How are non-maga Americans describing yourselves to non-Americans that you meet now?

[Peabody]

22 minutes ago, Gecko123 said:

Maybe those whose papers are in order can get a tattoo or something so they can get through check points easier.

A yellow star?  

[Jingthing]

11 minutes ago, Peabody said:

If asked, I just say that I'm from the States. If they ask more, I mention my home state of Alabama. I think some then just assume that I'm MAGA.

I am not a fan of Trump. I've met 1 new person in the last 2 years. He is an ex-cop and a Trump fan.

We get along great, with several common interests OUTSIDE of politics and a genuine curiosity about each other's habits and doings. He's a super nice guy and we just agreed to not debate politics. Same with one of my many brothers.

It sounds like you might be talking about fellow Americans.

I enjoy talking with old style never Trumper republicans.

I have a lot in common with them. 

However, I don't think I have anything to say to full blown maga cult members or me to them. 

 

You've given me an idea though with your Alabama reference.

Yes many people would get that code for likely maga.

I suppose I could say I'm "from" San Francisco which isn't technically true but that code would work for many people including foreigners. But San Francisco is loaded in too many ways so maybe California would be better as a more generic code for not maga.

 

I kind of really like that idea -- CALIFORNIA.

For any informed person on the U.S. divide saying that would at the very least indicate a person who can't be assumed to be maga, and more likely than that, probably not maga. Then if they want to pursue a discussion, it gives them an in. Otherwise. probably enough. 

 

 

[Jingthing]

2 minutes ago, pedro01 said:

 

Hahahahaha

 

This is brilliant.

 

 

Thank you!

[Gecko123]

3 minutes ago, Peabody said:

A yellow star?  

Yes, I was making that historical allusion.

[Jingthing]

24 minutes ago, daveAustin said:

That's what the left does. They do not do opinion very well. Yes, Trump is a douche, but he just has a different opinion and people clearly like the guy. And what is wrong with wanting to make one's country better? This whole maga thing (highly stigmatised now--if Obama invented it it wouldn't be a thing) is what America was wholesale back in the day... you guys have just forgotten what you are about. For supporting Brexit (yes, sorry, very off topic) and wanting my own country to have say-so on its own policy, I'm apparently racist. It is divisive and damaging as is the inflammatory tat coming from the democrats. All you guys whinging at Trump and his supporters ad nauseam need to come together a bit and find common ground.

 

Op, just say you're a yank that does not agree with its leadership and would prefer to make America worse.

 

Btw, did he open up the FBI files on JFK yet?

Of course I don't want to make America worse. What a sleazy thing to accuse.

[frank83628]

1 hour ago, Jingthing said:

Most of America's traditional democratic allies are very much anti Trump. 

 

What's a brokie?

Says who?

[Gecko123]

Just now, frank83628 said:

Says who?

It would be easier for you to name one who isn't.

[sammieuk1]

5 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

I'm an expat. The random European I met a tourist.

And magicly you have answered your own question🤔

[Jingthing]

1 minute ago, sammieuk1 said:

And magicly you have answered your own question🤔

No idea what you're talking about.

[NanLaew]

16 hours ago, Jingthing said:

Yeah well living in Pattaya, I can tell you that there are many Maga Americans here. Perhaps the majority. No hat needed. Less so in Bangkok and Chiang Mai. 

 

Yes, I recall someone having a rough stab at the American demographic in Thailand in another thread, and it was observed that bigger cities like Bangkok appears to have more Democrats whereas the tourist traps like Pattaya have more of the MAGA sect. I am not sure how that translates to other farang enclaves like Phuket, Samui or Chiang Mai, so I will take your word for it.

 

Personally, when I lived in Pattaya, most of the Americans who were regulars at one of the bars I frequented were ex-military and rabid Trump followers. These guys were decent and fun to drink with, but if someone raised politics, they became obnoxious and loud, and would pull more and more extreme first-term Trump conspiracy theory stuff out of their arses, like the birther conspiracy and 'Mike' Obama. It was like a puerility competition. That was usually a signal for me to pay my bill, and leave them to their nonsense.

