LTR Visa is Now available for Long Term Residency

[Pib]

26 minutes ago, Misty said:

 

Today at Chamchuri I asked if they can mail the certificate and was told no, unfortunately at this location you can only pay cash Bt500 and receive on the same day, within an hour.

 

My experience was very much like yours, Pib - super easy. I brought a number of documents just in case, but in the end they only wanted the application, copies of my passport, LTR visa, and arrival stamp,  and the TM30. I paid the Bt500 at Counter 8, submitted the documents at Counter 10, and was told to come back in an hour. I got a coffee downstairs and returned a little early. The certificate was ready about 5 min early.  It was a busy day maybe ahead of the long weekend, 

Thanks Misty.   As I mentioned earlier my memory was about "90%" that Chamchuri only issued residence certificate by paying Bt500 and waiting an hour or so to get it.   Can't have it mailed to you at a lower cost like some immigration offices will do such as CW will do.  With your confirmation I can now upgrade my memory of the situation from 90% to 100%.   😉

[MPoll]

12 hours ago, Pib said:

Yea...pretty much the same experience for me when I did my report in Dec 2023.  The front desk gave me a queue number and directed my down the hall to where you suppose to do the report....I didn't know if it was just a desk, a sperate room, etc.  This was just before the lunch hour.  I walked right by the room on the right and I asked someone at desk where to do the 1 year report...they told me to set down and they will get someone to help me.  A few minutes later two ladies showed-up to help me but then with big smiles they pointed me over to the address report room....it was only like 10 steps away but only had a small sign above the door....I convinced myself it can be easy to walk right by.   

 

So, I now back-track those ten steps and walk into the room which is actually a good sized room once entering with plenty of waiting area seats but only one person was waiting in the room.  I went right to the counter and said I'm here to do my 1 year address report...the officer asked what my queue number was and I showed the queue slip...the officer said that number already been called (like where in the heck had I been when my number had been called!!!) but then took my paperwork.  A few minutes later I'm done and out the door....see you next year.   

 

I spent more time going from the front desk and trying to find the address report room (which I walked right by the first time...simply didn't see the room) than the time I actually spent in the room having the report processed/approved.   😉

Someone saw me standing there looking bewildered and pointed to where I was supposed to go. On my way out I noticed a tiny arrow sign painted on the floor that said “90 day”. 

[sabaiguy]

15 hours ago, JohnnyBD said:

Forgive me for trying to make sure that I won't get hit with a 7 MM baht tax bill next year after remitting monies derived in the same year as remitted. I received one of those emails from the BOI LTR Visa Unit about monies being tax exempt, but after looking at the email more closely, it didn't have an official letter attached, it wasn't signed by anyone, and it had no names on it. It was just a reply email that could have been sent by some low level clerical person with the BOI logo. At the bottom, it had a disclaimer note saying to contact the Revenue Department for further questions. So, I will try to contact the Thai Revenue Department about my questions before remitting big some monies. 

Up to you.  I think you're blowing this way out of proportion..  What do you want personal letter from the Thai Minister of Finance?  If you get hit with a 7mm baht tax bill,  I would just send it to BOI.  Good luck trying to get a response from the Thai Revenue Department.  Keep us informed.

[SHA 2 BKK]

23 hours ago, JohnnyBD said:

Forgive me for trying to make sure that I won't get hit with a 7 MM baht tax bill next year after remitting monies derived in the same year as remitted. I received one of those emails from the BOI LTR Visa Unit about monies being tax exempt, but after looking at the email more closely, it didn't have an official letter attached, it wasn't signed by anyone, and it had no names on it. It was just a reply email that could have been sent by some low level clerical person with the BOI logo. At the bottom, it had a disclaimer note saying to contact the Revenue Department for further questions. So, I will try to contact the Thai Revenue Department about my questions before remitting big some monies. 

Johnny can you give some feedback mate?

[JohnnyBD]

9 hours ago, sabaiguy said:

What do you want personal letter from the Thai Minister of Finance?  If you get hit with a 7mm baht tax bill,  I would just send it to BOI.

