UK PM Johnson cannot keep Scotland in union against its will: Sturgeon

[david555]

3 minutes ago, Baerboxer said:

 

Did France say that to Algeria, Tunisia, Morocco, Viet Nam, Cambodia?

 

But they do to Corsica,

 

Did Spain say that to Mexico, Bolivia, Chile, Venezuela ?

 

But they do to Catalonia,

 

Did the US say that to the Philippines?

 

But they did to the Confederacy.

 

Do you understand the difference between former colonial powers giving the countries they colonized by force back to the original people and a part of a sovereign country wanting to break away?

So all your examples prove that nobody can stop a independence cry or fight for independence …. Thank you for the so many examples Sir !

 

Up to the U.K. to choose between a friendly neighbor or a troublesome one 

[cmarshall]

1 minute ago, david555 said:

Oh ...gosh … how I could forget them , "well trained redcoats "loosing from … colonists ,not a trained army , just fighting for their existing & freedom

 

However with "some" help from the French I thought …?

How else could they have prevailed against the most powerful army in the world?  Actually, the American War of Independence (not a revolution at all) is one of the early examples of how a less powerful country can defeat a more powerful one if the logistics and competition for resources favor the lessor power.

 

During the Paris Peace talks in the early 1970s, American Col. Harry Summers was talking to his North Vietnamese counterpart during a break. Summers reportedly told the Vietnamese that we had won every battle in the war. The Vietnamese replied, “That is true, but it is also irrelevant.”

 

George Washington could have said the same to Lord Cornwallis.

[Grusa]

1 hour ago, trainman34014 said:

Little Krankie just wants to be famous and someday have a Statue of herself erected next to the one of William Wallace !

Perhaps she would like to earn that place by suffering the same fate....?

[Baerboxer]

2 minutes ago, david555 said:

So all your examples prove that nobody can stop a cry or fight for independence …. Thank you for the so many examples Sir !

 

Up to the U.K. to choose between a friendly neighbor or a troublesome one 

 

Clearly you don't or don't want to understand the difference between a colony and being part of a sovereign nation.

 

Must go now, off to support the independence for the Basques, Brittany, Normandy and Corsica.

[david555]

10 minutes ago, Baerboxer said:

 

Clearly you don't or don't want to understand the difference between a colony and being part of a sovereign nation.

 

Must go now, off to support the independence for the Basques, Brittany, Normandy and Corsica.

Effectively some people did that to the civil war in Spain , even from England ….

 

By the example of Corsica , I don't remember if they had kings or parliaments , but I read your history and Scotland had many kings and even a Queen ruling (shopped the poor lass head of even …) , I forgot his name but even a Scottish King was ruling England ….,but not an expert in accurate U.K.  history , but was there not 1 or more wars between you both ….already 

 

Short said , if a movement becomes big enough you cant stop it anymore 

[evadgib]

The easiest way by far for the jocks to achieve this nonsence would be for a 'Gina McMiller' to push for the entire Kingdom to be polled. Had they done so at the first attempt in 2014 they'd be 'oot the noo'!

 

In reality HMG succeeded in infiltrating Sinn Fein/IRA & later parachuted Henry Bolton into UKIP in order to destroy it from within after they'd finally woken up to them post-Ferage. Whether they have already started on SNP remains to be seen (salmond's trial?), but their reigns will need to be pulled sooner rather that later IMO if they are to be curtailed.

[david555]

2 minutes ago, evadgib said:

The easiest way by far for the jocks to achieve this nonsence would be for a 'Gina McMiller' to push for the entire Kingdom to be polled. Had they done so at the first attempt in 2014 they'd be 'oot the noo'!

 

In reality HMG succeeded in infiltrating Sinn Fein/IRA & later parachuted Henry Bolton into UKIP in order to destroy it from within post-Ferage. Whether they have already started on SNP (salmond's trial?) remains to be seen, but their reigns will need to be pulled sooner rather that later IMO.

In 2014 there was no leaving the E.U. ….That is what made them call for independence now,pushing Brexit in their throat to swallow against their wish ….. your own fault U.K.

[Caldera]

As the UK's situation has changed significantly since the last Scottish independence referendum, because of Brexit, I see no justification whatsoever to deny the Scots another referendum.

