What is it about COVID 19 that has the World and Thailand in particular so scared?

[thaibeachlovers]

9 hours ago, alyx said:

You Surelynot mean that...you might be surprised to learn that sex is not the only way to become HIV+ and sometimes it doesn't take two to tango  

HIV is contracted by transfer of infected human fluid ie sex or using dirty needles for drugs. Use a condom and don't do injected drugs would stop most of it. Unfortunately babies can contract it in the womb, but if the mother doesn't get it they won't birth an infected baby.

 

It's probably the most easily not contracted disease around, but men will have sex without condoms and addicts will use dirty needles.

[thaibeachlovers]

On 8/27/2020 at 7:28 PM, tgeezer said:

Maybe they realise that their economic system was heading for collapse and the Covid19 provides a reason for collapse for which nobody can be held responsible thus securing their positions. The loss of freedom which will be necessary to contain the sheeple have become acceptable to people who believe that they save lives. In northern countries they need to keep up the pretence for only a few more months when the flu season starts. 

[thaibeachlovers]

17 hours ago, Bluetongue said:

And of course the endlessly dangling carrot of a vaccine is almost cargo cultist.

Indeed. Without that "carrot" the sheeple would soon revolt against the dictat of lockdown and business destruction.

They don't seem to have a plan B.

[RJRS1301]

10 hours ago, alyx said:

You Surelynot mean that...you might be surprised to learn that sex is not the only way to become HIV+ and sometimes it doesn't take two to tango  

How many non sexual transmissions of HIV, very few from needle stick injury, transfusions (almost impossible due to protocols), injecting drug use, very low where clean equipment supplied.  Mother to child transmission low in most countries with effective monitoring and treatment.  Surgical and dental very very low. HepC of course can be a different matter

Edited August 28, 2020 by RJRS1301

[Hamus Yaigh]

On 8/27/2020 at 1:28 PM, Thomas J said:

WHAT IS IT ABOUT COVID 19 THAT HAS CAUSED THIS HYSTERIA WHEN OTHER FAR MORE DEADLY DISEASES AND CAUSES OF DEATH DID NOT SO MUCH AS CREATE A RIPPLE? 

Reasonable people (inc most Thais) are more scared of contagious diseases than driving vehicles or stupidity. They also are less tolerant of people who shout to get their POV across.

[animalmagic]

On 8/27/2020 at 1:58 PM, Surelynot said:

Contagious nature and the potential for a high death rate amongst older people and those with underlying conditions.

 

Road deaths are not infectious; HIV is, but it would be your own fault if you contracted it; TB infectious, but largely treatable.

 

So you are not really comparing apples with apples.

I agree it is not comparing like with like.  The following description of the difference between disease (TB) and virus (Corona) is informative.

 

A disease is an abnormal state in the human body, psyche or the interpersonal negotiations, which causes greater levels of morbidity and mortality. It is usually associated with symptoms and signs. The disease may be caused by congenital, traumatic, toxic, infectious, inflammatory, neoplastic, metabolic, degenerative, iatrogenic, vascular, etc. One of the most common causes is the infective organisms, which include bacteria, fungi, parasites and viruses. Metabolic causes, give rise to a set of the most common present day diseases, namely diabetes mellitus. As mentioned here, single diseases can occur due to a set of diseases. Thus, coronary artery disease can be due to hypertension, diabetes mellitus and obesity. There are various sets of permutations of the level of contribution, all ultimately lead to CAD. On occasions, complications of a disease can cause greater morbidity than the disease itself.

 

A virus, as mentioned above is an infectious agent, which contributes to the causation and spread of infectious diseases. These are minute agents, only seen by the electron microscope and require another living cell to proliferate and produce other viral particles. This is due to the lack of self replicating machinery or metabolic functions required to proliferate itself. They spread using various methodologies from direct to vector based spread. And these cause and have caused dangerous epidemics and pandemics like Ebola fever, Lassa fever, and more recently Dengue fever, all the influenzas including swine flu. The most famous in the recent past and currently is HIV. One of the problems faced in dealing with viruses is that, some of them, have a tendency to change their genetic material from generation to generation, thus, a proper anti viral agent cannot be produced to kill off that virus. This is the case with HIV/AIDS. There are other uses in biotechnology with the viruses like gene therapy, phage therapy, etc.