 

So, back to the OP, I am not sure if the casual acquaintance non-American you meet is going to be overly concerned about your politics. I am sure that most may have already formed a generic one-size fits-all opinion of all Americans. Anyway, talking politics with comparative strangers is a bit crass, no? There's no need to bring your butt hurt to the table, as that may just enforce the opinion they already have, or otherwise.

[dinsdale]

4 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Of course I don't want to make America worse. What a sleazy thing to accuse.

Excellent. At last a reasonable comment. Do you therefore like the vast majority of voters want to...

[Jingthing]

8 minutes ago, NanLaew said:

 

Yes, I recall someone having a rough stab at the American demographic in Thailand in another thread, and it was observed that bigger cities like Bangkok appears to have more Democrats whereas the tourist traps like Pattaya have more of the MAGA sect. I am not sure how that translates to other farang enclaves like Phuket, Samui or Chiang Mai, so I will take your word for it.

 

Personally, when I lived in Pattaya, most of the Americans who were regulars at one of the bars I frequented were ex-military and rabid Trump followers. These guys were decent and fun to drink with, but if someone raised politics, they became obnoxious and loud, and would pull more and more extreme first-term Trump conspiracy theory stuff out of their arses, like the birther conspiracy and 'Mike' Obama. It was like a puerility competition. That was usually a signal for me to pay my bill, and leave them to their nonsense.

 

So, back to the OP, I am not sure if the casual acquaintance non-American you meet is going to be overly concerned about your politics. I am sure that most may have already formed a generic one-size fits-all opinion of all Americans. Anyway, talking politics with comparative strangers is a bit crass, no? There's no need to bring your butt hurt to the table, as that may just enforce the opinion they already have, or otherwise.

Chiang Mai is more of a crunchy granola type of place. Definitely the least maga of the major expat magnets unless you count Pai as a major destination.

I agree don't aggressively push politics.

I already said I would never say I'm American and I hate Trump.

I was looking for something more subtle and dignified because I know for a fact that some foreigners are thinking about the U.S. divide when they meet an American. 

 

But surprise surprise, I'm kind of shocked but I have now gotten exactly what I was looking for when I started this thread.

 

Where are you from?

CALIFORNIA

 

If the person is interested in taking the code and interested in politics, they make the move.

 

This is sorted for me now.

[bkk6060]

Why lie and hide as to who you are and where you are from jeez grow up.

People are so obsessed with this.  It is over maybe move on and if you live in Thailand; feel lucky and enjoy life.

[Jingthing]

5 minutes ago, bkk6060 said:

Why lie and hide as to who you are and where you are from jeez grow up.

People are so obsessed with this.  It is over maybe move on and if you live in Thailand; feel lucky and enjoy life.

It's not a lie for me to say California. 

I lived there longer than any other U.S. state.

For me at least the California response is truly perfect.

To be clear, I won't say America. I'll say California.

I used to find that a bit obnoxious but everyone has heard of California. and it really works for my subtle coding purposes in this the dark age of Magautocracy.

Of course I do realize there are maga Californians. but it's their problem if saying California codes to many people that they likely aren't. I won't worry about that.

[NanLaew]

5 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Chiang Mai is more of a crunchy granola type of place. Definitely the last maga of the major expat magnets.

I agree don't aggressively push politics.

I already said I would never say I'm American and I hate Trump.

I was looking for something more subtle and dignified because I know for a fact that some foreigners are thinking about the U.S. divide when they meet an American. 

 

But suprise surprise, I'm kind of shocked but I have now gotten exactly what I was looking for when I started this thread.

 

Where are you from?

CALIFORNIA

 

If the person is interested in taking the code and interested in politics, they make the move.

 

This is sorted for me now.

 

Self-help... awesome!

[frank83628]

3 minutes ago, Gecko123 said:

It would be easier for you to name one who isn't.

So, nobody then. Apart from the tit in the UK, David lammy

[Jingthing]

2 minutes ago, NanLaew said:

 

Self-help... awesome!

Yeah baby. 

[sqwakvfr]

Why would I be complicit in "MAGA happening? Do you know who I voted for? Of course not. Do not put all Americans in just two boxes. This is part of the Democratic failed campaign.  There are more than two boxes and some do not fit in either box. 

 

"Be curious, not judgemental".

Ted Lasso. 