 

[david555]

4 minutes ago, Caldera said:

As the UK's situation has changed significantly since the last Scottish independence referendum, because of Brexit, I see no justification whatsoever to deny the Scots another referendum.

 

Compare it with a pre marriage contract …. when 1 party after change the conditions or spirit from the contract ...

making the original as void

[cyril sneer]

How does the UK benefit from keeping Scotland? 

[evadgib]

16 minutes ago, Caldera said:

As the UK's situation has changed significantly since the last Scottish independence referendum, because of Brexit, I see no justification whatsoever to deny the Scots another referendum.

 

So 5.5M people get to ride rough shod over the 55M or more in the rest of the Kingdom?

 

I would rather they stay & in reality I think they will but this 'tail wagging the dog' is wearing a little thin.

[Caldera]

11 minutes ago, evadgib said:

So 5.5M people get to ride rough shod over the 55M or more in the rest of the Kingdom?

No. Nothing will change for the rest of the kingdom. Unless Northern Ireland and/or Wales wish to break away as well, obviously.

[NanLaew]

24 minutes ago, cyril sneer said:

How does the UK benefit from keeping Scotland? 

For starters, the UK's gene pool would be significantly depleted with the departure of Alba.

[finnishmen]

only totally idiot country join to EU today, we has in finland see thats and need out of EU fast, this is only big scam and communism system new start. and little countrys only need pay lot but no give anythink, if england join EU have totally big idiot and no newer can give any7think good att EU only need pay lot alltime and new lot lot stupid rules.no help economy newer,no help busines newer, no help anythink, why need join idiot systems.

[cmarshall]

2 minutes ago, finnishmen said:

only totally idiot country join to EU today, we has in finland see thats and need out of EU fast, this is only big scam and communism system new start. and little countrys only need pay lot but no give anythink, if england join EU have totally big idiot and no newer can give any7think good att EU only need pay lot alltime and new lot lot stupid rules.no help economy newer,no help busines newer, no help anythink, why need join idiot systems.

I was wondering when the Russian trollbots would chime in.

[cyril sneer]

23 minutes ago, cmarshall said:

I was wondering when the Russian trollbots would chime in.

Possibly Russian yes, but not trolling

[JAG]

22 minutes ago, Victornoir said:

Do not try to educate them, they are funny with their nationalist boastfulness and they really believe that they "saved Europe".

That is up there with De Gaulle's claim that the French liberated Paris!

[Laughing Gravy]

3 hours ago, dabhand said:

The 'once in a generation' remark was contained in the Scottish Government White Paper of November 2013. Stated by Alex Salmond in his position as First Minister of Scotland. 

Throwaway remark? Hardly.

 

On Salmond, it will be interesting what happens next month. His one time only mark might have a different meaning after the trial.

[Laughing Gravy]

2 minutes ago, david555 said:

We are one happy ethnic family , only when in the past family visit was to quick overwhelming and took to long ….!! LOL

Well finally some humour. The last time I was in Holland there were many different ethnicity's around.

 

I think that past family visit they stayed around and have never left but that is my view looking from the outside.

 

I will keep that quote of your of "We are one happy ethnic family" it might come back to haunt you

[Rookiescot]

Good grief the little englanders on this thread are priceless.

You all seem to think you own Scotland. It somehow belongs to England. Its not allowed to decide what it wants.

[vogie]

1 minute ago, Rookiescot said:

Good grief the little englanders on this thread are priceless.

You all seem to think you own Scotland. It somehow belongs to England. Its not allowed to decide what it wants.

It is part of the United Kingdom, why are you in the minority speaking for the majority of the Scots that wish to remain part of the UK. Only the SNP wish to split the UK up, not the Scots!

[david555]

2 minutes ago, vogie said:

It is part of the United Kingdom, why are you in the minority speaking for the majority of the Scots that wish to remain part of the UK. Only the SNP wish to split the UK up, not the Scots!

Something like the Conservatives Brexit ….??? Not all the Brits ...

[Rookiescot]

2 minutes ago, vogie said:

It is part of the United Kingdom, why are you in the minority speaking for the majority of the Scots that wish to remain part of the UK. Only the SNP wish to split the UK up, not the Scots!

What minority?

Polls show that there is a majority for independence because of Brexit and Johnson.

