Condo purchase in Pattaya ?

[OneMoreFarang]

3 minutes ago, NorthernRyland said:

I would never dream.There's a million condos everywhere and you can move whenever you get bad neighbors. In floating sky boxes you have zero control over your surroundings and so many things can go wrong.

 

I wonder how often those bad neighbors happen. They are mentioned again and again, but is it really a problem?

 

And about other things which can go wrong: Personally, I wouldn't want to look out of my window into someone else window a couple of meters away. But it seems for many Thais that is no issue.

I think a good view is important. But looking at pictures on property sites, it seems almost all pictures are from the inside, often with window curtains closed. I guess there would be more pictures of the views if more buyers would care.

[NorthernRyland]

2 hours ago, OneMoreFarang said:

I wonder how often those bad neighbors happen. They are mentioned again and again, but is it really a problem?

 

I've had so many problems, but not in condos actually so it's more of a Thailand thing. Condos are even more risky because you control even that less of your space.

[NorthernRyland]

2 hours ago, Yellowtail said:

For example? 

noise and disruptions. Maybe I shouldn't be talking because I just don't want to live that close to people anyways but I have lived in condos and the problems are even worse than houses. Having said that burning is a problem for me in Thailand and condos don't have this problem. Otherwise all the noise problems I have with Thai people are worse the more dense things get.

[OneMoreFarang]

3 minutes ago, NorthernRyland said:

noise and disruptions. Maybe I shouldn't be talking because I just don't want to live that close to people anyways but I have lived in condos and the problems are even worse than houses. Having said that burning is a problem for me in Thailand and condos don't have this problem. Otherwise all the noise problems I have with Thai people are worse the more dense things get.

Do you have an impression if this happens mostly in cheap condominiums or maybe also in HiSo places where some HiSo people think they can get away with that?

I live in a condominium with about 500 units in Bangkok and it seems that we have problems like that only very seldom. Rent range roughly about 10k to 30k per month, in the middle of lower Sukhumvit. 

[newnative]

3 hours ago, scubascuba3 said:

If you added in your labour costs you'd make a loss every time, you see it as a hobby fair enough, most wouldn't. Pointless buying in 70s if you plan to sell several years later, we all know how hard it is to sell plus loss, 5% agent commission loss straight off

      Selling has not been hard in Pattaya--if it had been we would have stopped long ago.  But, in any case, you've missed the point of my posts--and you're focused solely on the economics of owning, while disregarding everything else.   And, that 'everything else' far outweighs the economics, for me.   Note, for me.   Maybe not for that guy over there behind the tree.

      As I have said, owning is a lifestyle choice, a quality of life choice for me, and, I suspect, many others.  Whether I am 42 or 72, that doesn't change.  And, also like many, I have more money at 72 than I had at 42, so why wouldn't I want to own a nice place to live, if that is what suits me?

     It really comes down to what floats your boat, I think.  For some, it literally is a boat--even though they know owning a boat will be a money pit from Day 1.   For others, it's owning a luxury car, even though they know the luxury car will likely lose more than half its value after 5 years.  Some lose 70% or more. 

    Yet, people still buy boats and luxury cars, knowing they will lose money on the deal.  They want what they want--and nothing wrong with that if they can afford it.  For me, I'd rather own property than a boat or a luxury car--that floats my boat.

 

     

     

 

     

[NorthernRyland]

5 hours ago, OneMoreFarang said:

I live in a condominium with about 500 units in Bangkok and it seems that we have problems like that only very seldom. Rent range roughly about 10k to 30k per month, in the middle of lower Sukhumvit. 

I have very limited experience with only cheap condos so maybe the higher end solves this. In general though I have noise problems in Thailand for all sorts of reasons so I'm always very careful to chose where I live. Condos are just too risky for me to think about purchasing even if I wanted to live  in one.

[lexxy]

On 5/11/2024 at 12:15 AM, Sigmund said:

My friend, the golden rule in Thailand, is never buy...always rent...should it be for a house or a lady !!

 

another idiot

[lexxy]

4C01D02B-1909-4740-983B-D4596D1E9F3A.heic

 

If you dont need the money, then buy. If you need a bunch of losers on the internet who cannot afford a condo and negotiate with their landlord every year over 1000b a month to tell you its a bad idea, you shouldnt be buying a condo.

[Sigmund]

1 hour ago, lexxy said:

 

another idiot

oh c'mon don't call him an idiot, if he wants to buy, his choice after all...😁

[DonniePeverley]

10 hours ago, OneMoreFarang said:

 

I wonder how often those bad neighbors happen. They are mentioned again and again, but is it really a problem?

 

And about other things which can go wrong: Personally, I wouldn't want to look out of my window into someone else window a couple of meters away. But it seems for many Thais that is no issue.

I think a good view is important. But looking at pictures on property sites, it seems almost all pictures are from the inside, often with window curtains closed. I guess there would be more pictures of the views if more buyers would care.

