SURVEY: Will Thailand continue to be a favorable destination for retirees?

[gk10012001]

On 9/5/2021 at 1:02 AM, HAPPYNUFF said:

Started coming here, annually, in 1988, for three month holidays.   Did the bars, did the temples,  wandered  length and breadth of the country.  It was a real wild west then, but  free and easy. No  troubles, providing you behaved yourself and showed  respect.  Came to live here permanently  12 years ago..   Settled down.   Things   have gradually  gone downhill. The people arent as happy and carefree as before,  visa requirements  have gone  through the roof, blatant corruption everywhere, the cost of living   nearly equals  my home country, apart from housing, taxes etc., Im  talking about  those who  purchase farang food, and not live on rabbit food from the markets... I  do feel sorry for the general Thai populace, the working people who  seem to live a hand to mouth existance, but not the slightest empathy for  the government or any employed within it.

I agree with your post.   I started going there in 2004. Made 15 trips since then.  I always planned to semi retire to Thailand.  Prepared for it, invested for it, now made it to the finish line with proper finances, plenty of passive income, etc.  But so much has changed as the poster noted.  The foreign demographics alone are so different now.  I will maintain my USA Medicare which starts next year.  Not good in Thailand of course, but just an example of a carrying cost from my home country.  I always planned on the simple visa with retirement extension using the income method, but the USA embassy stopping income letters put another straw on the camel's back.  All still doable, just more doubts.  If I traveled from Thailand back to the USA for a few months for whatever reason, to keep the extension active I would have to keep transferring $2,000 USD to Thailand even during that away time.

 

  Ignoring all the current COVID restrictions, policies, COE, pre  travel arrangements, pre paying, closures etc. I had already probably changed my plans to just go twice a year, each time getting a 60 day SETV and extending it 30 days, so basically two 90 day stays.   Will see what shakes out next year.  I already decided to take one more contract engineeering job for probably the next 6 months or so while COVID and Thailand hash things out.  I am almost out of gas and motivation to keep working, but it is better to keep doshing up for a little while longer.  So miss Thailand and the ease of Pattaya.  Love the baht bus hop on and off.  Love walking around. So much food of different types from around the world.  Daily foot massages.  Fun nights out.  Buddhist temples are so peaceful.

[Maha Sarakham]

10 minutes ago, gk10012001 said:

I am almost out of gas and motivation to keep working, but it is better to keep doshing up for a little while longer.  So miss Thailand and the ease of Pattaya.  Love the baht bus hop on and off.  Love walking around. So much food of different types from around the world.  Daily foot massages.  Fun nights out.  Buddhist temples are so peaceful.

You're doing the right thing.  Pattaya isn't the same place you remember.  Keep working through this period of global struggle as long as you can.

[fredscats]

osted 9 hours ago

9 hours ago, gk10012001 said:

I am almost out of gas and motivation to keep working, but it is better to keep doshing up for a little while longer.  So miss Thailand and the ease of Pattaya.  Love the baht bus hop on and off.  Love walking around. So much food of different types from around the world.  Daily foot massages.  Fun nights out.  Buddhist temples are so peaceful.

You're doing the right thing.  Pattaya isn't the same place you remember.  Keep working through this period of global struggle as long as you can.

 

All this too...Thailand aint exactly the end of the earth  ,just 12 hours from UK if from there,..its that drip drip drip from pensions that is important,..burn the bridges?  keeping that home back home costs money,a lot of it,like a lead weight  and I do not particulary want to go back there..thats why Im here.    There does come a time tho when the eyes are growing dim,make your mind up time...old folks home,costs money in UK,those houses you own are gone in a flash...let the state take the strain

[John Drake]

17 hours ago, garyk said:

Bottom line is you don't have to pay all the fee's in the US. You just need to manage you money properly and it will fall into place. And not be so lazy. My neighbors think like you do and they spend a fortune on the houses. It is insane.

 

I do not want to spend my time doing home construction and improvements. I may be retired, but I have other things to do. I'm not some doomsday prepper trying to take myself off the grid. So that makes Thailand an enjoyable and efficient alternative for me. There are still far fewer rules and regulations for me to worry about here than there. Not to mention the weather related requirements of the US as opposed to Thailand. No need here to wrap the pipes, winterize the lawn, fertilize the grass in the spring, and then see it all die anyway because you run into another summer drought. 

