LTR Visa is Now available for Long Term Residency

[Pib]

3 hours ago, K2938 said:

The tax return requirement seems pretty silly as truly rich people generally pay very little taxes as they have enough money and options to structure their affairs such that this is the case.  Also, there are enough jurisdictions where certain income types are tax free so somebody could have a huge income while only showing very small taxable earnings and the same person living in two different jurisdictions could have hugely different taxable earnings depending on the local tax laws.

Couldn't agree more.  But does the BOI know or even care how a tax return could greatly under reflect a person's income.  If the BOI is hardcore in using a tax return as the key document in proof of income then those with fully or partially non-taxable/non-reportable pension and/or fixed income could fall short in meeting the BOI minimum income requirement.

[keemapoot]

9 hours ago, Pib said:

Plus, I would rather not submit my tax return for security/identify theft reasons....but if I do have to submit one certain info like SSN will be redacted.  

Let us know if they accept that redacted tax return without SSN #, and also I wonder if they will accept an e-filed tax return. I suppose they may want to see monthly pay slips or remittance or deposit slips as well, which is fine, just need to know.

[Northwest87]

Another question: did the application process change from early September? 

 

If I remember correctly, the "APPLICATION FOR QUALIFICATION ENDORSEMENT FOR WEALTHY PENSIONER" fillable PDF file had to be downloaded, filled out, and uploaded with justificative documents in an email.  I have the PDF, and I see I have to register an account to apply but I'm not ready yet. Some here have mentioned uploaded documents on a page on the BOI web site. I could use a bit of clarification, as I'll have quite a load of docs to upload and an email format could be useful to supply explanation or a documents breakdown. So, are we still doing the email thing? Also, if it is known, will they take a merged PDF with all docs included?

 

Thanks in advance for the info,

 

NW

 

 

Edited October 23, 2022 by Northwest87

[Northwest87]

8 minutes ago, keemapoot said:

Let us know if they accept that redacted tax return without SSN #, and also I wonder if they will accept an e-filed tax return. I suppose they may want to see monthly pay slips or remittance or deposit slips as well, which is fine, just need to know.

From the docs I have seen, including the initial application pdf (if it's still what we're using), a tax form is one of the allowable docs, but it's not a mandatory one. From a question and test documents I exchanged with BOI last month, pay stubs and official documents stating your annual salary or income are also acceptable. My stubs include my annual salary so that works. The BOI is looking for gross income.

Edited October 23, 2022 by Northwest87

[ThailandRyan]

3 hours ago, Northwest87 said:

Yes, but if your open enrollment for 2023 is now and you lock it in, Blue Cross might be willing to issue a document. I'm in a similar situation with nov12-dec12 open season. As I understand it, as long as you get your BOI letter of endorsement and you move fast to get your visa issued before the end of February (count 3 weeks to be conservative with the issuance), you can squeak by. The fly on the ointment is to first get the official insurance letter with an expiration date on it.

And ergo why I used my Thai insurance carrier to meet the requirements this time around, with the current policy renewing in November and renewing my policy so it continued onward from November to the next November.  This was done the middle of September to meet the requirements.  As posted earlier in the OP i successfully obtained my LTRWP. 

 

So in 5 years, when it becomes time to redo the next 5 year portion, and do the uploads for the LTR, just maybe my US insurance with Anthem company, with whom I have a lifetime medical plan through my pension, might issue a certificate letter to that effect. Only time will tell.  Good luck to all who are in the process.

[ThailandRyan]

32 minutes ago, Northwest87 said:

Another question: did the application process change from early September? 

 

If I remember correctly, the "APPLICATION FOR QUALIFICATION ENDORSEMENT FOR WEALTHY PENSIONER" fillable PDF file had to be downloaded, filled out, and uploaded with justificative documents in an email.  I have the PDF, and I see I have to register an account to apply but I'm not ready yet. Some here have mentioned uploaded documents on a page on the BOI web site. I could use a bit of clarification, as I'll have quite a load of docs to upload and an email format could be useful to supply explanation or a documents breakdown. So, are we still doing the email thing? Also, if it is known, will they take a merged PDF with all docs included?

