Controversy erupts as Thai doctors clash over mRNA vaccine effect

[dinsdale]

54 minutes ago, ozimoron said:

 

Both the sun and the moon are round. That's about as valid a comparison as covid is to the cold. Attempts to portray covid as just another cold are politically driven misinformation. Stop it.

Misinformation? I posted (above) with citations, one from the CDC and one from the UK Heat Foundation about the similarites of symptoms. You call this misinformation? I have also stated that SarsCov2, influenza and the common cold are caused by different viruses. They do, however, have overlaping symptoms. This is undeniable. What is also undeniable is Omicron for the vast majority is a mild viral infection andf this is evidenced by very low death rates. The following charts of course do not include comorbidities or vaccinated/unvaccinated details.

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/

The 3rd chart is the USA. Overall around 83 deaths out of around 430 million people in a day (yes they are different days but this will have no bearing on the very, very, very.....small number of deaths). This IS NOT misinformation. These are facts.

 

 

 

[Roo Island]

1 minute ago, dinsdale said:

Misinformation? I posted (above) with citations, one from the CDC and one from the UK Heat Foundation about the similarites of symptoms. You call this misinformation? I have also stated that SarsCov2, influenza and the common cold are caused by different viruses. They do, however, have overlaping symptoms. This is undeniable. What is also undeniable is Omicron for the vast majority is a mild viral infection andf this is evidenced by very low death rates. The following charts of course do not include comorbidities or vaccinated/unvaccinated details.

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/

The 3rd chart is the USA. Overall around 83 deaths out of around 430 million people in a day. This IS NOT misinformation. These are facts.

 

 

 

Many more die from covid than the flu or common cold. Especially the unvaccinated. Fact.

[Photoguy21]

23 hours ago, Roo Island said:

 

A vast majority of doctors and scientists around the world agree that the benefits vastly outweigh the side effects.

And a lot disagreed but were ignored. Just look at the doctors that signed the Barrington paper. All of them were ignored.

[ozimoron]

3 minutes ago, Photoguy21 said:

And a lot disagreed but were ignored. Just look at the doctors that signed the Barrington paper. All of them were ignored.

 

For good reason

 

The Great Barrington Declaration was an open letter published in October 2020 in response to the COVID-19 pandemic and lockdowns.[1][2] It claimed harmful COVID-19 lockdowns could be avoided via the fringe notion of "focused protection", by which those most at risk could purportedly be kept safe while society otherwise took no steps to prevent infection.[3][4][5] The envisaged result was herd immunity within three months, as SARS-CoV-2 swept through the population.[1][2][4]

 

Signed by Sunetra Gupta of the University of Oxford, Jay Bhattacharya of Stanford University, and Martin Kulldorff of Harvard University, it was sponsored by the American Institute for Economic Research (AIER), a libertarian free-market think tank associated with climate change denial.[

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Barrington_Declaration

[Rimmer]

A troll meme has been removed

[johng]

https://www.ons.gov.uk/peoplepopulationandcommunity/healthandsocialcare/causesofdeath/articles/estimatingexcessdeathsintheukmethodologychanges/latest

 

As the figures for excess death become undeniable  guess what ?

they change the way they count  excess death 🤨

 

"The role of us morons is just to except whatever they say"

[johng]

37 minutes ago, Photoguy21 said:

And a lot disagreed but were ignored. Just look at the doctors that signed the Barrington paper. All of them were ignored.

Indeed  and they where basically proposing following the "accepted"  pandemic procedures from the last 100'ish years.

[nauseus]

4 hours ago, Roo Island said:

Decide for themselves with misinformation? This is what's causing lots of problems. People thinking they know more than the professionals and posting it on social media. He's a conspiracy theorist. Not good for our society.

 

And how did you rate the guidance from governments through Covid? Many would call much of that disinformation.

 

Since the first signs of long Covid, then excess death rates, and now several new post covid medical problems, Campbell has simply tried to make people aware of these things. His concerns are always supported by the inclusions of relevant medical specialists. He is not a conspiracy theorist and I'm glad that there are some people like him in "our society".    

[dinsdale]

16 minutes ago, nauseus said:

 

And how did you rate the guidance from governments through Covid? Many would call much of that disinformation.

