Payment QR Codes

[lkn]

2 minutes ago, Yellowtail said:

So it was my fault, got it. 

I did not say that. Seriously, you guys seem to just want to argue about everything.

[Yellowtail]

Just now, lkn said:

I did not say that. Seriously, you guys seem to just want to argue about everything.

Get a grip homer, just a little friendly banter. 

[scottiejohn]

1 minute ago, Yellowtail said:

just a little friendly banter. 

From you!

That will be the day!

[Everyman]

Would you look at this…https://moreta.io

 

Seeks to imply that you can link load money in a digital wallet and pay using the Thai QR code payment system! 

 

I signed up for early access, I’ll let you guys know my experience if they contact me. 

[nrasmussen]

20 hours ago, Yellowtail said:

Do not most bona-fide stores/shops have this here? 

 

Yes, they do indeed. And the best thing about those (i.e., contactless payment terminals) is that there's even no need for fumbling with a card. I just hold my watch to the terminal and payment is done. I don't think it can be any easier than that.

[Highlandman]

On 5/1/2024 at 5:43 PM, lkn said:

Have you been to a food court in Thailand? They have been cashless for a decade or more.

 

This is probably about hygiene, you don’t want the person handling your food to also touch dirty cash.

 

In Taiwan I actually saw one shop that had a bowl with coins and instructed customers to “help themselves” (to change) when paying, as he did not want to touch these coins.

 

You use cash to purchase a value stored card to make payment. Not exactly "cashless".

[Highlandman]

On 4/30/2024 at 11:04 PM, OneMoreFarang said:

I guess the main reason will be fraught.

If you sell coffee with cash, I guess it is relatively easy for the cashier to "forget" to type everything in the cash register.

Maybe every hour 100B or 200B or maybe even more can easily get lost.

If owners want to make sure that doesn't happen, then do everything cashless.

In some places like i.e. coffee shops, I guess the majority of guests can easily pay with QR code and don't care if they can't pay in cash.

 

Do I like no cash? No. Will I walk 500m to avoid it? Likely no. And with things like that I am pretty sure that people who insist on cash are only very few. Too few to make an impact. 

 

That is pure conjecture. I've rarely seen anyone pay for a coffee with anything other than cash.

[OneMoreFarang]

19 minutes ago, Highlandman said:

 

That is pure conjecture. I've rarely seen anyone pay for a coffee with anything other than cash.

I know some starbugs places don't accept cash. Maybe all of them.

[scottiejohn]

1 hour ago, OneMoreFarang said:

I know some starbugs places don't accept cash. Maybe all of them.

That's one less coffee chain to even think of visiting if that is the case!

[OneMoreFarang]

1 hour ago, scottiejohn said:

That's one less coffee chain to even think of visiting if that is the case!

I only visit them if I really want a coffee and there is nothing decent nearby. 

[lkn]

10 hours ago, Highlandman said:

You use cash to purchase a value stored card to make payment. Not exactly "cashless".

 

The question was “why would any vendor not accept cash”, and the answer is that for people serving food, there is a hygienic reason to not touch potentially dirty cash, and therefore many Thai food courts are literally cashless.

 

Yes, you can buy a prepaid card with cash, but you can also buy a prepaid VISA or MasterCard with cash, or maybe a gift card, so by that logic, it’s hard to find something truly cashless. But my point remains the same, there are good reasons for some vendors to refuse cash that the customer should also appreciate.

[Highlandman]

5 hours ago, lkn said:

 

The question was “why would any vendor not accept cash”, and the answer is that for people serving food, there is a hygienic reason to not touch potentially dirty cash, and therefore many Thai food courts are literally cashless.

 

Yes, you can buy a prepaid card with cash, but you can also buy a prepaid VISA or MasterCard with cash, or maybe a gift card, so by that logic, it’s hard to find something truly cashless. But my point remains the same, there are good reasons for some vendors to refuse cash that the customer should also appreciate.

 

Food courts aren't cashless. You're merely paying cash to buy a stored value card and you receive change in cash when you return it. Your example isn't what is considered a "cashless" payment method.

[Yellowtail]

6 hours ago, Highlandman said:

 

Food courts aren't cashless. You're merely paying cash to buy a stored value card and you receive change in cash when you return it. Your example isn't what is considered a "cashless" payment method.

Well, then nothing is cashless. 

 

What is an example of a cashless system? 

[Highlandman]

1 hour ago, Yellowtail said:

Well, then nothing is cashless. 

 

What is an example of a cashless system? 

 

It's a semantic difference.

 

True cashless systems bypass the use of cash altogether; meaning QR codes that deduct money from your bank account or digital wallets that charge your bank account or debit or credit card. 

 

Another example are physical debit and credit cards and in the past, cheques or checks as well.