No, I don't need a personal letter from the Thai Minister of Finance... 😏 And, I don't think BOI will pay my 7MM baht tax bill. But, requesting confirmation in writing from the legitimate government taxing authority (the Thai Revenue Dept.) regarding the tax exempt status of monies remitted in the same year as derived, for a LTR-WP visa holder, is not an unreasonable request. In fact, it would be a very smart thing to do for someone remitting big monies. As you said, it's up to me... ☺️ Thank you.

Edited June 1 by JohnnyBD

[sabaiguy]

11 hours ago, JohnnyBD said:

No, I don't need a personal letter from the Thai Minister of Finance... 😏 And, I don't think BOI will pay my 7MM baht tax bill. But, requesting confirmation in writing from the legitimate government taxing authority (the Thai Revenue Dept.) regarding the tax exempt status of monies remitted in the same year as derived, for a LTR-WP visa holder, is not an unreasonable request. In fact, it would be a very smart thing to do for someone remitting big monies. As you said, it's up to me... ☺️ Thank you.

Did you pay tax on that money in your home country that you plan to remit?  If so nothing to worry about.

[JimGant]

9 minutes ago, sabaiguy said:

Did you pay tax on that money in your home country that you plan to remit?  If so nothing to worry about.

Not necessarily. If you paid US taxes on a private pension you remitted to Thailand, the DTA says Thailand has exclusive taxation rights on that pension -- and if remitted in same year paid, and LTR folks aren't correct about its exemption -- well, need to declare on a Thai tax return, and then file an amended US tax return for the credit.

 

Ain't this fun.

[sabaiguy]

14 hours ago, JohnnyBD said:

No, I don't need a personal letter from the Thai Minister of Finance... 😏 And, I don't think BOI will pay my 7MM baht tax bill. But, requesting confirmation in writing from the legitimate government taxing authority (the Thai Revenue Dept.) regarding the tax exempt status of monies remitted in the same year as derived, for a LTR-WP visa holder, is not an unreasonable request. In fact, it would be a very smart thing to do for someone remitting big monies. As you said, it's up to me... ☺️ Thank you.

I remitted $300,000 last month, same month as I received my LTR (maybe that's not considered a lot for you), I sleep easily at night.  Not worried about the Thai RD. 

[bobasdl]

On 5/31/2024 at 7:10 AM, JohnnyBD said:

Forgive me for trying to make sure that I won't get hit with a 7 MM baht tax bill next year after remitting monies derived in the same year as remitted. I received one of those emails from the BOI LTR Visa Unit about monies being tax exempt, but after looking at the email more closely, it didn't have an official letter attached, it wasn't signed by anyone, and it had no names on it. It was just a reply email that could have been sent by some low level clerical person with the BOI logo. At the bottom, it had a disclaimer note saying to contact the Revenue Department for further questions. So, I will try to contact the Thai Revenue Department about my questions before remitting big some monies. 

 

Hello Johnny,

 

If they end up answering you on that point could you please post an update here, much appreciated.

[oldcpu]

2 hours ago, JohnnyBD said:

The question I have is, why would Thailand create RD 743 which states the previous year's income if their true intention was that all foreign income from any year was exempt? It would have been so easy just to say all foreign income remitted once you obtain your LTR visa, no matter when it was derived? This doesn't make any sense to me, but this is Thailand, right?

 

I believe that it is simple logic - if one is required to pay tax, then one files their tax return the year after one brings money into the country.  So if one brings money into the country in year 2024, the tax return (if it was required) is only filed in year 2025. Or if one brings money into the country in year 2025, then the tax return, if it was necessary, would only be filed in year 2026.  i.e. its always the following year for filing a tax return ( if a tax return needed to be filed ) , for money brought into the country. 

 

One does not file a tax return to list income the year in which income is earned.

 

That then means the previous year's foreign income is tax exempt ( for the relevant LTR categories).

 

Hence the "statement about the previous year's income".

 

At least that is my interpretation.  I am also not worried about such.

Edited June 1 by oldcpu

[JohnnyBD]

11 hours ago, oldcpu said:

 

I believe that it is simple logic - if one is required to pay tax, then one files their tax return the year after one brings money into the country.  So if one brings money into the country in year 2024, the tax return (if it was required) is only filed in year 2025. Or if one brings money into the country in year 2025, then the tax return, if it was necessary, would only be filed in year 2026.  i.e. its always the following year for filing a tax return ( if a tax return needed to be filed ) , for money brought into the country. 

