Specific EV Questions

[Yodarapper]

14 minutes ago, Pib said:

See...finding out your home had three phase power made all the difference.  

 

And I recommend you keep in simple with your wall charger...like one that does not use/need an app to operate it.   Just need a RFID card you wave in front of it to turn it off and on for charging.    A lot of the fancy chargers are just way too expensive....keep it simple...it will also cost you a lot less.

Cheers, yes I tihnk the Zencar is the cheapest and I read it has no wifi or app.....

 

Let's see....Im still undecided, was looking at some second hand corolla crosses today....noooooooo, this is way to difficult!!!!!

[Pib]

7 minutes ago, Yodarapper said:

Cheers, yes I tihnk the Zencar is the cheapest and I read it has no wifi or app.....

 

Let's see....Im still undecided, was looking at some second hand corolla crosses today....noooooooo, this is way to difficult!!!!!

It seems difficult to you right now (just like when first learning to ride a bike), but after the light blub comes on in your brain (i.e., wow, I understand now) you'll think to yourself "why did I think this was hard to figure out" because it's not really hard at all/turned out to be not really hard at all like you thought it might.

[Yodarapper]

5 minutes ago, Pib said:

It seems difficult to you right now (just like when first learning to ride a bike), but after the light blub comes on in your brain (i.e., wow, I I understand now) you'll think to yourself "why did I think this was hard to figure out" because it's not really hard at all.  

 

I get that but I think for me it's the uncertainty...I like the idea and I love the Atto 3.....compared to other cars Ive test driven in my budget like the Yaris Cross......it's feel so much better.....but it's the uncertainty of if I will be in Thailand for x amount of years....and if going electric now is a wise choice....:(

[Pib]

Just now, Yodarapper said:

 

I get that but I think for me it's the uncertainty...I like the idea and I love the Atto 3.....compared to other cars Ive test driven in my budget like the Yaris Cross......it's feel so much better.....but it's the uncertainty of if I will be in Thailand for x amount of years....and if going electric now is a wise choice....:(

If the uncertainty is that great and you really don't drive that much now, just stick with a used vehicle....probably an used ICEV.

[richard_smith237]

Just on a note about charging etc...     The wife does most of the driving, school runs and her stuff about town etc... 

We had to run a few errands today, myself included, then pick up my son from school... 

We got in the car and it was something in the region of 25% charge.

 

We did what we needed to quickly in town, then drove out to our sons school on the way, stopped off at a PTT station and ran a Fast Charge while we grabbed a quick bite to eat...   we were up to 76% by the time we got back to the car.

 

Thus: the uncertainty of 'being out and about' and getting caught with the pant down and low charge is not really a concern unless on an extremely tight time bomb... 

 

 

Wife did ask - what happens if stuck in a major traffic Jam for hours (it happened to friends a few weeks ago when one of the lanes was blocked in Sukhumvit 39 cycle lane debacle) - I think the car goes into 'low battery mode' turns off the AC etc and goes 'full eco' in a worst case scenario.

But - realistically, I don't ever expect that to happen - after running rudimentary calcs - the car would have to be sitting stationary in a traffic jam for approx 22 hours to run out of power (from 50% with Air conditioning on) 

 

Assumptions: 

Base vehicle electronics (infotainment, lights, etc.): ~0.5 kW.

Air conditioning: ~1.5 kW (for cooling in warm weather).

No other electronics being charged.

Total estimated consumption: 2.0 kW.

Time to deplete the battery: 50% Battery: 44 kWh ÷ 2.0 kW = 22 hours.

 

 

 

[Pib]

I agree with above approx estimates. 

 

I have used OBD2 data (i.e., an OBD2 reader with OBD app) to monitor various metrics on my BYD Atto Extended range with 60.5KW battery.   With OBD data you can usually measure some metrics to greater accuracy than what is displayed on the car's digital dashboard/infotainment displays.  Like power usage can be measured to two decimal points vs just a whole number.

