Multiple entries on single entry tourist visas

[novster]

Arriving at Phuket Airport today from the UK, the immigration officer advised that I have spent a long time in Thailand recently and although she will allow entry I should apply for the 'correct visa' next time.  Unfortunately her english was not sufficient to explain what visa she would consider correct or let me know if I will actually have a problem entering next time (and to be fair we wouldn't have got past greetings with my thai).

 

I am a 48 year old retired UK national with a yearly property rental contract in Phuket ending in December 2022.  My intention until I get to 50 is to spend 90 day trips in Thailand and then a few weeks in between back in the UK.  

 

Post covid I was in Thailand for 5 months from June 21 (60 day tourist visa , 30 day extension, 60 day covid extension) and then from beginning of January 2022 for 3 months (60 day tourist visa, 30 day extension).   I have never overstayed.  Today I entered with a 60 day tourist visa and a flight home on the 90th day which she didn't ask to see.

 

My question is whether i need to be concerned that i may have a problem entering in the future.  I have read that you are allowed unlimited entries via airports in a calendar year so can I put this down to an over-enthusiastic officer or am I likely to have a problem next time?  Is it possible and indeed advisable to raise this at Phuket immigration on this trip or just ignore it? Perhaps a multi-entry visa would be better?  I did apply for a multiple entry tourist visa in early 2000 but they withdrew the visa when covid first hit and pocketed my £150 fee so since then I have been applying for single entry visas.  

 

Thanks in advance.

 

 

 

  

[DrJack54]

OP, METV are now available.

 

Your asking if you are likely to have issues in the future.

 

The positive side is that you are obtaining visas albeit 60 day TV.

Then couple of weeks back home country after 3 month visit. 

Wash and repeat. 

 

Surprised if you aren't given ongoing warnings for future trips. 

Edited April 21, 2022 by DrJack54

[novster]

Ok thank you for the advice.  I will apply for the multi entry visa next time.

 

 

Edited April 21, 2022 by novster

[DrJack54]

21 minutes ago, novster said:

Ok thank you for the advice.  I will apply for the multi entry visa next time.

 

 

Your in slightly different visit routine.

Meaning very common for folk that wish to stay say 9 months continuous out of each year.

METV perfect for them.

 

In your case 3 months in then 1 month out wash and repeat you would only get couple of entries out of each METV. 

At 48 you only have couple of years till you can obtain non O retirement and do ongoing extensions.

 

 

Edited April 21, 2022 by DrJack54

[freedomnow]

OP, whether SETV or METV you may still get agitation on arrival based on being flagged though due to your history in the country recently....

 

I'm trying to see if METV is live now from UK applicants.....no reply on my other thread yet.

You can choose it yes, but a report further back was the guy received SETV with no refund (as they don't refund in that case).

 

I may try and dig up an email address for the UK based Thai consulate and see if the METV is alive for applications now.... surrounding countries are opened up for visa-runs (though really you can fly anywhere out of Thailand so nearness is moot actually WRT to getting that visa.....)

 

OP you could maybe get an ed visa (Thai languge or Muay Thai fighting)  or volunteer visa if you want less hassles.

 

 

Edited April 21, 2022 by freedomnow

[asiacurious]

If you can get it, the METV is definitely a good way to go.  As DrJack mentioned, you can effectively get 9 months out of a 6 month METV.

 

A lot of people can have a hard time wrapping their head around how this all works at first and what the timing looks like, so here's a complete breakdown of the timing.  PM me if you want me to plug in hypothetical dates for you in those first 2 boxes.

 

 

Edited April 21, 2022 by asiacurious

[BritTim]

For your situation, an SETV for each visit seems entirely appropriate. Once you spend more than six months out of any 12 month period in Thailand as a tourist, some immigration officials can decide you need extra scrutiny. This can happen, not only arriving through Phuket airport, but also both Bangkok airports and possibly Samui. In my opinion, as long as you have a valid visa, the immigration officials have no business (according to the Immigration Act) to be questioning whether consular officials should have issued you the visa. Yes, most Western immigration officials have total discretion, but Thai immigration officials are not supposed to. (Thai immigration does have discretion when it comes to visa exemption, pursuant to orders issued a number of years ago.)