 

One does not file a tax return to list income the year in which income is earned.

 

That then means the previous year's foreign income is tax exempt ( for the relevant LTR categories).

 

Hence the "statement about the previous year's income".

 

At least that is my interpretation.  I am also not worried about such.

I hope your interpretation is correct. I think it would be prudent for me to get clarification (if I can) from the Thai Revenue Department before remitting any big monies. I read numerous opinions & guidelines from Thai Tax companies and they refer to RD 743, and some state it's the previous year's income being remitted in a subsequent year that's exempt. They say nothing about the current year's income being exempt, if it was remitted in the same fiscal year as it was derived. I won't post them all, but this is what Deloitte says about the Thai Royal Decree (No. 743) issued on 21 May 2022:

• An exemption from personal income tax for foreign nationals from jurisdictions designated as “wealthy countries,” retired foreign nationals, and foreign nationals who want to work remotely from Thailand and who are granted an LTR visa, in respect of their income derived in a prior fiscal year from work or undertakings carried out in a foreign country, or from assets situated in a foreign country, where such income is brought into Thailand in a fiscal year subsequent to the year in which the income is derived.

Edited June 2 by JohnnyBD

[JimGant]

3 hours ago, JohnnyBD said:

where such income is brought into Thailand in a fiscal year subsequent to the year in which the income is derived.

Wouldn't it make sense that, if the powers that be wanted to give LTR visa holders a tax perk -- the simplest avenue would be: Let's grandfather the LTR visa holders under the old rules. Which, of course, means: remit the money in a later year than year earned.

 

Obviously, another bump in the road with these new tax angles that need to be ironed out.

[JohnnyBD]

11 minutes ago, JimGant said:

Wouldn't it make sense that, if the powers that be wanted to give LTR visa holders a tax perk -- the simplest avenue would be: Let's grandfather the LTR visa holders under the old rules. Which, of course, means: remit the money in a later year than year earned.

 

Obviously, another bump in the road with these new tax angles that need to be ironed out.

I agree, that would be the simplest way... Maybe that is what RD 743 was meant to do, since it states the following:

"derived in the previous tax year from an employment, or from business carried on abroad, or from a property situated abroad, and brought into Thailand".

[Pib]

3 hours ago, JohnnyBD said:

I agree, that would be the simplest way... Maybe that is what RD 743 was meant to do, since it states the following:

"derived in the previous tax year from an employment, or from business carried on abroad, or from a property situated abroad, and brought into Thailand".

But RD743 came out a year or so "before" the recent tax change.

[JohnnyBD]

19 hours ago, Pib said:

But RD743 came out a year or so "before" the recent tax change.

You're right, it did come out about a year before, and if everyone's previous year's income was already exempt, then RD 743 was not needed. RD 743 does not state all income remitted is exempt, or income derived & remitted in the same fiscal year is exempt, that would have been too simple & straightforward. RD 743 states "derived in the previous tax year..., and brought into Thailand", which doesn't address one's current year's income. We can look at the same wording and arrive at different interpretations, nothing right or wrong about that. RD 743 does not address one's current year income being remitted in the same fiscal year, so that is left up to each person's own interpretation. I think they like to keep us guessing. I'm fairly certain all income remitted, no matter when derived or when remitted will be deemed exempt for LTR-WP visa holders, but I am going to be prudent, and try to get a written answer from TRD, to make absolutely certain.

Edited June 3 by JohnnyBD

[Ben Zioner]

1 hour ago, JohnnyBD said:

You're right, it did come out about a year before, and if everyone's previous year's income was already exempt, then RD 743 was not needed. RD 743 does not state all income remitted is exempt, or income derived & remitted in the same fiscal year is exempt, that would have been too simple & straightforward. RD 743 states "derived in the previous tax year..., and brought into Thailand", which doesn't address one's current year's income. We can look at the same wording and arrive at different interpretations, nothing right or wrong about that. RD 743 does not address one's current year income being remitted in the same fiscal year, so that is left up to each person's own interpretation. I think they like to keep us guessing. I'm fairly certain all income remitted, no matter when derived or when remitted will be deemed exempt for LTR-WP visa holders, but I am going to be prudent, and try to get a written answer from TRD, to make absolutely certain.

I'll keep doing one yearly transfer, on the first business day of January. 

