This is never going to end

[VBF]

5 minutes ago, Walker88 said:

The OP is correct in a large sense: this is never going to end....at least until there is a vaccine.  Then the next virus finds its way into the ecosystem and we do all of this again.

 

I've mentioned this in other threads, but the goal of sheltering and lockdowns is not to eradicate the virus. The virus is now a permanent part of the ecosystem. The goal of lockdowns was to slow the infection rate so as not to swamp the healthcare system. Pre CV-19 the US had 1 million hospital beds. At any given time 700,000 on average were occupied with folks suffering from a whole host of maladies.  If too many got CV-19 at the same time, not every sufferer could be given proper treatment, and some would unnecessarily die. It would also crowd out those suffering from other ailments.

 

Infection of the majority of the population is inevitable. Nothing short of a vaccine is going to stop that. The truly vulnerable are still going to die, if not now, then in the next wave.

 

There will be renewed outbreaks and clusters of infection, and that will bring about new lockdown measures. These will come and go either until there is a vaccine, or the remaining populace has built up antibodies to the current iteration of the virus. If the virus mutates too much, existing antibodies will be useless, and the whole thing begins again.

 

Time and experience will also show the most effective ways to treat sufferers, so lockdowns are buying time until the best treatment options are found and those become standard practice.

 

In new outbreaks, one goal will be to isolate the most vulnerable, such as the aged, obese, smokers, Type II diabetics, vapers, those with high BP, and those whose immune systems are already weakened by other ailments like HIV or cancer. Some unlucky folks who fall outside of any of those risk groups might get hit with a massive viral load and also die. Like it or not, that is our new world.

 

CV-19 is different from other coronaviruses like SARS and MERS because people evidencing no symptoms can pass it on. Because of that, CV-19 was never ringfenced like SARS and MERS were. CV-19 is everywhere, and it will continue to exist regardless of any lockdown measures. One bit of luck is that it doesn't fare as well in conditions of high heat, high humidity, and strong sunlight. That grants SEAsia a benefit, as well as the Northern Hemisphere summer. In the Autumn, all virologists and epidemiologists believe it will return.

 

We should know this and prepare accordingly. Think of what you might have done differently if you knew beforehand a month or more of lockdown was coming. Get that ready for next time, because there will be a next time.

Unless and/or until a quick, cheap cure is available, or better still a vaccine

[bwpage3]

I would hate to have to wake up everyday hating my life.

 

Ask yourself, when in the last 30 years, has the world stood still and the answer is never.

 

Do you honestly think you can change one location for another and all your problems will mysteriously disappear?

 

Newsflash! They won't.

 

Anything can happen in any country at any time in the entire world.

 

Anything.

 

Blaming all the world's problems because of where you live is ludicrous.

 

I suspect your low income is causing all of your woes.

 

We all make a path in life, need to learn to live within your means and accept it.

 

Doesn't matter what country you live in if you have problems financially surviving.

 

Those same problems will follow you to the next country.

[Max69xl]

On 5/3/2020 at 12:29 PM, mauGR1 said:

If you are saying that the US is not stable, i may start to be worried.

If you want to catch the virus in the US, go to Florida. That's the hot spot at the moment. 

[bwpage3]

On 5/3/2020 at 1:36 AM, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

From Johns Hopkins as of May 1:

 

Almost 10,000 dead from COVID around the world per day.

 

As for the U.S.:

 

 

In recent days, more than 2000 Americans have been dying each and every day from the pandemic.

 

The numbers speak for themselves. And by many accounts, the official stats probably continue to considerably undercount both the actual infections and deaths.

 

No the numbers do NOT speak for themselves.

 

There are 8 billion people in the world.

 

Do the math.

[mauGR1]

2 minutes ago, Max69xl said:

If you want to catch the virus in the US, go to Florida. That's the hot spot at the moment. 

I was not referring to the virus, but more to a perceived political divide.

Btw, with all the medias focused on the covid, we don't hear a lot of news about things happening in various parts of the world.