[garyk]

1 hour ago, John Drake said:

I do not want to spend my time doing home construction and improvements. I may be retired, but I have other things to do. I'm not some doomsday prepper trying to take myself off the grid. So that makes Thailand an enjoyable and efficient alternative for me. There are still far fewer rules and regulations for me to worry about here than there. Not to mention the weather related requirements of the US as opposed to Thailand. No need here to wrap the pipes, winterize the lawn, fertilize the grass in the spring, and then see it all die anyway because you run into another summer drought. 

Hahaha, what is a doomsday prepper?  Trying to take myself off the grid..  Almost spit out my tea.....  

Like another gentleman here has stated it makes me money, plain and simple. I don't mind doing the repairs as long as it is making cash.  

It is a great life.

Thailand is alright, I lived there for years, but when i sell out permanently  and to move to another country it will be one with a permanent retirement visa and land ownership rights. Not a one year extension of stay.   

 

Edited September 7, 2021 by garyk

[HAPPYNUFF]

Gee, Im glad I got in first  on this one...   Read  every   input, agree with some disagree with some, but thats democracy.

As my monicker states, Im happyenough here.  Got  a nice house, a car,  motor cycle,  wifes happy, (providing I keep  the money coming)  Got  two pensions,   got the rice fields,  live  OK    in a small town   away from the rush,,  just miss decent wine,  and too old  to get insurance now, so Ive told the wife, when things go bad,  buy me  a couple of bottles of Irish whisky, prop me up in bed and leave me to it.  There is a lot more  a person could comment on, but really, its up to oneself to be happy, or not.   Like many others here, Ive  had a few disasters, lost  a lot of money to  a  first bitch of a wife, but move on, stay positive. just ignore the doomsayers.    As   has been stated before, lifes like a bunch of roses, just  avoid the pricks.

[JonnyF]

Covid19 has shown beyond doubt the corruption and discriminatory practices in the Thai healthcare system. Whenever a statement is made about Covid it is always that "every Thai person" will get this or that, not simply every person.  So many reports on here of foreigners getting turned away at vaccination centres because it's for "Thai only". You can't even buy it for yourself because the Thai government refused to allow private hospitals to procure it until the queues to buy it were many months long. They wanted to control the purchase, and we all know why when you see the prices they paid.

 

Not many elderly foreigners would feel particularly welcome to retire in such a place. We never know when the next pandemic will be upon us, but what we DO know is that if/when it comes the government will once again use it to enrich themselves at the expense of the populace. Even worse, foreigners will be once again be placed at the back of the queue for vaccines, no matter how many "Elite" visas they have, how many millions they have sunk into condos, how many years they have supported their Thai wife, children and family.

 

In my opinion, post Covid many future retirees will consider places within Europe because it's more stable and closer to home if things once again go all Pete Tong. The beaches/air are cleaner, the wine flows cheaply and freely, you don't hear the word Farang 10 times a day, less scams, less corruption and most importantly they will have access to healthcare as an equal within that country. 

 

Edit; they can buy land as well, unlike here.

Edited September 7, 2021 by JonnyF

[GinBoy2]

I was just thinking about this a little more.

 

In my life I've lived in 8 countries either because of work or just by choice.

 

But now I'm kinda done. I like being home, things I know and the stability which as we all do, I approach the final chapter. Travel is great, but I always know I have homebase to return to.

 

So I think there may be two stages to that 'retirement' phase.

 

The first maybe the fun phase, but you then rapidly run into the reality phase.

 

That latter phase is the one that really needs to focus the mind

[tsigane]

12 hours ago, JonnyF said:

 

In my opinion, post Covid many future retirees will consider places within Europe because it's more stable and closer to home if things once again go all Pete Tong. The beaches/air are cleaner, the wine flows cheaply and freely, you don't hear the word Farang 10 times a day, less scams, less corruption and most importantly they will have access to healthcare as an equal within that country. 

 

So well said.  Tons of places in the world where one can get many things Farangs in Thailand can only dream of. 