[oldcpu]

2 hours ago, JohnnyBD said:

You're right, it did come out about a year before, and if everyone's previous year's income was already exempt, then RD 743 was not needed.

 

Hmm ... RD 743 says more than just information about no taxation in previous year - so RD 743 was needed for other aspects - lets not go too far here.

 

Further when RD 743 was put out, I speculate that maybe it was already 'confidentially' known within government how they were then going to start taxing anyone deemed a tax resident (for the 'tax residents' foreign money brought into Thailand, under certain circumstances (ie not covered by DTA, and not a foreign saving before 1-Jan-2024).  So given the knowledge of taxation efforts (for tax residents) that was to come soon, the RD 743 had information on taxation added to other items in RD 743. 

 

That is my speculation, but the main point I want to make is RD 743 is about much more than just the taxation concern you have. Much more.

 

Further - I want to make the point again. When does one pay tax?  If one brings money into the country in year 2025, one does NOT pay tax on such in the same year ( 2025 ) when it was brought into Thailand, unless there is a with holding tax. There has been NO announcements of holding tax. So logically, one submits their tax return in year 2026 (for the 2025 money brought into Thailand), at that point in time, the money brought into the country in year 2025 was the PREVIOUS year.

 

Further there is NO mention in the RD 743 about taxing current year foreign money brought into Thailand for LTR visa holders. 

 

I think it falacious to assume that one will be subject to tax on something where there are no legal statements saying one will be taxed. Else one could be taxed on all sorts of aspects where is no law saying one must be taxed on such.  So by that logic to tax money on the same year in which the money is brought into Thailand, there needs to be a Royal Gazette statement (or Thai revenue department statement) stating one is to be taxed on such. There is no such statement for the LTR visa saying taxed on the year it is brought into Thailand.

 

If the intent was to tax LTR visa holders on money, in the year in which they bring the money into Thailand, then I believe the BoI and the Revenue Department would make announcements of requirements of holding tax for money brought in. There was no such announcement. That means tax accounting for tax residents is the year AFTER the money is brought into to Thailand, and that makes such income the PREVIOUS year.

 

Again - BoI have been clear for LTR visa holders - no taxation of money brought into Thailand, every time they have been asked.

 

Other than concerned speculation on the internet, has anyone read an OFFICIAL Royal Gazette post  (or Thai Revenue department, or Boi Statement) stating there would be a withholding tax specifically for LTR visa holders?  I think not.

 

Edited June 3 by oldcpu

[Pib]

18 minutes ago, oldcpu said:

 

 

Further - I want to make the point again. When does one pay tax?  If one brings money into the country in year 2025, one does NOT pay tax on such in the same year ( 2025 ) when it was brought into Thailand, unless there is a with holding tax. There has been NO announcements of holding tax. So logically, one submits their tax return in year 2026 (for the 2025 money brought into Thailand), at that point in time, the money brought into the country in year 2025 was the PREVIOUS year.

 

 

 

 

Yeap...that's my understanding also.    When it comes to filing a tax return, say this coming Jan - Mar 2025 (which will be the "current" tax year once 2025 get here) you will be filing that return for the "previous" tax year which would be for Jan-Dec 2024.  So, any funds transferred in 2024 would be tax free on your tax return you file Jan-Mar 2025.

 

 

[JohnnyBD]

Who's right, some of the previous posters or Deloitte?

This is what Deloitte says about the Thai Royal Decree (No. 743) issued on 21 May 2022:

• An exemption from personal income tax for foreign nationals from jurisdictions designated as “wealthy countries,” retired foreign nationals, and foreign nationals who want to work remotely from Thailand and who are granted an LTR visa, in respect of their income derived in a prior fiscal year from work or undertakings carried out in a foreign country, or from assets situated in a foreign country, where such income is brought into Thailand in a fiscal year subsequent to the year in which the income is derived.

th-tax-newsletter-june-2022-en.pdf (deloitte.com)

[oldcpu]

24 minutes ago, JohnnyBD said:

Who's right, some of the previous posters or Deloitte?

 

Thai BoI working with Thai immigration grant the LTR visa.  BoI say no tax on any money brought into Thailand for LTR visa holders.

 

Who is right? Deloitte? or BoI working with immigration?

 

Do Deloitte dictate terms to BoI ?  I think not.

