Vote for the UK government to index link pensions in Thailand

[transam]

2 minutes ago, Golden Triangle said:

Yes, I did read from somewhere a while ago that if you go into hospital and stay for however long then they will stop your pension for that duration, it looks to me as though the state pension rules & regulations are in dire need of a modern day update.

It's because it is a benefit, not like a job private pension...

[Golden Triangle]

Just now, transam said:

It's because it is a benefit, not like a job private pension...

Most people, the honest ones, literally paid for their pension whilst working for 40 odd years, how they can class it as a benefit is beyond me.

[transam]

3 minutes ago, Golden Triangle said:

Most people, the honest ones, literally paid for their pension whilst working for 40 odd years, how they can class it as a benefit is beyond me.

I think the word/meaning is, so they have you by the balls when they want to change something to claw back money, a bit like them doing away with a pension top-up for having a wife, that started in 2010, all those who were receiving it, lost it in 2020. ????

[elwood]

27 minutes ago, transam said:

I think the word/meaning is, so they have you by the balls when they want to change something to claw back money, a bit like them doing away with a pension top-up for having a wife, that started in 2010, all those who were receiving it, lost it in 2020. ????

Yes, I was one of the losers.

Pension rules were that my initial pension rate was frozen until death, which is bad enough, but the bureaucratic bastards decided they could  de-frost it long enough to swipe the allowance!

[Baht Simpson]

6 hours ago, HauptmannUK said:

*Pension payments to expats represent a loss to the UK economy. He was quoting £6bn a year loss to UK at that time.*

That's hogwash. Maybe expats below pensionable age who don't pay tax or the rich who avoid tax but not state pensioners who have paid full tax all their working lives. He's just using the figure that's rightly paid to fully-entitled pensioners and quoting a rightful cost as a loss. They do this with the NHS too. 

 

If you think about it there must be a net benefit to expats not claiming NHS or other social benefits, especially the older you get. 

 

If all the expat pensioners went back tomorrow and claimed benefits it would be a tidy sum they would have to find.

 

 

 

 

6 hours ago, HauptmannUK said:

 

 

[Baht Simpson]

7 hours ago, bert bloggs said:

Its very unfair if you paid in all those years not to get the rises,but if you ever see pictures of retiries in the papers ,its always a " young looking" couple running on the beach  far from the truth for most 

Yes, "Golden Years" syndrome. ????

[Will B Good]

7 hours ago, bert bloggs said:

Its very unfair if you paid in all those years not to get the rises,

....and still have to pay UK taxes on your pensions and other incomes.......absolute swizz.

[Baht Simpson]

To whom it may concern:

From the State Pension claim form.

 

"Part 11 Declaration I understand that I must promptly tell the Department for Work and Pensions, by phone or in writing, of anything that may affect my entitlement to, or the amount of, my State Pension.

 

I declare that the information I have given on this form is correct and complete as far as I know and believe.

 

I understand that if I knowingly give false information, I may be liable to prosecution or other action.

 

I understand that if I fail to promptly notify the Department of a change in circumstances, I may be liable to prosecution or other action. This is my claim for State Pension."

 

"Other action" will certainly include paying back taxes and a fine. They'll get hotter on this as they get more desperate to claw back more funds. 

 

It's only a matter of time before it's "only fair" that they do away with state pension for expats entirely.

[fredscats]

1 hour ago, transam said:

I know of a couple that got caught, one it cost him a 1000 quid fine.

A friend of mine fiddles it, he said if I get caught I have a house in the UK to sell, the funny thing is, he has a passport full of Thai retirement visa's..????..

 

 

 

Care to elaborate on the "1000 quid fines"?  If I remember it was nothing to do with OAP, if you could confirm  think Ill look it up anyway,.....and so what with  passport full of Thai visas?,lose it  LOL

[Baht Simpson]

12 hours ago, Mike Teavee said:

Sorry to disappoint, but your State Pension as a maximum will be below £10,000 but this at least means you won't have to pay tax on it.

State Pension is always put onto the "List" 1st so you should never be taxed on it but there may be tax to pay if you have any additional income which takes you above your PTA + additional tax reliefs... e.g..

• Any rental Income from property will be added to your State Pension & taxed if you go above the PTA threshold (NB If you've not filled a Non-Resident Landlord form (NR1?) the tax will be withheld by the agent so you're more likely to get a refund & will only pay additional tax if your total income-allowances takes you into a higher tax bracket). 
• More than £1,000 in Interest from bank accounts
• more than £2000 in Dividend income - You may not need to pay this if you're non-resident for tax purposes (https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/non-residents-and-investment-income-hs300-self-assessment-helpsheet/hs300-non-residents-and-investment-income-2019) - NB The Dividend voucher will show a "Tax Withheld" amount but this is for the company, not you & cannot be reclaimed even if you don't go above your personal limit 

Each year you will need to file a Self Assessment form to pay (or claim) back tax, this is relatively easy to do online but I use an accountant (£240 per year) as they stay on top of all of the tax changes + ensure I claim any allowances that are due to me (e.g. you can claim a certain percentage of rental income for "Wear & Tear" of furniture in the property, something I never would have known about).

