richard_smith237 Posted January 11, 2022 Share Posted January 11, 2022 A few days ago it was a grandma with her grand daughter on a samlor - Hit by a pickup at 3am. Deaths involved. Driver fled the scene. A couple of days ago it was 3 boys - hitting pickup which was making a turn, at night time. Deaths involved. Driver didn’t sleep the scene. Today its grand parents and 3 children - hit by a pickup Deaths involve. Driver fled the scene. All this utter carelessness on the roads. Were the rear lights of the motorcycle working ? - that would be a fair assumption with the vehicles that were hit from behind. Was the driver of the pick-up drink ?? - that would be a fair assumption in the two cases were the driver fled. Were any helmets worn by any of the victims ? - that may have made the difference. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post richard_smith237 Posted January 11, 2022 Popular Post Share Posted January 11, 2022 1 hour ago, Lite Beer said: Yet more "responsible" adults who think nothing of putting their kids/grand kids lives at risk. Some people should not be allowed to have children. This has been discussed at length. Use of a motorcycle as a family vehicle is the norm here and stems from socio-economic necessity - families simply cannot afford cars and the baht-busses don’t run everywhere or at all times. For many there is no alternative. IMO the main issues are the way people ride and drive without any ’self awareness’. We see delivery vehicles flashing their lights and screaming through junctions. We see motorcycles pottering down the middle of the left lane without any rear lights but of the assumption they are safe because they are going slowly. We see kids on motorcycles ’racing’ down the roads at night. Hardly anyone outside of the major cities wears a helmet. So many people are drunk driving and the enforcement of such is absent. --------- I’m sympathetic to families who can’t afford a car but still need to get around. I become less sympathetic when they don’t wear helmets or ensure the lights on their vehicles are working. I am utterly intolerant of those drink driving and abhor the police who act only with hypocrisy regarding such matters, enabling the continued drink driving culture only to come down with puritanical sanctimony when raiding restaurants because they’ve served a beer after 9pm. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IvorBiggun2 Posted January 11, 2022 Share Posted January 11, 2022 2 hours ago, sanuk711 said: That's true, with 5 on the bike the back light (if it had one ) was sure to be covered. If the back light wasn't working before the accident then it certainly wasn't post accident. We'll never know if it was working. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post giddyup Posted January 11, 2022 Popular Post Share Posted January 11, 2022 1 hour ago, Lite Beer said: Yet more "responsible" adults who think nothing of putting their kids/grand kids lives at risk. Some people should not be allowed to have children. When the motorbike is the only means of family transport people have no choice but to pile everybody on. Doesn't mean they don't love their children. 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IvorBiggun2 Posted January 11, 2022 Share Posted January 11, 2022 1 hour ago, robblok said: You cannot escapre reality. But yes so many on a bike is not a responsible thing to do. However its a bit harsh judging those who have less money. You can't be sure the folks on the motorcycle have less money than the car owner. We have 2 cars but my missus still likes her motorcycle. She's not poor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IvorBiggun2 Posted January 11, 2022 Share Posted January 11, 2022 18 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said: For many there is no alternative. You can walk. You can cycle. You can ask someone for a lift. There's always an alternative. If Thais could drive to the toilet on a motorcycle they would. What did they use before motorcycles? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richard_smith237 Posted January 11, 2022 Share Posted January 11, 2022 7 minutes ago, IvorBiggun2 said: 28 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said: For many there is no alternative. You can walk. You can cycle. You can ask someone for a lift. There's always an alternative. If Thais could drive to the toilet on a motorcycle they would. What did they use before motorcycles? This response ignores the realities of every day life of the last 50 years - everyone has a motorcycle.... It cannot be expected that walking, cycling etc is a viable alternative, you may as well suggest they ride the buffalo down the road..... Additionally - would riding a bicycle or walking down a road be any safer when a drunk in a pickup isn’t watching where he is going ? