Thailand to tax residents’ foreign income irrespective of remittance

[essex boys]

Hi all, I’m going for my drivers license in Khon Kaen next week, I need to get a certificate of residency from Khon Kaen immigration, is this free or is there a fee to pay?

[brianthainess]

14 minutes ago, essex boys said:

Hi all, I’m going for my drivers license in Khon Kaen next week, I need to get a certificate of residency from Khon Kaen immigration, is this free or is there a fee to pay?

It is supposed to be free, with a few days wait, but their seems to be an 'Express' fee at some offices 200-500 baht, do not expect a receipt for this Bribe 'fee'. 

[Neeranam]

I've shown my address for the DL there with Work Permit once and also with the Yellow Housebook. If you have neither, the residence certificate is free, although they told me they usually charge people. 

[VocalNeal]

Where I live we go to DLT first and get a letter requesting a cert. from Immigration, Then go to immigration.

[Neeranam]

10 minutes ago, VocalNeal said:

Where I live we go to DLT first and get a letter requesting a cert. from Immigration, Then go to immigration.

Does that get it free?

[GroveHillWanderer]

In Hua Hin, it used to be 500 Baht and you got it straight away. Now it's free, but you have to wait three days. 

 

There was no mention of an option to pay and get it quicker. I would have taken that if available as I was renewing my driver's licence which had already expired and I didn't want to be driving around on an expired licence any longer than I had to.

[ripstanley]

12 minutes ago, Neeranam said:

Does that get it free?

They are free if you can wait three days up to a week. If you want it the same day 500 baht

Edited August 21, 2023 by ripstanley

[gomangosteen]

Provincial variations. I've been dealing with Chanthaburi Immigration since 2011, last week asked for another residence certificate and a very clear 'No we cannot issue them any more'.

 

An affidavit of residence is new required from the embassy in Bangkok. 

 

Such is life. I'll get two - 

 

Friday I went to the local Bangkok Bank branch with view to finally opening an account here as the one I have is from another province. Another 'cannot do' without an embassy letter. 

 

Edited August 21, 2023 by gomangosteen

[essex boys]

DLT have given me a letter to give to immigration asking for a certificate of residency , no doubt it’s free but I will donate a few hundred baht to help things along

[Danny Australia]

I have been obtaining a certificate of residency at least once a year for various reasons at Jomtien and always paid 300 Bahts and of course no receipt. 

Never been asked if it was required for same day or 3 days later so not sure the free option is even available.

[bradiston]

11 hours ago, Danny Australia said:

I have been obtaining a certificate of residency at least once a year for various reasons at Jomtien and always paid 300 Bahts and of course no receipt. 

Never been asked if it was required for same day or 3 days later so not sure the free option is even available.

300 me too just last week, Jomtien. 2 photos, tm30, rental contract, passport and copy of passport including details page, page with first visa, latest visa and entry stamp, application form stating reason for application. Same day.

[barnsleyman]

20 hours ago, GroveHillWanderer said:

In Hua Hin, it used to be 500 Baht and you got it straight away. Now it's free, but you have to wait three days. 

 

There was no mention of an option to pay and get it quicker. I would have taken that if available as I was renewing my driver's licence which had already expired and I didn't want to be driving around on an expired licence any longer than I had to.

You can renew a Thai driving License up to 6 Months if it has expired.

[Tom89]

In Phayao I was told 1 year. 

[GroveHillWanderer]

1 hour ago, barnsleyman said:

You can renew a Thai driving License up to 6 Months if it has expired.

I believe it's up to a year, actually. However that wouldn't save you from the fine for driving on an expired license if you get stopped.

[essex boys]

Spoke to immigration in Khon Kaen today, there’s no charge for the proof of residency letter, no doubt I will contribute a few hundred baht to keep everyone happy 

[racyrick]

16 hours ago, essex boys said:

Spoke to immigration in Khon Kaen today, there’s no charge for the proof of residency letter, no doubt I will contribute a few hundred baht to keep everyone happy 

What phone number did you use?

