Thailand's Expats Urged to Register with TRD for Tax, Says Expert

[Sigmund]

Many will be faced with the choice to either register or to start packing up and leave Thailand. Stay here for less then 180 days if no choice, but definately not worth staying here for more. Let all the foreigner money be spent elsewhere in Asia.

[riverhigh]

6 hours ago, Gottfrid said:

And again we will have a long winding thread, right? It´s just to go to the tax office and get a TIN. At the same time they will give you the tax form, so you have when time to file. Nothing more nothing less. Now can close the tread. All information that are going to be posted here, we already have in numerous thread already. You just have to pay tax on taxable income in almost every country you become a resident. Why everyone complain and think Thailand is the promised land and a tax haven?

If you are on a one year visa that can be teminated on the whim of a bureaucrat, you are not a resisednt.  You neither have the rights nor the representation of a resident. You are merely a glorified holiday maker on an extended visa. This is not taxes this is a unjustified money grab.

[NoDisplayName]

4 hours ago, Sheryl said:

Since the Thai tax form does not provide any means of declaring nion-assessable income, and there has been no indication that will change, it makes zero sense for people without assessable income to submit a Thai tax return. You'd have to show 0 income, which would surely lead to questions/problems.

 

Not likely.  Showing zero salary/income and zero assessable remittances is normal for many filing only to request refund of interest withholding tax.

 

In case someone asks about remittances, the response that it was prior savings or pension should be sufficient.

 

 

[black tabby12345]

28 minutes ago, Surasak said:

You most certainly did, and not so many days ago. I visited my local tax office a few months ago, August I believe, and was sent away. That will do for me.

 

Did the tax man tell you to go home as you have nothing to do with Thai income tax?

Exactly the same as what Thai Embassy says on website.

 

Do retirees pay income tax? | ThaiEmbassy.com

 

[JimGant]

2 hours ago, chiang mai said:

2 hours ago, anrcaccount said:

The vast majority of those using the income method for their visas have never filed a Thai tax return, despite many technically breaching the laws, for many years, with zero consequences.

 

IMO, next year will be no different. 

 

 

 

And your proof of these things is where?

In human nature. Only an idiot would file a tax return, when he didn't have to. Any other reason, particularly when no taxes were owed, would, I guess, be maybe because of an obscure, nonsensical requirement to file if having greater than 60/120/220, whatever, assessable income. Easily ignored -- with no reportable consequences -- due, I guess, to TRD common sense. Common sense, too, with your actions.

[Surasak]

5 hours ago, ujayujay said:

As a pensioner in Thailand, I can't do anything as long as I'm only given so little information by the Thai tax authorities! Are they too lazy to provide reliable information or are they simply incompetent?🤪

I wont say it is incompetence, more a case of they just don't know. There is a lot of information to digest as far as the international taxation changes are concerned. Knowing Thai authorities, they will do their damnedest to make as much as they can, from as many as they can.

[black tabby12345]

Discussing potential changes to Thailand’s tax system, Carden mentioned the speculative nature of shifting from a residence-based tax system to one that includes worldwide income, which would require parliamentary approval.

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He  admits he doesn't really know anything better than the ordinary expats(retires), but still want clients' money for his Useless Consultancy.

 

Bull*hit article of the year.

 

[chiang mai]

1 hour ago, sambum said:

"....only UK Government related pensions (not state pension) is free of tax in Thailand."

 

Are they not the same thing, or by "UK Government related pensions" do you mean something like a Civil Service pension, or a Serviceman's pension?

Government Pension - Civil service, military etc....not State Pension

[ModdaPunk]

Tax expert Thomas Carden can go suck a bag of mints.

[chiang mai]

24 minutes ago, JimGant said:

Has merit -- why? Why put yourself in TRD files as a tax filer -- when no taxes are owed? Probably (I hope) such a filing would go in the trash bin, as generating no interest, and no revenue. But, worst case -- you're now in the data base, and as such, they'll now expect an annual tax filing (even it it's another brain-dead nil filing) -- and if they don't get one, they'll investigate.