 

When you condo becomes 95% occupied by Russians, who chose to ignore rules (Eg no short term letting, no drinking or smoking by the pool, keeping noise down at night, etc) you will know about 'bad neighbours'. 

[mushroomdave]

Never buy.  If you have problems with the building/condo or even neighbors, you're stuck. Renting you can pick up and just go. So cheap I don't know why people buy as most people are saying above.  I just moved to the country but had a place in Jomtien behind Rompho Market (only 4-5 min walk), for 7 years, newer place, quiet, pool hardly ever used (clean), 7-11 and Tops 1 min. walk away...only 4000b/month + water/elec, 4,500 pool-view side.  

Edited May 12 by mushroomdave

[OneMoreFarang]

1 hour ago, mushroomdave said:

Never buy.  If you have problems with the building/condo or even neighbors, you're stuck. Renting you can pick up and just go. So cheap I don't know why people buy as most people are saying above. 

I think @newnative above had a great example: When you buy a car you also don't think about first thing how much you will get back when you sell it. You buy that car because you like that car and want to use it - possibly for hours every day.

I think that is a very good point.

Obviously, it also depends a lot on how much money people have and can afford to "lose" - just like with a car.

 

I think we can argue if buying a condo in Thailand for investment makes sense and most people would agree it doesn't make much sense, or at least it has risks.

Buying and living in it is a very different decision than buying as an investment.

[J Branche]

Overview. I am a landlord and Real Estate investor of 12 years.

 

If you are new to Thailand, do Not participate in Real Estate as a job/investor, 

 

You Need to spend the time to 

List what you must have and can afford

Quiet area, location to your interests, transportation for your lifestyle, Parking available for your vehicle, Size requirements (how many people living with you) Area/View? Public Parks/Beachs/Spaces, Working or Retired, Health (Require regular doctor, hospital visits).  Are people with similar lifestyle mostly occupying area/home, Is home near restaurants and bars that play music that intrudes inside home?

Talk to Juristic Management about Rules, Fines, how rules are enforced.  

 

Plan, research and rent in building or area first.  This allows you to decide if you like it if area is good fit for long term living and network to find a place you want to possibly buy.

 

I would check with landlord if there are some things you do Not like if they can be changed.  Buying (I believe it is difficult for a foreigner to get a bank loan).  You lose the Return on Investment from other investments(stocks, etfs, bonds, etc.)  

 

Know you better understand the work and complexities with deciding to make a Wise decision on whether to Rent or Buy in Thailand.

[Paris333]

In Thailand you live alone and I don't understand why do you want to buy an apartment? Rents are cheap and in my opinion you should rather rent than buying an apartment or studio furthermore do not spend your money on overpriced Chinese apartment projects.

You refered Pattaya region and even though I have been traveling in Thai since 2010, I have only been one time in Pattaya and I stayed......three hours.....

Save your money in your deposit account or in gold /gold sovereign coins to secure your wealth and do not "search" for "investments" in times all the world tight their belt to save money.

Since you are foreigner in Thailand, I don't see the reason why you are looking for to buy property when indeed  Thailand  is dangerous country to buy real estate:
1. The real estate is overpriced and usually belongs to Chinese - Russia- Ukranians or Australians -Germans -Britain "golden boys" who got cuffs from almost zero commercial real estate sales in......America....they want to "make up" for the loss in Uncle Sam investments.

2.Yearly Thailand Real Estate Tax is ......very-very -very l.o.w.........

Αre you sure that low real estate tax will exist to be so low? 

My suggestion is to find to rent in a quiet neighborhood in Pattaya, as I did during my first years of living in Bangkok, and afterwards I "moved" and stayed of my girlfriends houses that I occasionally acquaintance in Bangkok, and I don't mean "professionals".... .but average middle class women.

Keep low profile in Thailand for your safety and avoid to talk about money and investments.Trust and invest to yourself financial security.

Edited May 13 by Paris333

[Paris333]

Demand for real estate in tourist cities outpaces Bangkok

 

Tourist-favored destinations such as Phuket, Pattaya, and Hua Hin are witnessing a surge in demand, overshadowing the capital city of Bangkok.  Investments in these coastal cities have reached a substantial 56.6 billion baht, signaling a robust upward trend that is reshaping the market landscape.

“In recent months, we have seen a paradigm shift with the volume of new condominium sales and overall development value in Phuket and Pattaya exceeding that of Bangkok for the first time in a decade,” said Mr. Thaweewong. This trend is largely driven by major developers from Bangkok👈 and prominent local entities 👈initiating numerous high-stakes projects, which are attracting a significant amount of foreign investment, particularly from Russian buyers.👈

Source: May 13, 2024👈

https://www.huahintoday.com/hua-hin-news/demand-for-real-estate-in-tourist-cities-outpaces-bangkok/

 

Its already an overpriced area ........think it over again to buy and give priority to your financial security!