 

Frankly, I think Deloitte have this VERY wrong - and they are misleading their customers.

 

 

[oldcpu]

37 minutes ago, oldcpu said:

 

Frankly, I think Deloitte have this VERY wrong - and they are misleading their customers.

 

 

Let me 'rephrase that'. 

 

"Frankly, I think Deloitte, due to an abundance over caution, have this incorrect  - and they are giving their customers a less than fully accurate assessment.".

[JohnnyBD]

55 minutes ago, oldcpu said:

 

Thai BoI working with Thai immigration grant the LTR visa.  BoI say no tax on any money brought into Thailand for LTR visa holders.

 

Who is right? Deloitte? or BoI working with immigration?

 

Do Deloitte dictate terms to BoI ?  I think not.

 

Frankly, I think Deloitte have this VERY wrong - and they are misleading their customers.

 

 

I think you are misunderstanding their legal opinion. Deloitte issued a legal opinion on RD 743 only. They are not saying that any other income that falls outside of RD 743 is not tax exempt. BOI has promoted the LTR visas as tax exempt, so I'm fairly certain that all income is exempt no matter when it was derived and remitted. It's just that RD 743 doesn't address all the different situations. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion. It would be nice if BOI & TRD would issue some further guidance to clarify and/or add to the RD 743.

[oldcpu]

12 hours ago, JohnnyBD said:

I think you are misunderstanding their legal opinion. Deloitte issued a legal opinion on RD 743 only. They are not saying that any other income that falls outside of RD 743 is not tax exempt. BOI has promoted the LTR visas as tax exempt, so I'm fairly certain that all income is exempt no matter when it was derived and remitted. It's just that RD 743 doesn't address all the different situations. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion. It would be nice if BOI & TRD would issue some further guidance to clarify and/or add to the RD 743.

 

I note that the first LTR visas were issued in late 2022, where such income (for the 2022 taxation year) should have had income tax returns filed (if needed) by March/April 2023. 

 

And further there were many LTR visas issued in 2023, where this being June-2024, taxation submissions for taxation year 2023 (if needed) should have been submitted by March/April-2024.  

 

If there was an issue with bringing money into Thailand for LTR visa holders, given there have been 2 taxation years since the LTR visa came out, I suspect we would have heard of such by now.   I have read no news where Thai RD went chasing after LTR visa holders for money brought into Thailand.

 

But that is just my opinion - maybe I missed reading an official RD notice specific to LTR visa holders needing to pay tax in the scenario that concerns you ..  ... and further I note my opinion is no better nor worse than anyone else's.

 

I assume we may find out more in the coming year or two, either by total silence on this, or by some active news on taxation.

 

My speculation is that Deloitte will need to update their (June-2022) legal opinion on taxation aspects of RD 743 as the months go by.  But again this is speculation on my part - and I have no more insight than anyone else.

Edited June 4 by oldcpu

[Presnock]

On 7/25/2022 at 2:32 PM, BritTim said:

I stand to be corrected, but I recall reading that you can suspend use of the Elite visa when you get a Non B visa, and reinstate use of the Elite when you no longer have a valid Non B or extension based on working. Anyone know different?

if you qualify, get an LTR visa from the Board of Investment (4 categories) and they will also get you a work permit if you want to work.  No taxes on remitted funds from outside Thailand and lower taxes on Thai earned income.  Just saying, a lot cheaper than the elite visa

[Ben Zioner]

15 minutes ago, oldcpu said:

But that is just my opinion - maybe I missed reading an official RD notice specific to LTR visa holders needing to pay tax in the scenario that concerns you ..  ... and further I note my opinion is no better nor worse than anyone else's.

 

Is this such a big issue? I reckon that most of us had their money transfers organised to remain tax exempt before they got their LTR visa, so they just have to do nothing. 

 

This is what I do anyhow, and I won't even bother to file a tax return in 2025, just as before.

 

[Presnock]

On 5/13/2024 at 12:12 PM, hcvc said:

I have an appointment to receive a LTR Visa for Wealthy Pensioners at One Stop Service Center (OSS).

 

On the BOI website under the heading Wealthy Pensioner - Application Process – Visa Issuance – Dress Code Guidelines for Appointment Date - a pictorial displays a cartoon of a man wearing a suit and tie. Individual cutouts of a cartoon suit and pants are also shown.