[frank83628]

23 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

It sounds like you might be talking about fellow Americans.

I enjoy talking with old style never Trumper republicans.

I have a lot in common with them. 

However, I don't think I have anything to say to full blown maga cult members or me to them. 

 

You've given me an idea though with your Alabama reference.

Yes many people would get that code for likely maga.

I suppose I could say I'm "from" San Francisco which isn't technically true but that code would work for many people including foriegners.

Explains a lot

[Walker88]

The OP is kinder and gentler than I am. I have always been a patriot. I even took the oath and worked against those who would do the US harm, such as Hezbollah, al Qaeda, ISIS, Russia, etc. I have lost faith in my fellow citizens now. Yes, democracy prevailed, but so did ignorance.

 

On my increasingly infrequent trips back to the US, I see that few Americans even have the slightest clue as to what actual US ideals are. I have enormous respect for the brilliant people---almost all men and almost all atheists---who set up the nation some  250 years ago with a goal toward a "more perfect Union". I'm not a believer in Presentism, so I cut some slack to Jefferson and Washington and others who owned slaves. I would like to think that someone of my wealth, but with a strong moral core, would not have owned slaves and been an admirer of Frederick Douglas, but in reality I do not know. I have the luxury of being born when humanity largely accepted the immorality of owning other human beings. (By the way, religion was never so moral as to warn against slavery, not Jeebus nor those Two Corinthians, nor Yahweh nor Allah nor anyone's superstition.)

 

The brilliance of Jefferson (and Madison) was that they knew humans are flawed, and both men seemed to have an understanding that some of their beliefs, as well as societal norms, would change over time. Thus, they wrote documents that were vague enough to allow for adjustment as social attitudes adjusted. They made the USA a perpetual work in progress toward a goal of total human equality under law. That equality under law is important, and does not mean equality in other ways, as certainly Jefferson was smart enough to know the Universe did not create all humans as equals. Under the law, however, all should be equal and free to take themselves wherever their talents and skills allow.

 

Washington took the rare, courageous, and magnanimous step of not sticking around forever, not believing the US should in any way have anything approaching a monarchy. Democracy meant giving citizens a chance to change course if a majority agreed, and also his actions carried an assumption that change itself might be a good thing.

 

One of the most important facets of the system laid down by the Founders was that NOBODY would be above the law. Sadly, that has now been lost. I fear the abhorrence of monarchs or autocrats has also been lost.

 

One beauty we have seen this week is that there is one side of the political spectrum who still believes in the principles upon which the US was founded. Unlike 2020, the US will have a peaceful transfer of power. Dems accepted their defeat and conceded. No way the transfer would have gone as smoothly if Harris had prevailed.  All of the (R) claims about 'rigged' and 'fraud' suddenly evaporated, which suggests even 47 did not think he would win legitimately and was thus trying to set the table for another attempted coup. After his victory, he suddenly turned into Rosanne Rosannadanna..."Never mind". (An old SNL reference to a character of Gilda Radner.)

 

I accept the results of this week. I fear for the future, because I'm not one of those Pollyannas in Magastan who claim, "He just says stuff; he's not really serious". I believe, as Maya Angelou taught us, "When a person shows you who they are, believe them".

 

I expect he will try to go full autocrat, particularly since there will be no guardrails---in the form of Mattis, Milley, Tillerson, Coats, Haspel, Esper, Kelly, Cohn, etc.---this time to stop him. I also know he is incompetent, is willfully ignorant, hasn't a clue how to get 'the price of bacon' down, and generally is going to eff up the economy just as he always has done with his businesses. As a former trader, I'm of the belief---gained through experience and profit---that it is usually best to fade the initial reaction. That is why I am using the current rally in asset prices to get as lean as possible and immunize myself from the calamity and carnage I have no doubt 47 will bring on. I noticed a much better trader than me---Warren Buffett---is doing the same thing.

 

I do not look like a MAGA. I'm in top physical shape---before anyone chimes in, I look much better than the guy with the dead worm in his head, and I'm 100% 'natty'---I dress neatly, I wear no baseball cap, red or backwards or whatever, I am polite, un-tatted and clean. I certainly do not have a "Camp Auschwitz" sweatshirt, and in fact no logos or wording of any sort. Every part of my being says non-MAGA, perhaps even non-American.