What is the difference between Virus and Disease?

Both of these are medically relevant, but are totally opposite at a single point in time. This is because viruses will ultimately lead to all the characteristics of a disease. But all diseases are not caused by viruses, and all viruses will not invariably cause diseases. Some of them are sub clinical and some are immune to the effects of the virus. So the best analogy that would give justice to this topic is the comparison between the hydrogen atom (as a component of water –H2O) and a giant tsunami.

 

https://www.differencebetween.com/difference-between-virus-and-vs-disease/

[Matzzon]

It´s just the hype! I´ll pass......

[robbioff]

On 8/27/2020 at 12:10 PM, GeorgeCross said:

 

 

 

In reply to the OP, I couldn’t agree more. Hysteria it most definitely is! I fear it is being used by this non-elected government to a) control its population and keep them in fear, to try to prevent them from protesting about the failures of themselves (which clearly isn’t working) and b) reduce exponentially the number of foreigners in the Kingdom (which is working well).

 

 

[alyx]

4 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

HIV is contracted by transfer of infected human fluid ie sex or using dirty needles for drugs. Use a condom and don't do injected drugs would stop most of it. Unfortunately babies can contract it in the womb, but if the mother doesn't get it they won't birth an infected baby.

 

It's probably the most easily not contracted disease around, but men will have sex without condoms and addicts will use dirty needles.

Thanks for this (incomplete) information although I am perfectly aware of the means of transmission of this disease.  HIV is transmitted as well through blood contact and blood transfusion. I find your reply and Surelynot's a bit simplistic as it is not only men not wearing condoms, etc... I was pointing out that the fact that they cannot be held solely responsible for being HIV infected for many reasons but that is not the subject of the post so I lay it to rest.

[alyx]

4 hours ago, RJRS1301 said:

How many non sexual transmissions of HIV, very few from needle stick injury, transfusions (almost impossible due to protocols), injecting drug use, very low where clean equipment supplied.  Mother to child transmission low in most countries with effective monitoring and treatment.  Surgical and dental very very low. HepC of course can be a different matter

I have just replied above. You are missing my point: one cannot say that someone infected with HIV is responsible for getting it. Full stop.

"In most countries" does not mean all countries. Ignorance and misinformation lead to mistakes not only whereas HIV infection is concerned. So please do not serve me the "you know what you were doing" as I have heard it from some hospital staff, outside of Europe, when talking to/about patients a few years ago. Hopefully that has changed but the feeling doesn't seem to have died.

[Chassa]

5 hours ago, ukrules said:

Vaccines are coming, it's just a matter of time and it won't be that long either.

Still waiting for the vaccine for Bubonic Plague it's only been around 1000 years ans killed 200 million people.

[davemos]

[Bangkok Barry]

On 8/27/2020 at 2:09 PM, Surelynot said:

 

58 deaths NOW......no one knew in January...this could have been 58,000......hindsight is a wonderful thing. Who knows? Without the prompt action by the Chinese (not Thais) in stopping Chinese visitors coming to Thailand the situation could have been much worse.

It's been reported that the UK could have seen 504,000 deaths if lockdown had not been imposed. And that is with a very impressive health care service. What might the figure have been in Thailand, with a similar population number, with its far less-well financed health care service if the draconian measures hadn't been enforced, I wonder?

[NoshowJones]

On 8/27/2020 at 1:40 PM, GeorgeCross said:

 

 

 

What an excellent question. IMO and I am not medically knowledgeable, but just an opinion, the media, social media and internet have put a lot of fear in people, plus governments all over the world on power trips, Thailand been about the worst, though I would not refer to them as a government with a "PM" who is an unelected soldier.

Edited August 29, 2020 by possum1931

[Bender Rodriguez]

7 minutes ago, Bangkok Barry said:

It's been reported that the UK could have seen 504,000 deaths if lockdown had not been imposed.

that was the serious miscalculation that locked down the whole world, faulty information by a dude that did false calculation before ... hope lesson is learned, probably not as history keeps repeating itself

[chilli42]

On 8/27/2020 at 1:58 PM, Surelynot said:

Contagious nature and the potential for a high death rate amongst older people and those with underlying conditions.

