Ukrainian leaders worried about 'war fatigue' among Western allies amid protracted conflict with Russia

[Bkk Brian]

41 minutes ago, JimmyJ said:

This is called an "Ad Hominem" attack - Attacking the Messenger and not the Message.

 

[It is irrelevant, and a diversion (as intended) but if you had any interest in the Truth you would have scrolled down the thread as I did and found it].

Not at all. its called discrediting the messenger and the message, a double wammy. Feel free to read the lastest Kremlin propaganda but also to have it discredited when you post it here.

[billd766]

On 6/16/2022 at 2:47 PM, JimmyJ said:

superal - "Putins actions are causing devastation to the world with 30% of wheat coming from Russia and Ukraine combined and then of course the oi;l and gas that is controlled by Russia ."

 

USA sanctions on Russia are causing this.

 

 

USA sanctions are NOT causing this at all.

 

Russia invaded a neutral peaceful democratic country and the reason is in his own mind.

 

The sanctions are a reaction to that invasion. If Russia stops attacking, withdraws all its troops from the whole of the Ukraine, pay damages to the Ukraine, then, IMHO, the sanctions will ease over time.

 

Did the US, EU and world sanctions justify this action by Russia?

 

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-61967376

[JimmyJ]

 

 

This did not begin a few months ago, this began with the USA backed Maidan coup of 2014 which overthrew Ukraine's duly elected President.

 

What is happening now has been predicted for years.

 

Here is an article from 2017 about the coup:

 

https://www.cato.org/commentary/americas-ukraine-hypocrisy

 

Also one should be aware of:

 

"Leaked audio reveals embarrassing U.S.exchange on Ukraine, EU"

 

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-ukraine-tape-idUSBREA1601G20140207

 

 

 

 

 

[Bkk Brian]

3 minutes ago, JimmyJ said:

This did not begin a few months ago, this began with the USA backed Maidan coup of 2014 which overthrew Ukraine's duly elected President.

 

What is happening now has been predicted for years.

 

Here is an article from 2017 about the coup:

 

https://www.cato.org/commentary/americas-ukraine-hypocrisy

 

 

 

 

Your right, this did not start a few months ago, it started in 1994 with the Budapest Memorandum where Ukraine gave up all its nuclear weapons with Russia promising not to invade. Never trust a ruskie

[billd766]

22 hours ago, JimmyJ said:

Yes, let's do everything possible to start WWIII, from which there is no coming back.

I have a better idea that I am sure that you will like.

 

Let us completely abandon the Ukraine with its 40 million people, not to mention its food and mineral riches which they were sharing with the world. And while we are at it, why not grovel and apologise to Putin and lick his boots. We could tell him that he can walk into any former soviet block country and the West won't invoke NATO and he can do what he wants.

 

Unfortunately the rest of the world may not agree with that.

 

BTW while you are blaming the USA and the ROW for sanctions can you tell me when the sanctions started? Was it before or after the Russian invasion of the Ukraine?

[heybruce]

5 hours ago, JimmyJ said:

 

 

This did not begin a few months ago, this began with the USA backed Maidan coup of 2014 which overthrew Ukraine's duly elected President.

 

What is happening now has been predicted for years.

 

Here is an article from 2017 about the coup:

 

https://www.cato.org/commentary/americas-ukraine-hypocrisy

 

Also one should be aware of:

 

"Leaked audio reveals embarrassing U.S.exchange on Ukraine, EU"

 

https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-ukraine-tape-idUSBREA1601G20140207

 

That nonsense again.  What material support did the US provide to those in Ukraine protesting for democracy?

 

The US sympathized with those who wanted real democracy in Ukraine.  Putin wanted a corrupt autocracy that operated under his thumb in Ukraine.  To achieve this he seized Crimea, provided weapons and leadership to separatist thugs in eastern Ukraine, further supported those thugs with troops he called volunteers, then staged a massive invasion of the country which he insists be called a special military operation.