 

No, only an idiot would file a nil tax return -- and put themselves on the radar screen for future tax filings.

I think it has merit, that is my opinion. And please don't call people idiots just for having a different opinion to you!

[chiang mai]

11 minutes ago, JimGant said:

In human nature. Only an idiot would file a tax return, when he didn't have to. Any other reason, particularly when no taxes were owed, would, I guess, be maybe because of an obscure, nonsensical requirement to file if having greater than 60/120/220, whatever, assessable income. Easily ignored -- with no reportable consequences -- due, I guess, to TRD common sense. Common sense, too, with your actions.

Once again, stop calling people idiots just because they have a different opinion to you. Some people want to file a null return, some people want to be seen as small fry to avoid closer scrutiny.

[Sheryl]

23 minutes ago, NoDisplayName said:

 

Not likely.  Showing zero salary/income and zero assessable remittances is normal for many filing only to request refund of interest withholding tax.

 

In case someone asks about remittances, the response that it was prior savings or pension should be sufficient.

 

 

Last time I filled out form to get interest witholding back it led to 2 full days of inquisition at provincial tax office  and having to submit copious documentation going back many years. My replies were definitly not consideted  sufficient. ... and that was back before the  rule about remittances was modified. 

[JimGant]

5 minutes ago, chiang mai said:

Some people want to file a null return, some people want to be seen as small fry to avoid closer scrutiny.

Ok, I won't call them idiots. So, what shall we call them? Misinformed?

[Lacessit]

9 hours ago, BritManToo said:

Expat clubs are riddled with crooks trying to make money from elderly expats.

It's probably why I have never joined an expat club.

[JimGant]

11 minutes ago, chiang mai said:

I think it has merit

 Why, for goodness sakes?

[Keeps]

6 hours ago, Gottfrid said:

And again we will have a long winding thread, right? It´s just to go to the tax office and get a TIN. At the same time they will give you the tax form, so you have when time to file. Nothing more nothing less. Now can close the tread. All information that are going to be posted here, we already have in numerous thread already. You just have to pay tax on taxable income in almost every country you become a resident. Why everyone complain and think Thailand is the promised land and a tax haven?

Don't worry everyone. The font of all knowledge has just answered all our questions. Nobody need ever to open a thread (or tread depending on how you like to spell it) in this regard again. Any queries, send a PM to the above poster as he has all the answers.

[EVENKEEL]

3 hours ago, chiang mai said:

If you mean that link you posted a couple of times, the one that talked about Negative Income Tax, that's something completely and totally different from what everyone else is talking about currently and has nothing to do with the need to file a return next year.

That's because there isn't anything new about filing taxes, that's according to the Minister of Finance. 

 

https://thethaiger.com/guides/best-of/top-5-tax-firms-in-thailand

 

Lister contributed the above thread for tax experts. But, he was just giving advice to help.

[chiang mai]

2 minutes ago, JimGant said:

 Why, for goodness sakes?

I've already explained it to you! Some people want a track record with the Revenue to show they are following the rules and to demonstrate they are small fry in the tax world and the world of remittances to Thailand. It's a matter of personal choice, it's not as though they are breaking any laws, they are in fact following the law to the letter. Now enough of this, we've been down this road endless times and you know all these things already. 

[chiang mai]

1 minute ago, EVENKEEL said:

That's because there isn't anything new about filing taxes, that's according to the Minister of Finance. 

I've no idea what you're talking about.

[Keeps]

7 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

It's probably why I have never joined an expat club.

Have you ever had an invitation?...555

[NoDisplayName]

10 minutes ago, Sheryl said:

Last time I filled out form to get interest witholding back it led to 2 full days of inquisition at provincial tax office  and having to submit copious documentation going back many years. My replies were definitly not consideted  sufficient. ... and that was back before the  rule about remittances was modified. 

 

That is surprising.  Opposite my experience in Bangkok and Korat.