 

Road deaths are not infectious; HIV is, but it would be your own fault if you contracted it; TB infectious, but largely treatable.

 

So you are not really comparing apples with apples.

Well there have been four major pandemics in modern times.  Most were genetic cousins of the present flu. Lots more people died and life went on.  What is different this time that makes authorities want to hide under a rock?  It’s a fair question and I am skeptical it’s out of great concern for “the people”.  

[chilli42]

They are not really scared.  They are just following the WHO decision tree

 

 

[JusticeGB]

5 minutes ago, chilli42 said:

They are not really scared.  They are just following the WHO decision tree

 

 

Now I understand why the Ministry of Tourism is making up rules that appear to allow tourists to come to Thailand but in fact make the hurdles and costs so high that none in fact will come!

[Sumarianson]

The reason for the fear is simple. It is propagated by a spineless news media that is bought and paid for and encouraged not to investigate; A corrupt medical system that puts personal gain before the health of their citizens; A corrupt WHO and CDC  all paid for by the Gates foundation and supported by China and Soros with a goal to decimate countries economies, encourage revolt and war to the point where people agree to any demands they make to put an end to it. Those demands will be a mandatory deadly vaccine that will kill, maime or steralise a huge percentage of the population of the world. A new world government (already in waiting). Tag everyone so we are all servants of the devil. Full control and a massive cull is the price to save you from a virus no wore than a flu. Covid 19 has little or no effect on those with a healthy immune system. In the elderly who may be frail and have compromised immune systems, hydroxycloroquine has been effective. However, the death toll in the worst case scinario would be no worse than the flu and Pneumonia and any number of viruses we have to live with each day. I am sixty one and have been diagnosed with Emphysema, Chronic Bronchitis and Asthma many years ago. I suffer from none of the symptoms I had back then and take none of the many drugs prescribed for those diseases. I have done my own research and found my own resolution to stemming the symptoms and in other instantces stopping them altogether. I now do not take any drugs whatsoever. I however would not want people to have to go around wearing masks and not showing their kind and comforting smiles. Facial reactions are extremely important and our controllers know that.

I would not want people to be curtailed in their travel plans because of restrictive measures or extreme and unnecessary costs in complying with those measures, all for the sake of protecting someone like me from coming in contact with a very mild virus. Don't believe all the numbers the spew out to put you in fear. Know that many banned doctors ( not part of their corrupt system) have said that they were being compelled to state COVID 19 as the cause of death when it most definately was not. Many Virologists including nobel prize winner have said that the virus was constructed ( very cleverly) in a laboratory. Fauci is under indictement and is no longer the advisor to the US President. Gates and his wife have stated publicly that blacks and the indigenous people should be first to get the vaccine ( not whites like them) do you wonder why? Free your minds and watch "Plandemic Indoctrination" on londonreal or Bit Chute to be more broadly informed. Plandemic is also very good and was the first documentary in the series. All statements in the documentary are backed up by facts and not conspiracy.

[scorecard]

On 8/27/2020 at 4:48 PM, RJRS1301 said:

Contagion and easy transmission and lack of intensive care facilities would be among some of the worries

Plus for folks over 60, 65, 70, 75, 80 etc., quite strong and increasing chance of catching the virus (compared generally to much younger folks) and with increasing age increasing possibility patients don't respond and increasing chance of death. And even more so if the patient has other lung complications; recurring bronchitis and similar, and/or had pneumonia in the past. 

Edited August 29, 2020 by scorecard

[spiekerjozef]

Death.

[Thomas J]

15 hours ago, baansgr said:

Oh goody, not had one of these for a long time....maybe there is only 58 deaths because the response they adopted contained the virus...you just imagine if open borders with 3 million visitors a month crammed in buses, clubs and restaurants....that 58 could well be 58,000 and probably a lot more....

