Writing about the future, from a point further in the future.

[JayClay]

When constructing a piece of creative writing in the English language it's fairly easy, in the opening sentence, to establish that you are narrating on an event that has yet to happen, but from the perspective of even further in the future.

 

For example if I start an article with the sentence "On January 20, 3015, Mr Spoon sat at the breakfast table", the reader knows that the narrator is speaking from some point further in the future than Jan 20, 3015. And the story would go on to tell the rest of the story in the past tense.. ie "He woke up, brushed his teeth and walked out the front door, leaving his keys on the kitchen table".

 

Is there any function of the Thai language which can easily and clearly set up such a scene? Tenses in Thailand are limited at best, and generally abused in every day speech anyway.

 

Taking the original text...

On January 20, 2035, Mr Spoon sat at the breakfast table

 

We could translate that as

20 มกราคม 3015, Mr Spoon นั่งที่โต๊ะอาหารเช้า

 

However, my understanding of how Thais use their language, this could cause the reader confusion...

 

The reader may conclude that 3015 is a typo, and actually the writer meant 2015, and then go on to read the rest of the text as if it had taken place in the past.

 

Or they could conclude that this is a prediction about what is going to happen in the future. Now, technically, if we're talking about what will happen in the future we should be useing จะ, ie "20 มกราคม 3015, Mr Spoon จะนั่งที่โต๊ะอาหารเช้า, however we also know that Thai is a relatively loose language, and I'm not confident that the reader would always be able to note the lack of จะ and arrive at the conclusion that the article is written from the intended perspective; I rather think there's a high risk that the sentence could be read with an "invisible" จะ, and the reader would see this as a prediction/forcast of what will happen in the future.

 

So, yea, does anyone know how I could start such a written work which would unambiguously indicate that I am narrating from a point further in the future than the event itself? Or is this just not possible in Thai?

[Bredbury Blue]

With "On January 20, 3015, Mr Spoon sat at the breakfast table" in english, the reader doesn't get confused and assume you mean 2015, so why would a Thai in thai language get confused? My mate Google says use วันที่ 20 มกราคม 3015 คุณสปูนนั่งอยู่ที่โต๊ะอาหารเช้า which looks correct and clear to me.

[owl sees all]

Interesting topic.

 

Right at the moment I'm writing a piece that could get to 50k+ words. And it has time conflicts within it. The story centres around a village, whose inhabitants live perfectly happy lives sometime in the past, but also in the present. They have only just discovered the wheel. But can do wonders with the elements round them. Might say they have skills that modern living has left behind; in the relentless pursuit of progress.

 

The village is visited by different 'things'. One of these visitors is a 'robot' called Digger Dog. The robot is in the present but obviously far more advanced than the villagers.

 

Eventually they leave their village, due to it becoming uninhabitable, in an 'air-ship'. Powered in a most unique way. Then the adventures begin.

 

To add to the village challenges, two of the inhabitants speak in a strange lingo'; a very basic East London slang. It is not easily understood, and leads to problems within the village. Making for new story lines.

 

There is going to be at least 50 sections (completed 33). But once they leave their village the stories go to infinity.

 

Not in Thai at the mo. But if the daughter gets the urge, she could probably translate it in a month or so.

 

Edited November 7, 2023 by owl sees all

[JayClay]

19 hours ago, Bredbury Blue said:

With "On January 20, 3015, Mr Spoon sat at the breakfast table" in english, the reader doesn't get confused and assume you mean 2015, so why would a Thai in thai language get confused?

 

Because in English we have a stuctured and unambiguous tense system.

[Bredbury Blue]

On 11/7/2023 at 2:43 PM, Bredbury Blue said:

With "On January 20, 3015, Mr Spoon sat at the breakfast table" in english, the reader doesn't get confused and assume you mean 2015, so why would a Thai in thai language get confused? My mate Google says use วันที่ 20 มกราคม 3015 คุณสปูนนั่งอยู่ที่โต๊ะอาหารเช้า which looks correct and clear to me.

 

ในอนาคตวันที่ 20 มกราคม 3015 คุณสปูนนั่งอยู่ที่โต๊ะอาหารเช้า

In the future, January 20, 3015, Mr. Spoon is sitting at the breakfast table.

[JayClay]

10 hours ago, Bredbury Blue said:

 

ในอนาคตวันที่ 20 มกราคม 3015 คุณสปูนนั่งอยู่ที่โต๊ะอาหารเช้า

In the future, January 20, 3015, Mr. Spoon is sitting at the breakfast table.

