U.S. Social Security For Thai Spouse

[bhatmasterson]

I got married in Chiang Mai several years ago. My wife has a 10 year visa with about 6 years left on it. I am now trying to figure out how to arrange social security illegibility for her. Is there anyone on the forum in a similar situation who has successfully arranged social security for your spouse?

Please inform as to what's needed. 

Thanks

[northsouthdevide]

In the UK we have a free advice organisation called the citizens advice bureau. 

Don't you have anything similar in the states? 

That might be a good place to start. 

[BarnicaleBob]

I went through all this with my spouse and can offer only what I learned during the process.  

At first I wanted a SSN for my spouse so I could claim her as a dependent on my income tax every year.  I found that only immigrants to the US with valid green cards could obtain a SSN.  However, as my spouse, she was eligible to be issued a IRS tax number, commonly refereed to as an Individual Tax Identification Number.  You can google for how to apply. 

Once she was granted the ITIN  from the IRS, I could claim her as a dependent on my income tax.  I also did amendments for the past couple of years to my income tax filings adding her as a dependent which resulted in a major tax refund for me.  

My spouse also had a ten your tourist visa and visited the US with me on a few occasions.  

Now for my spouse to be able to collect social security benefits, she could do so by filing for them under my social security number once she had been married to me for ten or more years.  There are some exceptions to this for disabled combat veterans and maybe one or two other circumstances. 

If you decide to have your spouse immigrate to the US, you can apply for a spousal visa.  Being that you have been married more than two years, it should be a straight forward thing to do.  If done properly on the first attempt, the immigration visa should be completed in four to five months.  However, with the current virous restrictions that the US has just put in place, this may be up to question.  

Upon moving to the US, your spouse will then receive her green card within a few weeks.  When that happens, you may take her to the Social Security office in your city and she can apply for a SSN which she will receive within two weeks of applying.  

I hope this clears things up for you, if not feel free to ask me more here or in a pm.  

[grin]

If your wife does not become a US citizen or resident she can still collect SS benefits if she meets the five year rule. This only requires you to live together in the US for a total of five years and it is cumulative time and does not have to be continuous. I'm not sure what kind of visa would be required.

 

[Dante99]

7 hours ago, grin said:

If your wife does not become a US citizen or resident she can still collect SS benefits if she meets the five year rule. This only requires you to live together in the US for a total of five years and it is cumulative time and does not have to be continuous. I'm not sure what kind of visa would be required.

 

Sounds correct.  I think it used to be a 2 or 3 year requirement but was increased sometime in the past 15  years.

 

Note must be married during the live together in US time.

[holy cow cm]

As far as I understand, if she doesn't live in the USA for a period of 5 years then there is no way she can get your SS which is so BS.

[pgrahmm]

8 hours ago, holy cow cm said:

As far as I understand, if she doesn't live in the USA for a period of 5 years then there is no way she can get your SS which is so BS.

I had read that it had to be parts of 5 years falling within 5 years.....

However, I didn't bookmark the source/article.....

[bhatmasterson]

21 hours ago, BarnicaleBob said:

I went through all this with my spouse and can offer only what I learned during the process.  

At first I wanted a SSN for my spouse so I could claim her as a dependent on my income tax every year.  I found that only immigrants to the US with valid green cards could obtain a SSN.  However, as my spouse, she was eligible to be issued a IRS tax number, commonly refereed to as an Individual Tax Identification Number.  You can google for how to apply. 

Once she was granted the ITIN  from the IRS, I could claim her as a dependent on my income tax.  I also did amendments for the past couple of years to my income tax filings adding her as a dependent which resulted in a major tax refund for me.  

My spouse also had a ten your tourist visa and visited the US with me on a few occasions.  

Now for my spouse to be able to collect social security benefits, she could do so by filing for them under my social security number once she had been married to me for ten or more years.  There are some exceptions to this for disabled combat veterans and maybe one or two other circumstances. 

