Procedure For Obtaining A Death Certificate

[shortstop2]

What is the procedure for obtaining a death certificate?   I'm specifically interested in what documentation a Thai in a long term but not married  relationship must provide.

[nglodnig]

Step 1 - die ???? 

Step 2 - if we are talking about a foreigner, then contact the local police who I believe will contact the respective embassy. If they don't then ask the Thai person to contact them direct. They MUST be informed AFAIK

 

Sorry if the answer is somewhat facetious but the question IS a bit vague.

Edited August 11, 2023 by nglodnig

[shortstop2]

I'll try to make the question less vague.

 

When I, a foreigner, die exactly how does my girlfriend get my death certificate so that she can prove my death and collect an inheritance? 

 

Does she go to the local police?  My embassy?  

 

I would assume that the local police or my embassy won't give a death certificate to just anybody so what is normally required in order for her to get the death certificate.

 

I get that some will get their jollies by having fun with my questions.  That's OK. But I hope that I also get a couple of thoughtful responses that can point me in the right direction.

 

 

Edited August 11, 2023 by shortstop2

[nglodnig]

1 minute ago, shortstop2 said:

get that some will get their jollies my having fun with my questions

Not me. It's a question I ask myself as I expect my Thai wife to outlive me.

 

Step 1 - get a JOINT will from a Thai lawyer (we got one for approx 5k baht) and they will lodge it with the Amphur, This is believe is water tight.

 

Step 2 - if necessary if you have assets outside Thailand in that country a will in that country would be helpful as well. I don't think Thai wills will cover assets outside of Thailand. Even if they do, it wouldn't hurt.

 

Step 3 - pass on the necessary contact details to your Thai GF.
- Bank accounts - I imagine you have a 800k deposit in your name only. Go to the bank and get your GF to be made beneficiary in the event of your death, on the production of a (Thai) death certificate.

 

Step 4 - REALLY IMPORTANT get your GF to inform the embassy of your country. I believe (but I am no expert as I've never died before ha ha ???? ) that the local police will do that anyway. But best to make sure.

 

Step 5 - "Your inheritance": is whatever is in your will. Get a RELIABLE lawyer as your executor and get your GF to contact them.

 

Assets outside of Thailand you would need a will in that country (and a executor your GF can contact).

 

I imagine your embassy would arrange a death cert for your home country.

 

Hope this helps. As I said, this is on my mind as well. 

 

 

[topt]

12 hours ago, shortstop2 said:

What is the procedure for obtaining a death certificate?   I'm specifically interested in what documentation a Thai in a long term but not married  relationship must provide.

This may be useful to show it is not necessarily easy to do - see especially @Sherylcomments towards the end although you do not say what country you are from -

https://aseannow.com/topic/1222568-death-certificate/

 

Your partner may need written permission from your next of kin which you could set up in advance.

 

[Dirk Z]

The official death certificate comes from the district office. This is after the police, in case of a foreigner, release the body, with our without autopsy. For inheritance issues a will is required and translations need to be provided. These need to be legalized and certified by Ministry of foreign affairs and the relevant embassy.

[LukKrueng]

If you die in a hospital, the hospital will issue the death certificate.

If you die at home I think your gf or whoever find your body will have to call the police. They'll check if there's any faul play and if they think it was not of natural causes they'll investigate further. If no faul play they'll approve removal of the body, probably to the local hospital and a doctor there will issue the certificate.

[Muhendis]

9 hours ago, shortstop2 said:

I would assume that the local police or my embassy won't give a death certificate to just anybody so what is normally required in order for her to get the death certificate.

Neither police nor embassy staff are qualified to judge if you are dead or not.

That is the job of your local hospital doctor. 

[jeddas]

Have asked Britsh consulate (on line) process for allowing disposal of body for cremation. As usual-no reply. Consulate is useless.

[brianthainess]

1 hour ago, LukKrueng said:

If you die in a hospital, the hospital will issue the death certificate.

Even then some are sent for autopsy, and it is them who issue the death cert. it also has to be registered at the Amphur where you lived.