 

Thanks in advance for the info,

 

NW

 

 

No, just fill out the 3 pages of required info. Upload all required on page 4 and hit submit after checking that box just above and to the left of submit. There is an other box for uploading any other documents or letters needed. This was where I uploaded a Word document which indicated I did not require nor did I want a work permit, as they requested an upload of the work permit even though I check the box No.  System still has some glitches.

 

Filling it out and emailing it was for the pre-screening some of us did.

[aublumberg]

33 minutes ago, Northwest87 said:

Another question: did the application process change from early September? 

No change, application has always been via the BOI online system since start on 01 Sep 2022 when it was launched. If you go to https://ltr.boi.go.th/ in the upper right hand corner is an 'Apply' icon. Just click that and follow the instructions. Subject to the LTR visa type, details are provided what information and which documents are required, it's fairly straightforward. I don't believe applications by email are (or ever were) entertained. Suggest you register the online account and have a look around the forms, even if you're not ready to submit just yet. 

[keemapoot]

3 minutes ago, ThailandRyan said:

And ergo why I used my Thai insurance carrier to meet the requirements this time around, with the current policy renewing in November and renewing my policy so it continued onward from November to the next November.  This was done the middle of September to meet the requirements.  As posted earlier in the OP i successfully obtained my LTRWP. 

 

So in 5 years, when it becomes time to redo the next 5 year portion, and do the uploads for the LTR, just maybe my US insurance with Anthem company, with whom I have a lifetime medical plan through my pension, might issue a certificate letter to that effect. Only time will tell.  Good luck to all who are in the process.

Yeah, you are fortunate to have both, but again, I won't waste time and money  buying a redundant policy when I already have world class policy that works. I checked my policy renewal and it renews January 1, so my plan is probably to start the process Dec. 1, and then be ready to travel to BKK in January to do it at the BOI office. As another poster mentioned, you have to be in Thailand already to process at the BOI, so I may have to schedule a trip of a week or so to do this, but luckily I live in Asia, so not as bad as trekking across the globe to do it.

[Pib]

1 hour ago, keemapoot said:

Let us know if they accept that redacted tax return without SSN #, and also I wonder if they will accept an e-filed tax return. I suppose they may want to see monthly pay slips or remittance or deposit slips as well, which is fine, just need to know.

I think I remember someone submitting their IRS tax transcript....and those transcripts come with the SSN redacted (only last 4 digits shown),  name redacted (only part of the first and last name shown), and address redacted (on the first part of the street address.    I know for sure as I have an IRS online acct and have downloaded my transcript numerous times to include just a day ago.   

 

And for those who have seen your IRS transcript is a long doc in IRS language where some data field are in geek/tax man talk, etc.; does not look like the layman's return you submit.  Not quite sure a lot of it would make a lot of sense to a non-U.S. person like a BOI rep; but then again the BOI probably sees all types of business/personal financial docs they get from applicants who apply for the many different "setting up a business in Thailand" authorizations foreign businesses and people apply for.

 

Now if you submit your paper or efiled tax return you are going to have to manually redact such data.

 

 

 

 

Edited October 24, 2022 by Pib

[keemapoot]

2 minutes ago, Pib said:

I think I remember someone submitting their IRS tax transcript....and those transcripts come with the SSN redacted (only last 4 digits shown),  name redacted (only part of the first and last name shown), and address redacted (on the first part of the street address.    I know for sure as I have an IRS online acct and have downloaded my transcript numerous times to include just a day ago.   

 

And for those who have seen your IRS transcript is a long doc in IRS language where some data field are in geek/tax man talk, etc.; does not look like the layman's return you submit.  Not quite sure a lot of it would make a lot of sense to a non-U.S. person like a BOI rep

 

Now if you submit your paper or efiled tax return you are going to have to manually redact such data.

 

 

 

 

Excellent point! Yes, in fact I already have downloaded the last two years transcripts from IRS, I just wonder if BOI knows what these are? It's actually highly preferred by banks, governments and institutions rather than the laborious full return.