 

When you have a visa, some entry points have historically been completely safe. These include most land border crossings (avoiding Poi Pet/Aranyaprathet though) and both Chiang Mai and U-Tapao airports. At other airports, you are unlikely to be denied entry, but it is not totally impossible.

[novster]

Thanks for the replies. 
 

It is a difficult situation as I am meeting the rules for each visa which I can apply for online in 20 minutes and receive in a matter of days and happy to fly back to the UK every 3 months for short trips.

However it seems the thai authorities do not want long term tourists under 50 in the country and with villa rental and relationship here (in no particular order) I do not want to be denied entry. 
 

Does anyone know if it is possible to arrange an appointment with immigration where I can explain my circumstances, prove I am not working and get some sort of clearance or otherwise?  (I understand the problem with applying for clearance is when they say no but at least with this information I can make other arrangements.)
 

I turn 50 in 13 months time so I will also investigate converting my current tourist visa to a 12 month educational visa and going back to school to see me to my half century. 

[DrJack54]

32 minutes ago, novster said:

Does anyone know if it is possible to arrange an appointment with immigration where I can explain my circumstances, prove I am not working and get some sort of clearance or otherwise?

No. Don't waste your time.

 

However I don't see a problem. 

You turn 50 in a year. At that time you will be able to obtain a non O (retirement) and subsequent 12 month extensions ongoing.

In effect your looking for the next 12 months suggestions to meet your needs.

A few have been outlined in the thread. 

Stick with tourist visas. 

Perhaps spend more time between trips in home country.

Land borders will open at some stage giving other options to stay longer in Thailand.

I don't see the point in an ED visa.

 

[Onerak]

8 hours ago, freedomnow said:

OP you could maybe get an ed visa (Thai languge or Muay Thai fighting)  or volunteer visa if you want less hassles.

I don't understand. He is coming on a Tourist visa from his home country (irrespective of how many days he has lived in Thailand), why he would opt for fake Ed visa and volunteer visa? MY opinion is just to ignore the comments. 

[KhaoYai]

15 hours ago, novster said:

My question is whether i need to be concerned that i may have a problem entering in the future.  I have read that you are allowed unlimited entries via airports in a calendar year so can I put this down to an over-enthusiastic officer or am I likely to have a problem next time? 

Who can really answer your question?  Did the officer spend long typing in her computer before letting you in?

 

All I can tell you is my (similar) experience - I'm married to a Thai and had a Multi Entry Non O for years.  A few years ago I got tired of paying for a visa that allowed me to stay for 3 months at a time when I only stayed for 2 weeks ( I visited every 8 weeks) so I went back to visa exempt entries.  That was OK for a while until on one entry I was asked why I was entering the country so often.  When I explained that I was visiting my wife I was told that I was not considered to be a tourist and although I was being allowed in, I would not be allowed in again without the correct visa -  a Non O based on marriage.  The officer spent a couple of minutes typing into her computer.

 

I duly obtained a Non O and on my next entry the officer flicked through my passport after looking intently at their computer and commented something like 'good, you have a visa'.

 

Then came covid and I was unable to visit. For the last 2 entries I have returned to exempt entries but I think nothing's been said because I was away nearly 2 years due to Covid - I won't push it and may obtain a Non O for my next trip.

 

So although our circumstances are different, we were both issued warnings.  I guess much will depend on whether the officer that warned you recorded that fact on the system.  I don't really understand what the officer told you - that you should have the correct visa. As far as I'm aware you had the correct visa and to the best of my knowledge these warnings have in the past, normally been issued to people entering exempt. If they are now going to start issuing warnings to people with visas - that's a bit worrying. To be honest I think your problem has a lot to do with your recent entry/extension history - you have only been out of the country for a short time and more or less came straight back. They often suspect people with back to back entries or close ones of working illegally.