[brianthainess]

17 minutes ago, jeddas said:

Have asked Britsh consulate (on line) process for allowing disposal of body for cremation. As usual-no reply. Consulate is useless.

As above and can not get the body released, until death registered with Amphur. Any funeral directors recommended by embassies are the best way to go IMO they take care of all that is required. Your GF will need a letter of attorney from your family sent to your embassy. Anyhow that is how it panned out when my mate died and I was the only one here to arrange everything, 'cept the cremation my wife took care of that  

[khunPer]

As mentioned above, a last will is very important, as a girlfriend is not an heir without a will. You can also appoint your girlfriend as executor in the will. Even a simple document signed by two witnesses can serve as a valid last will; you can even sign it at the local amphor office and have it kept on file there.

(Source: "Thai Law for Foreigners", page 77-80.)

[poppysdad]

When my British wife died here albeit a few years ago now, the hospital issued me with a document that I along with a Thai friend to help me to the district office where I was then given the official death certificate in the Thai language. As I needed an English translation I then took that document for translation. It was all very easy but I did have the help mainly for language problems of a Thai friend and I believe the cost was absolute minimal. 

[Delight]

Back in 2021 my friend died in a Pattaya Hospital

I contacted his ex wife.

He had left a Will -covering is UK assets.

He had no Thai assets.

I visited the Pattaya hospital where he  had died. My mission was to obtain a death certificate.

However-because i was not family -the hospital could not help.

Pattaya has no facilities to store bodies.

So the body plus his passport were sent to Bangkok.

The passport ended up at the British Embassy.

The body was cremated.

Embassies cannot issue death certificates.

End of story.

I cannot see that death certificates can be issued to friends of the deceased.

If somebody has absolute evidence that my statement is incorrect-i would be pleased to hear

 

The only solution that will work for the OP is to legally  marry his girlfriend.

With that in place -all is simple and straight forward.

 

Edited August 12, 2023 by Delight
added detail

[mrwebb8825]

17 hours ago, shortstop2 said:

I get that some will get their jollies by having fun with my questions.  That's OK.

In that case... Have the gf get a few poloroids standing over your decapitated body with a smoking gun and large knife. Make sure your passport is visible. ????

Edited August 12, 2023 by mrwebb8825

[dddave]

7 hours ago, jeddas said:

Have asked Britsh consulate (on line) process for allowing disposal of body for cremation. As usual-no reply. Consulate is useless.

Both the British and US Embassy have detailed instructions and FAQs on their websites.  Not that hard really.  

A friend was hit by a car in Pattaya and later died from his injuries.  Hospitals can make the issuing of the Death Certificate difficult by demanding full payment before issuing it while insurance companies demand the Death Certificate before they will pay a penny. 

There is actually a great deal of paperwork involved in the custody of and the handling the body, and ultimately the cremation of the remains.  My friends family elected to use a service that specializes in such arrangements.  They took care of all the paperwork, arranged the custody and transfer of the body and also arranged the temple funeral with both Buddhist monks and a Christian Priest in attendance.  All in, it was about B45,000 which under the circumstances was money well spent. 

Edited August 12, 2023 by dddave

[Kwaibill]

Yes. As I’ve told my wife if I die at home the police are the first call. The US embassy has pretty good instructions on their web page. Kinda hope I go in hospital to save her some bother.

In my US will which we have also translated to Thai the funeral arrangements are left to Mrs. Kwai’s preference. A quick Buddhist ceremony and warm send off are good by me.

I want to ensure she has funds while awaiting the probate process in the US, which I understand can take a year. Have to ask at Bkk bank to be sure she has access.

[JimGant]

On 8/11/2023 at 11:22 PM, shortstop2 said:

What is the procedure for obtaining a death certificate?   I'm specifically interested in what documentation a Thai in a long term but not married  relationship must provide.

Yeah, if she were your wife, she's automatically your next of kin (NOK) -- and as such, is granted the authority to receive all the death related paperwork, and the authority to dictate disposal of the body. But a girlfriend....?

