensions Thailand would be down the economic crapper. 

Edited November 18, 2019 by samran

[dimitriv]

17 minutes ago, nauseus said:

Brilliant. I wonder who "they" is? What if UK trade with other parts of the world increases? You are aren't proving anything.

 

"They" are people with more knowledge of economy than you and me ????  

 

 

[samran]

39 minutes ago, transam said:

Are you going to replace it with an Aboriginal emblem...?

I know you were trying to be deliberately amusing as opposed to most of your dads army posts which are unintentionally amusing (but funny for the rest of us) but it’s actually not a bad idea.
 

The first verse of the Kiwi National anthem is already sung in the Maori language and the SA national anthem incorporates many of the native languages. Some of the best at the recent RWC. 
 

Who’d have thunk it Trans? Underneath it all you are really a virtue seeking, PC, kumbaya singing tolerance seeker.

 

Next you’ll be telling us all how you need a safe space and really voted ‘in’. 

[nauseus]

6 hours ago, tebee said:

Those monthly payments are 0.0042% of EU GDP or about 0.05% of it on a yearly basis - if you think the EU is going to collapse because of this or even notice the loss then I think your economics education has failed you 

Problem with that is that the EU finances are very little to do with the combined GDP of member states. The EU budget is only comprised of traditional own resources (mainly customs levies), VAT-based resources (from members' own VAT revenue), GNI based resources (members contributions) and some other small items. More than half of the total budget of about 170B Euros is from member contributions which will be down about 6% without the UK contributions, unless they find more revenue from elsewhere.

 

The EU has no other money. Yet. 

[nauseus]

17 minutes ago, dimitriv said:

 

"They" are people with more knowledge of economy than you and me ????  

 

 

Speak for yourself. Providing less and less. Carry On.

[transam]

1 hour ago, samran said:

I know you were trying to be deliberately amusing as opposed to most of your dads army posts which are unintentionally amusing (but funny for the rest of us) but it’s actually not a bad idea.
 

The first verse of the Kiwi National anthem is already sung in the Maori language and the SA national anthem incorporates many of the native languages. Some of the best at the recent RWC. 
 

Who’d have thunk it Trans? Underneath it all you are really a virtue seeking, PC, kumbaya singing tolerance seeker.

 

Next you’ll be telling us all how you need a safe space and really voted ‘in’. 

Thank you...????

[transam]

On 11/14/2019 at 8:50 AM, dimitriv said:

 

When these countries see what will happen with the UK I am sure they will have no wish to leave.

 

For a while I tried to understand the proponents of a Brexit. I mainly see a wish to go back to the past. Everything used to be better. But those people don't understand that the world has changed.

 

I am Dutch. We used to own half of the world. New York was Dutch. We owned countries in South America and Indonesia was ours. We won almost all wars. My small country was a world power.

 

And what is it now? We are a small dot on the globe. Most countries are more a threat than an ally. Do you really think that we would have a good negotiating position with the US or China when talking about trade? They will only laugh at us. The idea that we can achieve more independently than in a partnership is absurd.

 

I think the UK over estimates their strength and possibilities. I am curious to see what will happen.

 

 

Yeh but, the UK didn't trade in Tulips. I believe your downfall was putting all your Tulips in one vase...????

[sandyf]

23 hours ago, nauseus said:

Choices were the same in 1975. The only difference is the result. Ask again 41 years after we actually leave.

That is absolute garbage, In 1975 the UK had only been in the EU a couple of years and it was quite obvious the majority of the electorate were happy to give government policy the thumbs up and 47 years has proved it right. Probably chosen to forget there was a state of emergency 4 times in the 3 years preceding entry to Europe.

In 2016 different scenario altogether, the electorate were far from happy with government policy and there is every chance that if the government had been in favour of leaving the result would have been the other way.

[nauseus]

1 minute ago, sandyf said:

That is absolute garbage, In 1975 the UK had only been in the EU a couple of years and it was quite obvious the majority of the electorate were happy to give government policy the thumbs up and 47 years has proved it right. Probably chosen to forget there was a state of emergency 4 times in the 3 years preceding entry to Europe.

In 2016 different scenario altogether, the electorate were far from happy with government policy and there is every chance that if the government had been in favour of leaving the result would have been the other way.

The "scenario" was only different because the deception by the Heath and subsequent UK governments had not been realised and because there had been no referendum allowed before actually joining. But the aims of the EEC/EU were in fact the same as they are now. Those 43 years proved that the choice was wrong, as far as the UK electorate was concerned. 

 

 

[tebee]

6 hours ago, nauseus said:

Problem with that is that the EU finances are very little to do with the combined GDP of member states. The EU budget is only comprised of traditional own resources (mainly customs levies), VAT-based resources (from members' own VAT revenue), GNI based resources (members contributions) and some other small items. More than half of the total budget of about 170B Euros is from member contributions which will be down about 6% without the UK contributions, unless they find more revenue from elsewhere.

 

The EU has no other money. Yet. 

Yes, but  firstly  any increase in taxes to replace the UK contribution will be an insignificant amount 

Secondly The Eu will no longer be funding anything in the UK so the spending budget will be less.

thirdly the income from those customs levies will increase as most UK goods will be subject those self same customs levies when imported into the EU.

Fourthly the UK is either going to have to spend a fortune setting up it's own equivalents of EU standards and regulatory bodies  or pay the EU to use theirs.

Fifthly, if we come to some sort of Norway type deal we'll end up probably contributing more to the EU than we do now. Norway contributes considerably more in both per capita and percentage of GDP terms for it's associate membership than we do for our full membership.

 

[nauseus]

1 hour ago, tebee said:

Yes, but  firstly  any increase in taxes to replace the UK contribution will be an insignificant amount 

Secondly The Eu will no longer be funding anything in the UK so the spending budget will be less.

thirdly the income from those customs levies will increase as most UK goods will be subject those self same customs levies when imported into the EU.