 

Like power usage (i.e., KW)  as you drive along.  On the Atto (and I expect all BYD EVs) the amount of KW being used as you drive along, set/stuck in traffic, etc., is only displayed as a "whole" number....like 0KW, 1KW, 2KW, 20KW, 30KW, etc....no decimal point readout.  While only displaying to a  whole number is all that needed to quickly & easily display approximate power usage for everyday driving if you need/want to know how much power you are really using like when stuck in traffic/idling in hot weather where the dashboard is showing low power usage (i.e., like only a 1 or 2KW) "and" you are really low on battery then only a whole number power usage readout can be deceiving. 

 

By "deceiving" I mean you could be using almost twice as much KW when stuck in traffic/idling than what is being displayed on the card dashboard because of the way the BYD system "rounds" to the newest whole number for power usage.  Whether actually using 1KW or 1.99KW the car's dashboard will display display 1KW although you could actually being using 1.99KW which is twice the power.  If the dashboard is displaying 2KW it could really be as high a 2.99KW actually being used.

 

If it's not too hot of day, you are running the A/C but the car is already cooled down to where the electric AC compressor is no longer running loud & hard and say you are idling/stuck in a traffic jam wondering if you ever get to where you are going, your dashboard could be displaying 0 (zero) KW usage....but actually you could be using 0.99KW.  If the dashboard is displaying 1KW you could actually be using 1KW to 1.99KW.....if displaying 2KW you could actually be using 2KW to 2.99KW, etc.  

 

What I have found in my OBD data monitoring which reports two decimal point of KW being used (or regenerated)  when the Atto is running with no A/C or fan, repeat, off, then the car is really using approx 0.3KW (300 watts).   And the running lights only using approx 0.04KW (40 watts) of that 0.3KW.  So turning off your running lights to save a little power  won't really help much to decease battery usage.  Low beam headlights use approx 0.08KW (80 watts) and high bean approx 0.120KW (120 watts).  All measured using OBD2 data which reports power usage to two decimal points vs just a whole number.

 

And as nice to know, when you are braking and regenerating KW when the display is say showing a minus 7KW being generated it will really be between a -7 to -7.99KW,....say, -1KW is displaying then it's really -1 to -1.99KW.   Just the way BYD rounds and displays power usage/regeneration.

 

So, knowing how BYD vehicles "rounds the display for KW being used/regenerated"  if I was stuck in traffic with say 10% battery SOC (which would be around 6KW of my Atto's 60KW battery), A/C turned on to cool of my "hot-under-the-collar attitude due to the traffic jam, headlights even turned on, and the dashboard showing 1KW power usage (which could really be as high as 1.99KW), I know I could really set idling in that traffic jam without moving an inch for at least 3 hours if really using 1.99KW.  And if It  was really using 1KW then around 6 hours...but it's best to round-up to the next whole KW number to play it safe.   Roll the windows down and just turn the A/C and fan off to where the car is only drawing 0.3KW (300 watts) and I could idle in that daytime traffic jam for 20 hours before the battery hit 0% SoC.

 

Yeap, if getting stuck in a traffic jam and running out of juice then you have really let your battery get way, way too low before you started your trip.....you are gambling on smooth traffic the whole way....just blame yourself.   Gosh, about the only time I let my Atto drop below 25% SoC is when I have decided to run it down to 10% or below followed by a charge to 100% for the battery BMS recalibration that BYD recommends be done every 3 to 6 months to keep your SoC display accurate.  

 

 

 

 

[Pib]

Here's an example of the KW usage while idling in traffic on a cloudy 30C day when the AC did not have to work that hard....car dashboard shows 1KW being used but OBD data shows it's really 1.89KW...durn near 2KW.  See circled numbers.

 

[KhunLA]

We use about 2% or 1 kWh, per hour, w/ MG ZS, at idle, full power, AC on, high fan.

[Yodarapper]

I thought the atto3 was the car to go but I am seeing there are other options that cna do longer ranges. Is there a better alternative in the same ballpark price wise that can do longer range?

 

I’ve kept my appointment tomorrow to go and see the car again….

[UWEB]

36 minutes ago, Yodarapper said:

I thought the atto3 was the car to go but I am seeing there are other options that cna do longer ranges. Is there a better alternative in the same ballpark price wise that can do longer range?

 

I’ve kept my appointment tomorrow to go and see the car again….

I would stay with the Atto3 ext. Range. Was my first intention as well to buy one, but finally I bought a Seal.