[Pib]

5 minutes ago, keemapoot said:

Excellent point! Yes, in fact I already have downloaded the last two years transcripts from IRS, I just wonder if BOI knows what these are? It's actually highly preferred by banks, governments and institutions rather than the laborious full return.

That's because U.S. institutions know what they are...are use to viewing/reviewing the "IRSise" the transcript is written in.....and it proves you did file an income tax return.   I don't have a warm, fuzzy feeling a BOI rep would understand the transcript.

Edited October 24, 2022 by Pib

[Pib]

13 minutes ago, ThailandRyan said:

...as they requested an upload of the work permit even though I check the box No. 

Regarding doc upload when the BOI has initially reviewed your application with docs you submitted at the BOI LTR website and then the BOI wants more....like upload of XYZ document you didn't initially include.

 

Do they send you an email asking for the upload OR do they call you asking for the doc OR are you prompted in some way when checking your online application for status OR ??????  

 

 

[ThailandRyan]

2 minutes ago, keemapoot said:

Yeah, you are fortunate to have both, but again, I won't waste time and money  buying a redundant policy when I already have world class policy that works. I checked my policy renewal and it renews January 1, so my plan is probably to start the process Dec. 1, and then be ready to travel to BKK in January to do it at the BOI office. As another poster mentioned, you have to be in Thailand already to process at the BOI, so I may have to schedule a trip of a week or so to do this, but luckily I live in Asia, so not as bad as trekking across the globe to do it.

Having both policies alleviates any out of pocket deductible I might have since the second policy will pick it up. My PCH policy, so I could obtain a cheaper premium, has a 100k Thb deductible when I go to the doctors. After that deductible is met then I am good to go.  I then submit a claim back to my US insurer which shows what I paid and they reimburse me. In the US I have no deductible. Here the US insurance only reimburses me after the incident. Not sure why the Thai hospitals can not bill them directly like they do my Thai insurer, on the other hand my pre-existing Conditions are not covered by my Thai Insurance and are by the US insurance. Most times an appointment here is for issues where pre-existing and actual new issues are seen by the doctors.

[keemapoot]

1 minute ago, ThailandRyan said:

 Here the US insurance only reimburses me after the incident. Not sure why the Thai hospitals can not bill them directly like they do my Thai insurer, on the other hand my pre-existing Conditions are not covered by my Thai Insurance and are by the US insurance. Most times an appointment here is for issues where pre-existing and actual new issues are seen by the doctors.

Yeah, My Cigna policy is great. The approved Thai hospitals (all the best ones) are preapproved, and they bill directly to Cigna, which has a representative in Malaysia they can contact immediately same day. For some routine exams, sometimes reimbursement is easier, but I understand your situation.

[ThailandRyan]

9 minutes ago, Pib said:

Regarding doc upload when the BOI has initially reviewed your application with docs you submitted at the BOI LTR website and then the BOI wants more....like upload of XYZ document you didn't initially include.

 

Do they send you an email asking for the upload OR do they call you asking for the doc OR are you prompted in some way when checking your online application for status OR ??????  

 

 

It can be found above your log in name. There will be a notification bell which will indicate you have a notice to look at. Click the notification and it will tell you what they need you to upload.

[JimGant]

My income tax filings are "married filing jointly." Thus, my individual taxable income is not separately broken out (except in the worksheets tax software, like TurboTax, utilize). Also, for self insurance for health, my required 100k is in a joint bank account. Does it, then, have to be 200k?

Any ideas/solutions?

[Pib]

For those of you which have been following this new LTR Visa much closer than I, do you have any intel/knowledge of how many LTR Visa's have been "approved/issued" so far?   When you log into your LTR acct the first pages shows a running count of SMART visas approved over the last few years and that count is only 625.  But I don't see anything talking the number LTR Visas approved.

 

I expect the BOI is still far, far short of the 1 million over 5 years which started 1 Sep 2022.  The Thai govt has stated they hope to issue one million LTR visas over 5 years which stated 1 Sep 2022.  That's 200K LTR visas per year. 

 

Since there is around 250 business days in every 365 day calendar year then 200,000 divided by 250 this means the BOI would have receive and approve on average 800 LTR visas "per business day."   I'd be surprised if they are approving more than a 5 to 10 per day.