 

Since the first signs of long Covid, then excess death rates, and now several new post covid medical problems, Campbell has simply tried to make people aware of these things. His concerns are always supported by the inclusions of relevant medical specialists. He is not a conspiracy theorist and I'm glad that there are some people like him in "our society".    

Does make me wonder if any of those on here having a go at Campbell have actually watched any of his videos. My best guess is they haven't. Probably still think Ivermectin is only a drug for horses a line that was heavily pushed.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

8 minutes ago, nauseus said:

His concerns are always supported by the inclusions of relevant medical specialists. He is not a conspiracy theorist

 

I don't know if Campbell is a conspiracy theorist, but he certainly is a documented and chronic peddler of COVID and COVID vaccines misinformation, as has been well documented by many sources.

 

"In the episode, Dore replayed a popular video previously posted on YouTube by nurse educator John Campbell, who also has a history of spreading misinformation about vaccines."

 

https://www.factcheck.org/2023/12/scicheck-yale-preprint-recorded-patient-experiences-did-not-demonstrate-vaccines-cause-new-syndrome/

 

https://www.factcheck.org/person/john-campbell/

 

"On March 6, John Campbell, who has a doctorate in nursing education but is not a physician, posted a video about the drug that amassed nearly a million views. It incorrectly presented two weak studies as “powerful” and “overwhelming” evidence that the drug works to combat the disease.
 

“Why isn’t this in the newspapers?” Campbell asks his viewers after reviewing preliminary results of a study that was later canceled by its authors and the results of a flawed study."

 

https://www.factcheck.org/2022/03/scicheck-evidence-still-lacking-to-support-ivermectin-as-treatment-for-covid-19/

 

 

"In addition to the debunks published by Susan Oliver and Greg Tucker-Kellogg, cited above in the review, molecular biologist Dan Wilson also published a video pointing out the misleading interpretation Campbell gave to COVID-19 death certificates listing pre-existing health conditions.

UPDATE (1 February 2022):

Following reader feedback, we provided additional context from Campbell’s video and explanations to clarify why John Campbell’s video was found to be misleading."

 

https://healthfeedback.org/claimreview/ivermectin-wasnt-shown-more-effective-than-remdesivir-contrary-to-claim-by-john-campbell/

 

"A video watched more than 700,000 times on YouTube, and being shared on Facebook, wrongly claims that a new study in the New England Journal of Medicine (NEJM) means that “the risk of adverse events [from vaccination] is roughly a little more than four times greater than the risk of the child requiring oxygenation [from Covid-19]”.

 

The video was posted by a popular YouTuber called Dr John Campbell, who regularly posts videos about Covid, and whose YouTube channel has been watched more than half a billion times.

At the end of the video, Dr Campbell invites viewers to “see if I have misinterpreted anything”.

He has, in several ways."

 

https://fullfact.org/health/john-campbell-youtube-singapore-children/

 

 

Analysis of adverse event variation between Pfizer COVID-19 vaccine batches doesn’t indicate safety problems, contrary to claim by John Campbell

 

https://healthfeedback.org/claimreview/analysis-adverse-event-variation-pfizer-covid-19-vaccine-batches-doesnt-indicate-safety-problems-contrary-john-campbell/

 

Or, as his Wikipedia profile page correctly summarizes:

 

"Initially, the videos received praise, but they later veered into misinformation.^[2] He has been criticised for suggesting COVID-19 deaths have been over-counted, repeating false claims about the use of ivermectin as a COVID-19 treatment, and providing misleading commentary about the safety of COVID-19 vaccines.^[3][4][5]

^...

In August 2022 David Gorski wrote for Science-Based Medicine that while at the beginning of the pandemic Campbell had "seemed semi-reasonable", he later became a "total COVID-19 crank".^[2] Others have expressed concern that Campbell's videos have been used by podcaster Jimmy Dore and others to support false claims against the Covid-19 vaccines.^[19]

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Campbell_(YouTuber)

 

 

And THIS is the man who's bogus claims are the main source for the equally bogus claims made in the OP of this thread.