 

Above the pictorial is a message (warning) stating - * Remarks: * Please dress politely in proper formal clothes and shoes. The immigration officer reserves the right to refuse service if inappropriate clothing is observed.

 

I am a large framed fashionably challenged individual living on a rural farm and do not have a suit or tie. I have made several fruitless attempts to purchase a suitable suit online.

 

For those who already have a BOI LTR Visa for Wealthy Pensioners - were you required to wear a suit and tie – or did you happen to observe any one denied a BOI LTR Visa for a dress code violation?

 

Any help would be much appreciated.

I read the same description, bought a dress shirt and tie plus new shoes....I was the best dressed at the BOI especially among those coming to get their visa stamps.  Just dress respectively neat, no jogging clothes, football or sports jerseys, as long as clean and neat, they are very accomodating in my opinion.

[JohnnyBD]

15 minutes ago, oldcpu said:

 

I note that the first LTR visas were issued in late 2022, where such income (for the 2022 taxation year) should have had income tax returns filed (if needed) by March/April 2023. 

 

And further there were many LTR visas issued in 2023, where this being June-2024, taxation submissions for taxation year 2023 (if needed) should have been submitted by March/April-2024.  

 

If there was an issue with bringing money into Thailand for LTR visa holders, given there have been 2 taxation years since the LTR visa came out, I suspect we would have heard of such by now.   I have read no news where Thai RD went chasing after LTR visa holders for money brought into Thailand.

 

But that is just my opinion - maybe I missed reading an official RD notice specific to LTR visa holders needing to pay tax in the scenario that concerns you ..  ... and further I note my opinion is no better nor worse than anyone else's.

 

I assume we may find out more in the coming year or two, either by total silence on this, or by some active news on taxation.

 

My speculation is that Deloitte will need to update their (June-2022) legal opinion on taxation aspects of RD 743 as the months go by.  But again this is speculation on my part - and I have no more insight than anyone else.

There must be another order, directive or edict that was issued by the Director-General of the Revenue Dept. or the Minister of Finance that states all income is tax exempt, otherwise BOI would not be telling everyone that. RD 743 cannot be the only order that was issued because it does not state all income is tax exempt. Several tax firms have issued the same opinion & guidance on RD 743 as Deloitte, I just didn't list them all. If RD 743 is the only order or directive on the issue,  then whoever drafted it, needs to be fired.

[Presnock]

On 5/12/2024 at 2:32 PM, john donson said:

 

80$ pension or salary? as for average europeans, this is xx more then they get...

 

oh I forgot, everybody here is a millionaire in dollars...

 

when I see youtube videos or posts, that people with $100k salary only barely survive, I think wth... mcdo is now at 20$ an hour in the US... 2 days of full slave wager here for average somchai....

I believe that 20 USD an hour was passed recently for Calf only and immediately prices at Mickey D's went up and some workers were let go as the owners said they couldn't afford to keep business as usual due to the increase of basic salary for their workers.  Other states are a lot less than that.

[Presnock]

On 5/17/2024 at 3:04 PM, Eddie45 said:

My understanding with the LTR Visa, you dont need to file a tax return if you stay in Thailand for more than 183 days a year in a tax year. You dont pay tax on your overseas earnings and you wont need to pay tax on the money you bring into Thailand to pay for your living expenses. Is this also the case with the Elite Visa as trying to workout best option for me. I did look on the Elite Visa website but this information was not covered.

LTR is the only visa type that I have seen any information about and so far is the only exempted tax on remitted funds into Thailand the Elite visa is not exempted !

 

[Presnock]

On 5/28/2024 at 1:02 PM, JohnnyBD said:

Thanks. I will submit the original joint tax return just as it is, that we filed electronically along with my 1099s and verification letters from SSA and company pension. I will try to include notes if there is a note section to explain that she is a Thai citizen and doesn't have any income, and that all of the income shown on the tax return is mine. I just transferred the marriage extension stamps to my new passport today, so I'm excited to get started.

Yes, My 1040's submitted were the same - i.e. Thai wife with no income  and after submitting along with govt health insurance letter attesting to USD $50K for hospitalization - application zoomed and a week later I had my stamps.  Total time 3 weeks.