Edited October 24, 2022 by Pib

[ThailandRyan]

35 minutes ago, JimGant said:

My income tax filings are "married filing jointly." Thus, my individual taxable income is not separately broken out (except in the worksheets tax software, like TurboTax, utilize). Also, for self insurance for health, my required 100k is in a joint bank account. Does it, then, have to be 200k?

Any ideas/solutions?

That is a very good question. Now, I would suspect your other joint filer is a Thai with US residency, or am I wrong as far as filing your taxes?. If it was another foreigner then you could probably use it for you and then your partner as an add on Visa, at a cost as well, and then having to show 100K USD more for their insurance.  I wonder if it was just for you and only you are the one earning for the income you could show the W-2 and write a word document which could be uploaded as well.  Just a few Ideas.  You could always call them and hopefully you get an answer.

[JimGant]

11 hours ago, Pib said:

Was those pension letters enough for the BOI to prove req'd 80K USD income; the BOI didn't require a tax return also?

I didn't see any requirement for tax returns for "pensioners." Only "global citizens" and "work in Thailand" categories. So, yeah, would be interesting to see if they're also asking for tax returns when their application requirements don't list it.

[keemapoot]

40 minutes ago, JimGant said:

My income tax filings are "married filing jointly." Thus, my individual taxable income is not separately broken out (except in the worksheets tax software, like TurboTax, utilize). Also, for self insurance for health, my required 100k is in a joint bank account. Does it, then, have to be 200k?

Any ideas/solutions?

If BOI could understand what a W-2 or 1099 is then this is easy for you to just show those for the income you received. Again, not sure of that one, just like the tax transcript question...

[ThailandRyan]

31 minutes ago, Pib said:

For those of you which have been following this new LTR Visa much closer than I, do you have any intel/knowledge of how many LTR Visa's have been "approved/issued" so far?   When you log into your LTR acct the first pages shows a running count of SMART visas approved over the last few years and that count is only 625.  But I don't see anything talking the number LTR Visas approved.

 

I expect the BOI is still far, far short of the 1 million over 5 years which started 1 Sep 2022.  The Thai govt has stated they hope to issue one million LTR visas over 5 years which stated 1 Sep 2022.  That's 200K LTR visas per year. 

 

Since there is around 250 business days in every 365 day calendar year then 200,000 divided by 250 this means the BOI would have receive and approve on average 800 LTR visas "per business day."   I'd be surprised if they are approving more than a 5 to 10 per day.

That number of 625 has not changed since the program went live unfortunately.  When I obtained my LTRWP I asked how many they had issued since the program went live in September and I was told I was the 15th person to obtain my LTR Visa.  I just summarized by that statement that it included all of the LTR's and only those issued by the LTR Unit in Bangkok, and not any from overseas.

[JimGant]

4 minutes ago, ThailandRyan said:

I wonder if it was just for you and only you are the one earning for the income you could show the W-2 and write a word document which could be uploaded as well.

Thanks for the ideas. But, I still wonder: Do I have to provide tax documents since this is not a listed requirement for "Wealthy Pensioner?" You've gone thru this process already -- what did you provide?

[ThailandRyan]

1 minute ago, JimGant said:

I didn't see any requirement for tax returns for "pensioners." Only "global citizens" and "work in Thailand" categories. So, yeah, would be interesting to see if they're also asking for tax returns when their application requirements don't list it.

I just submitted my letter I had requested from my Pension program which indicated the amount I am issued on a monthly basis and which also stated it was a lifetime pension which would never reduce and only grow as the COLA adjustments were added yearly.  They never asked for a tax return as an additional upload, and I would suspect they contacted the Pension program as the person who issued it had also indicated the following:

 

The current gross monthly benefit amount is $xx,xxx.xx and is a lifetime defined benefit pension which will never decrease and will have annual C.O.L.A. (cost of Living Adjustments) added to the retirement pension account of the retired employee.

If additional information is needed, please return a photocopy of this letter along with your request. Please be very specific as to the additional information required.  If you have any further questions please visit www.xxxxxxx.gov, or you may contact us toll free at 888 xxxxxxx (or xxx-xxx-xxxx).