BAANSGR that is total conjecture

Here is Sweden who DID NOTHING No quarantines, no lock downs, not stoppage of business, no stoppage of air traffic.  Its covid infection rate is not materially higher than Belgium that had strict lock downs, and IT IS LESS THAN SPAIN that also imposed severe restrictions.  Facts talk, conjecture is a guess.  If the lock downs were effective, the rate in Italy, Spain, France, Belgium, Germany and the UK should have been markedly lower than Sweden THEY ARE NOT. 

 

 

[Flying Saucage]

I mentioned it in other posts before already, but will do it here again.

 

Why are the Thai Covid-19 numbers are so small?

 

1. The official numbers are censored (since around end of February) and manipulated, as all official numbers in Thailand. Seriously, who believes any official Thai number??? To get an idea about the real numbers, check the excess deaths, which were 2400 between mid of March and mid of May, and correct this number by safed lifes due to less traffic deaths during the lookdown, which I estimate to be 3000. So the total deaths caused by Covid in Thailand between mid of March and mid of May alone is likely to be around 5500.

 

2. There are very few tests done per day, less than in other countries.
 

3. The virus is still in active in the country, similar to the other two virus-free countries which are not in the middle of the pacific ocean, namely Turkmenistan and North Korea (do you trust their numbers?)
 

4. Covid deaths in Thailand are diagnosed as pneumonia, heart attack or whatever, instead of Covid

 

And why have neither the hospitals nor the crematories ever been overwhelmed in Thailand, with no scores of dead people on the road?

 

1. Because despite the official numbers are faked and despite the virus is (very very likely) still in the country, Thailand nevertheless performs very well without any doubt!!!
 

2. Because Thailand performs as well as other good performing countries like Germany or Italy (yes, Italy, but I mean today!), with single digit Covid deaths per day now. Neither hospitals nor the crematories are overwhelmed in Europe. There are huge free capacities. Germany's Covid deaths last Thursday: 5! Five!!! At a population of 82 million. Given that Thailand has a population of aout 67 millions, the excess deaths per million between mid of March and mid of May are very similar to Germany.
 

And why did Thailand not experience a similar disaster to other countries like Spain, UK, or Italy (yes, again Italy, but now I mean in March/April)?

Because of the climate and the social behaviour of the Thais: 

1. Due to the climate in Thailand, whenever there is no AC available, the windows are open. The virus concentration in the air therefore always stays low, the contaminated aerosoles leave the room through the windows 

 

2. Whenever there is an AC, this AC reduces for physical reasons the humidity of the air. The humidity, and hence the contaminated exhaled aerosoles of infected people, condensate in the AC, which reduces the virus concentration in the air. I haven't seen and scientific proof yet about this, but it's simply logic and physics.

 

3. A strongly reduced virus concentration in the air might lead to less severe and more asymptotic infections. I think we saw this in Thailand.

 

4. Looking to Europe and China in March/April: It was winter time, the windows were closed, AC - if available at all - was switched-off, old and vulnerable people stayed in closed rooms together. This is differently in Thailand also because the old, vulnerable people normally live in their families and not jammed together with others in nursery homes. A receipe for a disaster in the western world, compared to Thailand. Also in Europe, not knowing anything about the virus yet and not expecting the pandemic to arriving so quickly, people were having carnival parties and apres-ski parties in closed rooms (due to winter time). Italy and Spain where simply overwhelmed by the sheer dynamics of the pandemic at this time.  

 

But the disasters in countries under at dumbheads like Bolosonaro, Trump and Bojo should not be compared with countries under responsible governments in Europe, btw.

 

In the meantime, the doctors and scientists have learned a lot about the virus. They know much better how to treat the infections than before, and they know how the virus is transmitted. The cases will never be as they were in March/April, as governments everywhere and most of the poeple stay alerted and cautious.

 

But it is really time now to relax a little! Indeed today Covid resembles very much a normal flu. Again, look to Italy: 1000 deaths per day in April, around 5 per day now. At a population of 50 million! But these are facts which are not popular in Thailand. Thais need their panic, and Thais love to look down on others and on other countries.

 

 

Edited August 29, 2020 by Flying Saucage

[1FinickyOne]

8 hours ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Yes, it's such a terrible disease one has to have a test to know that one has it.

you mean like cancer, TB, and nearly every other disease? 