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richard_smith237 Posted January 11, 2022 Share Posted January 11, 2022 27 minutes ago, IvorBiggun2 said: 2 hours ago, sanuk711 said: That's true, with 5 on the bike the back light (if it had one ) was sure to be covered. If the back light wasn't working before the accident then it certainly wasn't post accident. We'll never know if it was working. And therein lies the importance of a dash-cam (for all of us who drive)... though in this case I suspect any dash-cam evidence may be rather self-incriminatory with the exception of perhaps higllgting the motorcycle did not (or may not have) had functioning rear lights. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IvorBiggun2 Posted January 11, 2022 Share Posted January 11, 2022 (edited) 8 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said: It cannot be expected that walking, cycling etc is a viable alternative, you may as well suggest they ride the buffalo down the road..... Which is safer in Thailand? Walking, cycling, riding a buffalo or riding a overloaded motorcycle that may be not fit for the road with 5 people on it? I know the one I wouldn't select Edited January 11, 2022 by IvorBiggun2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
prakhonchai nick Posted January 11, 2022 Share Posted January 11, 2022 1 hour ago, Henryford said: OK that bad but if you can't afford a car, which many can't, what are you supposed to do? Leave the kids at home. Did Grand-dad have a licence? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post giddyup Posted January 11, 2022 Popular Post Share Posted January 11, 2022 2 minutes ago, prakhonchai nick said: Leave the kids at home. Then you'd complain that the kids are left unsupervised. 2 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post prakhonchai nick Posted January 11, 2022 Popular Post Share Posted January 11, 2022 Pointless expressing any opinion on TV. 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post richard_smith237 Posted January 11, 2022 Popular Post Share Posted January 11, 2022 5 minutes ago, IvorBiggun2 said: 12 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said: It cannot be expected that walking, cycling etc is a viable alternative, you may as well suggest they ride the buffalo down the road..... Which is safer in Thailand? Walking, cycling, riding a buffalo or riding a overloaded motorcycle that may be not fit for the road with 5 people on it? I know the one I wouldn't select Without transport, how would you take 3 kids where they needed to be more than a few KM away. Walk on the side of the road at night which as no sidewalk / pavement ? Cycle on the road ??? thats got to be more dangerous. The only ’safe’ option is not to travel at all, especially at night, or waiting until the following day, take a baht-bus etc... but we don’t know the specifics of why they were travelling. It could be argued that riding a motorcycle is the safer option..... Its somewhat of a moot and sanctimonious discussion. The motorcycle is the mode of transport of choice for families through the nation and that won’t change. It is of course less safe than a car.... but walking distances are not an option and neither is riding a bicycle (or a buffalo). When passing judgment from the seat of sanctimony we really should not be forgetting the realities of life in a developing nation such as Thailand. 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IvorBiggun2 Posted January 11, 2022 Share Posted January 11, 2022 5 minutes ago, prakhonchai nick said: Pointless expressing any opinion on TV. Why you posting then? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richard_smith237 Posted January 11, 2022 Share Posted January 11, 2022 11 minutes ago, prakhonchai nick said: Leave the kids at home. Did Grand-dad have a licence? What is the relevance of a licence ???? Would having a licence have prevented a pickup from hitting them all on the motorcycle ??? Leave the kids at home? would posters such as yourself not them argue that the kids were left unsupervised ? Obviously in many cases there are alternatives, i.e. not travelling 5 up on a motorcycle at all. But is that a realistic alternative for a family when everyone around them and the whole of Thailand has being doing just that for over 5 years already ????? The motorcycle is the form of family transport for the vast majority..... its risky, the issue is a potentially drunk driver who fled the scene... If the pick-up driver had hit the family while they were walking on the side of the road would the discussion then be asking if the Grandparents should have not stayed at home with the kids ? - where is that line ? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IvorBiggun2 Posted January 11, 2022 Share Posted January 11, 2022 1 minute ago, richard_smith237 said: The only ’safe’ option is not to travel at all That is your safest option. Along with don't go out on Thai roads after dark. There's always another option. Unfortunately it's the Thai way and usually that's the wrong way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post jvs Posted January 11, 2022 Popular Post Share Posted January 11, 2022 I blame half of those accidents at night on the dark film on the window,if your windshield is not 100% clean or it is raining just a little bit or there are no street lights ,you just can not see clearly! Combined maybe with a few drinks or not paying attention the results are often deadly. Imo the moment a driver flees the scene he/she/it is guilty! Blaming the victims seems to be a favorite past time of certain posters here,it must be nice to be a superior being. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IvorBiggun2 Posted January 11, 2022 Share Posted January 11, 2022 2 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said: Obviously in many cases there are alternatives, i.e. not travelling 5 up on a motorcycle at all. But is that a realistic alternative for a family when everyone around them and the whole of Thailand has being doing just that for over 5 years already ????? Just cuz everyone else does it doesn't make it right. Common sense tells you that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richard_smith237 Posted January 11, 2022 Share Posted January 11, 2022 4 minutes ago, IvorBiggun2 said: 10 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said: The only ’safe’ option is not to travel at all That is your safest option. Along with don't go out on Thai roads after dark. There's always another option. Unfortunately it's the Thai way and usually that's the wrong way. Thats a bit harsh..... You would be right to argue from the technicality that there is always another option if ‘No option’ (i.e. not travelling) is the ‘other option’..... but it's not realistic. Thailand does have a fare more Laissez-faire attitude towards road safety which is echoed by society in general - it is perhaps this which leads to the elevated levels of risk such as riding poorly, too slowly in the middle of the lane without lights etc driving while drunk etc... However, when it comes to a family riding on a motorbike - I don’t see any realistic alternatives. Its the same issue as cramming 30 schools kids in a baht bus..... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richard_smith237 Posted January 11, 2022 Share Posted January 11, 2022 8 minutes ago, IvorBiggun2 said: 13 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said: Obviously in many cases there are alternatives, i.e. not travelling 5 up on a motorcycle at all. But is that a realistic alternative for a family when everyone around them and the whole of Thailand has being doing just that for over 5 years already ????? Just cuz everyone else does it doesn't make it right. Common sense tells you that. Thats somewhat of an elevated ‘ivory tower’ view...... The whole nation uses motorcycles as a form of family transport..... Would you have the government stop families using motorcycles as a form of Transport ??? As a society Thailand is not socio-economically advanced enough for that. The key issue is one which has been overpowered by the motorcycle safety aspect and that is the way people drive and ride...... i.e. drunks driving, people driving too fast, carelessly, not paying attention, not indicting, people also riding very poorly etc.... One of the key facets of all these accidents is usually booze / night time / Poor driver-rider education......... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IvorBiggun2 Posted January 11, 2022 Share Posted January 11, 2022 (edited) 11 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said: Its the same issue as cramming 30 schools kids in a baht bus..... And that is against the law but we're getting posters on here who side with the grandparents who caused these unwarranted death/injuries with breaking the laws. I suppose they're going to side with the minibus driver when 30 children get killed? Edited January 11, 2022 by IvorBiggun2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
richard_smith237 Posted January 11, 2022 Share Posted January 11, 2022 1 hour ago, IvorBiggun2 said: And that is against the law but we're getting posters on here who side with the grandparents who caused these unwarranted death/injuries with breaking the laws. I suppose they're going to side with the minibus driver when 30 children get killed? But thats a somewhat ‘black vs white’ view point.... The realities of living in a developed nation involve primarily ‘grey area’ its up to each and everyone of us how white and how dark we want that grey area to be for ourselves.... Sosome of us ride a motorcycle and live in a darker grey area, others wear flipflops and a crappy helmet, whereas others were a full face Shoei and riding gear. Others will only travel by car