 

Over the 13 years that I spent in Thailand, I've seen steady trend in

• decrease of "bang for the buck" index of everything, from hotel rooms to food and entertainment;
• increase in experiencing scams and bad attitude every time I refuse to throw money at sellers/service providers, and
• tightening of requirements for legal stay in Thailand.

The biggest mistake was buying a place there and taking money into Thailand.  I could never, ever, recommend someone to retire in Thailand.  Visiting or going back for a few months a year may be ok, but never plan on living there permanently.

[Odysseus123]

I guess that the men will always follow the availability of the women/sexual partners and Thailand has always done rather well with that strategy.Whether it remains the same post-Covid is anyone's guess but I assume that after a slow start all the escapees from their home countries will be rarin' to go.

What happens to them after that only time (and ThaiVisa) will tell...????

[GinBoy2]

22 minutes ago, Odysseus123 said:

I guess that the men will always follow the availability of the women/sexual partners and Thailand has always done rather well with that strategy.Whether it remains the same post-Covid is anyone's guess but I assume that after a slow start all the escapees from their home countries will be rarin' to go.

What happens to them after that only time (and ThaiVisa) will tell...????

Well, men will always be horn dogs, that ain;t gonna change.

 

Now I've always specuted the percentage of horn dogs to the general tourist population.

 

I suspect it's actually quite small, which doesn't bode well for the likes of Pattaya.

 

So if and when Thailand opens up the horn dogs may well return, but whether or not the maidens of Issan return to service said horn dogs is an open question

 

 

[Saddic]

When I was making my initial investigations into retiring in Thailand...

 

... I wanted a central hub for travel, affordable healthcare, accepting and easy access to both western and asian goods and services, etc etc

 

As has been state above... since the coup... most of this has gone to snit...  Having been trapped in Thailand for a large portion of the covid mishandling, the blinders are well and truly off...

 

While Thailand was (and if you follow the travel industry) WAS a targeted central travel hub... This has changed and Thailand as a central regional hub for the major and local airlines has gone up in smoke...  (and this was happening well before covid)...

 

Affordable health care, well, yes and no...  I think covid has pretty much stripped away the facade of the Thai medical industry/medical tourism/etc...  and exposed it as all the flaws/greed/shortcomings etc of any other Thai run industry..  covid was a stress test, and it mostly failed.

 

Goods and services..  I noticed that the xenophobia of the Thai gov and businesses in general pretty much had a good internal supply line, during covid there weren't a lot of shortages or disruptions... that was until the Thai gov stuck their foot in it and disrupted the supply lines and ability for the Thai industries to do their jobs...  As far as for foreign goods, well the huge import taxes pretty much make them unaffordable, if not unavailable...  this was before covid, now even more so...

 

Part 2 of the goods and services discussion is the ability to innovate, change and adapt...  This is pretty much were Thailand falls flat on it's face...  Thai's don't like to change, especially if it's not originated in Thailand by Thai's...  nuff said...

 

Will some common sense prevail in the future, and give these cornerstones a chance to recover... I doubt this very much...  Covid and the gov appear to have made the xenophobia and anti-Thai attitudes even firmely more entrenched...  Without an overhaul in gov and business attitudes towards making money from fair trade, instead of Thai superiority and face... it's just going to be more of the same...

 

 

Edited September 7, 2021 by Saddic

[meechai]

3 hours ago, Odysseus123 said:

I guess that the men will always follow the availability of the women/sexual partners and Thailand has always done rather well with that strategy.

One thing that always makes me laugh is the ones that love Thailand for the sex & always talk about how badly they were treated in their home country during divorce etc

Not once do they realize their little heads got them into that marriage the same as it now has gotten them halfway around the world to have sex & into a country with even less rights & after that same little head gets them again into trouble 555

[meechai]

11 hours ago, GinBoy2 said:

In my life I've lived in 8 countries either because of work or just by choice.

 

But now I'm kinda done. I like being home, things I know and the stability which as we all do, I approach the final chapter. Travel is great, but I always know I have homebase to return to.

 

So I think there may be two stages to that 'retirement' phase.

 

^^^This^^^ Exactly

Like baseball home should always be someplace you can slide into & be SAFE!

