Action needed now to save "filthy, dangerous, rip-off, vice ridden" Pattaya, says watchdog

[Leaver]

43 minutes ago, CGW said:

but ignore my POV, you are obviously the more knowledgeable than I.

I don't ignore anyone's POV.  We are all entitled to one, and I am happy to listen everyone's, and no, I never claimed I was more knowledgeable than you.  

 

45 minutes ago, CGW said:

I lived in Pattaya starting in 97

That old chestnut.  I've lived here longer, so therefore I have seen and done more.  For me, the longer you have lived here, the more of a boiling frog you are.

 

47 minutes ago, CGW said:

Thailand's exports have increased every year for many years and continue to do so, but you appear to be bound and determined to paint a picture of gloom and doom for all things Thai!

I'm not Thai.  I don't work in the factories here.  I am only going by new articles and statistics. 

 

Once again, the below quote.  Are you saying it's fake news? 

 

Thailand was starting to gain a middle class, and the domestic tourism you mentioned was increasing, then along came the military, and look where we are now.  We even have recent protests against the Government, because the people are hurting due to their policies, yet you claim all is well in the industrial zone on the eastern seaboard.  Try telling that to the thousands of Thai's that are out of work in the industrial zone on the eastern seaboard. 

 

"There were 1,339 factories with 34,569 employees and a total investment of approximately Bt56.9 billion registered for sale or out of business in the first 10 months of 2019, according to the Industry Ministry."

 

 

[CGW]

18 minutes ago, Leaver said:

That old chestnut.  I've lived here longer, so therefore I have seen and done more.  For me, the longer you have lived here, the more of a boiling frog you are.

If you are trying to be insulting you are not succeeding, I stated I was here from 97, the point being that tourism was low, very low back then, yet Pattaya survived, something you stated would not happen with your "are you serious" comment, read into my comments as you wish, don't let the truth get in the way ???? 

You seem to now be under the impression that I stated that the poor in Thailand would prosper, I never stated that, the rich will get richer, the social divide will continue to grow & Pattaya will survive, even with vastly reduced tourist numbers, the poor will return to their villages, casualties of making money for the rich & be forgotten about, just as they always have been here!

[Traubert]

3 hours ago, yogi100 said:

I spoke to a Thai woman today who's a hairdresser in Pattaya. She mainly gets her living doing the girls hair who work the bars. It's the worst high season she's ever known it and she's been in the same salon for nearly 20 years.

 

She also said factories are laying off people all over Thailand. They can't sell their products because the Baht is too expensive.

 

So who knows what are false assertions about Thailand's official unemployment rate and what is the true rate. I'd take the word of a lady who works at the sharp end rather than the word of some politician who claims that the economy is booming because he wants to 'save face'.

 

She's got a mobile phone and keeps in touch with her friends and family who tell her what the situation is in their parts of Thailand

A woman in the hairdressers gossiping? Well that's a new first.......

Edited January 16, 2020 by Traubert
spelling

[garyk]

Perfect place for Chinese and Indian tourists. 

[Leaver]

6 minutes ago, CGW said:

I stated I was here from 97, the point being that tourism was low, very low back then, yet Pattaya survived,

Firstly, I am not insulting you.

 

Have you considered that the lower tourism in 97 actually matched the amount of businesses in Pattaya back then?  Thus, most businesses survived.

 

Just look at all the development since 97.  Do you think there is too much supply for the current demand of tourists? 

 

You can only cut the tourist pie in so many slices, yet, they keep building more condo's, hotels, bars, restaurants, shopping malls etc.

[Leaver]

11 minutes ago, Traubert said:

A woman in the hairdressers gossiping? Well that's a new first.......

And when she closes her salon, would you believe her then????

[Traubert]

12 minutes ago, Leaver said:

And when she closes her salon, would you believe her then????

I've no idea who she is. She's a woman gossiping in the hairdressers is the extent of my knowledge about her now and forever. Not what I'd call the font of all wisdom.