[Yodarapper]

What about the m6 - that has a range of 520 km? That’s a lot more than the atto3 right?

the Kia EV 5 also has more range?

[vinny41]

21 minutes ago, Yodarapper said:

What about the m6 - that has a range of 520 km? That’s a lot more than the atto3 right?

the Kia EV 5 also has more range?

Kia EV 5 price range from B1,299,000 – 1,799,000 

Light / Air Maximum driving distance per full charge is 490 kilometers (NEDC standard).

Earth Long Range Maximum driving distance per full charge is 665 kilometers (NEDC standard).

Earth Exclusive AWD Maximum driving distance per full charge is 620 kilometers (NEDC standard).

EV5 Earth Long Range : 1,599,000 baht

EV5 Earth Exclusive AWD : 1,799,000 baht

Atto 3 480 Extended Range   899,900 baht during Motor show

So nearly B700K extra  for EV5 Earth compared to atto 3 480 extended

[vinny41]

8 hours ago, Yodarapper said:

What about the m6 - that has a range of 520 km? That’s a lot more than the atto3 right?

the Kia EV 5 also has more range?

M6 Extended has range of 530km they also have new model with 7 seats for B899K

https://autolifethailand.tv/official-discount-price-byd-m6-ev-thailand-motor-expo-2024/

https://www.reverautomotive.com/news/byd-m6-7-seat-price-announcement

[JBChiangRai]

If I were Yodarapper my head would be spinning.

 

For me, the solution is obvious.

 

Typical maximum journey is 185km to Rayong.  There are more than a dozen fast chargers on the way to Rayong and lots in Rayong.

 

He doesn't need an extended range vehicle, the standard Atto 3 is fine, but by all means go for the extended if you prefer.  It will get you to Rayong with as much again spare.  Top up on the way back at any of the chargers on the way back, I would top up at the first one for about 15-20 minutes to avoid range anxiety.

 

Next the issue of the home charger.  I would be budgeting 15,000 baht maximum (I may be as cheap as 9,500 baht) for a plug in 7Kw portable wall box, asking my landlord if I could fit a 32 amp socket where I park the car to allow EV charging, it improves the rentability of the property, he would be mad to say no.  Perhaps it costs 3-7,000 for that, that is the only wasted expenditure when you move to a new property, you unplug and take the charger with you.

 

You should not consider an ICE car, you've already driven the Atto and know how superior it is to drive over an ICE.

 

I think it would help if instead of bombarding Yodarapper with possibilities and information, we advised what we would do, bearing in mind a wall box is not included.

[vinny41]

7 minutes ago, JBChiangRai said:

If I were Yodarapper my head would be spinning.

 

For me, the solution is obvious.

 

Typical maximum journey is 185km to Rayong.  There are more than a dozen fast chargers on the way to Rayong and lots in Rayong.

 

He doesn't need an extended range vehicle, the standard Atto 3 is fine, but by all means go for the extended if you prefer.  It will get you to Rayong with as much again spare.  Top up on the way back at any of the chargers on the way back, I would top up at the first one for about 15-20 minutes to avoid range anxiety.

 

Next the issue of the home charger.  I would be budgeting 15,000 baht maximum (I may be as cheap as 9,500 baht) for a plug in 7Kw portable wall box, asking my landlord if I could fit a 32 amp socket where I park the car to allow EV charging, it improves the rentability of the property, he would be mad to say no.  Perhaps it costs 3-7,000 for that, that is the only wasted expenditure when you move to a new property, you unplug and take the charger with you.

 

You should not consider an ICE car, you've already driven the Atto and know how superior it is to drive over an ICE.

 

I think it would help if instead of bombarding Yodarapper with possibilities and information, we advised what we would do, bearing in mind a wall box is not included.

 It was @Yodarapper that posted he was looking at the atto3 extended and from his previous posts he stated ideally his preferance was for 7 seats has he has family coming over from Europe

[JBChiangRai]

5 minutes ago, vinny41 said:

 It was @Yodarapper that posted he was looking at the atto3 extended and from his previous posts he stated ideally his preferance was for 7 seats has he has family coming over from Europe

 

I missed that, then the Atto Station Wagon is the right choice, I think it's called M6 or B6.