If you decide to have your spouse immigrate to the US, you can apply for a spousal visa.  Being that you have been married more than two years, it should be a straight forward thing to do.  If done properly on the first attempt, the immigration visa should be completed in four to five months.  However, with the current virous restrictions that the US has just put in place, this may be up to question.  

Upon moving to the US, your spouse will then receive her green card within a few weeks.  When that happens, you may take her to the Social Security office in your city and she can apply for a SSN which she will receive within two weeks of applying.  

I hope this clears things up for you, if not feel free to ask me more here or in a pm.  

Thanks Bob! This is encouraging information. All I had been able to learn from the social security office in Whittier CA when we were there last June was about the 5 year rule which has been mentioned below. Even then I wasn't told that the five years didn't need to be concurrent. 

[TGIR]

It's not always easy so be prepared for some headache/heartache:   Sorry this will be long-winded but it won't help anyone if they can't see exactly what happened.

 

My wife and I have been married for 31 years.  She lived with me in California from 1988 until we retired and moved here in 2006.  She never worked a job where she had taxes taken from a paycheck.  She cleaned houses with a friend and is a seamstress, which never garnered enough money to file a business tax return or to include in our income taxes.  She has has a Social Security number since 1989.

 

She turned 62 in January and was anxious to file for her supplemental social security as my spouse.  I suggested she wait as she would get more money later but she wanted to file and start getting a check of her own.

 

The filing process seemed pretty easy and I processed the one or two page form for her and submitted it.  She got a notice in a few weeks that they had recieved it and gave her a date of November 21, 2019 as the official date of her application.  She was also notified that she should apply for a "My Social Security Account" by computer which could be used to ask questions and assist her and the SSA in processing anything to do with Social Security.  I attempted three times in one day to file it but never could complete the form.....it asked on the third page of three which of five credit "companys" she had used.  Since we don't have any debt save for two Visa cards we were unable to complete that page..........thusly, the application for her "My Social Security" account was simply not processed.  On subsequent days I attempted to file it again, every time running into the issue with no credit reference.

 

After a month or so went by we had heard neither from the SSA on her Supplemental Income application, nor had I been sucessful in figuring out what to do with the My SSA account problem.

 

I spent the next two weeks calling Social Security offices in California, the Phillipines and God knows where else trying to figure out how to solve these two (I thought independent) issues.  

 

Two people told me since we didn't complete the "My Social Security" application in three tries we would have to ........wait for it.............................Go to America and refile there, as the My SSA process was only for applicants who LIVED IN THE U.S. !!!!  Of course being the dummy I am and trusting in my Government, I said "surely there must be some other way to get this done?"............Sorry Charlie, that's the way it is!  I was told.

 

To make matters worse, one of the two ladies I spoke with looked into my wife's actual SSA Supplemental Income application for us, and told me she thought the clerk who had the file was "going to throw it away".   I tried to call the particular office in California three times and they never returned my call. 

 

It is now FIVE Months passed and we never heard another word from any of these people.  I am assuming the "clerk" mentioned did, indeed, <deleted>can my wife's application!!

 

At this point I am not sure what I'm going to do, but for this year, at least, I'm going to lie low and see if we ever hear from anyone......I have a very real fear it is going to end up In tears, as the Aussies say.

 

Hopefully this story will help some of you as you face the same problems.

[BarnicaleBob]

33 minutes ago, bhatmasterson said:

Thanks Bob! This is encouraging information. All I had been able to learn from the social security office in Whittier CA when we were there last June was about the 5 year rule which has been mentioned below. Even then I wasn't told that the five years didn't need to be concurrent. 

The five year thing is true and it can be an accumulation of five years.  However, time in the US for that to be counted must be as an immigrant not a tourist.  My wife had a total of 8 months as a tourist and SS told her it would not count.  

There are also exceptions to the five year rule if you as her spouse, are a veteran and die of a combat related injury or in action then the rule is waved.  Also, if she becomes a US citizen the five year rule is waved. 

 

[bhatmasterson]

10 hours ago, TGIR said:

It's not always easy so be prepared for some headache/heartache:   Sorry this will be long-winded but it won't help anyone if they can't see exactly what happened.