 

One possible tip - I've rarely been asked questions on entry and only had the one warning but on each of those occassions the I.O. has been female. Join a queue with a male I.O.

Edited April 22, 2022 by KhaoYai

[novster]

Thanks for the information and queue selection advice! 

She asked me whether I have accommodation and when I answered yes told me I have been in Thailand a lot and although she will allow entry that next time I should get the right visa.  

 

She certainly didn’t write extensive notes but was probably typing for long enough to say something like  “warning given of last tourist entry”.
 

I did try to politely question the process but she didn’t really understand and with a queue forming behind there wasn’t the opportunity to pursue. 

[MajorTom]

Ignore the warning. Continue with TR visas. Not that you have much of a choice anyway until you are 50. I would not do the ED-visa with your travel schedule. That might look even more suspicious. It would be a good option if you could just stay until 50 and didn't have to leave several times in between?

 

As mentioned: Avoid female IOs as far as possible. I would also say avoid Immigration at Phuket International. They are the worst in my personal, and everyone I knows experience. DMK also seems to have a bad rep.

 

Some IOs like to intimidate. But I would say its very unlikely they would refuse someone with a valid Tourist visa simply for "Stay Thailand too mutt". Has this ever been reported on this forum?

 

[DrJack54]

13 minutes ago, MajorTom said:

But I would say its very unlikely they would refuse someone with a valid Tourist visa simply for "Stay Thailand too mutt". Has this ever been reported on this forum?

There was a "crackdown" think about 2019. People were denied entry with a valid TV.

This thread has some references.

 

 

[MajorTom]

2 hours ago, DrJack54 said:

There was a "crackdown" think about 2019. People were denied entry with a valid TV.

This thread has some references.

Interesting read. In the lack of legal paragraphs, Corrupt IOs has used false claims and incorrect paragraphs to deny certain people they don't like.

And those rejected had no problems going to other points of entry using the same visa ????

 

As for the OPs concerns: Flying in from the UK (home country). With a visa issued by the Thai embassy in the UK, and a return ticket back to said country.. I would not worry too much about it.

[DrJack54]

3 minutes ago, MajorTom said:

Flying in from the UK (home country). With a visa issued by the Thai embassy in the UK, and a return ticket back to said country.. I would not worry too much about it.

Agree.

The ones I recall having issues where for example guys living in Thailand and flying to eg Saigon obtain tourist visa or return visa exempt with 1 or 2 night stay outside of Thailand.

Doing that over and over. 

DMK was prob the worst at that time. 

One horror story, a guy flew Saigon to DMK refused entry then flown back to Vietnam and refused entry there.

Finally flew to UK (UK national).

 

The OP situation very different. 

[freedomnow]

13 hours ago, Onerak said:

I don't understand. He is coming on a Tourist visa from his home country (irrespective of how many days he has lived in Thailand), why he would opt for fake Ed visa and volunteer visa? MY opinion is just to ignore the comments. 

Er, because he is looking for alternate options to tourist visa after getting warned he used tourist visa too many times...

 

Nothing fake about those alternate visas if you attend to study what you apply for.

[StayinThailand2much]

14 hours ago, novster said:

However it seems the thai authorities do not want long term tourists under 50 in the country and with villa rental and relationship here (in no particular order) I do not want to be denied entry. 

It's not about the 50-mark. I know someone who got quizzed at both Bangkok airports despite being older than 50.

Edited April 22, 2022 by StayinThailand2much

[asiacurious]

3 hours ago, freedomnow said:

Er, because he is looking for alternate options to tourist visa after getting warned he used tourist visa too many times...

I think SETV can lead to entry problems.  If I recall correctly, back in 2018-2019 they started limiting visa exempt and SETV entries to 2 entries in any calendar year.

 

I used several Multi Entry visas back to back (with 1-2 month breaks in-between each) before I qualified for a retirement visa and the one time I had a problem was when I was entering by land from Cambodia.  I was warned not to come back by land again.  "Flight ok, no problem.  Come through here again and we deny entry."