[Tony125]

5 hours ago, Chomper Higgot said:

You have a strange idea of 'hardly killed anyone'.

 

In case you haven't noticed the lockdown has also dramatically reduced road deaths. Win Win.  

Has also reduced air polution in most major cities in the world, some wild animals are returning to areas they have not been in or only seen rarely.

[mpyre]

5 hours ago, kingstonkid said:

 

Let me guess you also think that vaccines do not work, Kennedy was assassinated by the FBI and the mob, we never landed on the moon and of course there really is an Easter bunny and tooth fairy.

 

Oh I forgot Elvis is still alive.

Well, Kennedy WAS assassinated by some consortium of Deep State operatives, and other nefarious types...the fact that you don't seem to even consider the possibility demonstrates a serious lack of critical thinking. 

[baansgr]

5 hours ago, phantomfiddler said:

May I point out that on any normal PRE-COVID day in U.S.A. an AVERAGE of 8,500 people die, every winter day, (and around 7,000 per day in the warmer months) mainly of course from respiratory ailments. I believe this to be the most gargantuan hoax ever perpetrated on the human race, and to call it a pandemic verges on the criminal. The Black Plague WAS a pandemic, killing 50% of the population in Europe at the time. This load of spin invites a comparison between 50 and 0.007% !

We are only a few months into this...Black death went on for 8 years or so, not forgetting there wasn't any healthcare systems in those days...and without the restrictions in place...would the current numbers be more???

[bwpage3]

2 hours ago, Max69xl said:

If you want to catch the virus in the US, go to Florida. That's the hot spot at the moment. 

Funny that we are opening all the restaurants and businesses in our area of Florida.

 

You should get the facts straight

[natway09]

Next major concern is when the open up International incoming airtravel tourism 

from the US, UK, France, China, Spain, Italy Africa & the likes

A resurgence of this virus could change the way we live for a long time & kill our business for sure

[teacherclaire]

On 5/3/2020 at 12:29 PM, mauGR1 said:

If you are saying that the US is not stable, i may start to be worried.

I do not think that the US is stable. Please watch what will happen in the next four weeks and let's get back on topic.

[mauGR1]

6 minutes ago, teacherclaire said:

I do not think that the US is stable. Please watch what will happen in the next four weeks and let's get back on topic.

Well, the topic is very much general, and i agree with the OP, this is never going to end.

Now, what's happening in an important and powerful nation like US, may be quite relevant to the topic imho.

[bkkgriz]

9 hours ago, Lacessit said:

I feel safer in Thailand than I would in Australia. The USA? Personal freedom was what let the virus spread so readily there, aided by Trump's incompetence.

Ah yes, the old Trump is incompetent chestnut. He tries to stop flights from China and is called a racist xenophobe while idiots in SF and NY, Dems by the way, tell people to go to China Town and enjoy Chinese New year. Trump derangement syndrome is a hell of a drug.

[DaRoadrunner]

27 minutes ago, natway09 said:

Next major concern is when the open up International incoming airtravel tourism 

from the US, UK, France, China, Spain, Italy Africa & the likes

A resurgence of this virus could change the way we live for a long time & kill our business for sure

They have done well so far, lets hope the Thais do not make this mistake in their greed to get tourism going again.

[Ventenio]

I feel bad for the kids (40 and under:  yes, we are still pretty stupid in our 30's -- most of us) who came to Thailand for a few months, brought some cash and NOW they might be stuck here for three or four months just burning money and maybe hungry.  If you spend 20,000 a month (I'm guessing the lowest for everything) then you will spend about 80,000 sitting in your room......to me, that has to beat you down on many, many levels.  and there will NOT be many jobs when they go back home.

 

and then you have the zillion of filipino teachers who were making 15,000 to 20,000 a month and i can't imagine they saved a cool 80,000 for any hardship.  

 

in America, I forgot about the credit cards......so they can just charge it and live.  pass the craziness down the road a little bit.....