Edited January 16, 2020 by Traubert

[Maitdjai]

This happens, when "Dilettants" trying to change a running system, or extort more money out of it.
20, to 30 years ago, it was a rough place, but much more honest and sure, not every bodies taste. 

The Exchange rate was more or less the same. 1 Deutschmark about 15 to 18 Baht (Except during the Asia crisis in the late 90ties, but not very long).

Today 1 Euro (1.9xx DM) is about 30 Baht.

But it was the "Original"!

No need of complaining "Family Travellers" with disgusted faces then.

Sometimes, the bill comes late...Don't cry!
 

 

Edited January 16, 2020 by Maitdjai

[yogi100]

13 minutes ago, Traubert said:

A woman in the hairdressers gossiping? Well that's a new first.......

She was not 'gossiping' she was airing her views on the economy and the government and those of herself her friends and her family. And those views were extremely negative.

 

After my haircut I went to the strangely named  Big C supermarket on Second Rd and it was like a morgue between 12.30 and 13.30. Very few shoppers and even fewer Westerners. If you doubt me take a trip up there one day and see for yourself.

 

When businesses are slack in the Los of Smiles they lay staff off. There are few regulations concerning shop workers' rights here and AFAIK no effective trade unions. Fewer people shopping in stores spending money equals less need for employees. The hairdresser told a similar story about the factories outside of Pattaya.

 

I had trouble finding an employee to tell me where the black bags.

were. That's how bad it was.

 

When I did find eventually find someone I got the usual "No hab". However not to be thwarted I had a scout around and in the end found them myself.

 

A lot of bars have closed in recent months and if the staff have found new employment it definitely won't be in Big C.

[CGW]

24 minutes ago, Leaver said:

yet, they keep building more condo's, hotels, bars, restaurants, shopping malls etc.

Yes, they do - greed has taken over from common sense! exploiting tourists became an easy way to riches, Pattaya would be far better off with half the tourists it gets now, the infrastructure would then, just about be able to cope!

Sure lots of poor folks would lose their jobs, but that was never the discussion, all I stated was that Pattaya would survive & in my view be a better place once the current downturn really bites.

[Traubert]

6 minutes ago, yogi100 said:

She was not 'gossiping' she was airing her views on the economy and the government and those of herself her friends and her family. And those views were extremely negative.

 

After my haircut I went to the strangely named  Big C supermarket on Second Rd and it was like a morgue between 12.30 and 13.30. Very few shoppers and even fewer Westerners. If you doubt me take a trip up there one day and see for yourself.

 

 

It used to be Carrefour supermarket, French owned and sold to a Thai company so I'm led to believe.

 

Airing ones views/gossiping, I'm a little misty on the difference, particularly when it takes place in a hairdressers.

 

'See United won last night. Any plans for a holiday this year, see the bar girl trade is dropping away. They cant get off their backs to come for a 'do'......'

[yogi100]

12 minutes ago, Traubert said:

It used to be Carrefour supermarket, French owned and sold to a Thai company so I'm led to believe.

 

Airing ones views/gossiping, I'm a little misty on the difference, particularly when it takes place in a hairdressers.

 

'See United won last night. Any plans for a holiday this year, see the bar girl trade is dropping away. They cant get off their backs to come for a 'do'......'

You're talking about Big C Extra up on Central Rd near Foodland. That used to be Carrefour.

The Big C on second Rd was always called Big C.

 

Gossip is meaningless tittle tattle and the spreading of rumours.

 

That's not quite the same thing as airing views on a nation's economy or it's political situation and how it affects your livelihood.

 

Would you describe discussing the ins and outs of Brexit or the question of immigration as 'gossiping'?

[URMySunshine]

7 hours ago, bagheera65 said:

It would  be better without it, i agree, but beach roads are common in almost ANY major seashore city in the world ( even Cannes that i was quoting has exactly the same ) and it's not the problem, except if they were endless traffic jam on it which would pollute even more the air, but it is not the case. Cleanliness IS the problem.