  

Thanks Mike. I have private pensions that put me above the allowance. These appear on my  HMRC account. I didn't realise that the State Pension takes preference.  I suppose the State Pension will appear on there too once I start receiving it.

 

My finances are quite simple so I shall file an assessment online. I hope that's possible and not like the claim form that expats can only do by post.

[Baht Simpson]

4 minutes ago, fredscats said:

Care to elaborate on the " fines"?  If I remember it was nothing to do with OAP, if you could confirm  think Ill look it up anyway,.....and so what with  passport full of Thai visas?,lose it  LOL

Filing your tax self-assessment form late is a fine of up to 1000 pounds so I imagine this something similar. 

[fredscats]

10 minutes ago, Baht Simpson said:

To whom it may concern:

From the State Pension claim form.

 

"Part 11 Declaration I understand that I must promptly tell the Department for Work and Pensions, by phone or in writing, of anything that may affect my entitlement to, or the amount of, my State Pension.

 

I declare that the information I have given on this form is correct and complete as far as I know and believe.

 

I understand that if I knowingly give false information, I may be liable to prosecution or other action.

 

I understand that if I fail to promptly notify the Department of a change in circumstances, I may be liable to prosecution or other action. This is my claim for State Pension."

 

"Other action" will certainly include paying back taxes and a fine. They'll get hotter on this as they get more desperate to claw back more funds. 

 

It's only a matter of time before it's "only fair" that they do away with state pension for expats entirely.

The fact you 'failed " to declare is not punishable in itself,its what it may lead to   .  fortunately?unfortunately  those are written in DWP regulations ,No fines/no punishment/no clawbacks/no suspension( other than Proof of Life) until received   Read regulations   Sort of a catch 22 situation

[fredscats]

1 minute ago, Baht Simpson said:

Filing your tax self-assessment form late is a fine of up to 1000 pounds so I imagine this something similar. 

Well could be

[Baht Simpson]

7 minutes ago, fredscats said:

The fact you 'failed " to declare is not punishable in itself,its what it may lead to   .  fortunately?unfortunately  those are written in DWP regulations ,No fines/no punishment/no clawbacks/no suspension( other than Proof of Life) until received   Read regulations   Sort of a catch 22 situation

As long as you're aware, up to you.

[fredscats]

8 minutes ago, Baht Simpson said:

As long as your'e aware, up to you.

Does state (DWP regulations)  OAP is amongst small list of non-punishable items,it is regarded as a disqualifying benefit,something else that could be touched instead  ,but defiantly not OAP

 

Would be good if others could read up on DWP regulations,its not endless,nobody has ever been punished for supposedly acting against OAP

  It all comes down to jealousy actually 

[BritManToo]

2 hours ago, Baht Simpson said:

Thanks Mike. I have private pensions that put me above the allowance. These appear on my  HMRC account. I didn't realise that the State Pension takes preference.  I suppose the State Pension will appear on there too once I start receiving it.

 

My finances are quite simple so I shall file an assessment online. I hope that's possible and not like the claim form that expats can only do by post.

There's nothing for you to file.

You get an email telling you your tax code is changed, and your new tax code = your personal allowance - your state pension. The new and reduced tax code is used for your other incomes/pensions. Nothing gets deducted from your state pension.

 

If your personal allowance is 12,000 GBP, and your state pension is 9,000 GBP, your tax code becomes 3,000 GBP.

 

No need for you to even think.

 

[BritManToo]

2 hours ago, Baht Simpson said:

Filing your tax self-assessment form late is a fine of up to 1000 pounds so I imagine this something similar. 

Never had one, never completed one, all my income tax, NI, state pension is done online through my Gateway account. You guys gotta move to the modern digital online age, not post bits of paper back and forth.

[Mike Teavee]

14 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

Never had one, never completed one, all my income tax, NI, state pension is done online through my Gateway account. You guys gotta move to the modern digital online age, not post bits of paper back and forth.

You're lucky if you've never had to file a Tax Return, especially as you were earning in the higher rate tax bracket... Have you really never received any additional income over your salary (e.g. Dividends or even income from a Bank Account) that would have needed declaring/extra tax paying? 

 

I've had to do Tax Returns since I was 19 & put it down to a bad break-up with a girl who's mum was a Tax Inspector... Have had to file one every year since, 36 & counting ????.

 

 

[Baht Simpson]

28 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

There's nothing for you to file.

You get an email telling you your tax code is changed, and your new tax code = your personal allowance - your state pension. The new and reduced tax code is used for your other incomes/pensions. Nothing gets deducted from your state pension.

 

If your personal allowance is 12,000 GBP, and your state pension is 9,000 GBP, your tax code becomes 3,000 GBP.