 

then we have the students of all ages.... loans, stress, and now nobody has an idea.... omg

 

what a mess.  for most people over 40, this is only a minor setback.  unless you are sick and then you worry about dying.  

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

6 hours ago, johng said:

https://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/health/conditions-and-diseases/coronavirus/coronavirus-disease-2019-vs-the-flu

 

 

 

Yes, and those flu cases will probably still die around the world, so most of the coronavirus deaths will be in addition to those.

 

But in the U.S. specifically, the official/undercounted CV death toll is heading toward 70,000 and beyond, just in the past couple months -- whereas the total U.S. deaths attributed to the annual flu for 2018-19 was 34,000+.

 

Thus the U.S. CV death toll is already going to double the annual U.S. flu deaths, and is nowhere yet near its end point. So if there's anything there that you think somehow ameliorates the CV problem, I don't see it.

 

https://www.cdc.gov/flu/about/burden/2018-2019.html

 

Quote

CDC estimates that the burden of illness during the 2018–2019 season included an estimated 35.5 million people getting sick with influenza, 16.5 million people going to a health care provider for their illness, 490,600 hospitalizations, and 34,200 deaths from influenza (Table 1).

 

Edited May 4, 2020 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[Sujo]

8 hours ago, phantomfiddler said:

May I point out that on any normal PRE-COVID day in U.S.A. an AVERAGE of 8,500 people die, every winter day, (and around 7,000 per day in the warmer months) mainly of course from respiratory ailments. I believe this to be the most gargantuan hoax ever perpetrated on the human race, and to call it a pandemic verges on the criminal. The Black Plague WAS a pandemic, killing 50% of the population in Europe at the time. This load of spin invites a comparison between 50 and 0.007% !

Sounds like you would rather nothing be done until 50% of the population dies then say ok its a problem so its time to do something.

[bartender100]

End of August this will all be over IMHO, already death rates are falling in the countries ahead of the game, antibody test and vaccines will be getting rolled out, slow lifting of lockdown rules from early June

 

The much hyped Nightingale hospital in London has been mothballed only ever treating 56 patients

 

Russia will be a problem still

 

 

[Logosone]

Let us not wallow in the valley of despair, I say to you today, my friends.

 

And so even though we face the difficulties of today and tomorrow, I still have a dream. It is a dream deeply rooted in the Asian dream.

 

I have a dream that one day this nation will rise up and live out the true meaning of its creed: "The Land of Smiles."

 

I have a dream that one day on the smokey hills of Chiang Mai, the sons of former bar girls and the sons of former cashiers will be able to sit down together at the table of brotherhood.

 

I have a dream that one day even the province of Phuket, an island sweltering with the heat of injustice, sweltering with the heat of sling-shots, will be transformed into an oasis of freedom and justice.

 

I have a dream that my four little masseuses will one day live in a nation where they will not be judged by the absence of a face mask but by the content of their character.

 

I have a dream today!

 

I have a dream that one day every shop shall be open, and every restaurant and playground shall be made whole, the rough places will be made plain, and the crooked places will be made straight; and the glory of Central Festival shall be revealed and all flesh shall again be seen.

 

And if Thailand is to be a great nation, this must become true.

And so let freedom ring from the prodigious hilltops of Chiang Mai.

Let freedom ring from the mighty towers of Bangkok.

Let freedom ring from the shallow roads of Hua Hin.

Let freedom ring from the go-go bars of Pattaya

Let freedom ring from the curvaceous slopes of Phuket.

But not only that:

Let freedom ring from distant jungles of Isaan.

Let freedom ring from the ancient capital of Ayutthaya

Let freedom ring from every hill and molehill of Surat Thani.

From every mountainside, let freedom ring.

 

 

And when this happens, and when we allow freedom ring, when we let it ring from every village and every moo baan, from every province and every city, we will be able to speed up that day when all of God's children, black men and white men, Germans and Swedes, British and Australian, will be able to join hands and sing in the words of the old Negro spiritual:

Free at last! Free at last!