At last a newbier poster with something to say.  Truly welcome aboard to TVF and thanks for the erudite and comprehensive remarks.

[bagheera65]

7 hours ago, CGW said:

The Sanctuary of truth is ok, worth a visit (I lived beside there from 97-99) & used to look in regularly long before it was open to the public, but you are omitting many other areas of Pattaya that are good, what about the 30 world class golf courses etc, etc.

There is a lot more to Pattaya than the square mile around beach Road that so many seem to have difficulty getting away from.

Well, yes but it was "culturally"  speaking, and on this angle, the Sanctuary of Truth is the best in the area.

[balo]

Has Pattaya been saved yet?  If not I know a village full of young Isaan girls that are willing to move south. 

[simonok]

17 hours ago, Petew said:

Something should be done about all the street dogs that are breeding so prolifically around the residential areas and beaches. It is a rabies outbreak waiting to happen. When it does, and a tourist is bitten, that will be the end of Pattaya. 

Not being able to get a decent sleep because of the barking and howling is one thing, but rabies is a killer and this issue needs action of some sort. 

 

Call someone in Nakhon Sakom, they have a notable lack of street dogs up there!

[simonok]

17 hours ago, yogi100 said:

I dunno about dogs but where I stay in Soi Bhukaow it's the lack of pavements and loonies tearing about on motor bikes that scare me.

 

They even weave in and out of the pedestrians in Soi LK Metro. There used to be speed bumps in LKM but the M/C taxi boys tore them up.

 

I've seen two falangs knocked down by Thai blokes on M/Cs in Sois Bhukaow and Diana and that's when it hits home.

 

It's none of my business but I can't believe the people in the Town Hall don't regard this as a priority.

....and there in lies the fun!

[daveAustin]

But I thought Pattaya was now a thriving family destination?

[observer90210]

1 US$ should yield at least 37 THB....problem will be solved overnight....and fine any hooker entertainement guide asking for more then 1'700 THB for triple set,  boumBoum session

[NanLaew]

2 hours ago, simonok said:

19 hours ago, yogi100 said:

I dunno about dogs but where I stay in Soi Bhukaow it's the lack of pavements and loonies tearing about on motor bikes that scare me.

 

They even weave in and out of the pedestrians in Soi LK Metro. There used to be speed bumps in LKM but the M/C taxi boys tore them up.

 

I've seen two falangs knocked down by Thai blokes on M/Cs in Sois Bhukaow and Diana and that's when it hits home.

 

It's none of my business but I can't believe the people in the Town Hall don't regard this as a priority.

....and there in lies the fun!

When it comes to soi dogs, lunatic motorbike drivers or even over-zealous bar 'security' and their frequent, sometimes violent interaction with the foreign demographic, with regard to Pattaya city management, I see it more of a case of mind over matter.

 

They don't mind and we don't matter.

[jacko45k]

13 hours ago, DannyCarlton said:

I don't know of anyone who doesen't come to Pattaya anymore because of the coaches. You could argue that more coaches means more tourists.

You might think back to one who was killed after being crushed by a coach on the Thai/Beach Rd corner, that tourist never came back. 

[NanLaew]

1 hour ago, jacko45k said:

You might think back to one who was killed after being crushed by a coach on the Thai/Beach Rd corner, that tourist never came back. 

One in million?

 

A bit like my first Thai GF actually. Set her free... never came back.

[mikebell]

18 hours ago, NanLaew said:

This belief would suggest that the ageing foreign lothario's increasingly loud protestations about the Pattaya bars lacking in any sort of pleasant company and being totally bereft of any demimondaines worth paying for bedtime interest as unfounded and fallacious.

You are in denial.  Thailand is famous for the beauty of its populace.  It is infamous for its poor Education system; male-dominated career paths;  (check out police recruitment.); massage parlours; Go-Go bars; and just bars with rooms upstairs.