 

[johng]

1 hour ago, ozimoron said:

it claimed harmful COVID-19 lockdowns could be avoided via the fringe notion of "focused protection", by which those most at risk could purportedly be kept safe

"Fringe notion"

By protecting the elderly  those most at risk ?  nothing different than the past 100'ish year of "pandemic"  protocols.

1 hour ago, ozimoron said:

otherwise took no steps to prevent infection.[3][4][5] The envisaged result was herd immunity

Sweden ????

 

1 hour ago, ozimoron said:

a libertarian free-market think tank associated with climate change denial.

555  yes climate change caused the excess death and libertarians are evil    

could the "narrative" not be any planer if came and slapped you right in the face ?

[johng]

3 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

And THIS is the man who's bogus claims are the main source for the equally bogus claims made in the OP of this thread.

Says you !!  and of course "the fact checkers"

Who fact checks the fact check checkers ? 

who funds the "fact check checkers" ?

Here's my guess who funds them  the same who fund the MSN  "AKA"

legacy media or "trusted media sources"  guess who.

 

17 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

as his Wikipedia profile page correctly summarizes:

His Wikipedia page which HE can't edit/emend to counter the accusations against him.

[dinsdale]

In an information war it is those who control the information that will win. By win I mean making sure that their narrative becomes the generally accepted narrative. It is undeniable that the dominant narrative around the Covid19 years is one being pushed by big pharma, governments, the UN and mainstream media.

[johng]

3 hours ago, Roo Island said:

Many more die from covid than the flu or common cold. Especially the unvaccinated. Fact.

How's the vaccine for common cold coming along  just round the corner with the super duper MRna technology  right ?

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

As the following FactCheck.org report recounts, Campbell's latest claims about clots found in cadavers, and trying by implication and his questioning to falsely link those to COVID vaccines, is a recycling of prior debunked claims made in a notorious anti-vax film, as follows:

 

https://www.factcheck.org/2022/12/scicheck-died-suddenly-pushes-bogus-depopulation-theory/

 

Posted on December 1, 2022

 

"The roughly hourlong video repeatedly flashes across the screen what appear to be postmortem blood clots, which are often found in dead bodies. Although such clots are common, the video features nine embalmers and funeral directors who describe the clots as a new anomaly and surmise that they were caused by COVID-19 vaccines."

...

As the camera pans over clot specimens in tubes, Richard Hirschman, a licensed funeral director and embalmer in Alabama featured in the video, asks, “How come, all of a sudden, these things are happening in so many people?” [Hirschman also being one of the main figures interviewed by Campbell in his recent YouTube video].

...

But there is no evidence that the clots are related to vaccination, nor are they necessarily abnormal. Many of the clots shown, in fact, appear to be postmortem clots, or blood clots that form after death, which would have nothing to do with vaccination or why someone died.

...

Some of the clots could be ones that formed prior to death, as blood clots are relatively common, but there is no evidence that COVID-19 mRNA vaccination causes them, as we’ve written."

 

Then the above FactCheck report goes on to cite various sources explaining why the pictured blood clots are normal postmortem occurrences, and that The National Funeral Directors Association had previously told PolitiFact that embalmers had noticed an increase in blood clots among COVID-19-related deaths, including vaccinated and unvaccinated people.

 

In short, just more anti-vax nonsense from Campbell, a documented COVID and COVID vaccines misinformation peddler as cited by various sources linked above.

 

 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

21 minutes ago, dinsdale said:

In an information war it is those who control the information that will win. By win I mean making sure that their narrative becomes the generally accepted narrative. It is undeniable that the dominant narrative around the Covid19 years is one being pushed by big pharma, governments, the UN and mainstream media.

 

You mean as opposed to YouTube and social media cranks and documented anti-vax misinformation peddlers, not forgetting also about the actual cardiologists, podiatrists and other out-of-their field MDs making money selling bogus COVID cures and so-called natural remedies.

 

[johng]

5 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

In short, just more anti-vax nonsense from Campbell, a documented COVID and COVID vaccines misinformation peddler as cited by various sources linked above

Again with the so called "fact checkers"  experts in their fields are rasing alarms/concerns but are instantly  "poo pooed"  by the fact checkers something stinks.