Fourthly the UK is either going to have to spend a fortune setting up it's own equivalents of EU standards and regulatory bodies  or pay the EU to use theirs.

Fifthly, if we come to some sort of Norway type deal we'll end up probably contributing more to the EU than we do now. Norway contributes considerably more in both per capita and percentage of GDP terms for it's associate membership than we do for our full membership.

 

Replacing the UK contribution will be significant enough to cause discord among the few remaining contributors if the EU budget is to remain the same size (of course they plan to expand it).

 

The EU doesn't really fund anything in the UK - it's our money to start with.

 

If duties are applied evenly on both sides, the UK will collect more customs revenue due to the ridiculously high trade imbalance plus the EU will stop receiving VAT revenue from the UK. The latter is at least 3 billion.

 

The UK is already at EU standards - off topic anyway.

 

"Some sort" of Norway type deal means SM and EEA - this involves continued freedom of movement and probably won't fly after all this and 3.5 years. Norway does contribute more per capita but far less than the UK in total - that was their choice.

Edited November 18, 2019 by nauseus

[nauseus]

58 minutes ago, Victornoir said:

 you hope that I will do your research work for you, expect a big disappointment.

I always expect you to be a big disappointment. 

[Bruntoid]

15 hours ago, nauseus said:

Brilliant. I wonder who "they" is? What if UK trade with other parts of the world increases? You are aren't proving anything.

Like where ? Brexiteers have always been light on economic detail so heres your big chance ...

 

Which other parts of the world are you talking about that the EU won’t trump with their vastly superior financial clout, for how much will it increase?,  (try to relate it to money lost through no EU connection) and when ?? 
 

Prove something, anything 

Edited November 18, 2019 by Bruntoid

[Bruntoid]

On 11/17/2019 at 10:10 PM, tomacht8 said:

Ohh the UK subsidise the EU and get nothing back in return?

Then, in fact, all the British politicians of the last 40+ years must have been idiots then. Or is it possible that the free access to the largest domestic market in the world brings advantages and increases the GDP by multiple times as measured by the contributions for access?

 

But no, now we have here a new Einstein of economics, which puts all politicians of the UK from the last 40 years with his wisdom in the shade. Blessed are the spiritually poor.

 

Every word of that would have flown over his head - good effort though ????????

[dimitriv]

1 minute ago, Bruntoid said:

Like where ? Brexiteers have always been light on economic detail so heres your big chance ...

 

Which other parts of the world are you talking about that the EU won’t trump with their vastly superior financial clout, for how much will it increase?,  (try to relate it to money lost through no EU connection) and when ?? 
 

Prove something, anything 

 

Talking will not help. Proving anything also not. He is 100% pro Brexit. Everything you prove or say will be considered untrue. He strongly believes that the UK will prosper after Brexit, and that the UK will become a world power again.

 

These people believe that in the past everything was much better. The past...  When people could make a living doing repeating work, every day the same, in factories. But forgets that the UK car industry is now German, even icons like Jaguar, Rolls Royce and Bentley are now foreign, the UK steel industry was bought by the Chinese etc. 

 

And this is all the fault of the EU. Once the UK is out, everything will get better soon.

 

And I forgot that the EU will collapse because they will miss the 8 billion UK contribution. They will go down because all other countries together are not able to compensate for this.

 

That is how it is ????  

 

 

[melvinmelvin]

13 minutes ago, dimitriv said:

 

Talking will not help. Proving anything also not. He is 100% pro Brexit. Everything you prove or say will be considered untrue. He strongly believes that the UK will prosper after Brexit, and that the UK will become a world power again.

 

These people believe that in the past everything was much better. The past...  When people could make a living doing repeating work, every day the same, in factories. But forgets that the UK car industry is now German, even icons like Jaguar, Rolls Royce and Bentley are now foreign, the UK steel industry was bought by the Chinese etc. 

 

And this is all the fault of the EU. Once the UK is out, everything will get better soon.

 

And I forgot that the EU will collapse because they will miss the 8 billion UK contribution. They will go down because all other countries together are not able to compensate for this.

 

That is how it is ????  

 

 

 

you forgot to mention the downfall of the UK computer industry and the shipping industry,

and a bunch of others

 

on the bright side;

Allards are still screwed together on the island though

 

to dream that UK will grow and prosper and that waves will seek out the foggy island so that

they can be ruled by GT sippers on the southern piers is OK

 

but to blame commercial and industrial shortcomings on the EU is a step on the way to Hades

 

enjoy the ride

 

[sandyf]

20 hours ago, nauseus said:

The "scenario" was only different because the deception by the Heath and subsequent UK governments had not been realised and because there had been no referendum allowed before actually joining. But the aims of the EEC/EU were in fact the same as they are now. Those 43 years proved that the choice was wrong, as far as the UK electorate was concerned. 

 

 

Obviously the words "in my opinion" are absent from your vocabulary.

Only the minority think the electorate were deceived, the majority of the electorate were fed up facing a state of emergency every year and more than happy to give the European project a chance.

Despite what you want to think, there never was any "good old days", and I can only assume you never had a mortgage in the 70s. Only a warped mind would want to put people back into that situation.

[nauseus]

10 hours ago, Bruntoid said:

Like where ? Brexiteers have always been light on economic detail so heres your big chance ...

 

Which other parts of the world are you talking about that the EU won’t trump with their vastly superior financial clout, for how much will it increase?,  (try to relate it to money lost through no EU connection) and when ?? 
 

Prove something, anything 

Let's start with the Commonwealth countries, which can certainly feed us and get us drunk to ease any pain, as we will miss the EU and its clout sooo much.