[johng]

On 5/2/2024 at 5:01 PM, nrasmussen said:

just hold my watch to the terminal and payment is done. I don't think it can be any easier than that.

It will be easier once they insert the microchip in your hand and or use facial recognition...no need to carry anything around  just instant deductions from the bank account....ahh utopia ?

[Yellowtail]

5 minutes ago, Highlandman said:

 

It's a semantic difference.

How so? 

5 minutes ago, Highlandman said:

True cashless systems bypass the use of cash altogether; meaning QR codes that deduct money from your bank account or digital wallets that charge your bank account or debit or credit card. 

Indeed. 

5 minutes ago, Highlandman said:

Another example are physical debit and credit cards and in the past, cheques or checks as well.

A debit card, a rabbit card and a food-court card are all effectively stored value cards, meaning you do not have to carry cash i.e. "cashless"

 

A credit is arguably a stored value card, only with the stored value being credit. 

 

The Starbucks app has a stored value digital card that you can reload with a credit card. How is this not cash-less, while a debit card is? 

[lkn]

18 hours ago, Highlandman said:

True cashless systems bypass the use of cash altogether; meaning QR codes that deduct money from your bank account or digital wallets that charge your bank account or debit or credit card. 

You can actually pay using PromptPay in the food courts I have visited (i.e. the QR code payment that deducts money from your bank account), I also believe they have supported various digital wallets like LINE Pay, and the Rabbit card (at least when I got my Rabbit card some ten years ago, I was told that it could be used in some food courts).

 

But I don’t think your definition of “cashless” is quite what people normally think of when saying cashless. Cashless means that you do not give physical cash to the vendor when paying for goods and services.

 

It doesn’t matter if the digital wallet or plastic card used for the payment is connected to your bank account or has been prepaid / topped up beforehand. As of such, my Thai bank account is really just a “prepaid wallet” that was topped up with Wise… oh… and my Wise debit card, is that cashless when I use it? Because I regularly have to top up my Wise account as well…

[nrasmussen]

23 hours ago, johng said:

It will be easier once they insert the microchip in your hand and or use facial recognition...no need to carry anything around  just instant deductions from the bank account....ahh utopia ?

 

To each their own; however, I'm quite happy using my watch.

[Highlandman]

23 hours ago, lkn said:

You can actually pay using PromptPay in the food courts I have visited (i.e. the QR code payment that deducts money from your bank account), I also believe they have supported various digital wallets like LINE Pay, and the Rabbit card (at least when I got my Rabbit card some ten years ago, I was told that it could be used in some food courts).

 

But I don’t think your definition of “cashless” is quite what people normally think of when saying cashless. Cashless means that you do not give physical cash to the vendor when paying for goods and services.

 

It doesn’t matter if the digital wallet or plastic card used for the payment is connected to your bank account or has been prepaid / topped up beforehand. As of such, my Thai bank account is really just a “prepaid wallet” that was topped up with Wise… oh… and my Wise debit card, is that cashless when I use it? Because I regularly have to top up my Wise account as well…

 

I beg to differ. Your definition of cashless isn't what people normally think of as cashless.

 

Cashless means not involving the use of cash in any way. Using cash to purchase a card and getting cash back at the end isn't what people think of when "cashless" is meant. You're still exchanging cash for something, in this case a card.

 

Money in your bank account isn't cash. 

 

So if you're using PromptPay to pay for food at a food court, then yes, that's truly cashless. 

[Highlandman]

On 5/3/2024 at 6:10 PM, Yellowtail said:

How so? 

Indeed. 

A debit card, a rabbit card and a food-court card are all effectively stored value cards, meaning you do not have to carry cash i.e. "cashless"

 

A credit is arguably a stored value card, only with the stored value being credit. 

 

The Starbucks app has a stored value digital card that you can reload with a credit card. How is this not cash-less, while a debit card is? 

 

The Starbucks stored value card is definitely cashless. Why are you making a distinction I never made?

 

A stored value card where you have to refill it using cash is technically "cashless" but it's not really what is meant here because cashless in this context generally means a digital payment using either a card or electronic means such as a QR code. 

 

Thus cashless means it does not involve the use of physical cash at any stage. 

[Yellowtail]

4 minutes ago, Highlandman said:

 

I beg to differ. Your definition of cashless isn't what people normally think of as cashless.

 

Cashless means not involving the use of cash in any way. Using cash to purchase a card and getting cash back at the end isn't what people think of when "cashless" is meant. You're still exchanging cash for something, in this case a card.

 

Money in your bank account isn't cash. 

 

So if you're using PromptPay to pay for food at a food court, then yes, that's truly cashless. 

If you use a credit or debit card to load the card, it is cashless, yes? 

 

But if you deposit cash into your debit account, or pay your credit card with cash, does it make it not cashless? 

 

So I think it fair to say that per your definition, at a typical food court, some of the cards are cashless and some aren't, correct? 