 

Well, if you made her your Executor in your Will, then she's your "legal representative." And using the US example, the Embassy/Consulate will grant her the same authority as a NOK

Quote

"Prepare documents for the disposition of the remains in accordance with instructions from the next-of-kin or legal representative." https://th.usembassy.gov/u-s-citizen-services/death-of-a-u-s-citizen/

This is somewhat recent, as apparently the State Dept got tired of trying to locate a NOK, or at least one who wanted to help.....

 

As an aside, for Yanks -- once you parlay the hospital certificate of death into the official "Civil Registry of Death Certificate" from the Tessabahn/Amphur -- you then need to have this translated into English by a certified translator. Then, the Embassy/Consulate will issue -- to the NOK/Legal Representative -- a "Consular Report of Death Abroad," the equivalent of a US death certificate. But, if this requires a trip to the Embassy/Consulate (don't know...) -- obviously a pain for those outside Bangkok or Chiang Mai. But, I checked with everyone in the States that require a death certificate to payout insurance, start survivor benefits, etc -- and they said the Thai death certificate, accompanied with a certified translation, is perfectly acceptable. So, maybe no trip to the Embassy/Consulate required....

 

Oh, one other possible hickup -- to release the body for burial, some hospitals require authorization from your Embassy/Consulate. Thus, as the NOK/Executor, you may be required to go in person with the deceased's passport and Will -- to get the necessary paperwork. Again, don't know if you could do this all online -- if not today, probably someday.

 

Actually, I like the idea of a bureaucratic SNAFU, where I remain on ice for a year, until the police arrange for a pauper's funeral, using taxpayer funds. Would serve them right for all those annoyances at my annual Immigration extensions..

[dddave]

On 8/12/2023 at 10:16 PM, Kwaibill said:

Have to ask at Bkk bank to be sure she has access.

This is a very sticky issue and don't trust Bangkok Bangkok bank employees to give accurate information.  My deceased friends brother who is handling the estate has found it to be very complex and time consuming to have any access to his brother's BKB account.

The moment you die, your bank accounts become part of the estate and legally a deceased person's wife can not access the account, even if it is a joint account.    

My friends brother has to have power of attorney in Thailand which can only be approved by a Thai court.  he had to get notarized and legally translated statements from his other siblings renouncing any claim to the estate and he's still not done.  There was no will in Thailand and that has created huge issues.

[acepredator]

On 8/12/2023 at 4:29 AM, nglodnig said:

Go to the bank and get your GF to be made beneficiary in the event of your death, on the production of a (Thai) death certificate.

I went to Bangkok Bank and specifically asked them to make my companion the beneficiary of my bank accounts with them, and they told me unequivocally that they could not do so. The branch manager told me that my assets on deposit with the bank would be distributed according to my last will and testament, and by no other means. I assume every other bank in Thailand has the same policy, so your statement, quoted above, is inaccurate. The original poster would be well advised to ignore it.

[couchpotato]

8 minutes ago, acepredator said:

I went to Bangkok Bank and specifically asked them to make my companion the beneficiary of my bank accounts with them, and they told me unequivocally that they could not do so. The branch manager told me that my assets on deposit with the bank would be distributed according to my last will and testament, and by no other means. I assume every other bank in Thailand has the same policy, so your statement, quoted above, is inaccurate. The original poster would be well advised to ignore it.

You are correct, but the 'Will' still needs to go thru the court process before the bank will release funds.

The best way around this is to have joint accounts, with either/or signature.

[acepredator]

2 minutes ago, couchpotato said:

You are correct, but the 'Will' still needs to go thru the court process before the bank will release funds.

The best way around this is to have joint accounts, with either/or signature.

Yes, that's true. I have a joint savings account with my companion, but the fixed account with 800,000 for my retirement visa is, of course, in my name alone. This is the most valuable asset I have in my Thai will, of which my companion is the executor. I hope that the court process  you mentioned won't be too complicated or lengthy so that she can get access to my assets without any undue delay.