 

Could you share some non-personally-identifying details?  What office?  Did you have any assessable income?  What sort of documentation was requested that a bank or brokerage statement wouldn't easily suffice?  Why would many years of documentation be required when income not from current year is not assessable?

[Lacessit]

3 hours ago, chiang mai said:

I agree with this assessment. 

 

Another poster made a valid point earlier when he said he would file, even though he had no tax to pay. His motive was that he wanted to identify himself to TRD as a small fish and to build up a track record as such....the idea has merit.

Maybe. My policy has always been to fly under the radar, and give bureaucrats as little information as possible.

 

It's also why I stay off Facebook and X.

[chiang mai]

3 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

Maybe. My policy has always been to fly under the radar, and give bureaucrats as little information as possible.

 

It's also why I stay off Facebook and X.

How far under the radar can a resident foreigner be in Thailand! Immigration has all our bank details, the bank has our Immigration/visa details, everyone has copies of our passports, the BOT sees all our inbound and outbound TT's, the TRD gets details of tax withheld on savings accounts, etc etc etc. 

[Njoku]

7 hours ago, spidermike007 said:

The only way they could get me to register for a tax number would be to threaten to deny the renewal of my visa. Anything short of that, and I will remain without a tax number as long as I possibly can. 

And when that day comes the tax is retrospective plus interest plus a fine for each year you did not comply...and no visa renewal until tax is up to date...good one...thats how to do it...

[chiang mai]

31 minutes ago, JimGant said:

Ok, I won't call them idiots. So, what shall we call them? Misinformed?

You don't need to cal them any name, they are just people with opinions different to yours. You don't have a monopoly on correct options and you are not an authority on expat Thai taxpayer strategy.

[MartinBangkok]

7 hours ago, spidermike007 said:

The only way they could get me to register for a tax number would be to threaten to deny the renewal of my visa. Anything short of that, and I will remain without a tax number as long as I possibly can. 

This is exactly what is going to happen. Next year when you go to renew your visa, they will show you your world wide income, or at least income from your home country, thanks to the new global reporting.

 

The message will be: You owe us this much, and you have to pay now. If not we will not renew your visa, and until you pay we will put you in the immigration detention center.

 

Trust me. This will be close to the truth.

[Sheryl]

52 minutes ago, NoDisplayName said:

 

That is surprising.  Opposite my experience in Bangkok and Korat.

 

Could you share some non-personally-identifying details?  What office?  Did you have any assessable income?  What sort of documentation was requested that a bank or brokerage statement wouldn't easily suffice?  Why would many years of documentation be required when income not from current year is not assessable?

Thus was a few years ago. After that I stopped trying to claim ghe witholding back.

 

Office = Prachinburi. 

 

No assessable income.

 

I had to show years worth of credit advices proving remittances ftom abroad.

 

The issue was they did  not believe  I did not work in Thailand.  Endless demands for the "work permit" I do not have and complete incomprehrnsion when I pointed to my retirement extension. Many very personal and intrusive questions.

 

[thailand49]

Maybe he wasnt so busy drumming up the fear to use " tax experts "  to navigate  he didnt get the memo they havent drafted a thing still in discussion havent voted.

[Airalee]

Easier and cheaper for me to just have lots of holidays abroad.  This year it was 3 months in the US followed by a 5 day stay in Thailand to renew my retirement visa and now I’m currently in Da Nang where they are more than happy to have me.

 

Next year…Japan.  
 

I own a sweet condo in Bangkok that I will let friends stay in for free when they come….(and will do all the necessary reporting of a foreigner staying)….and that means less money for Thai hotels and restaurants.

[chiang mai]

2 minutes ago, thailand49 said:

Maybe he wasnt so busy drumming up the fear to use " tax experts "  to navigate  he didnt get the memo they havent drafted a thing still in discussion havent voted.

There is no discussion and there is no vote, the rule change was made effective 1 January 2024, it's all been done and dusted and is now in effect.