Something you can never have in a  Junta fueled country where you are a transitory guest at best & merely tolerated

 

Goalposts can & do get moved for any reason

Look at Malaysia's second home program & recent changes to that which caught so many off guard as they thought it could never happen that quickly

 

[meechai]

17 hours ago, JonnyF said:

Covid19 has shown beyond doubt the corruption and discriminatory practices in the Thai healthcare system. Whenever a statement is made about Covid it is always that "every Thai person" will get this or that, not simply every person.  So many reports on here of foreigners getting turned away at vaccination centres because it's for "Thai only".

Yes & this lays waste to many other preconceived notions

I always smiled when foreigners worried about the Bank insurance or dropping to one million baht coverage etc

 

Perhaps now they realize that if/when a bank collapse happens in Thailand what insurance will be worth to foreigners lining up to get

repaid & where in that loooong line they would be standing

 

 

[Odysseus123]

5 hours ago, GinBoy2 said:

Well, men will always be horn dogs, that ain;t gonna change.

Ha ha-love the term.

 

I can just imagine this scene..

The IO eyeing the aging Expat up and down,noting the wife covered in gold,the Fortuner,the four Isaan kids....

 

and saying "You have missed your 90 day report..you aintn't nothin' but a horndog!"

[John Drake]

4 hours ago, meechai said:

Look at Malaysia's second home program & recent changes to that which caught so many off guard as they thought it could never happen that quickly

That was due to the particularities of recent Malaysian history. The second home program was being flooded with mainland Chinese, and this started to worry people. Chinese and Malay tensions are still very strong.  The communist guerillas during the Malayan Emergency were mainly Chinese. And a lot of the leadership was either deported or fled to the PRC, such as Chin Peng. The three rival ethnic groups in that country do not like each other. Upsetting the balance in terms of numbers that favored the Chinese and their economic clout was bound to cause trouble. Thailand doesn't have anything similar to that situation.  The Chinese already own everything here.

[SpaceKadet]

I think that Thailand had it's time. And it's over now. Unless, of course, you have bonds to the country, like family or business investment.

 

It has become increasingly more expensive, and I often wonder how the locals, on their very low salaries, can survive. This is beside the current Covid issues. For the six years that I have been here permanently, I have seen the cost of food in the markets rise by estimated 20%. Certainly the fuel has gone up much more. Alcohol prices, and I'm talking here quality wines, top shelf spirits and imported beers, are much more expensive than in EU. Granted, some of this is baht exchange rate manipulations, but the increase in taxes that hits us every couple of years doesn't help.

 

The only thing that still makes Thailand on the list are the rather beautiful and easy women, even for the older retiree folks. And the security in the country, which, despite all what happens, beats the closes retiree neighbor, the Philippines. Please don't even bother to mention Laos, Cambodia or Vietnam. They are way below Thailand.

 

If I had to chose now, and didn't have a Thai family binding, I would go for Portugal or Croatia. Both in the EU, have great climate, very civilized, access to healthcare for EU citizens, and cheaper than the rest of Europe. In fact, from Croatia I could get in my car and be in my home country in less than 20 hours, if need be.

Edited September 8, 2021 by SpaceKadet
correct typos

[meechai]

18 hours ago, John Drake said:

That was due to the particularities of recent Malaysian history. The second home program was being flooded with mainland Chinese, and this started to worry people.

The cause is irrelevant to the thousands who invested in a 2nd Malaysian home program. Who now have the $$$ requirements raised to insane new heights without warming without recourse...Pay or get out period

 

[sdweller]

As usual, much cynicism from much the same group of people. The reality is that Thailand will continue to be one of the places people want to retire to, as the country still has the things retirees want. Is it perfect, of course not. And you would think, from listening to this same old group of grumps, that Thailand is the only country in the world that Covid screwed up.  Silly.  Once the world adjusts to Covid as the new normal, Thailand will be back to being Thailand... a special place. For those that disagree, please feel free to let the rest of us in on all those "perfect" places to retire to instead of Thailand, I'd love to hear about them! 

[HeijoshinCool]

SURVEY: Will Thailand continue to be a favorable destination for retirees?

 

"Continue to be.....?"