 

My wife and I have been married for 31 years.  She lived with me in California from 1988 until we retired and moved here in 2006.  She never worked a job where she had taxes taken from a paycheck.  She cleaned houses with a friend and is a seamstress, which never garnered enough money to file a business tax return or to include in our income taxes.  She has has a Social Security number since 1989.

 

She turned 62 in January and was anxious to file for her supplemental social security as my spouse.  I suggested she wait as she would get more money later but she wanted to file and start getting a check of her own.

 

The filing process seemed pretty easy and I processed the one or two page form for her and submitted it.  She got a notice in a few weeks that they had recieved it and gave her a date of November 21, 2019 as the official date of her application.  She was also notified that she should apply for a "My Social Security Account" by computer which could be used to ask questions and assist her and the SSA in processing anything to do with Social Security.  I attempted three times in one day to file it but never could complete the form.....it asked on the third page of three which of five credit "companys" she had used.  Since we don't have any debt save for two Visa cards we were unable to complete that page..........thusly, the application for her "My Social Security" account was simply not processed.  On subsequent days I attempted to file it again, every time running into the issue with no credit reference.

 

After a month or so went by we had heard neither from the SSA on her Supplemental Income application, nor had I been sucessful in figuring out what to do with the My SSA account problem.

 

I spent the next two weeks calling Social Security offices in California, the Phillipines and God knows where else trying to figure out how to solve these two (I thought independent) issues.  

 

Two people told me since we didn't complete the "My Social Security" application in three tries we would have to ........wait for it.............................Go to America and refile there, as the My SSA process was only for applicants who LIVED IN THE U.S. !!!!  Of course being the dummy I am and trusting in my Government, I said "surely there must be some other way to get this done?"............Sorry Charlie, that's the way it is!  I was told.

 

To make matters worse, one of the two ladies I spoke with looked into my wife's actual SSA Supplemental Income application for us, and told me she thought the clerk who had the file was "going to throw it away".   I tried to call the particular office in California three times and they never returned my call. 

 

It is now FIVE Months passed and we never heard another word from any of these people.  I am assuming the "clerk" mentioned did, indeed, <deleted>can my wife's application!!

 

At this point I am not sure what I'm going to do, but for this year, at least, I'm going to lie low and see if we ever hear from anyone......I have a very real fear it is going to end up In tears, as the Aussies say.

 

Hopefully this story will help some of you as you face the same problems.

TGIR- Sorry to hear this news. Can you tell me if this was mandatory in regards to your wife being able to receive SSA Supplemental Income? (She was also notified that she should apply for a "My Social Security Account" by computer which could be used to ask questions and assist her and the SSA in processing anything to do with Social Security.) 

[holy cow cm]

18 hours ago, pgrahmm said:

I had read that it had to be parts of 5 years falling within 5 years.....

However, I didn't bookmark the source/article.....

For me and my wife in any course it is not going to happen. Do not want to even be in the states more than a week or 2 at a time being maybe only once a year or every year and a half at best now..

[pineapple01]

 Hi So Thai Lady neighbour married to US Man 25 years and lived over there long time came back when he Died. She went back to sign something for a few years now its stopped she doesn't bother ,matters not shes rich anyway.

[TGIR]

9 hours ago, bhatmasterson said:

TGIR- Sorry to hear this news. Can you tell me if this was mandatory in regards to your wife being able to receive SSA Supplemental Income? (She was also notified that she should apply for a "My Social Security Account" by computer which could be used to ask questions and assist her and the SSA in processing anything to do with Social Security.) 

The My SS account is voluntary and informational only.   As far as I know the two applications are completely independent of each other.  When you apply for any SS benefits they ask you to file for the My Social Security Account theoretically for your own benefit, i.e. a place to ask pertinent questions on benefit qualifications, getting your annual letter of what your payment will be, etc.