 

Should anyone know my place or origin and ask, as the OP asked us, I will quote H.L. Mencken from 100 years ago:

 

"On some great and glorious day the plain folks of the land will reach their heart's desire at last, and the White House will be adorned by a downright moron".

 

It is what it is. We play the cards we are dealt, and we wear no blinders. We see the utter ugliness to come, but should we turn out wrong (highly unlikely), no harm done.

 

[Jingthing]

4 minutes ago, sqwakvfr said:

Why would I be complicit in "MAGA happening? Do you know who I voted for? Of course not. Do not put all Americans in just two boxes. This is part of the Democratic failed campaign.  There are more than two boxes and some do not fit in either box. 

 

"Be curious, not judgemental".

Ted Lasso. 

This is part of my political philosophy. Take it or leave it. Obviously there are levels of complicity. Obviously my level would be very low but the USA is indeed now Trump's maga America and as an American even though I hate maga, it's as impossible for me to totally divorce myself from that any more than an anti Putin Russian. 

[Gecko123]

1 minute ago, frank83628 said:

So, nobody then. Apart from the tit in the UK, David lammy

Again...name a single Western European leader who is genuinely happy to see Trump re-elected with the possible exception of Italy's right wing Giorgia Meloni, and Israel's super-right wing Netanyahu. This is well documented, so lose the smug tone, Frankie Valli.

[sqwakvfr]

Just now, Jingthing said:

This is part of my political philosophy. Take it or leave it. Obviously there are levels of complicity. Obviously my level would be very low but the USA is indeed now Trump's maga America and as an America even though I hate maga, it's as impossible for me to totally divorce myself from that any more than an anti Putin Russian. 

That would be your opinion. We all have opinons but no one speaks for all Americans. Certainly not me and not you.

 

 

[EVENKEEL]

1 hour ago, transam said:

Very funny..............😂

Keep laughing. 

[Walker88]

5 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

It's not a lie for me to say California. 

I lived there longer than any other U.S. state.

For me at least the California response is truly perfect.

To be clear, I won't say America. I'll say California.

I used to find that a bit obnoxious but everyone has heard of California. and it really works for my purposes the age of Magautocracy.

An aside...when I worked in intel in the Middle East, and when I was out and about in true form (not in disguise), I might be in a taxi and be asked, "Where are you from?". Never knowing when a kidnap might be in the cards, I would usually say "California".

 

That almost always resulted in the driver saying, "Hotel California !".

 

Perhaps the spread of American culture kept me out of harm's way.

[Jingthing]

Just now, sqwakvfr said:

That would be your opinion. We all have opinons but no one speaks for all Americans. Certainly not me and not you.

 

 

I just said it's part of my political philosophy. I never said I'm forcing everyone to share my political philosophy or that I speak for everyone so I find you accusing me of that to be quite bizarre.

[Jingthing]

1 minute ago, Walker88 said:

An aside...when I worked in intel in the Middle East, and when I was out and about in true form (not in disguise), I might be in a taxi and be asked, "Where are you from?". Never knowing when a kidnap might be in the cards, I would usually say "California".

 

That almost always resulted in the driver saying, "Hotel California !".

 

Perhaps the spread of American culture kept me out of harm's way.

That's a good one.

Sometimes I feel that way about Thailand.

California does have a magical cultural patina about it.

Part of America, but somehow something else entirely.

[sqwakvfr]

1 minute ago, Jingthing said:

I just said it's part of my political philosophy. I never said I'm forcing everyone to share my political philosophy or that I speak for everyone so I find you accusing me of that to be quite bizarre.

You said we are all complicit? That would be bizarre as well.  So those who did not vote are complicit as well? 

[EVENKEEL]

6 minutes ago, Walker88 said:

The OP is kinder and gentler than I am. I have always been a patriot. I even took the oath and worked against those who would do the US harm, such as Hezbollah, al Qaeda, ISIS, Russia, etc. I have lost faith in my fellow citizens now. Yes, democracy prevailed, but so did ignorance.

