New Guidelines Introduced for Safer School Trips

[OneMoreFarang]

Just now, brianthainess said:

And here we are again today with another bus accident, because the driver was to close to a pig truck when it braked, no seat belts worn by the students and the side door would not open.  Unless driving skills improve, test examiners improve and vehicle inspectors improve then the carnage will continue. Examiners and Testers need training from the real world, nobody here has a clue what is needed. 

 

Another possibility would be that people refuse to be passengers in unsafe vehicles. 

If enough people would do that then we would have better vehicles in Thailand. 

[lordgrinz]

2 minutes ago, OneMoreFarang said:

 

Imagine those inspectors would be held responsible for allowing vehicles on the roads which shouldn't be on the roads.

I am sure that would motivate them real fast.

 

Well I am sure the plan is to blame the inspectors when something goes wrong, but how about checking their qualifications for the job, do they even know what they are doing? I doubt it.

[brianthainess]

1 minute ago, OneMoreFarang said:

 

Imagine those inspectors would be held responsible for allowing vehicles on the roads which shouldn't be on the roads.

I am sure that would motivate them real fast.

The point I'm trying to make is they only follow what they have been taught, they don't know how to make a proper inspection, no jack or levers are ever used, brake air systems never checked, steering never checked.

[brianthainess]

5 minutes ago, OneMoreFarang said:

 

Another possibility would be that people refuse to be passengers in unsafe vehicles. 

If enough people would do that then we would have better vehicles in Thailand. 

How would they know a passenger vehicle is unsafe ? 

[OneMoreFarang]

3 minutes ago, lordgrinz said:

Well I am sure the plan is to blame the inspectors when something goes wrong, but how about checking their qualifications for the job, do they even know what they are doing? I doubt it.

 

Yes, that is part of it.

But everybody should be responsible for our actions. If I agree to work for somebody and I know already that I am not qualified, then I shouldn't even apply for the job.

[OneMoreFarang]

Just now, brianthainess said:

How would they know a passenger vehicle is unsafe ? 

 

Sometimes it's obvious, i.e. no seatbelts. 

[MikeandDow]

13 minutes ago, OneMoreFarang said:

 

Imagine those inspectors would be held responsible for allowing vehicles on the roads which shouldn't be on the roads.

I am sure that would motivate them real fast.

Thais might think a little bit more about the consequences of their actions if they were hit with huge law suits or prison sentences, but that doesn't happen either. I don't necessarily agree with overly-litigious societies like the United States, but the threat of a huge law suit at least makes people think about the possible consequences of their actions.

[retarius]

Who the hell is going to verify that the 'guidelines' are implemented by all bus companies and others. Guidelines is a weasel word. Do it have a precise meaning in law....or is a guideline just a suggestion that can be ignored if inconvenient to bus owners and has no legal; back up behind it?

[lordgrinz]

3 minutes ago, MikeandDow said:

Thais might think a little bit more about the consequences of their actions if they were hit with huge law suits or prison sentences, but that doesn't happen either. I don't necessarily agree with overly-litigious societies like the United States, but the threat of a huge law suit at least makes people think about the possible consequences of their actions.

 

I am waiting for them to make better use of their point system, like we do in the USA, where tickets get expensive and insurance even more so for those who decide to not follow laws. That an towing with massive costs to get your vehicle back, only after making sure tickets are paid, having proper registration, and insurance. Hitting people in their wallets makes them change their way really quickly!

[MikeandDow]

1 minute ago, retarius said:

Who the hell is going to verify that the 'guidelines' are implemented by all bus companies and others. Guidelines is a weasel word. Do it have a precise meaning in law....or is a guideline just a suggestion that can be ignored if inconvenient to bus owners and has no legal; back up behind it?

correct the word "guidelines " are as just as it says Guidelines Not mandatory can be ignored  the word should have been "Shall" which is mandatory  "YOU must comply"

[lordgrinz]

5 minutes ago, retarius said:

Who the hell is going to verify that the 'guidelines' are implemented by all bus companies and others. Guidelines is a weasel word. Do it have a precise meaning in law....or is a guideline just a suggestion that can be ignored if inconvenient to bus owners and has no legal; back up behind it?

 

Nobody even follows laws here, you can pretty much bet they will ignore anything labelled as "guidelines".

[MikeandDow]

3 minutes ago, lordgrinz said:

 

I am waiting for them to make better use of their point system, like we do in the USA, where tickets get expensive and insurance even more so for those who decide to not follow laws. That an towing with massive costs to get your vehicle back, only after making sure tickets are paid, having proper registration, and insurance. Hitting people in their wallets makes them change their way really quickly!