Have you not been paying attention? 

Are you still stuck in the last independence referendum?

Its up to Scotland to decide if it wants to remain in the UK. 

[Laughing Gravy]

13 minutes ago, david555 said:

"Well finally some humour. The last time I was in Holland there were many different ethnicity's around."

 

So I am sure you where feeling just like home on the Island , probably some in waiting to cross the channel over....? lol.. 

 

As for those waiting to leave the island. Nobody is stopping them. They can go whenever. But I think many know that live is better on the Island, as a UK citizen. If not they will not be missed and more refugees for the EU, who seem to love them

[Laughing Gravy]

10 minutes ago, Rookiescot said:

What minority?

Polls show that there is a majority for independence because of Brexit and Johnson.

Have you not been paying attention? 

Are you still stuck in the last independence referendum?

Its up to Scotland to decide if it wants to remain in the UK. 

Is that them same polls we have been hearing for the last 4 years. More people wanted top remain. They Lost.

 

More people want to remain so in a a general election the remain would overwhelmingly win. They lost.

 

Some people just don't get it and believe the polls especially from their political media outlets, that they read.

 

Scotland had a once in a generation/lifetime vote and. yes they voted to remain.

 

I feel sorry for the majority of Scots who voted to remain in the UK as they have a minority of windbags like Sturgeon, who just can't accept defeat.

[david555]

1 minute ago, Laughing Gravy said:

As for those waiting to leave the island. Nobody is stopping them. They can go whenever. But I think many know that live is better on the Island, as a UK citizen. If not they will not be missed and more refugees for the EU, who seem to love them

You deliberately misunderstood my post , as I said you must felled like home U.K. with al those ethnicities in Holland , and the channel crossing was meant in direction to Paradise Island (in their thinking …) like now started dingy way ….

 Nice try anyway …(wink)

[Laughing Gravy]

1 minute ago, david555 said:

You deliberately misunderstood my post , as I said you must felled like home U.K. with al those ethnicities in Holland , and the channel crossing was meant in direction to Paradise Island (in their thinking …) like now started dingy way ….

 Nice try anyway …(wink)

I was right the first time. The Dutch have a very different sense of humour. It must be all those Dutch comedians clogging up (intended) the comedy circuit with their one liners and comedy magic.????

[vogie]

15 minutes ago, Rookiescot said:

What minority?

Polls show that there is a majority for independence because of Brexit and Johnson.

Have you not been paying attention? 

Are you still stuck in the last independence referendum?

Its up to Scotland to decide if it wants to remain in the UK. 

The minority that the polls show, you know that minority.

 

"Have you not been paying attention?" If patronising and insulting me makes you feel better, carry on.

 

Scotland is part of the UK, not a rogue country.

 

No I am not stuck in the last independence election, I accepted it, I think you should also, once in a gereration referendum remember.

 

[david555]

1 minute ago, Laughing Gravy said:

I was right the first time. The Dutch have a very different sense of humour. It must be all those Dutch comedians clogging up (intended) the comedy circuit with their one liners and comedy magic.????

You are right as many typical humor from Brits escape me too , is normal we are continental with many different close neighbors than example U.K. who is an Island .

 

[Rookiescot]

2 minutes ago, Laughing Gravy said:

Is that them same polls we have been hearing for the last 4 years. More people wanted top remain. They Lost.

 

More people want to remain so in a a general election the remain would overwhelmingly win. They lost.

 

Some people just don't get it and believe the polls especially from their political media outlets, that they read.

 

Scotland had a once in a generation/lifetime vote and. yes they voted to remain.

 

I feel sorry for the majority of Scots who voted to remain in the UK as they have a minority of windbags like Sturgeon, who just can't accept defeat.

If the Brexit result had been 52% in favour of remain would all you Brexiteers have pulled down the tents and gone away? No chance.

Where in the section 30 order from the last referendum did it say it was once in a generation? When was the law passed in parliament saying Scotland cant have another vote for a generation?

If your sole reason for denying Scotland the right to determine its own future rests with an off the cuff remark then you are on pretty thin ice. Johnson said he would rather be dead in a ditch? Should he now be enacting that?

You were warned Brexit will result in moves for Scottish independence. You guys either didnt listen or didnt care. Either way your actions have brought this about.

Own it.