 

On my increasingly infrequent trips back to the US, I see that few Americans even have the slightest clue as to what actual US ideals are. I have enormous respect for the brilliant people---almost all men and almost all atheists---who set up the nation some  250 years ago with a goal toward a "more perfect Union". I'm not a believer in Presentism, so I cut some slack to Jefferson and Washington and others who owned slaves. I would like to think that someone of my wealth, but with a strong moral core, would not have owned slaves and been an admirer of Frederick Douglas, but in reality I do not know. I have the luxury of being born when humanity largely accepted the immorality of owning other human beings. (By the way, religion was never so moral as to warn against slavery, not Jeebus nor those Two Corinthians, nor Yahweh nor Allah nor anyone's superstition.)

 

The brilliance of Jefferson (and Madison) was that they knew humans are flawed, and both men seemed to have an understanding that some of their beliefs, as well as societal norms, would change over time. Thus, they wrote documents that were vague enough to allow for adjustment as social attitudes adjusted. They made the USA a perpetual work in progress toward a goal of total human equality under law. That equality under law is important, and does not mean equality in other ways, as certainly Jefferson was smart enough to know the Universe did not create all humans as equals. Under the law, however, all should be equal and free to take themselves wherever their talents and skills allow.

 

Washington took the rare, courageous, and magnanimous step of not sticking around forever, not believing the US should in any way have anything approaching a monarchy. Democracy meant giving citizens a chance to change course if a majority agreed, and also his actions carried an assumption that change itself might be a good thing.

 

One of the most important facets of the system laid down by the Founders was that NOBODY would be above the law. Sadly, that has now been lost. I fear the abhorrence of monarchs or autocrats has also been lost.

 

One beauty we have seen this week is that there is one side of the political spectrum who still believes in the principles upon which the US was founded. Unlike 2020, the US will have a peaceful transfer of power. Dems accepted their defeat and conceded. No way the transfer would have gone as smoothly if Harris had prevailed.  All of the (R) claims about 'rigged' and 'fraud' suddenly evaporated, which suggests even 47 did not think he would win legitimately and was thus trying to set the table for another attempted coup. After his victory, he suddenly turned into Rosanne Rosannadanna..."Never mind". (An old SNL reference to a character of Gilda Radner.)

 

I accept the results of this week. I fear for the future, because I'm not one of those Pollyannas in Magastan who claim, "He just says stuff; he's not really serious". I believe, as Maya Angelou taught us, "When a person shows you who they are, believe them".

 

I expect he will try to go full autocrat, particularly since there will be no guardrails---in the form of Mattis, Milley, Tillerson, Coats, Haspel, Esper, Kelly, Cohn, etc.---this time to stop him. I also know he is incompetent, is willfully ignorant, hasn't a clue how to get 'the price of bacon' down, and generally is going to eff up the economy just as he always has done with his businesses. As a former trader, I'm of the belief---gained through experience and profit---that it is usually best to fade the initial reaction. That is why I am using the current rally in asset prices to get as lean as possible and immunize myself from the calamity and carnage I have no doubt 47 will bring on. I noticed a much better trader than me---Warren Buffett---is doing the same thing.

 

I do not look like a MAGA. I'm in top physical shape---before anyone chimes in, I look much better than the guy with the dead worm in his head, and I'm 100% 'natty'---I dress neatly, I wear no baseball cap, red or backwards or whatever, I am polite, un-tatted and clean. I certainly do not have a "Camp Auschwitz" sweatshirt, and in fact no logos or wording of any sort. Every part of my being says non-MAGA, perhaps even non-American.

 

Should anyone know my place or origin and ask, as the OP asked us, I will quote H.L. Mencken from 100 years ago:

 

"On some great and glorious day the plain folks of the land will reach their heart's desire at last, and the White House will be adorned by a downright moron".

 

It is what it is. We play the cards we are dealt, and we wear no blinders. We see the utter ugliness to come, but should we turn out wrong (highly unlikely), no harm done.

 

Outstanding post. 🤣

[Jingthing]

Just now, sqwakvfr said:

You said we are all complicit? That would be bizarre as well.  So those who did not vote are complicit as well? 

Definitely those who didn't vote.

Dude. I'm sharing my political philosophy.

Not telling you that you need to agree.

Take it or leave it.