Thank God Almighty, we are free at last!

[mauGR1]

5 minutes ago, Sujo said:

Sounds like you would rather nothing be done until 50% of the population dies then say ok its a problem so its time to do something.

It should be clear by now that not even 5% of the population is going to die, let alone 50%.

This is another scaremongering post, enough said.

[Ryan754326]

14 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

Yes, and those flu cases will probably still die around the world, so most of the coronavirus deaths will be in addition to those.

 

But in the U.S. specifically, the official/undercounted CV death toll is heading toward 70,000 and beyond, just in the past couple months -- whereas the total U.S. deaths attributed to the annual flu for 2018-19 was 34,000+.

 

Thus the U.S. CV death toll is already going to double the annual U.S. flu deaths, and is nowhere yet near its end point. So if there's anything there that you think somehow ameliorates the CV problem, I don't see it.

 

https://www.cdc.gov/flu/about/burden/2018-2019.html

 

 

How many flu deaths do you think have been counted as Covid19? New York’s death count went up by 30% overnight when they started counting “probable” deaths, without a positive test, based simply on the patient having Covid-like symptoms.

Edited May 4, 2020 by Ryan754326

[vermin on arrival]

6 minutes ago, mauGR1 said:

It should be clear by now that not even 5% of the population is going to die, let alone 50%.

This is another scaremongering post, enough said.

Not even 1% and maybe much less, and really talking about the cfr since not all will be infected, but it will be a bad epidemic.

Edited May 4, 2020 by vermin on arrival

[vermin on arrival]

8 minutes ago, bartender100 said:

The much hyped Nightingale hospital in London has been mothballed only ever treating 56 patients

Yeah it's kind of shocking they set up a special facility with 4,000 beds and it has been shut down.

[chessman]

4 minutes ago, Ryan754326 said:

How many flu deaths do you think have been counted as Covid19?

a few, but the number of Covid deaths not being classified as Covid deaths will be much much more.

 

Look at excess deaths: https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/04/28/us/coronavirus-death-toll-total.html

 

 

[bartender100]

3 minutes ago, vermin on arrival said:

Yeah it's kind of shocking they set up a special facility with 4,000 beds and it has been shut down.

They are keeping it in case there is a second wave, good job they built it in my view, it could have easily been needed

[mauGR1]

2 minutes ago, vermin on arrival said:

Not even 1% and maybe much less, but it will be a bad epidemic.

Well, if we think about how many lives has been ruined, how many businesses destroyed, perhaps we can say that the cure was worse than the disease.

https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2020/apr/28/coronavirus-hype-biggest-political-hoax-in-history/?fbclid=IwAR1AA44Dpk9DpBgAz9i9dx8wemfxJSmS92kVtXxoGpvPni1zehowWFe5Dqg

[chessman]

6 minutes ago, vermin on arrival said:

Yeah it's kind of shocking they set up a special facility with 4,000 beds and it has been shut down.

I think the early models that suggested the huge shortfall in ICU beds were based on the data from Italy (and China) but nowhere else had such acute pressure on the healthcare service.

[vermin on arrival]

1 minute ago, mauGR1 said:

Well, if we think about how many lives has been ruined, how many businesses destroyed, perhaps we can say that the cure was worse than the disease.

https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2020/apr/28/coronavirus-hype-biggest-political-hoax-in-history/?fbclid=IwAR1AA44Dpk9DpBgAz9i9dx8wemfxJSmS92kVtXxoGpvPni1zehowWFe5Dqg

Maybe. I have been crushed by it.

[vermin on arrival]

3 minutes ago, bartender100 said:

They are keeping it in case there is a second wave, good job they built it in my view, it could have easily been needed

agreed.

[vermin on arrival]

1 minute ago, chessman said:

I think the early models that suggested the huge shortfall in ICU beds were based on the data from Italy (and China) but nowhere else had such acute pressure on the healthcare service.

And really the ventilators were bad treatment. Putting people on them was almost a death sentence with covid.