Yes they made a big thing about the point system but then Nothing No enforcement

Edited October 15 by MikeandDow

[hotchilli]

3 hours ago, webfact said:

The Office of the Private Education Commission (OPEC) has introduced six critical guidelines for private schools across Thailand regarding student safety during off-campus trips.

Stay off the roads and transport.

[MikeandDow]

1 hour ago, brianthainess said:

Rubbish we were taught of road safety when I was in junior school 60+ years ago and there was little traffic in those days. But there again that was the UK.

(We were also taught how to swim.)

You know this is a Thailand forum NOT UK  I was asking the question in regard to Thailand not the UK so the question is NOT rubbish !!

[scorecard]

3 hours ago, motdaeng said:

 

"Why is there no Road safety taught at schools" ...

it’s assumed to be common sense, but safety, consideration, and caution aren’t things thai culture typically emphasizes ... 

 

Many believe not needed, kid(s) have good karma.

[MikeandDow]

3 hours ago, scorecard said:

 

Many believe not needed, kid(s) have good karma.

wonder if they would say that if there kid is dying on the road after a accident

[richard_smith237]

9 minutes ago, MikeandDow said:

3 hours ago, scorecard said:

 

Many believe not needed, kid(s) have good karma.

wonder if they would say that if there kid is dying on the road after a accident

 

They don't say that at all....    Its just some people who think they've become at one with their Thainess and believe they have a full understanding of the Thai culture who use throwaway comments such as "they believe in Karma, so nothing will change"....

 

The reality is there is a whole spectrum of 'strength of belief' here...    so some may be very passive about their 'lot' and the cards they've been dished in life, the disasters and tragedies believing this is Karma...  Meanwhile, most, particularly the younger and more moderate in society will not accept Karma as an excuse. 

 

No one is happy about dyeing as if the move the next life is a pleasurable experience - its horrific and people know that, they want to avoid it...     You can see the tragedy and hurt at funerals etc.

 

BUT... people are also believe they have no control - so they are forced to 'accept' what has occurred and fill in the heartache....  with worlds like karma in much the same manner we'll will have heard someone tell our Grandmother ... 'He's in a better place now' when our Grandfather passed....   no one truly believes that (well, with the exception of the very faithful) - so is just words of comfort taking a different form than they do in the west (thats the way I see it anyway).

 

[BritScot]

Greed will stop anything happening.  Back in 2007 the owner of the school I worked at was a nasty, nasty man. Took 100baht off every Thai teacher every month (they were only paid 6,000baht a month). Last School Camp I did, 4 coaches full of students took the kids to the camp. However, only 2 coaches came to take them home. I was so angry. 4 kids to a seat, standing and sitting on the floor. I wrote a letter of complaint and his response was to go to the police accusing me of trying to take students to another school with me. Nothing happened. He had a long list of female teacher sex abuse made against him, that he would pay off... nasty, nasty man.

[Snackbar]

Ban LNG?

[MikeandDow]

32 minutes ago, Snackbar said:

Ban LNG?

Now that is a stupid comment,  LNG if used in a safe Manner and in a properly maintained vehicle there is no problem,  And why just ban LNG what about the other gases  CNG NVG  LPG ban them all, think you would have a riot on your hand if you ban LPG would be no snack bar  

[scorecard]

9 hours ago, Geoffggi said:

Don't forget to include qualified & certified Public Service Vehicle Drivers with up to date medicals

And specific age limits for all bus / public vehicle drivers, and specific age limits for school bus drivers. 

[scorecard]

2 hours ago, BritScot said:

Greed will stop anything happening.  Back in 2007 the owner of the school I worked at was a nasty, nasty man. Took 100baht off every Thai teacher every month (they were only paid 6,000baht a month). Last School Camp I did, 4 coaches full of students took the kids to the camp. However, only 2 coaches came to take them home. I was so angry. 4 kids to a seat, standing and sitting on the floor. I wrote a letter of complaint and his response was to go to the police accusing me of trying to take students to another school with me. Nothing happened. He had a long list of female teacher sex abuse made against him, that he would pay off... nasty, nasty man.

Greed. YES. Also the fact it's so easy to get under the counter approvals for licences / certificates. Collusion.

[richard_smith237]

2 hours ago, MikeandDow said:

Now that is a stupid comment,  LNG if used in a safe Manner and in a properly maintained vehicle there is no problem,  And why just ban LNG what about the other gases  CNG NVG  LPG ban them all, think you would have a riot on your hand if you ban LPG would be no snack bar  

 

I think it would be fair enough to ban CNG (compressed natural gas) on busses and minivans.

 

This is because of the poor quality of conversions and graft within the inspection industry - thus...  while I usually object to knee-jerk reactions, in nations such as Thailand where corruption is so deeply systemic and intertwined with the culture - the sensible option, IMO is banning these in busses or only allowing LNG in busses.