 

Frankly, I am mystified that my wife's application for benefits was just apparently abandoned.  I used an old mailing address which may have caused the problem, because I didn't want them to process her application with an address in Thailand.  They said in the letter they sent me they would contact her if they needed any other documentation (like a marriage license), and we never heard from them again.  Perhaps my thought that they would email us for info was not something the processing clerk wanted to do.   I didn't give them a phone number or an address where mail coming to us would necessarily be forwarded, thinking that would force them to use email.  I've decided to get after them tonight because now I've gotten mad all over again for my wife's sake.  I get the feeling from other things I've read that "overseas marriages" aren't looked upon favorably in certain places.

[amykat]

You say you are filing for SSI for your wife.  Your wife doesn’t qualify for SSI.  You have to be a citizen or lawful resident, be over 65 and it is means/income tested.  This is basically a welfare program for the poor and disabled.  

[BarnicaleBob]

4 hours ago, TGIR said:

The My SS account is voluntary and informational only.   As far as I know the two applications are completely independent of each other.  When you apply for any SS benefits they ask you to file for the My Social Security Account theoretically for your own benefit, i.e. a place to ask pertinent questions on benefit qualifications, getting your annual letter of what your payment will be, etc.

 

Frankly, I am mystified that my wife's application for benefits was just apparently abandoned.  I used an old mailing address which may have caused the problem, because I didn't want them to process her application with an address in Thailand.  They said in the letter they sent me they would contact her if they needed any other documentation (like a marriage license), and we never heard from them again.  Perhaps my thought that they would email us for info was not something the processing clerk wanted to do.   I didn't give them a phone number or an address where mail coming to us would necessarily be forwarded, thinking that would force them to use email.  I've decided to get after them tonight because now I've gotten mad all over again for my wife's sake.  I get the feeling from other things I've read that "overseas marriages" aren't looked upon favorably in certain places.

I'm sorry to learn you and your wife are having such a difficult time getting her set up on SS retirement.  In reading what you have posted I can point out a couple of things that may be causing your problem.  

1.  You left out contact information such as phone number.  This alone can shut down her application as the SS office will rarely want to waste their time trying to figure out things that are your fault. 

2.  You attempted to mislead SS by indicating she was not living overseas which further complicates the claim.  This in the minds of the SS is an attempt on your part to giving false information which will kill the application.  

3.  Your wife needs to file via the SS office in the Philippians and to put her correct address, phone number and email for her contact information in Thailand.  Trying to do it any other way will stall if not shut down her application.  

4.  Being she had no or very little documentation of earned income in the US she most likely does not have the required 40 quarters to get SS retirement based on her income.  Therefore, it is best for her to file as your spouse basing her income under your earnings which it sounds like you attempted to do.  

5.  How much will your wife get will be based on what you would get now if you filed at her age now and she would get (ABOUT) half that amount depending on how they calculate it.  

 

Finally, be 100% truthful to the SS office and they will work with you.  Give them false or misleading information and your wife may not only get nothing but could be subject to fraud charges.  

So contact the SS office in the Philippians and just restart the process over again.  I hope this works out for you and your wife and good luck.  

 

[XBroker]

On 5/6/2020 at 10:45 PM, holy cow cm said:

As far as I understand, if she doesn't live in the USA for a period of 5 years then there is no way she can get your SS which is so BS.

Well gee maybe I can file for an income from the phillipines  if I marry a Fillipina here in the US?  ????

Edited May 14, 2020 by XBroker

[Dante99]

On 5/8/2020 at 9:46 PM, amykat said:

You say you are filing for SSI for your wife.  Your wife doesn’t qualify for SSI.  You have to be a citizen or lawful resident, be over 65 and it is means/income tested.  This is basically a welfare program for the poor and disabled.  

That does not all fit with my experience.

[XBroker]

8 hours ago, Dante99 said:

That does not all fit with my experience.

I think it's correct except for the over 65 part. Not sure what problem you have w/ my comment, but it seems pretty entitled to think we here in the US should pay SSI to someone who has not paid into the system or even lived here. Granted it's all a cluster frack of socialism for the few rich people.