I have tried to call KK Imm all day yesterday and today and the phone will not connect.

Thanks

[Negita43]

One thing to bear in mind  if you wait for the residence cert - make sure your medical cert (valid 1 month I believe) doesn't expire in the "waiting period" for the residence cert - last time for me ( last year) it was a 10 day wait for the residence cert in in Korat

[essex boys]

@racyrick thé mrs called the number listed, it rang a few times but they answered fairly quickly.

went to Khon Kaen immigration yesterday ( Wednesday) and got my certificate of residency took all of 10 minutes to sort out, got the medical booked in at the local clinic for 4pm Friday, then all set for my test on the 30th

[racyrick]

1 hour ago, essex boys said:

@racyrick thé mrs called the number listed, it rang a few times but they answered fairly quickly.

went to Khon Kaen immigration yesterday ( Wednesday) and got my certificate of residency took all of 10 minutes to sort out, got the medical booked in at the local clinic for 4pm Friday, then all set for my test on the 30th

Thanks, went there today and they said there were issues with the phone, so your Mrs. got lucky.

Glad all went well for you.

[essex boys]

@racyrick glad you got sorted,…it was a funny atmosphere in there when I went the IO’s are normally ok they have a chat etc but there was one of the IO’s walking around asking if people were being dealt with etc, looked like he might have been the boss, then there was a younger bloke walking around trying to talk to any of the foreigners in there and playing up a bit to try and impress the two pretty girls that were working on the counter on the left as you walk in the doors….they seemed to me to be overly helpful, but anyway I got my stuff sorted quickly and I was on my way….as an aside anyone else think those stairs in there are a killer on your knees..they are steep and narrow, it’s almost like you can’t put your foot on them properly ..

[ThaiLawOnline]

I can explain the history of the fees for the certificate of residency. It is not in the law, it is not in a regulation.

 

Around 2007-2008, a Belgian man complained in Korat about the new 200 baht fee for the certificate of residency. It was free before, but they decided to charge 200 baht. After the complaint, which was posted on local forums that immigration officers also read, they stopped providing the service for a few months. They removed the forms that were normally available at the counter.

 

The pressure from foreigners who wanted the service to be available again for things like driver's licenses was high. They eventually resumed the service, but they started charging 500 baht. This was followed by many other offices that used to provide the service for free, and the fees ranged from 200 to 500 baht. At first, the document had a date but no expiration date. Later, I saw documents that said "valid until September 30, 2010" for example.

 

The document was necessary for driver's licenses (if you do not have a work permit or a yellow ta bian baan). It was also required by foreign banks as proof of address.

 

A client of mine once made a police report about his address to buy a car, and it worked perfectly. However, this was in Khon Kaen around 2008-2009.

 

I am still confused about why the transportation department would accept a document from immigration but not a lease agreement. Immigration will issue a certificate of residency based on a lease agreement, without any verification (normally, unless they have changed their procedures). TIT.
 

Thailand is a land of bureaucracy and paperwork. Immigration once refused to issue me a document similar to a re-entry permit. I took them to the administrative court and got it the next day. You cannot always let authorities play their "arbitrary" games. There is a thin line between discretion and arbitrariness. Grey areas are everywhere in Thailand. Unfortunately, they are slowing down progress, human rights and the rule of law in this country, I have friends that LOVE these grey areas as they can do here, what would be impossible in western countries.

[bbko]

Many years back when I 1st applied for my Thai driver's license, I showed them my yellow book and was told I need the letter from immigration. WTF is my yellow book for then? When I renewed my license 2 years later, my yellow book was ok, 555, what a country.

[Neeranam]

6 hours ago, ThaiLawOnline said:

Thailand is a land of bureaucracy and paperwork. Immigration once refused to issue me a document similar to a re-entry permit. I took them to the administrative court and got it the next day. You cannot always let authorities play their "arbitrary" games. There is a thin line between discretion and arbitrariness. Grey areas are everywhere in Thailand. Unfortunately, they are slowing down progress, human rights and the rule of law in this country, I have friends that LOVE these grey areas as they can do here, what would be impossible in western countries.