[Pib]

On 12/3/2024 at 8:22 PM, Yodarapper said:

Wallbox people were at my house, I wasn't there but they said it was no problem to install the charger and no need to contact MEA. They asked where the charger would go, asked how I park front or back to see where the charging point would be etc.

They recommended 3 chargers:

Schneider Charge 7.4KW

Autel MaxiCharger 7.4KW

Zencar Wpro 7.4KW

 

No prices yet, they said quote tomorrow.

 

Did you get the quote?  If so, how much, which charger,  etc?  Thanks.

[Yodarapper]

3 hours ago, Pib said:

Did you get the quote?  If so, how much, which charger,  etc?  Thanks.

I did - they gave me the three options and the three prices.

i asked for the cheapest which was the zencar and they have quoted 35K

 

[Yodarapper]

9 hours ago, JBChiangRai said:

If I were Yodarapper my head would be spinning.

 

For me, the solution is obvious.

 

Typical maximum journey is 185km to Rayong.  There are more than a dozen fast chargers on the way to Rayong and lots in Rayong.

 

He doesn't need an extended range vehicle, the standard Atto 3 is fine, but by all means go for the extended if you prefer.  It will get you to Rayong with as much again spare.  Top up on the way back at any of the chargers on the way back, I would top up at the first one for about 15-20 minutes to avoid range anxiety.

 

Next the issue of the home charger.  I would be budgeting 15,000 baht maximum (I may be as cheap as 9,500 baht) for a plug in 7Kw portable wall box, asking my landlord if I could fit a 32 amp socket where I park the car to allow EV charging, it improves the rentability of the property, he would be mad to say no.  Perhaps it costs 3-7,000 for that, that is the only wasted expenditure when you move to a new property, you unplug and take the charger with you.

 

You should not consider an ICE car, you've already driven the Atto and know how superior it is to drive over an ICE.

 

I think it would help if instead of bombarding Yodarapper with possibilities and information, we advised what we would do, bearing in mind a wall box is not included.

My head is definitely spinning mate! Probably just my over thinking nature…..

went again today and saw the atto3 and the M6. Wife asked for us to test drive and wife and kids loved it but to me it seems less….nice. More room but the driver seat is lower and doesn’t feel so premium.

good things I guess is the 7 seater and bigger battery means more km but everything in be read puts the atto3 as a better car?

current offer means both are same price. But in thinking the atto3 is a better option because it’s a better car? 
thoughts?

[Yodarapper]

3 hours ago, Pib said:

Did you get the quote?  If so, how much, which charger,  etc?  Thanks.

 

[JBChiangRai]

15 minutes ago, Yodarapper said:

My head is definitely spinning mate! Probably just my over thinking nature…..

went again today and saw the atto3 and the M6. Wife asked for us to test drive and wife and kids loved it but to me it seems less….nice. More room but the driver seat is lower and doesn’t feel so premium.

good things I guess is the 7 seater and bigger battery means more km but everything in be read puts the atto3 as a better car?

current offer means both are same price. But in thinking the atto3 is a better option because it’s a better car? 
thoughts?

 

11 minutes ago, Yodarapper said:

 

 

I'm driven by my head not my heart when it comes to cars.  The Atto 3 is more my taste than the M6 but I would sacrifice practicality over looks every time.

 

On the charger you can pay 36-47,000 baht and write it all off when you leave, or you can 10-15,000 baht and only write off 3-8,000 baht when you leave and your next installation will be cheap too.  Both give you the same charging speed.  I am from Yorkshire, we are like the Scottish but with the generosity wrung out of them.

[Yodarapper]

10 minutes ago, JBChiangRai said:

 

 

I'm driven by my head not my heart when it comes to cars.  The Atto 3 is more my taste than the M6 but I would sacrifice practicality over looks every time.

 

On the charger you can pay 36-47,000 baht and write it all off when you leave, or you can 10-15,000 baht and only write off 3-8,000 baht when you leave and your next installation will be cheap too.  Both give you the same charging speed.  I am from Yorkshire, we are like the Scottish but with the generosity wrung out of them.

I hear you, if it was my

house I would definetly do this but I’m thinking I would need to find an electrician, get him to understand me, check with my landlord, landlord would have to trust him…..etc etc etc….