Benefits Services Division

[ThailandRyan]

5 minutes ago, JimGant said:

Thanks for the ideas. But, I still wonder: Do I have to provide tax documents since this is not a listed requirement for "Wealthy Pensioner?" You've gone thru this process already -- what did you provide?

I just provided a letter from my Pension plan I had them issue, which is done annually, or can be requested at anytime.  With my Pension being Non-Taxable for certain reasons, a tax return would not show it as earned income and it would be listed as $0.00, but does have its own line a few below where the W-2 info and SS income is listed.

[Pib]

When filling out the online application for Pension/Fixed Income you just enter amounts at that stage of the application.,.see snapshot 1 below.  But at the very end of the application (Snapshot 2) where the main area for upload of docs is located I can only see two places where a person should upload income related docs like pension statements and that is Number 11 and possibly Number 16.  

 

And there are various disconnects/conflicts/head-scratchers between the general info on the public LTR website and the actual online application.  

 

Snapshot 1

 

 

 

 

Snapshot 2

 

[Pib]

29 minutes ago, ThailandRyan said:

That number of 625 has not changed since the program went live unfortunately.  When I obtained my LTRWP I asked how many they had issued since the program went live in September and I was told I was the 15th person to obtain my LTR Visa.  I just summarized by that statement that it included all of the LTR's and only those issued by the LTR Unit in Bangkok, and not any from overseas.

But aren't all of the LTRs "approved" (or maybe you can even say "issued") by the BOI regardless of whether the actual visa may be issued/stamped into your passport like at BOI immigration or a Thai embassy/consulate?   The BOI basically approves/directs/tells the immigration section at BOI  or Thai embassy/consulate that issue of a LTR visa is approved...the applicant now only needs to fork out the $50K payment to get the visa stamped into his passport.

[mudcat]

Head scratchers indeed - what is supposed to go where is unclear.

 

Should you choose to upload U.S. tax documents it would be good to let them know what they are looking for:

 

On a 1040 pension income is on line 5B and gross Social Security Benefit is on line 6a (6b has the 85% that is taxable income).

On the transcript my pension is on the bottom line of the first page, while my gross Social Security Benefit is on line 14 of the second page .

[ThailandRyan]

5 minutes ago, Pib said:

But aren't all of the LTRs "approved" (or maybe you can even say "issued") by the BOI regardless of whether the actual visa may be issued/stamped into your passport like at BOI immigration or a Thai embassy/consulate?   The BOI basically approves/directs/tells the immigration section at BOI  or Thai embassy/consulate that issue of a LTR visa is approved...the applicant now only needs to fork out the $50K payment to get the visa stamped into his passport.

You would be correct but then the numbers have been static and no one is maintaining the counter it appears.

[Pib]

5 minutes ago, mudcat said:

Head scratchers indeed - what is supposed to go where is unclear.

 

Should you choose to upload U.S. tax documents it would be good to let them know what they are looking for:

 

On a 1040 pension income is on line 5B and gross Social Security Benefit is on line 6a (6b has the 85% that is taxable income).

On the transcript my pension is on the bottom line of the first page, while my gross Social Security Benefit is on line 14 of the second page .

Initially I'm not going to upload my tax return unless I gotta....like they come back later and ask for it.  But for the pensions statements/letters I'm uploading I'm including a memo  that briefly explains I'm a govt retiree, receive X-amount of lifetime govt pensions, fixed income, etc.  That memo will also included a table listing each pension, the amount, and some remarks that some are 100% tax free, not reportable on a tax return, etc.  

[JimGant]

22 minutes ago, Pib said:

And there are various disconnects/conflicts/head-scratchers between the general info on the public LTR website and the actual online application.  

Haven't seen the actual online application, but only the requirements delineated here:

https://ltr.boi.go.th/page/application-forms.html

 

Where there's no requirement for tax forms, just: "Evidence showing the incomes in current year, e.g., pension."  And tax returns, being historical, wouldn't seem to fit the bill....

 

So, yeah, a disconnect, indeed, when you get to the actual application (oh, do you have to wear "business attire" in the photo required in the actual application?).