 

It shares symptoms w/other conditions.. where are you from? 

[RocketDog]

OP are you asking a question or making a point? 

If it's a question then you need a much wider audience than this forum to find a comprehensive answer. You're wasting your time. 

 

If you're simply making a point then you are duplicating countless such efforts on TVF so this discussion is just worn out. You're wasting my time. Henceforth I will scroll past such posts. 

 

If you are attempt to evince change, again this is the wrong place to try. Very few people in this forum control much of anything beyond their own households, much less have influence over governments. 

[Max69xl]

On 8/27/2020 at 1:55 PM, Thomas J said:

rjrs1301  Again, TB is just as easy if not more so in terms of transmission.  One study said 1 in 5 taxi drivers in Thailand have TB.  Again, why no hysteria over disease transmissions, lack of intensive care facilities etc over those diseases. The common flu infects between 5% and 20% of the worlds population annually.  Though less deadly per million.  It impacts far more people.  

Flu: The World Health Organization estimates that 1 billion people worldwide get the flu every year.  Flu: The World Health Organization estimates that 290,000 to 650,000 people die of flu-related causes every year worldwide.

 

I would say, especially in Thailand, the answer is ignorance. 

[allanos]

The OP asked what are the specific reasons why Thailand and the world is panicked by Covid-19.

 

How about MSM media hype and sensationalism, erroneous predictions on the course the virus will take,

flawed "scientific" modelling, and possibly the worst of all, Fake News, spread on the Internet and

other social media?

 

The model created at Oxford University in the UK predicted 508 000 deaths.  After all of the

panic had set in, the wailing and gnashing of teeth by politicians, the flood of money thrown at

the "pandemic" (the definition of which is seemingly imprecise), the model was shown to be wrong by around a factor of 10x.  Its creator later broke the lockdown rules which were implemented on the

back of the faulty model, and was forced to resign his post!

 

In the past, when were we bombarded with so-called facts and figures from annual deaths

stemming from the common 'flu, or, indeed, other viruses and diseases?  These days, one can

almost quote the numbers of dead in each country from the Chinese virus, verbatim.

 

At the top end of the scale, the 'flu virus kills, perhaps, 700 000 people annually, worldwide.

The Chinese virus, currently perhaps, and if the figures aren't massaged in any way, around

800 000.

 

Compare the trillions of dollars worldwide, under various guises, which has been thrown at the "new" virus, which is actually 78% composed of its previous iteration,  to that which is committed to fighting the common 'flu each year.  You think there may be something wrong here?

 

It is no wonder that the common man thinks that there is a conspiracy at play.  Possibly

suivez l'argent (follow the money)? Are the fingers being pointed at Soros, Gates and Fauci correct, in some way?

 

 

 

 

Edited August 29, 2020 by allanos
typo

[RJRS1301]

4 hours ago, alyx said:

I have just replied above. You are missing my point: one cannot say that someone infected with HIV is responsible for getting it. Full stop.

"In most countries" does not mean all countries. Ignorance and misinformation lead to mistakes not only whereas HIV infection is concerned. So please do not serve me the "you know what you were doing" as I have heard it from some hospital staff, outside of Europe, when talking to/about patients a few years ago. Hopefully that has changed but the feeling doesn't seem to have died.

I did NOT say and never have even vaguely indicated they "are responsible" cease placing incorrect suppositions.

I was replying to your post regarding transmission and infection methods, and it is a transmissible infection not a contagious infection. Please do NOT attribute meanings which are not explicit in my post. End of story.

 

[sead]

The worst thing is that the government doesnt want to lose face. They want to show everyone they are doing the right thing. Now since im from Sweden and we havent wore a mask in 9 months and also everything is as normal as it can be. I can see the reactions from people jailed up in their homes getting poor 9 months.......

Edited August 29, 2020 by sead

[chilly07]

Wuhan flu is highly infectios with no known treatment. All the others have treatments to contain or cure. It has the potential to decimate mankind like Spanish flu with deaths into hundreds of millions. Well done  Thailand for restricting the spread unlike the USA UK and several other European and South American countries.