 

yes M6 may be more practical but not sure we really need a 7 seater - have 2 kids and folks coming out now but do we need a 7 seater for the

off chance someone visits us?

[Andrew Dwyer]

6 minutes ago, Yodarapper said:

I hear you, if it was my

house I would definetly do this but I’m thinking I would need to find an electrician, get him to understand me, check with my landlord, landlord would have to trust him…..etc etc etc….

 

yes M6 may be more practical but not sure we really need a 7 seater - have 2 kids and folks coming out now but do we need a 7 seater for the

off chance someone visits us?

M6 has 2 x 6 seater versions also but i agree the Atto 3 is the nicer car.

Boils down to how much do you want the extra seats ? would you regret buying the Atto just for the times you have visitors or would the practicality of a 6/7 seater be more important than the more modern Attos looks ??

 

I think it is down to you now, you have narrowed it down …… almost to one !!!

[vinny41]

1 hour ago, Yodarapper said:

My head is definitely spinning mate! Probably just my over thinking nature…..

went again today and saw the atto3 and the M6. Wife asked for us to test drive and wife and kids loved it but to me it seems less….nice. More room but the driver seat is lower and doesn’t feel so premium.

good things I guess is the 7 seater and bigger battery means more km but everything in be read puts the atto3 as a better car?

current offer means both are same price. But in thinking the atto3 is a better option because it’s a better car? 
thoughts?

deleted

 

 

[Pib]

1 hour ago, Yodarapper said:

 

Pricey....and a good portion of that price is since they are only offering higher end wall chargers which includes fancy settings/display/wifi/app.    Even the ZENCAR Wpro 7.4Kw apparently has Wifi and an app.   And for each installation meter above 15m is probably being charged at Bt400-Bt500 per meter which includes the wire, conduit, and misc installation parts. 

 

 And just as FYI "if" a 2nd meter/wiring had been required (but it not in your case) that would have added approx another Bt10K-15K to the cost due to larger wiring requirement, more installation costs, and some payment to the electric company for the 2nd meter & inspection.

 

When I bought my Atto in Oct 2023 with free wall charger installation if I remember right that was "BYD valued" at around Bt25K (i.e, charger with installation) but in came with a simple ZHida 7.4KW wall charger that has no display/fancy settings/nor uses Wifi or an app....it simply used a RFID card to turn it off on and the charger and installation came with a 2 year warranty.  I didn't have any additional installation costs as I have a 100A service and they only needed 11 meters of wire.   The simple Zhida charger has worked just fine after having it for around 13 months now.   On Lazada at the time the very same Zhida charger was going for around Bt11K. 

 

Now, when looking at the BYD Rever Automotive website at the bottom is all I can find about free wall charger with installation when the vehicle you buy comes with the free wall charger.   And I'm sure what BYD pays a contractor for a wall charger installation is a lot less than the retail price you are being quoted.

 

Anyway, free 7.4KW wall charger with installation is a nice value-added component when buying an EV....it's worth at least Bt25K and probably more like around/over Bt36K if a person has to pay retail price and can't get the low price that a large company like BYD can get.   Plus, less headaches in arranging the installation.   I'm surprised free wall charger with installation is not being offered now when buying an Atto....maybe that's how BYD is partially offsetting the Atto's current promotional price which is Bt50K lower than before the promotion began.  

 

•  

  Quote

   

  • Free ! Home Charger Unit ready for installation. To ensure our valued customers will have their BYD electric vehicles sufficiently charged to lead their daily life with peace of mind, BYD customers will be provided with a home charger unit FOC plus onsite installation service at your home. Installation of home charger unit covers wiring of cables and electrical safety equipment with a distance of 15 m, as well as listed equipment only. This will be carried out by Encom Sharge Utility Services Co., Ltd. with one-year warranty for the first installation. (excluding charging adapter and any other services not covered by the existing terms and conditions). In case where other additional services and/or equipment not stated in the existing terms and conditions are required, the customer shall be responsible for the expenses incurred. The additional services may include, for instance, ceiling, wall, and floor slitting, or in case where the electric power is not sufficient for electric car charging, the customer is required to pay an extra cost for electrical cable wiring. In addition, the installation of home charger does not include the cost of other accessories, for instance, home charger base stands.