[nglodnig]

1 hour ago, acepredator said:

bank would be distributed according to my last will and testament,

I SPECIFICALLY TOLD the OP to get a will (step 1)

[couchpotato]

53 minutes ago, acepredator said:

Yes, that's true. I have a joint savings account with my companion, but the fixed account with 800,000 for my retirement visa is, of course, in my name alone. This is the most valuable asset I have in my Thai will, of which my companion is the executor. I hope that the court process  you mentioned won't be too complicated or lengthy so that she can get access to my assets without any undue delay.

I believe the time period is between 3-6 months, but that was a few years ago.

So possibly quicker these days, but will still take a long time.

[shortstop2]

On 8/12/2023 at 3:44 PM, khunPer said:

As mentioned above, a last will is very important, as a girlfriend is not an heir without a will. You can also appoint your girlfriend as executor in the will. Even a simple document signed by two witnesses can serve as a valid last will; you can even sign it at the local amphor office and have it kept on file there.

(Source: "Thai Law for Foreigners", page 77-80.)

Last year,  I created a new Thai will as I have a new bank account which wasn't listed in the old will.

 

The first lawyer had no interest in going to the amphur to have the will registered.  My girlfriend and I went and couldn't figure out how to do it.  It's a busy amphur; perhaps easier at others.  My new lawyer also said it wasn't necessary.   I got the impression from him that perhaps there was a downside to registering in case I subsequently create a new will that doesn't get registered.  at any rate, right now it is not registered.

 

I suppose that with the Thai will she can get death certificates that my USA brokerage account will accept where she is named as a beneficiary. 

 

Thanks for all the responses so far!   ????

 

 

 

 

[khunPer]

1 hour ago, shortstop2 said:

The first lawyer had no interest in going to the amphur to have the will registered.  My girlfriend and I went and couldn't figure out how to do it.  It's a busy amphur; perhaps easier at others.  My new lawyer also said it wasn't necessary.   I got the impression from him that perhaps there was a downside to registering in case I subsequently create a new will that doesn't get registered.  at any rate, right now it is not registered.

Yes, it's not necessary to have it registered.

The important issue is that when you – and I – is not here anymore, somebody knows that there is a last will and can find it.

 

1 hour ago, shortstop2 said:

I suppose that with the Thai will she can get death certificates that my USA brokerage account will accept where she is named as a beneficiary.

That might be one of the reasons for the advice to make two wills, one for Thailand and one for one's home-country.

[JimGant]

On 8/14/2023 at 10:55 PM, acepredator said:

I went to Bangkok Bank and specifically asked them to make my companion the beneficiary of my bank accounts with them, and they told me unequivocally that they could not do so. The branch manager told me that my assets on deposit with the bank would be distributed according to my last will and testament

Thailand has no provision for naming a beneficiary for your bank account, akin to the Pay on Death (POD) policy available in the US, which allows the bank account to avoid probate. This subject surfaces frequently on this forum, as does: will a joint account be frozen upon death of a co-owner? Legally, no. But apparently it has happened several times, with a confused bank manager. Best advice: Have the surviving account owner transfer out the funds to his or her individual account -- should an errant bank manager get word of the death -- just to be on the safe side.

 

For your individual account, that can't be joint for Immigration purposes -- have your companion named as a co-signatory. This will allow her or him to access your account with your passbook, which will have his name affixed to it in UV readable ink -- thus no confusion for Immigration to ponder. He can also get his own ATM card, if desired. Thus, upon your death, have him go to the bank and clean out most of the funds (he can't close the account). Or, if you have online banking, have him do an online transfer, as you've given him your password and set up the transfer procedure ahead of time (where setting up a third party account requires the One Time Password drill).

 

Strictly speaking, the bank is supposed to freeze your individual account *IF* they get word of the owner's death (being a co-signature account doesn't change this). By why would they? -- no one is obligated to tell them. And if your companion is your sole beneficiary and Will executor -- who's going to raise a fuss -- legal or ethical -- about your companion/beneficiary/executor cleaning out your account? Yeah, the lawyer mafia will be upset your companion avoided probate -- and the 50,000 baht fee. But what normal person would be upset about that?