I don't recommend taking immigration to court, they can be very 'mai po jai' or resentful, with serious consequences. 

It's better to contact the Ombudsman.

https://www.ombudsman.go.th/

Alternatively, contact some police friend to have a word. 

Once I went to Nong Kai immigration with some influential Khon Kaen people, including a University rector, who just happened to be travelling to NK for a funeral so took me along and came into  the immigration wearing their white uniforms. This is when Khon Kaen didn't have an immigration. The immigration guy flexed his muscles and felt like his kingdom was being invaded and sent them on their way and the consequences were painful for me, I had to travel to Nong Kai every month for nearly a year.

Much different story when I had a problem and got a police friend, who was in charge of 7 Northern provinces to have a word! 

Another suggesting I have is to contact some politicians to look into it. 

Once upon a time, Khon kaen Imm had a tip box. I contacted former Minister of Finance, Korn Chatikavanich, who posted the phot of it on his Facebook page,

 

[thaitom]

On 8/21/2023 at 8:12 PM, gomangosteen said:

Provincial variations. I've been dealing with Chanthaburi Immigration since 2011, last week asked for another residence certificate and a very clear 'No we cannot issue them any more'.

 

An affidavit of residence is new required from the embassy in Bangkok. 

 

Such is life. I'll get two - 

 

Friday I went to the local Bangkok Bank branch with view to finally opening an account here as the one I have is from another province. Another 'cannot do' without an embassy letter. 

 

If your from the  USA the embassy (consulates) have stopped issuing these letters.

[soi3eddie]

14 minutes ago, thaitom said:

If your from the  USA the embassy (consulates) have stopped issuing these letters.

Same if from UK. British Consulate stopped issuing "affirmation of residence" in December 2022.

 

[ThaiLawOnline]

1 hour ago, Neeranam said:

I don't recommend taking immigration to court, they can be very 'mai po jai' or resentful, with serious consequences. 

It's better to contact the Ombudsman.

https://www.ombudsman.go.th/

Alternatively, contact some police friend to have a word. 

Once I went to Nong Kai immigration with some influential Khon Kaen people, including a University rector, who just happened to be travelling to NK for a funeral so took me along and came into  the immigration wearing their white uniforms. This is when Khon Kaen didn't have an immigration. The immigration guy flexed his muscles and felt like his kingdom was being invaded and sent them on their way and the consequences were painful for me, I had to travel to Nong Kai every month for nearly a year.

Much different story when I had a problem and got a police friend, who was in charge of 7 Northern provinces to have a word! 

Another suggesting I have is to contact some politicians to look into it. 

Once upon a time, Khon kaen Imm had a tip box. I contacted former Minister of Finance, Korn Chatikavanich, who posted the phot of it on his Facebook page,

 

Unfortunately, I am a foreign attorney, with 19 years living in Thailand.

i managed a law firm for 17 years. I took immigration twice at the administrative court and won twice.

 

Not only that, a client of mine works for the administrate court in Bangkok and told me everything you can imagine or not about the administrative court. I also have permanent residency.

 

So I have NO IDEA who you are, what job you do, but I think I know what I am doing,. I do not want to be impolite, but you really have no idea about what you talk. Because I doubt you ever dealt with the administrative court in Thailand and I deal with court every month, for 17 years, hundreds of cases.

 

Good luck with your “ombudsman”. Whatever you do, if it works for you, do it. I was living in Isaan and never pay tea money for an extension. I might know people more affluent that you and I do know cultural things like “losing face” and many others. Thailand is a country of compromise but when you have tried and it does not work, some courts will do the job. Ask Prayut about the constitutional court.  ????