[Highlandman]

On 5/5/2024 at 12:34 PM, Yellowtail said:

If you use a credit or debit card to load the card, it is cashless, yes? 

 

But if you deposit cash into your debit account, or pay your credit card with cash, does it make it not cashless? 

 

So I think it fair to say that per your definition, at a typical food court, some of the cards are cashless and some aren't, correct? 

 

I've never loaded a debit or credit card with cash. Cards take money from my bank account/credit card account and could function/be topped up/paid off regardless of whether physical cash is available or not.

 

A debit or credit card functions purely as a cashless device.

 

A food court card can also be called a "cash card". As I've mentioned too many times, you start with cash and end with cash. Just because you're using a card for that brief period to pay for your meal or drink, doesn't mean you can bypass the use of cash. Therefore, not a true cashless system and NOT what is meant by cashless (not withstanding the QR code options you have now; I'm talking about food courts that don't have QR codes not to mention how you can go back decades before QR codes and these food courts required you to give cash to get a card to pay).

 

Which doesn't happen with digital cashless payments because these do NOT require cash handling at any point in the transaction. 

 

From debit and credit cards to digital wallets and QR codes they all allow you to bypass the handling of cash if you so wish.

 

A don't understand the need to be so pedantic and go back and forth on something that is so simple to comprehend. 

[Yellowtail]

2 hours ago, Highlandman said:

 

I've never loaded a debit or credit card with cash. Cards take money from my bank account/credit card account and could function/be topped up/paid off regardless of whether physical cash is available or not.

 

A debit or credit card functions purely as a cashless device.

 

A food court card can also be called a "cash card". As I've mentioned too many times, you start with cash and end with cash. Just because you're using a card for that brief period to pay for your meal or drink, doesn't mean you can bypass the use of cash. Therefore, not a true cashless system and NOT what is meant by cashless (not withstanding the QR code options you have now; I'm talking about food courts that don't have QR codes not to mention how you can go back decades before QR codes and these food courts required you to give cash to get a card to pay).

 

Which doesn't happen with digital cashless payments because these do NOT require cash handling at any point in the transaction. 

 

From debit and credit cards to digital wallets and QR codes they all allow you to bypass the handling of cash if you so wish.

 

A don't understand the need to be so pedantic and go back and forth on something that is so simple to comprehend. 

If you use a credit or debit card to load a food court card, it is cashless of not? 

 

A debit card is loaded with cash every time you make a deposit. 

 

A credit card is loaded with credit. 

[Gekko888]

this is so old topic guys why bother just use cash 

[indyo]

sometimes under that qr code there's their bank account number, just try to transfer by wise if you have it but I never tried if the merchant accepts that. few baht should arrive in seconds.

[topt]

For those of you arguing about fraud with QR codes earlier in this thread have a look at this current article from the UK -

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/money/beatthescammers/article-13526249/Rise-QR-fraudsters-exploiting-car-parks-going-cashless.html

[Gekko888]

so funny ! However I must say that finally i have downloaded an app called jamjang and this is crazy great tool no more cash or cards for me...! 

[Gekko888]

On 5/5/2024 at 3:19 PM, Highlandman said:

 

I beg to differ. Your definition of cashless isn't what people normally think of as cashless.

 

Cashless means not involving the use of cash in any way. Using cash to purchase a card and getting cash back at the end isn't what people think of when "cashless" is meant. You're still exchanging cash for something, in this case a card.

 

Money in your bank account isn't cash. 

 

So if you're using PromptPay to pay for food at a food court, then yes, that's truly cashless. 

you are correcy however jamjang app allow all tourists pay with their phones hustle free 

[Gekko888]

On 4/29/2024 at 1:22 PM, Everyman said:

The Thai QR code payment system has a few shortcomings, such as no options for foreigners without a Thai bank account and relying on buggy and slow banking apps. Even WeChat pay and AliPay in China can be used by foreigners, although with considerable difficulty in setting it up. But at least that system is fast - faster than taking cash, even if exact change. 

 

The problem with being able to link a credit card to the Thai QR code payment system is that you could pay someone in cash using credit. Banks don’t want that because it creates a system where you would be paying the bank back with its own money. There’s also the issue of who would pay the transaction fees.

 

From the Bangkok Bank app there seems to be something called prompt pay international, and you can possibly pay from a Singaporean account using one of their banking apps.

 

So what it will take is for foreign banks to join the prompt pay international system. That seems unlikely.

 

So absent some fintech solution that is foreigner friendly, it’s going to get rocky for people without Thai bank accounts.

 

@Everyman you are correct but world is moving fast and this is not the case now about few weeks ago there is new app jamjang i was skeptical but after people posting videos on youtube all over i thought why not to try and its works all the time 24/7 you can pay with the app and no need any bloody thai bank account apparently australian and thai company is behind it