 

Needless to day... I never did go back via land.  That's when I discovered/realized that flights were actually quicker and cheaper and I could visit a wider variety of places during my exit and re-entries.

[BritTim]

7 hours ago, asiacurious said:

I think SETV can lead to entry problems.  If I recall correctly, back in 2018-2019 they started limiting visa exempt and SETV entries to 2 entries in any calendar year.

 

I used several Multi Entry visas back to back (with 1-2 month breaks in-between each) before I qualified for a retirement visa and the one time I had a problem was when I was entering by land from Cambodia.  I was warned not to come back by land again.  "Flight ok, no problem.  Come through here again and we deny entry."

 

Needless to day... I never did go back via land.  That's when I discovered/realized that flights were actually quicker and cheaper and I could visit a wider variety of places during my exit and re-entries.

There is a limit of two visa exempt entries by land in any calendar year. At most land borders, there is no problem entering any number of times as long as you have a visa.  (The main exception is entering at the Poi Pet/Aran border from Cambodia, which should be avoided.) Entering visa exempt by air has no explicit limitations. However, immigration is under instructions to prevent you from staying longer in Thailand than is consistent with regular tourism. In most cases, immigration will start to scrutinise you closely if you have spent more than 180 days out of the last year in Thailand as a tourist. Denied entry is possible. At some airports, you might be denied entry even with a tourist visa, though this is less likely than when entering visa exempt (and, in my view, Thai immigration officials are not supposed to deny entry to you if you have a visa except pursuant to specific criteria in Section 12 of the Immigration Act).

[ubonjoe]

8 hours ago, asiacurious said:

If I recall correctly, back in 2018-2019 they started limiting visa exempt and SETV entries to 2 entries in any calendar year.

That is only for visa exempt entries at land border crossings (it was done in 2015). By air there is no written limit.

[asiacurious]

6 hours ago, BritTim said:

There is a limit of two visa exempt entries by land in any calendar year. At most land borders, there is no problem entering any number of times as long as you have a visa.

5 hours ago, ubonjoe said:

That is only for visa exempt entries at land border crossings (it was done in 2015). By air there is no written limit.

I'll note again - I had a METV and was NOT visa exempt.  Maybe it was just that particular officer giving me a hard time, but the warning was given.

 

Checking my old passport, the METV was issued at the end of February and I entered Thailand the first time in early March.  In early May I took a trip to Cambodia (I love Siem Reap) and it was on my way back to Thailand via the border crossing at Poipet that I was told not to cross by land anymore.  Only flights.

 

To clarify, it was my first re-entry into Thailand that year and the first re-entry on that METV.  And I was specifically told that I could not cross in by land again.  They actually pulled me into an office where I sat waiting for about 20 minutes before the IO came in to talk to me.  I had to hop on a motorcycle taxi - which I hate - with my big back pack no less (awful) to catch the blue bus back to Bangkok before it left.

 

Maybe it was just an IO having a bad day, but I never went through that border again on any kind of tourist visa.

 

[DrJack54]

3 minutes ago, asiacurious said:

........it was on my way back to Thailand via the border crossing at Poipet that I was told not to cross by land anymore.  Only flights.

Rule #1 : Never use Poipet

Rule #2 : Poipet is not normal. 

[asiacurious]

27 minutes ago, DrJack54 said:

Rule #1 : Never use Poipet

Rule #2 : Poipet is not normal. 

That should be the tagline for the whole site.

[BritTim]

12 hours ago, asiacurious said:

19 hours ago, BritTim said:

There is a limit of two visa exempt entries by land in any calendar year. At most land borders, there is no problem entering any number of times as long as you have a visa.  (The main exception is entering at the Poi Pet/Aran border from Cambodia, which should be avoided.) 

I'll note again - I had a METV and was NOT visa exempt.  Maybe it was just that particular officer giving me a hard time, but the warning was given.

The problem (as I explained in the post you truncated) was not the individual officer, but that particular border crossing. Many, many people have had problems entering from Poi Pet. While there have been isolated reports of issues at a couple of other entry points, other land crossings with a visa are virtually always fine.