[dinsdale]

4 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

As the following FactCheck.org report recounts, Campbell's latest claims about clots found in cadavers, and trying to falsely link those to COVID vaccines, is a recycling of prior debunked claims made in a notorious anti-vax film, as follows:

 

https://www.factcheck.org/2022/12/scicheck-died-suddenly-pushes-bogus-depopulation-theory/

 

Posted on December 1, 2022

 

"The roughly hourlong video repeatedly flashes across the screen what appear to be postmortem blood clots, which are often found in dead bodies. Although such clots are common, the video features nine embalmers and funeral directors who describe the clots as a new anomaly and surmise that they were caused by COVID-19 vaccines."

...

As the camera pans over clot specimens in tubes, Richard Hirschman, a licensed funeral director and embalmer in Alabama featured in the video, asks, “How come, all of a sudden, these things are happening in so many people?” [Hirschman also being one of the main figures interviewed by Campbell in his recent YouTube video].

...

But there is no evidence that the clots are related to vaccination, nor are they necessarily abnormal. Many of the clots shown, in fact, appear to be postmortem clots, or blood clots that form after death, which would have nothing to do with vaccination or why someone died.

...

Some of the clots could be ones that formed prior to death, as blood clots are relatively common, but there is no evidence that COVID-19 mRNA vaccination causes them, as we’ve written."

 

Then the above FactCheck report goes on to cite various sources explaining why the pictured blood clots are normal postmortem occurrences, and that The National Funeral Directors Association had previously told PolitiFact that embalmers had noticed an increase in blood clots among COVID-19-related deaths, including vaccinated and unvaccinated people.

 

In short, just more anti-vax nonsense from Campbell, a documented COVID and COVID vaccines misinformation peddler as cited by various sources linked above.

 

 

Have you watched the videos? My guess is you haven't. I don't think anyone has directly linked these clots with vaccinations but they exist and need to be investigated. If you are going to argue against or discredit someone then you need to know what they are saying not just rely on cherry picked articles.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

2 minutes ago, johng said:

Again with the so called "fact checkers"  experts in their fields are rasing alarms/concerns but are instantly  "poo pooed"  by the fact checkers something stinks.

 

What experts? Campbell, not even a routine MD, is at best an expert COVID misinformation peddler as documented by multiple sources above.

 

Who else, the embalmer Hirschman that Campbell interviews in his video, the guy who also admitted:

 

"But in a phone interview with FactCheck.org, he told us he never said he could prove a connection between the clots he was showing and the COVID-19 vaccines.

 

“I can’t prove what this is,” Hirschman told FactCheck.org in a phone interview. “I’m not a doctor nor a scientist — I never said I was.”

 

https://www.factcheck.org/2022/12/scicheck-died-suddenly-pushes-bogus-depopulation-theory/

 

[johng]

6 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

making money selling bogus COVID cures

Ha ha ha  that's really quite amusing  considering who made billions of dollars of profit.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

Just now, dinsdale said:

Have you watched the videos? My guess is you haven't. I don't think anyone has directly linked these clots with vaccinations but they exist and need to be investigated.

 

They've been investigated.... but people like you and Campbell just don't like the answers from actual experts in the field:

 

"Other experts have come to the same conclusion when asked before by fact-checkers about such claims from funeral service providers, including Hirschman and O’Looney.

 

“The images look to me more like postmortem clots, mainly due to the color, the shape, and particularly because of the amount,” Nikolaus Klupp, an associate professor of forensic medicine at the Medical University of Vienna, told Health Feedback in September.

 

“The blood clots are from refrigeration. It happens to many bodies,” embalmer Monica Torres, of NXT Generation Mortuary Support, told AFP the same month. “It’s just that there were so many bodies to process, many of them sat in refrigeration for long durations so they got blood clots. It’s not a big deal and these people are trying to make it a thing.”

 

https://www.factcheck.org/2022/12/scicheck-died-suddenly-pushes-bogus-depopulation-theory/

 

But sure, let's all listen to a documented COVID misinformation peddler as opposed to actual forensic medical professors and other actual medical experts.

 

[johng]

11 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

“I can’t prove what this is,” Hirschman told FactCheck.org in a phone interview. “I’m not a doctor nor a scientist — I never said I was.”