[Scott]

A post violating Fair Use Policy as well as not provided a link to the quoted content has been removed.  

 

27. You will not post any copyrighted material except as fair use laws apply (as in the case of news articles). Only post a link, the headline and three sentences from the article.

 

https://aseannow.com/terms/

[billd766]

15 hours ago, billd766 said:

I have a better idea that I am sure that you will like.

 

Let us completely abandon the Ukraine with its 40 million people, not to mention its food and mineral riches which they were sharing with the world. And while we are at it, why not grovel and apologise to Putin and lick his boots. We could tell him that he can walk into any former soviet block country and the West won't invoke NATO and he can do what he wants.

 

Unfortunately the rest of the world may not agree with that.

 

BTW while you are blaming the USA and the ROW for sanctions can you tell me when the sanctions started? Was it before or after the Russian invasion of the Ukraine?

I note that Jimmy J has not responded to either of my posts.

[JimmyJ]

 

28+ years of warnings and predictions that what has happened would happen if NATO did not keep out of Ukraine.

 

Russia has reacted no differently than the USA would react if Russia was about  to establish military bases along the USA's borders with Mexico and Canada.

 

The move to join NATO was seen accurately by many as essentially an effort to encircle Russia and destroy its sovereignty.

 

 

3-1-22 - 

"Most fascinating thing about the Ukraine war is the sheer number of top strategic thinkers who warned for years that it was coming if we continued down the same path.

 

No-one listened to them and here we are."

 

( Click on either "Read the full conversation on Twitter" in blue type, or, click on the long link, either of which shows a long history of people considered experts predicting the current crisi)

 

https://mobile.twitter.com/RnaudBertrand/status/1498491107902062592?ref_src=twsrc^tfw|twcamp^tweetembed|twterm^1498491107902062592|twgr^|twcon^s1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Faseannow.com%2Findex.php%3Fapp%3Dcoremodule%3Dsystemcontroller%3Dembedurl%3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Fmobile.twitter.com%2FRnaudBertrand%2Fstatus%2F1498491107902062592

 

[heybruce]

23 minutes ago, JimmyJ said:

 

28+ years of warnings and predictions that what has happened would happen if NATO did not keep out of Ukraine.

 

Russia has reacted no differently than the USA would react if Russia was about  to establish military bases along the USA's borders with Mexico and Canada.

 

The move to join NATO was seen accurately by many as essentially an effort to encircle Russia and destroy its sovereignty.

 

 

3-1-22 - 

"Most fascinating thing about the Ukraine war is the sheer number of top strategic thinkers who warned for years that it was coming if we continued down the same path.

 

No-one listened to them and here we are."

 

( Click on either "Read the full conversation on Twitter" in blue type, or, click on the long link, either of which shows a long history of people considered experts predicting the current crisi)

 

https://mobile.twitter.com/RnaudBertrand/status/1498491107902062592?ref_src=twsrc^tfw|twcamp^tweetembed|twterm^1498491107902062592|twgr^|twcon^s1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Faseannow.com%2Findex.php%3Fapp%3Dcoremodule%3Dsystemcontroller%3Dembedurl%3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Fmobile.twitter.com%2FRnaudBertrand%2Fstatus%2F1498491107902062592

 

There were always arguments for and against NATO enlargement every step of the way.  Cherry picking the against arguments doesn't change the fact that every country that joined wanted to join, none of them want out, and more countries want in now than before Russia's invasion.

 

"Russia has reacted no differently than the USA would react if Russia was about  to establish military bases along the USA's borders with Mexico and Canada. "

 

The US isn't establishing military bases along Russia's borders.  NATO has deployed some forces into NATO countries most at risk of a Russian incursion, which is to be expected.

 

Most noteworthy, the US hasn't done anything to cause Canada or Mexico to feel they need to call upon Russia, or any other country, for help in defending itself against a US invasion.  Countries bordering Russia are in the opposite situation.