 

As far as taxi's and Trucks are concerned - there are few enough occupants for them to 'get out' when something goes amiss - of course, there will still be the 'tragic' car crashed and became a fireball - but a line in the sand has to be drawn at some point - and that for me is when you could have 50 people trying to escape through a single door when a CNG line ruptures at pressure.

 

 

 

(It seems some are getting their acronyms jumbled a little) 

 

CNG: Compressed Natural Gas: (primarily methane - stored in high pressure cylinders): 

Buses, lorries, passenger vehicles

 

LPG: Liquified Petroleum Gas: (Mixture of Propane and Butane - stored in high pressure tanks): 

Cars, taxis, some buses

 

LNG: Liquefied Natural Gas (Mainly methane - stored in cryogenic tanks) 

Heavy-duty trucks, buses, ships

[BangkokReady]

14 hours ago, webfact said:

conducting emergency drills

 

This is more important for the bus staff, surely.  Evacuate the bus, not run away.

[BangkokReady]

1 hour ago, richard_smith237 said:

I think it would be fair enough to ban CNG (compressed natural gas) on busses and minivans.

 

This is because of the poor quality of conversions and graft within the inspection industry - thus...  while I usually object to knee-jerk reactions, in nations such as Thailand where corruption is so deeply systemic and intertwined with the culture - the sensible option, IMO is banning these in busses or only allowing LNG in busses.

 

My thoughts exactly.  One of the most important things is realising that for whatever reason, this CNG stuff keeps incinerating people in their vehicles upon impact, so should be banned.

 

The fact that it can be safe, if things are done in a completely different manner, is irrelevant.

[Jeff Reinstad]

14 hours ago, JoePai said:

What about the overcrowded Baht Buses taking the kids to school, some having to hold on to the outside of the pickup ?

 

That's where the cool kids are. 🤑 Are you jealous that in your fantasy of visiting a Thai school, you would be with nerds at the front? 😊

[JoePai]

7 hours ago, Jeff Reinstad said:

 

That's where the cool kids are. 🤑 Are you jealous that in your fantasy of visiting a Thai school, you would be with nerds at the front? 😊

You ned help - and quick !

[lordgrinz]

It's pretty sad when my daughter comes home from these trips and tells me she is the only one wearing her seatbelt, that tells me all I need to know about the teachers and the parents idea of safety. Two days ago they painted a new Zebra crossing in front of my daughters school, this morning there was a pickup truck completely blocking it. It's a lost cause, either they get the RTP out on the road enforcing safety every single day, or you can write-off Thailand as another 3rd World S**thole. You can't expect to get quality tourist to keep coming back to a country where safety is an afterthought, or just completely ignored.

[MikeandDow]

1 hour ago, lordgrinz said:

It's pretty sad when my daughter comes home from these trips and tells me she is the only one wearing her seatbelt, that tells me all I need to know about the teachers and the parents idea of safety. Two days ago they painted a new Zebra crossing in front of my daughters school, this morning there was a pickup truck completely blocking it. It's a lost cause, either they get the RTP out on the road enforcing safety every single day, or you can write-off Thailand as another 3rd World S**thole. You can't expect to get quality tourist to keep coming back to a country where safety is an afterthought, or just completely ignored.

yes you will have to write-off Thailand as another 3rd World S**thole.  No concept of safety just the knee jerk reaction BAN, CNG fuel they don't think that it maybe the system of  maintenance, Inspection, corruption  lack of Training, lack of education in safety just ban CNG problem solved !!!  Yes get the RTP out every day BUT They are just as bad no training in safety, Safety education should be taught in schools and at the workplace

Thailand has a comprehensive legal framework in place to ensure health and safety. The primary law governing this is the Occupational Safety, Health and Environment Act B.E. 2554 (2011). This law outlines the responsibilities of both employers and employees, mandates hazard prevention and risk control measures, and requires the establishment of safety committees for larger businesses.

The Department of Labor Protection and Welfare (DLPW) is the primary body responsible for health and safety in Thailand. The DLPW has labor inspectors who conduct inspections and enforce safety regulations. Where are theses Inspectors?? Why are they not doing there job??

Why are these safety Regulations not being enforced ??

[lordgrinz]

14 minutes ago, MikeandDow said:

Yes get the RTP out every day BUT They are just as bad no training in safety,

 

I want to believe that, but after going to the RTP station for 3 different accidents in my car, and one in my wife's car. The RTP officer in charge sided with us on all four incidents, at least the traffic officer in charge definitely knows the laws and applied them correctly. So either they only have a few officers with enough knowledge of the Thai laws, or they are blatantly ignoring the lawbreaking, and refusing to do their jobs.