But he is an "expert in his field" of embalming and has not seen anything like this before  so he raises the question what is causing this ?

so called "fact checkers" 

whatever it is it can't be the novel solutions provided in the last few .

[dinsdale]

22 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

“The blood clots are from refrigeration. It happens to many bodies,” embalmer Monica Torres, of NXT Generation Mortuary Support, told AFP the same month. “It’s just that there were so many bodies to process, many of them sat in refrigeration for long durations so they got blood clots. It’s not a big deal and these people are trying to make it a thing.”

So many bodies. Long term refrigeration. Is this still the case? Yep blood clots will form but if you actually watch the videos you will see that these are not postmortem blood clots which are jelly like and these white clots are rubbery. Seems that they've been found in the living also.

[nauseus]

1 hour ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

I don't know if Campbell is a conspiracy theorist, but he certainly is a documented and chronic peddler of COVID and COVID vaccines misinformation, as has been well documented by many sources.

 

"In the episode, Dore replayed a popular video previously posted on YouTube by nurse educator John Campbell, who also has a history of spreading misinformation about vaccines."

 

https://www.factcheck.org/2023/12/scicheck-yale-preprint-recorded-patient-experiences-did-not-demonstrate-vaccines-cause-new-syndrome/

 

https://www.factcheck.org/person/john-campbell/

 

"On March 6, John Campbell, who has a doctorate in nursing education but is not a physician, posted a video about the drug that amassed nearly a million views. It incorrectly presented two weak studies as “powerful” and “overwhelming” evidence that the drug works to combat the disease.
 

“Why isn’t this in the newspapers?” Campbell asks his viewers after reviewing preliminary results of a study that was later canceled by its authors and the results of a flawed study."

 

https://www.factcheck.org/2022/03/scicheck-evidence-still-lacking-to-support-ivermectin-as-treatment-for-covid-19/

 

 

"In addition to the debunks published by Susan Oliver and Greg Tucker-Kellogg, cited above in the review, molecular biologist Dan Wilson also published a video pointing out the misleading interpretation Campbell gave to COVID-19 death certificates listing pre-existing health conditions.

UPDATE (1 February 2022):

Following reader feedback, we provided additional context from Campbell’s video and explanations to clarify why John Campbell’s video was found to be misleading."

 

https://healthfeedback.org/claimreview/ivermectin-wasnt-shown-more-effective-than-remdesivir-contrary-to-claim-by-john-campbell/

 

"A video watched more than 700,000 times on YouTube, and being shared on Facebook, wrongly claims that a new study in the New England Journal of Medicine (NEJM) means that “the risk of adverse events [from vaccination] is roughly a little more than four times greater than the risk of the child requiring oxygenation [from Covid-19]”.

 

The video was posted by a popular YouTuber called Dr John Campbell, who regularly posts videos about Covid, and whose YouTube channel has been watched more than half a billion times.

At the end of the video, Dr Campbell invites viewers to “see if I have misinterpreted anything”.

He has, in several ways."

 

https://fullfact.org/health/john-campbell-youtube-singapore-children/

 

 

Analysis of adverse event variation between Pfizer COVID-19 vaccine batches doesn’t indicate safety problems, contrary to claim by John Campbell

 

https://healthfeedback.org/claimreview/analysis-adverse-event-variation-pfizer-covid-19-vaccine-batches-doesnt-indicate-safety-problems-contrary-john-campbell/

 

Or, as his Wikipedia profile page correctly summarizes:

 

"Initially, the videos received praise, but they later veered into misinformation.^[2] He has been criticised for suggesting COVID-19 deaths have been over-counted, repeating false claims about the use of ivermectin as a COVID-19 treatment, and providing misleading commentary about the safety of COVID-19 vaccines.^[3][4][5]

^...

In August 2022 David Gorski wrote for Science-Based Medicine that while at the beginning of the pandemic Campbell had "seemed semi-reasonable", he later became a "total COVID-19 crank".^[2] Others have expressed concern that Campbell's videos have been used by podcaster Jimmy Dore and others to support false claims against the Covid-19 vaccines.^[19]

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Campbell_(YouTuber)

 

 

And THIS is the man who's bogus claims are the main source for the equally bogus claims made in the OP of this thread.