[Bkk Brian]

25 minutes ago, JimmyJ said:

 

28+ years of warnings and predictions that what has happened would happen if NATO did not keep out of Ukraine.

 

Russia has reacted no differently than the USA would react if Russia was about  to establish military bases along the USA's borders with Mexico and Canada.

 

The move to join NATO was seen accurately by many as essentially an effort to encircle Russia and destroy its sovereignty.

 

 

3-1-22 - 

"Most fascinating thing about the Ukraine war is the sheer number of top strategic thinkers who warned for years that it was coming if we continued down the same path.

 

No-one listened to them and here we are."

 

( Click on either "Read the full conversation on Twitter" in blue type, or, click on the long link, either of which shows a long history of people considered experts predicting the current crisi)

 

https://mobile.twitter.com/RnaudBertrand/status/1498491107902062592?ref_src=twsrc^tfw|twcamp^tweetembed|twterm^1498491107902062592|twgr^|twcon^s1_&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Faseannow.com%2Findex.php%3Fapp%3Dcoremodule%3Dsystemcontroller%3Dembedurl%3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Fmobile.twitter.com%2FRnaudBertrand%2Fstatus%2F1498491107902062592

 

I see the Russian Embassy in the UK also promotes Arnaud's tweets ????

[candide]

3 hours ago, Bkk Brian said:

I see the Russian Embassy in the UK also promotes Arnaud's tweets ????

And that's the only reason he appears in this thread, as he is an unknown guy. Let's look at his pedigree on Twitter:

"Entrepreneur. Previously HouseTrip (sold to TripAdvisor), now http://MeAndQi.com, the website that explains Chinese Medicine. I've been known to write decent threads."

 

So after Caitlin Johnstone, Arnaud Bertrand......

[Bkk Brian]

5 minutes ago, candide said:

And that's the only reason he appears in this thread, as he is an unknown guy. Let's look at his pedigree on Twitter:

"Entrepreneur. Previously HouseTrip (sold to TripAdvisor), now http://MeAndQi.com, the website that explains Chinese Medicine. I've been known to write decent threads."

 

So after Caitlin Johnstone, Arnaud Bertrand......

yea RT and a nobody being promoted by the Russian Embassy, great pedigree ????

 

I won't give the orcs credit with a link but here's a screen shot

 

[placeholder]

On 6/27/2022 at 10:47 AM, sscc said:

 

CNN reported  on June 26, 2022

 

“  Europe and the US’ plan to file pain on Putin hasn’t worked. “

“ The West wants to go further on Russian oil.  Inflation is making that difficult. ”    

“ Russia keeps cashing in. ”   

 

 

I focus on data, facts and reality only and not bother with off-focus, irrelevant subject.  People perpetually choose denial and believe in whatever,  up to them.  

 

Billionaire oligarch called 'Putin's favorite industrialist' says 'destroying Ukraine would be a colossal mistake'

Oleg Deripaska, a billionaire aluminum tycoon and close Vladimir Putin ally, spoke out against the war in Ukraine on Tuesday while speaking with local journalists, suggesting there would be no winner following Russia's invasion, Reuters reported.

"I'm troubled by how quickly we abandoned everything that was achieved (economically) in the '90s, then we abandoned everything that we achieved in the 2000s, and now we are sitting and waiting for victory. 

https://news.yahoo.com/billionaire-oligarch-called-putins-favorite-222054162.html

[candide]

13 hours ago, billd766 said:

I note that Jimmy J has not responded to either of my posts.

End of work shift in Russia! 

(Their machines are so outdated! ????)

[placeholder]

On 6/28/2022 at 6:22 PM, JimmyJ said:

This is called an "Ad Hominem" attack - Attacking the Messenger and not the Message.

 

[It is irrelevant, and a diversion (as intended) but if you had any interest in the Truth you would have scrolled down the thread as I did and found it].

Maybe if Caitlin Johnson's post contained some evidence and a rational argument, you'd have a better point. But it clearly is relevant that her paycheck comes from the Russian govt.