My step-daughter worked in one of these sweat shops whilst the college was supposedly training her to be a teacher.

  The above quote, wrapped in fancy language, cannot disguise the lack of intelligence behind it.

[mikebell]

On 1/16/2020 at 8:55 AM, URMySunshine said:

The look on many a girl's face as they accompany some fat, leering socially inept farang back to their grubby lair often says it all. Most are only doing it for the money and if they find a nice one a ticket out of dodge. 

Some time back, a Thai cabinet minister recommended Thai girls marry a farang as they tend to be more caring (about her/kids/family); less violent; less drunk.  That's the choice they have.

[Global Guy]

The prices have gone up and service has gone down. The Thais don't get that if you scam a tourist or an expat who lives here, you may have gotten 50 or 100 baht extra today, but that person isn't coming back to your bar tomorrow and will tell everyone he knows plus on the internet to stay away. 

 

We talked about this years ago and now they see the results. Now you have Chinese groups that don't go outside of their pre-planned tourist stops and then go back to Bangkok. Having not spent any money in the local economy except these few main tourist places.

 

Plus they stick to the larger hotels, don't go to the bars, and don't spend as much here.

[bkk6060]

On 1/15/2020 at 10:16 PM, twizzian said:

Pattaya is my least favourite place to visit, but worst of all is the vile taste of Starbucks coffee.

I had not been for awhile seems they jacked up the prices recently. A cold coffee 130 b and not even freshly made. Shameful.

Edited January 17, 2020 by bkk6060

[Traubert]

7 hours ago, daveAustin said:

But I thought Pattaya was now a thriving family destination?

Cringe..........

 

Top arch comment and totally deserving of the 'original comment of the week' award.

[NaamGin]

filthy, dangerous, rip-off, vice ridden

Hmm, I always thought that this was the draw for people going to Pattaya. 

If you want a safe, clean, over-priced and family-friendly destination, go to Disney World. 

[Leaver]

19 hours ago, Traubert said:

I've no idea who she is. She's a woman gossiping in the hairdressers is the extent of my knowledge about her now and forever. Not what I'd call the font of all wisdom.

It's my understanding she is the salon owner or manager.  If so, she would have knowledge of a downturn in her business profits.

 

I would not call a salon owner the "font of all wisdom" either,  but I would say she has wisdom when it comes to her own business, and if she says turnover is down, and offers up her opinion as to why, I see no problem in listening to her and discussing her point of view.  

 

So, whilst she may not be knowledgable on macroeconomics, she can speak with knowledge on her own microeconomics, her business.   

[Leaver]

19 hours ago, CGW said:

Yes, they do - greed has taken over from common sense! exploiting tourists became an easy way to riches, Pattaya would be far better off with half the tourists it gets now, the infrastructure would then, just about be able to cope!

Sure lots of poor folks would lose their jobs, but that was never the discussion, all I stated was that Pattaya would survive & in my view be a better place once the current downturn really bites.

No argument from me that Thai greed has played a big part in what is happening to the tourism industry here. 

 

When you say Pattaya would be better off with half the amount of tourists it has now, so infrastructure could cope, I understand what you are saying, but if greed wasn't a factor, infrastructure could be upgraded to cope, instead of funds being misappropriated. 

 

Another thing is, with better infrastructure, Pattaya could handle the extra tourists, and those "poor folks" could remain employed, which is also good for the local Pattaya economy, because those "poor folks" have to pay rent, eat etc, so some of their salary goes back into the local economy also. 

 

So, you would have big numbers of tourists, and big numbers of Thai's in jobs to cater for them, so the Pattaya economy expands, rather than contracts, which is what we are seeing now. 

 

If Thailand went into a deep recession, of course Pattaya will survive, but can you define "survive?" 

 

The city will not become a barren wasteland, there will still be people coming here, but just like in American during the GFC, you will see For Sale signs everywhere, and closed doors and derelict buildings on every soi, and we are starting to see that here now.