[ThaiLawOnline]

8 hours ago, bbko said:

Many years back when I 1st applied for my Thai driver's license, I showed them my yellow book and was told I need the letter from immigration. WTF is my yellow book for then? When I renewed my license 2 years later, my yellow book was ok, 555, what a country.

Exactly. You met people that are stubborn, useless and do not understand. That happens so many times in Thailand.  They apply rules without knowing why they apply it. They do not think very deep….

[essex boys]

My certificate of residency cost nothing from Khon Kaen immigration about 3 weeks ago

[Neeranam]

1 hour ago, ThaiLawOnline said:

I also have permanent residency.

 

So I have NO IDEA who you are, what job you do, but I think I know what I am doing,. I do not want to be impolite, but you really have no idea about what you talk. Because I doubt you ever dealt with the administrative court in Thailand and I deal with court every month, for 17 years, hundreds of cases.

 

What does you having permanent residency got to do with anything? 

I'm a naturalized Thai citizen, living in Thailand for 30 years and you are being impolite. 

You haven't got a clue what you are talking about.

It's due to foreigners like you complaining that they raised the charge of residence certificates, and made it harder to get visas.

When you live here longer and integrate into Thai society, you learn about vital cultural things like 'greng jai' and 'boon koon'. 

I've no idea what's you come from but in Thailand we use indirect communication style, and non-confrontational behaviour unlike you. 

Taking immigration to court over some document( which you never mention what it was) is ridiculous advice for forum members, especially coming from an ex lawyer. 

 

 

 

[ThaiLawOnline]

 

We call this a defensive mechanism. You are projecting your own problems onto someone else. So let me answer you:

 

For your information, in 2008, I was the one who translated the visa extension for all foreigners in Thailand, free of charge. This is known as Police Order 777/2551. I am not the one who causes problems for expats; I solve their problems.

 

Having permanent residency does not mean I know more than others, but it is the most difficult thing to obtain, and I did it on my own. This means that I also have a certain understanding of Thailand. Just like you like to say that you are a naturalized Thai citizen, which I could also apply for tomorrow. You say that to make me look like I don't know about Thai culture. Well, I also lived in Isaan, had Thai employees, and can read and write Thai. I have no lessons to learn from you. I put that to show you that I am also integrated into Thai culture and there is nothing that you wrote that I didn’t know. But you are attacking the wrong person and I was not impolite, just putting you at your place.

 

Do foreigners like me cause problems? I am the one who challenged the TM30 law in 2019 and started the movement to change it. Many people like you said that nothing would come of it, but the government changed the policy in 2020 and eased the TM30 requirements.

 

You are right that non-confrontational and third-party solutions are the best way to solve problems, but that is my job. I do this every day. I am not being impolite; I am telling you that you have no idea who you are talking to. I have more experience with ombudsmen, courts, Thai authorities, and problem-solving than you could ever imagine.

 

I explained the case of the foreigner who complained about the residence permit as an anecdote. I know the guy, and I disagree with what he did and how he did it. I am not Belgian.

 

Name one foreigner who has changed Thai law. I don't know of any except myself. So sit down, stop shouting, and learn a little bit. It is very impolite to be stubborn, to underestimate other people, and to explain things like you are the only one who knows.

 

I have dealt with 30 different ombudsmen in my life in different countries. You are the one who does not know that.

 

This is me in a BBC article:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-49470726

 

And this is the link to the modifications to the TM30 law that were made in 2020 to help foreigners:

https://www.bangkokpost.com/business/general/1941048

 

You have no idea what I have done to help expats in Thailand. You, what did you do to help expats or Thailand? Giving money to a temple? What an arrogant guy you are. Telling someone who has 30 years of experience in law, 17 in Thailand, how to use an ombudsman and how to deal with legal problems.

 

You are like the sick patient telling the doctor what to do and telling him he is also impolite, arrogant, know nothing about medications and you know more because you got the disease….

 

Great arguments. I do not have time and more energy to read your next comments so do not be surprised if I don’t reply. I feel it is un accessory and losing my time. Because you know so much about how the Thai system works…