    
    

   

   

 

 

 

[Pib]

3 hours ago, Yodarapper said:

I hear you, if it was my

house I would definetly do this but I’m thinking I would need to find an electrician, get him to understand me, check with my landlord, landlord would have to trust him…..etc etc etc….

 

yes M6 may be more practical but not sure we really need a 7 seater - have 2 kids and folks coming out now but do we need a 7 seater for the

off chance someone visits us?

 

First, since installation of a 7KW wall charger is presenting challenges (and healthy cost) you need to decide if you can effectively live with an EV "without a 7KW/32A wall charger" and just a portable approx 2KW/10A wall charger for most of your day-to-day charging needs.  Now the answer is "of course you can" as long as you live somewhere has a typical 3-wire 16A household electrical outlet you can easily and securely access.  By securely access I mean leave the portable charger plugged in like overnight while charging without fear of the charger being stolen.   

 

And of course you will need to ensure the circuit that 16A outlet is on is not already powering a bunch of other households items which might cause the circuit breaker for that 16A outlet to trip due to overload when you plug in the 10A portable charger....like the circuit is already drawing say 8A as it powers an A/C, a TV, a microwave, fan, lights, etc., which means 8A plus another 10A charger would be 18A and would cause the circuit breaker to trip after a while if it's a 16A breaker....but if it's a 20A or more breaker you are good to go.  Typical household sockets are usually on a 16A or 20A circuit breaker.    But I expect whatever 16A socket you will hopefully have in your carport area will be able to easily handle a portable charger....even one that is a little larger than 2KW/10A.   You might even be able to get away with a 3.6KW/16A charger although I would make sure the outlet is at least a 20A outlet and circuit breaker.

 

OK, let's say you decide a portable charger will be just fine for you....lots of EV owners get by just fine with a portable charger.   Now with that worry, bee buzzing around you head out of the way, you just need to decide on what EV you like the best and can afford.  That's a personal decision as personal tastes and also finances vary greatly from individual to individual.   Since you seem to be focused on the Atto and M6 right now and since they are very similarly spec'ed and priced EVs it really comes down to which one you like best...feels/rides the best to you.  And when it comes to those 2 extra seats in the M6 "for me, what I need" they would be a waste...just in the way...stay folded down all the time for cargo space----just like the 2 extra seats in my 2009 Toyota Fortuner...actually those 2 extra Fortuner seats are more in the way than useful and I've only used those 2 seats "one" time to seat people when I  first got the car right after buying it in late 2008....those seats haven't been used to seat people since.

 

Cheers.

 

[JBChiangRai]

Here is a 3,500 baht solution.  I doubt you'll ever have a scenario where this doesn't work for you, about 8 hours overnight will take you from 20% to 80% and it's 60% faster than the supplied granny charger. 8 amp, 10 amp, 13 amp and 16 amp selectable.

 

 

 

 

 

[Yodarapper]

3 hours ago, JBChiangRai said:

Here is a 3,500 baht solution.  I doubt you'll ever have a scenario where this doesn't work for you, about 8 hours overnight will take you from 20% to 80% and it's 60% faster than the supplied granny charger. 8 amp, 10 amp, 13 amp and 16 amp selectable.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Does this just plug into a normal socket or do I need to do anything else?

[JBChiangRai]

2 minutes ago, Yodarapper said:

 

Does this just plug into a normal socket or do I need to do anything else?

 

Just plug it into a normal socket, no need to do anything else.

 

Start off at 16 amps and if you have a problem (breaker trips or you feel something is getting too hot) knock it down to 13 amps.

 

I have one of these with a 10 metre cable we take with us if we're going to a motel or someone else's house. 

[Andrew Dwyer]

3 minutes ago, JBChiangRai said:

 

Just plug it into a normal socket, no need to do anything else.

 

Start off at 16 amps and if you have a problem (breaker trips or you feel something is getting too hot) knock it down to 13 amps.

 

I have one of these with a 10 metre cable we take with us if we're going to a motel or someone else's house. 

I bought one of these also, the granny charger that came with the BYD wouldn’t work on a socket without earth protection which was the case at the mil’s house.

So faster charging and overcame the “ no earth “ issue.