preferring to live in a whiter grey area while accepting that it is still more risky than our home nations. Thais are not as fortunate, they have far less choice through economics and through poor government controls... i.e. local government does not put on school busses etc - just crams kids in to a baht-bus (Songthaew) or tolerates kids riding motorcycles to school.... Thailand authorities also ‘allow’ multiple riders / families on bikes because they know there is little alternative. Thus: When a motorcycle is wiped out by a drunk in a pickup, or a baht-bus full of school kids is taken out by a poorly maintained lorry with brake failure and a dabba’d up driver..... who do we blame ? Perhaps the tolerance of society for widely accepting such risks, or is the poor enforcement of DUI etc... Should we blame gramps for doing something he’s done all is is life, or the baht bus driver for providing a service ???? - I’m not so sure... Its definitely an imperfect system - when something does go wrong and tragedy strikes its usually because of a far greater flaw in the system - lack of policing of major issues (drunks / yabba’d lorry drivers / poorly maintained vehicles etc) - then we ask.... Did gramps have a licence ?? - thats kind of missing the issue. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deli Posted January 11, 2022 Share Posted January 11, 2022 That's called a strike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chelseafan Posted January 11, 2022 Share Posted January 11, 2022 3 hours ago, cardinalblue said: Why is this sad? This is thailand….you have drivers constantly speeding with no spatial awareness combined with sticking 5 people on a Honda wave….Both are selfish acts stupidity has consequences….so be it You also have motorbikes with no rear lights... 60 baht for a bulb. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vandeventer Posted January 11, 2022 Share Posted January 11, 2022 6 hours ago, Geoffggi said: All of the above is true but lets also not forget that 5 on a bike is also a little OTT ................. I have have seen 6 all young kids under aged on a new bike. Now if the parents don't care who does? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IvorBiggun2 Posted January 11, 2022 Share Posted January 11, 2022 1 hour ago, richard_smith237 said: Should we blame gramps for doing something he’s done all is is life, or the baht bus driver for providing a service ???? - I’m not so sure... Just cuz 'gramps' got away with it in the past doesn't make it right for him to carry on doing it in the future. And that's why he carried on doing it. Nobody was stopping him. The police force in this country really need a bomb sticking up their asses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hotchilli Posted January 11, 2022 Share Posted January 11, 2022 8 hours ago, webfact said: The driver of the pick-up had fled the scene and is being sought. Manslaughter charge pending. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Road Warrior Posted January 11, 2022 Share Posted January 11, 2022 sad. RIP. for those who died . did due to thai idiot driver .and he fled away .unbelievable !!!!! 5 on a motor cycle designed for 2 max !!! only in Thailand .IQ 1/10 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IvorBiggun2 Posted January 11, 2022 Share Posted January 11, 2022 (edited) A story from about 2 and a half years ago show how bad things here are. Quote BANGKOK — The Thai woman was riding on a motorcycle on her way to work when a pickup truck sideswiped her on a rural stretch of asphalt in northeastern Thailand. The truck’s driver was an off-duty police officer. He was drunk. Orathai Chanhom, the motorcyclist, was catapulted off her bike and killed almost instantly in the crash. The officer who struck her still has his police job. His driver’s license was not taken away. A court declined to sentence him to prison. Edited January 11, 2022 by IvorBiggun2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dont confuse me Posted January 11, 2022 Share Posted January 11, 2022 It's a poor country people simply do not have the ability to buy a car particularly older people! Whilst I obviously cannot condone 5 on a motorcycle, it may well have been the case that the grandparents wanted to 'treat' their grandchildren. Not an ideal situation and I seriously doubt if anyone was in possession of a current driving license or insurance, or indeed wearing helmets, but as I said there are a lot of poor people who simply cannot afford the things we take for granted. The driver of the pick-up hasn't done anything unexpected, a 7 Yr girl in my wife's village was struck and killed by a hit and run driver whilst waiting for school bus, he was never traced. Won't be the last case we hear of this year! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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