 

Warren Buffet's son gets farm subsidies and I have an entire rant I'll spare people of as far as that goes. We get the crumbs, but still there are people here who need to be taken care of and they're giving it to illegals where are here. I don't think we should be giving to to people who never were here or paid into the system.. ideally..  We know virtually none of this world is ideal.

[Bill97]

2 hours ago, XBroker said:

I think it's correct except for the over 65 part. Not sure what problem you have w/ my comment, 
 

 

 

 

 

You are claiming amykat’s comment as yours xBroker so you are posting with at least two identities. 
Schizophrenia rules

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

2 hours ago, XBroker said:

[JimGant]

On 5/14/2020 at 12:56 PM, Dante99 said:

You say you are filing for SSI for your wife.  Your wife doesn’t qualify for SSI.  You have to be a citizen or lawful resident, be over 65 and it is means/income tested.  This is basically a welfare program for the poor and disabled.  

All correct, except for the age 65. No SSI payments to non resident aliens.

[Sheryl]

I think he/she may be confusing early SS retirement benefits at 62 with SSI. SSI is an entirely different thing and indeed does not sound like she would qualify

[Greg O]

You apply online and receive a password at my Social Security and a representative will call to conduct a telephone interview on a USA number. Can use Skype (or the equivalent) of that for a psuedo number. I maintain my USA number here for business use and communication with Social Security via telephone and email once my benefit started three years ago is quite good but you have to follow up if they don't reply.  My 9 year old daughter receives a monthly benefit as well and her Thai mum was also eligible as a guardian but we have divorced (which is better than any government stipend) I've found the Staff at Social Security to be helpful and efficient assuming you or she qualify. 

[NancyL]

You have to have a U.S. address to get a My Social Security account, but you don't need to have a U.S. address or a My Social Security account to apply for Social Security or Medicare online.  And you should use your actual address of residence, i.e. Thailand if you live in Thailand and input your Thai phone number. Manila SSA will email you stating a time they will call your Thai phone number and they will review with you the application you filed online.  It's really a very straight-forward process if, as has been said, you're totally upfront and honest with them and don't try to game the system by using a U.S. address or phone number.  Oh, there is no problem in applying with your Thai address, phone number, etc and having your monthly benefit deposited to a U.S. bank account.

 

At the time we applied for SS benefits we were using a Florida mail forwarding service for our address with the IRS and Manila SSA said it wasn't a problem that our IRS address and SSA address weren't the same.  They stressed that you have to use your actual physical location as your SSA address, or a PO Box in that location if you don't have secure mail delivery where you live.  Since then we've realized that the mail delivery to our condo address is very secure and we've since changed our IRS address, too.  The U. S. mail forwarding address is just used for banking, credit cards, investments, etc.

[bhatmasterson]

On 5/25/2020 at 2:27 PM, Sheryl said:

I think he/she may be confusing early SS retirement benefits at 62 with SSI. SSI is an entirely different thing and indeed does not sound like she would qualify

To be more clear, my intention is to secure survivor benefits for my Thai wife. Thanks

[Bill97]

56 minutes ago, bhatmasterson said:

To be more clear, my intention is to secure survivor benefits for my Thai wife. Thanks

Only took you a month to clarify that important bit.  You and wife need 5 years living in the US while married for her to qualify. No 5 years no SS for her. . .

 

So not possible for you only married a few years.  Not to worry divorce fast when she finds out you will leave her little or nothing.

[bhatmasterson]

4 minutes ago, Bill97 said:

Only took you a month to clarify that important bit.  You and wife need 5 years living in the US while married for her to qualify. No 5 years no SS for her. . .

 

So not possible for you only married a few years.  Not to worry divorce fast when she finds out you will leave her little or nothing.

Thank you. Don't try to make a living as a comedian. 

[Bill97]

2 hours ago, bhatmasterson said:

Thank you. Don't try to make a living as a comedian. 

Sorry I don’t think it is anywhere close to funny when someone marries expecting and perhaps causing his wife to expect future income when it will not be coming.

 

Certainly you may qualify but ...