 

Right. Now I'm telling a story in the future. How can I make it apparent that the narrator's perspective is from further in the future looking back, rather than from the present looking forward?

[JayClay]

On 11/7/2023 at 2:23 PM, owl sees all said:

Right at the moment I'm writing a piece that could get to 50k+ words

 

Does that piece also have all the text cenrte-justified?

[owl sees all]

53 minutes ago, JayClay said:

 

Does that piece also have all the text cenrte-justified?

That's just my default on the platform.

 

The story is written in stage script.

 

Have a lot translated into Thai.

[2baht]

On 11/7/2023 at 6:07 AM, JayClay said:

"On January 20, 3015, Mr Spoon sat at the breakfast table"

 

      Isn't that " Mr Spoon was sat at the table, Mrs Spoon was stood nearby, innit?"       "Prolly!"???

Edited November 8, 2023 by 2baht

[JayClay]

3 minutes ago, 2baht said:

 

      Isn't that " Mr Spoon was sat at the table, Mrs Spoon was stood nearby, innit?"       "Prolly!"???

 

Either is fine

[2baht]

Just now, JayClay said:

 

Either is fine

 

    One is total butchering of the English language!

[JayClay]

Just now, 2baht said:

 

    One is total butchering of the English language!

 

It really depends on what you want to say.

 

Mr spoon sat at the table and began to eat his breakfast.

 

Mr spoon was sat (was sitting) at the breakfast table when he received an unexpected phone call.

[Bredbury Blue]

1 hour ago, JayClay said:

 

Right. Now I'm telling a story in the future. How can I make it apparent that the narrator's perspective is from further in the future looking back, rather than from the present looking forward?

 

https://www.thaipod101.com/blog/2021/07/08/thai-tenses/

[2baht]

Just now, JayClay said:

 

It really depends on what you want to say.

 

Mr spoon sat at the table and began to eat his breakfast.

 

Mr spoon was sat (was sitting) at the breakfast table when he received an unexpected phone call.

 

     Was sat? That's mixing past and present tense! Was sitting is correct!  I've never heard King Charles say " I was sat on the throne, Camilla was stood nearby!"

[JayClay]

24 minutes ago, 2baht said:

 

      Isn't that " Mr Spoon was sat at the table, Mrs Spoon was stood nearby, innit?"       "Prolly!"???

 

11 minutes ago, 2baht said:

 

     Was sat? That's mixing past and present tense! Was sitting is correct!  I've never heard King Charles say " I was sat on the throne, Camilla was stood nearby!"

 

I would have used "was sitting", personally. I included the "was sat" variant because I was directly quoting you.

 

Now, if you've finished your little ascent of the Dunning Kruger peak, could you please refrain from responding unless you actually have anything to say that may be useful to answer the OP.

[JayClay]

17 minutes ago, Bredbury Blue said:

 

https://www.thaipod101.com/blog/2021/07/08/thai-tenses/

 

Which part of the article are you referring me to?

[2baht]

2 minutes ago, JayClay said:

 

 

I would have used "was sitting", personally. I included the "was sat" variant because I was directly quoting you.

 

Now, if you've finished your little ascent of the Dunning Kruger peak, could you please refrain from responding unless you actually have anything to say that may be useful to answer the OP.

 

      It's a public forum, I will respond as I see fit (within community standards)! 

[JayClay]

1 minute ago, 2baht said:

 

      It's a public forum, I will respond as I see fit (within community standards)! 

 

I look forward then to whatever other words of wisdom you have on a subject that you are clearly so well versed in...

[2baht]

Just now, JayClay said:

 

I look forward then to whatever other words of wisdom you have on a subject that you are clearly so well versed in...

 

    Stick with Mr Spoon, you're on a winner! When are you publishing? 

[owl sees all]

45 minutes ago, JayClay said:

Mr spoon sat at the table and began to eat his breakfast.

 

Mr spoon was sat (was sitting) at the breakfast table when he received an unexpected phone call.

The breakfast was on the table. Mr Spoon sat down and began gobbling it up; like a pig at a trough.

[ningnong]

ใน วันที่ 20 มกราคม 3015 Mr Spoon กำลังนั่งที่โต๊ะอาหารเช้า

[JayClay]

On 11/10/2023 at 8:18 PM, ningnong said:

ใน วันที่ 20 มกราคม 3015 Mr Spoon กำลังนั่งที่โต๊ะอาหารเช้า

 

That seems like it would work. In my mind, at least.