 

 

No. Campbell is an accused peddler of COVID and COVID vaccines misinformation, as has been claimed by your so-called fact check rubbish - strange that it contains no actual direct links to the examples of misinformation that Dr. Campbell is accused of spreading.

[johng]

2 minutes ago, dinsdale said:

but if you actually watch the videos

No don't what ever you do watch the actual video 

the fact checkers have said its  "misinformation"

The "fact checkers"  watched it for you and have decided already how you should perceive the information....

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

More rubbishing of this recycled old anti-vax misinformation:

 

No clear evidence that COVID vaccines are responsible for strange blood clots observed by embalmers

 

February 9, 2022

 

• A handful of embalmers claim they started noticing strange blood clots in bodies after the COVID-19 pandemic began, with some attributing it to the vaccine.

• The National Funeral Directors Association said embalmers in its network have noticed an uptick in blood clots in COVID-related deaths; however, it has been among the unvaccinated and vaccinated. 

• This anomaly may be the result of the coronavirus itself, since the infection can cause blood vessel inflammation, damage to very small vessels, and blood clots.

https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/2022/feb/09/newswars/no-clear-evidence-covid-19-vaccines-are-responsibl/

 

 

[johng]

2 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

The National Funeral Directors Association said embalmers in its network have noticed an uptick in blood clots in COVID-related deaths; however, it has been among the unvaccinated and vaccinated.

No clues here move along nothing to see.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

And more re Campbell's interviewee Hirschman:

 

US embalmer baselessly links clots to Covid-19 vaccines

20 September 2022

 

A video shared on social media features an interview with an embalmer who claims he has seen an increasing number of bodies with unusual blood clots due to the Covid-19 vaccines. But experts say there is no data connecting the anecdotal observation to the shots...

...

""It is usually impossible to tell what caused the blood to clot in the first place by looking at the clot," said David Dorward, a consultant pathologist and a senior clinical lecturer at the University of Edinburgh, in a September 22 email. "For example, a blood clot from a patient who had clots caused by Covid infection when compared to blood clots formed following prolonged bed rest after a major operation would look pretty much identical."

...

A study published in The Lancet in 2021 concluded that patients with a Covid-19 infection faced a significantly higher risk of developing blood clots than people who received mRNA vaccines."

 

https://factcheck.afp.com/doc.afp.com.32JG7UE

 

 

[dinsdale]

2 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

More rubbishing of this recycled old anti-vax misinformation:

 

No clear evidence that COVID vaccines are responsible for strange blood clots observed by embalmers

 

February 9, 2022

 

• A handful of embalmers claim they started noticing strange blood clots in bodies after the COVID-19 pandemic began, with some attributing it to the vaccine.

• The National Funeral Directors Association said embalmers in its network have noticed an uptick in blood clots in COVID-related deaths; however, it has been among the unvaccinated and vaccinated. 

• This anomaly may be the result of the coronavirus itself, since the infection can cause blood vessel inflammation, damage to very small vessels, and blood clots.

https://www.politifact.com/factchecks/2022/feb/09/newswars/no-clear-evidence-covid-19-vaccines-are-responsibl/

 

 

Again no one has claimed that the vaccines are linked to the white clots. The thing is they are real and there needs to be investgation into the cause. Your last dot point is telling though. The clots are found in arteries not vessels. Blood clots vessels, white clots arteries. Watch the videos and educate yourself before doing your usual cherry picking stunts.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

4 minutes ago, johng said:

No clues here move along nothing to see.

 

"Jessica Koth, director of public relations for the [National Funeral Directors] association, told us in an email that “[f]uneral service professionals are in no way qualified to draw any conclusions about COVID vaccines and blood clots. We’re not medical examiners or physicians or scientists.”

 

She pointed us to a blog post by funeral director and embalming expert Ben Schmidt, who called such claims “clickbait” and noted that it would be “extremely unusual for an embalmer to know someone’s medical history unless they were closely related to the deceased person,” and that embalming “often takes place before a specific cause of death is communicated to the embalmer let alone their vaccination records.”

 

https://www.factcheck.org/2022/12/scicheck-died-suddenly-pushes-bogus-depopulation-theory/