 

No need for you to even think.

 

I do use the Gov Gateway online and my current private pensions appear there with my current tax  code. I guess they'll add the State Pension once its paid and I'll get an amended code.  I'll look out for it. Thanks BritmanToo

[pj123]

On 4/16/2022 at 8:48 AM, Will B Good said:

Very kind to explain......but how does this tally with the stated UK state pension max currently being £175.20 pw?.......am I missing something (don't be rude...555)

I was thinking the same. Maybe thats how the UK system works. 

[jacko45k]

22 hours ago, Red Forever said:

Which political party are you leader of this week Nigel?

Do shut up.... I live in Thailand away from all that UK nonsense.... thankfully. 

[jacko45k]

21 hours ago, sammieuk1 said:

I had a similar view to yours until I got up close and personal to the benefits system very recently its not like something from a Sun headline anymore ????  

I still see that foreigners landing in the UK have immediate access to benefits and statements like In 2020/21 the UK government is expected to spend approximately 212 billion British pounds on benefits, an increase of over 20 million pounds when compared with the previous year. 

It of course should not be easy, and I feel should be more aligned to those who have paid into the system. Anyhow, the state pension is supposed to be paid for by contributions during working life... to then discriminate based on where you reside flies in the face of their usual approach. 

[fredscats]

7 hours ago, pj123 said:

I was thinking the same. Maybe thats how the UK system works. 

9green eyed monster   DWP set its stall up years ago  South Lakes/North Somerset county courts,attempting to nail potential frozen pensioners living quite openly in frozen lands...failed,DWP could never mount legal action,could take it to jury trial,would surely lose.

 use UK/EU  that is not frozen,UK best tho,no POL needed

  Have to admit jealousy rules here especially,get some outlandish fake quotes" 1000 quid fines"  lol  avoid taking note of the dreaded Green Eyed Monsters

[BritManToo]

9 hours ago, Mike Teavee said:

You're lucky if you've never had to file a Tax Return, especially as you were earning in the higher rate tax bracket... Have you really never received any additional income over your salary (e.g. Dividends or even income from a Bank Account) that would have needed declaring/extra tax paying? 

 

I've had to do Tax Returns since I was 19 & put it down to a bad break-up with a girl who's mum was a Tax Inspector... Have had to file one every year since, 36 & counting ????.

 

 

Never declared anything outside my pay packet, and they never asked.

Did claim tax rebates 2 or 3 times recently, did that online as well.

[sammieuk1]

1 hour ago, jacko45k said:

I still see that foreigners landing in the UK have immediate access to benefits and statements like In 2020/21 the UK government is expected to spend approximately 212 billion British pounds on benefits, an increase of over 20 million pounds when compared with the previous year. 

It of course should not be easy, and I feel should be more aligned to those who have paid into the system. Anyhow, the state pension is supposed to be paid for by contributions during working life... to then discriminate based on where you reside flies in the face of their usual approach. 

I know nothing about foreigners landing in the UK benefits but I do know a lot about a UK citizen with just about 35 years of stamps and the subsistence survival tool called the universal credit system ????

[ASEAN NOW News]

only 241 votes to go and they will have reached their target...please tell your UK expat friends to log on and vote. It may help!!

[jacko45k]

15 minutes ago, sammieuk1 said:

I know nothing about foreigners landing in the UK benefits but I do know a lot about a UK citizen with just about 35 years of stamps and the subsistence survival tool called the universal credit system ????

Well a sample of one is not complete.... but do you have 35 years of taxation or of stamps or both? The stamp of those on benefits is paid for by taxpayers.  

[fredscats]

1 hour ago, ASEAN NOW News said:

only 241 votes to go and they will have reached their target...please tell your UK expat friends to log on and vote. It may help!!

"May" is the operative word  Its worth signing tho,not that it will do any good,Better the UK system that can be bodged than the AU/NZ system that is much more restricted

[maxcorrigan]

16 hours ago, Golden Triangle said:

Yes, I did read from somewhere a while ago that if you go into hospital and stay for however long then they will stop your pension for that duration, it looks to me as though the state pension rules & regulations are in dire need of a modern day update.

They have been updated that tory stuck up his own arris <deleted> George Osborne re-classified our pensions as a "benefit" the same as paid to all the other scroungers in the UK, in other words it's now government money despite you paying in all your working life, makes us proud eh?

[billd766]

18 hours ago, transam said:

It's because it is a benefit, not like a job private pension...

No matter what the government says it is NOT a benefit.

 

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2812400/Stop-treating-state-pension-like-benefit-earned-lifetime-work-says-minister.html

 

https://www.gov.uk/state-pension

 

https://www.ageuk.org.uk/information-advice/money-legal/pensions/state-pension/new-state-pension/

 

The state pension is a bit like a pantomime with one lot saying "it is a benefit" and the other lot saying, "oh no its not"