 

[stratocaster]

It is interesting to view the Bank of Thailand index figures for property classes. Taking the class of Bangkok detached houses we find that in 2011 the index was 100. Last week the index was 150 based on mortgage loans granted. The bank also state an index figure accounting for property inflation, this figure is 128. If we generalize this figure to percentages you could say that in the last 13 years Thailand has seen a 50 percent rise in Bangkok detached house values, but factoring in property inflation it is a 28% rise or an average of 2% yearly. So if you are a landlord renting a detached house in Bangkok you need to factor in 2% per year just to cover the Thai inflation.

A real life example is my friend in Bangkok who purchased a condo 10 years ago for 8 million baht (258,000 baht). He finally managed to sell it, after being on the market for 3 years for 9.3 million baht a 16% gain which translated to 258,000 baht due to exchange rates, which you always have to consider. After inflation he is looking at a paper 15/17% loss over 10 years. And yes I understand that in this period he has not been having to pay rental costs so living basically rent free. But as he said, if he were to buy a new replacement condo he is looking at 11.5 to 13 million to get a compatible condo unit .

As an aside the condo opposite me, completed in 2018 still have 8 remaining new units available today at the original 2018 price.

[stratocaster]

From the REIC. In the first quarter 2024 7000 new condos were sold. 31 percent or 2200 were priced below 2 million baht.

[Alidiver]

On 5/10/2024 at 3:57 PM, ThaiNoobie101 said:

 

okay thanks,      I have plenty,   it's more for peace of mind,  and knowing i can stay forever.

Forever? Lease is 30 years if landowner does not want to renew.

[stratocaster]

OK I know it is not Pattaya but it is sobering all the same. REIC figures for Cha Am 2034.

No new condo developments have been launched since 2016.

At the present uptake rate it will take until 2023 to clear the backlog.

There are 3200 units completed and ready for transfer today.

Samples.

1. condo build 2018, 124 units built, today 79 units available today.

2. condo build 2018 536 units built  241 available today.

3. condo built 2021 207 units built, 155 units remain available today.

 

 

Edited June 1 by stratocaster
wrong date

[Yellowtail]

1 minute ago, stratocaster said:

OK I know it is not Pattaya but it is sobering all the same. REIC figures for Cha Am 2023.

No new condo developments have been launched since 2016.

At the present uptake rate it will take until 2023 to clear the backlog.

There are 3200 units completed and ready for transfer today.

Samples.

1. condo build 2018, 124 units built, today 79 units available today.

2. condo build 2018 536 units built  241 available today.

3. condo built 2021 207 units built, 155 units remain available today.

 

 

The 2023 year is a mistake, yes? What should it be? 

[scubascuba3]

6 minutes ago, stratocaster said:

OK I know it is not Pattaya but it is sobering all the same. REIC figures for Cha Am 2023.

No new condo developments have been launched since 2016.

At the present uptake rate it will take until 2023 to clear the backlog.

There are 3200 units completed and ready for transfer today.

Samples.

1. condo build 2018, 124 units built, today 79 units available today.

2. condo build 2018 536 units built  241 available today.

3. condo built 2021 207 units built, 155 units remain available today.

 

 

I bet the prices are too high, ignores market forces

[OneMoreFarang]

28 minutes ago, scubascuba3 said:

I bet the prices are too high, ignores market forces

The prices are too high to sell everything. But it seems the developers don't have to sell everything.

Some time ago I talked at a private party with one of those developers. The cost of building, including the land, was about 1/3 of the selling price. 

I guess if they sell half, then the developer breaks even.

[Yellowtail]

2 minutes ago, OneMoreFarang said:

The prices are too high to sell everything. But it seems the developers don't have to sell everything.

Some time ago I talked at a private party with one of those developers. The cost of building, including the land, was about 1/3 of the selling price. 

I guess if they sell half, then the developer breaks even.

I think it would be much more competitive were the 1/3 thing true. 

[OneMoreFarang]

34 minutes ago, Yellowtail said:

I think it would be much more competitive were the 1/3 thing true. 

I don't know if it is true.

It seems that many developers built buildings and don't sell all the units. And then they build more buildings and don't sell all of the units.

If they wouldn't make money with selling only part of the building, then you would think they wouldn't build more and more of the same. Or not?

[Yellowtail]

4 minutes ago, OneMoreFarang said:

I don't know if it is true.

It seems that many developers built buildings and don't sell all the units. And then they build more buildings and don't sell all of the units.

If they wouldn't make money with selling only part of the building, then you would think they wouldn't build more and more of the same. Or not?

They typically do not use their own money. Most of the projects I see sell out. 

[NativeBob]

On 5/10/2024 at 5:59 PM, Yellowtail said:

Owning a condo is not a guarantee you can stay in Thailand forever. 

 

many years ago there was some rule that if you buy directly from developer and not less than 2M than ^^^^^

But I think that rules expired decades ago. However there are still suckers who believe in that BS.