Dual Pricing in Thai Tourism: Economic Necessity or Hidden Bias?

[richard_smith237]

14 hours ago, Tomtomtom69 said:

No, they wouldn't. Thais pay more than Laotians when visiting tourist sites there and don't complain about that.

 

How would you know ???....      take a read on the Thai forums such as Panthip.com and you'll see just how much the Thai's complain about the very same things we 'foreigners' do..     the overlap of comments is quite astonishing and often highlights how closely aligned attitudes across cultures are.

Many Thai's on such forums are also quite outspoken about the 'dual pricing' against foreigners.

[richard_smith237]

9 hours ago, gaucan said:

I've got step by step guide on how to solve this for u:

step1) look at ur white privilege

step2) pay 

step3) stfu

ur welcome 🤗 

 

White privilege - such woke nonsense....      And, let’s not ignore the irony here: your sociophonetic quirks betray a profound inability to wield whatever privilege you think might have been handed to you. If you can’t even articulate your supposed advantage, how exactly are you planning to leverage it? It seems the only thing you’ve mastered is proving the point you’re so eager to dismiss.

[ikke1959]

2 hours ago, willip said:

No  back packers because of thai government greed. (Visas). I used to leave the country every month.  For visa runs.  I'd see alot of farrang every month.  Good day out!. Good for thai busses. Restaurants. Immigration. Long boats. All local people.  We used to stop at sarasin Bridge, the driver got out walked around the bus, dropped an envelope with 💰 in.  Then the border police would pick it up. We always found this amusing to watch. So blatant but a secret. The hotel couldn't get the right plates for the van to take it out of phuket. money was going into local peoples pockets!.

Then the government stopped the runs. The money had to go into the governments big pockets. 

What made this country was the people getting money. 

But now the super rich want it.

If you're one of these you don't have to worry about jail time. Also jobs for the family. 

I know it, I have a long term visa, but my statement is that everybody could make some money because of the border runs, but some one in the Government wanted to look important and stopped this, with a result that the people now earning less.. The Government officials have no brains only for their own pockets. And they try to pretend that the tourists, foreigners stay away, but they have no idea how much damage they have done to the country already years ago... and it continues

[richard_smith237]

14 hours ago, mikebike said:

23 hours ago, MalcolmB said:

Thais can not simply buy an air ticket and fly over to the west. We don’t let them.

What planet do you live on? Thais jump through the same, or more, hoops than we do to move to another country. The ones that have done it are working a lot harder to maintain their status than you ever will...

 

Many Thai's can travel to the UK at their convenience, obtaining a 10-year is straightforward - it was for my Wife, it was for many of my Thai friends, it was for many of the Thai wives of many friends.

 

MalcolmB's point primarily applies to less affluent Thais who'd struggle to afford the flight ticket in the first place.

A quick look at the phenomenon of "Phi-Noi" (Little Ghosts), shows the significant number of Thais working illegally in countries like South Korea and illustrates why nations with higher minimum wages adopt more cautious visa policies. This context is conveniently ignored by those such as MalcomB pushing a biased agenda.

 

 

[richard_smith237]

5 hours ago, pacovl46 said:

There's dual pricing in Thailand and it's not gonna go away. So people have two options, either take it for what it is or bitch and moan about it, but it's not gonna change no matter how much people keep complaining about it. What I don't get is why this subject keeps popping up in this forum. It's literally flogging a dead horse at this point!

 

For those willing to move beyond b!tching and moaning, there are constructive alternatives.....  such as engaging in a balanced and thoughtful discussion....  isn’t that the very purpose of a discussion forum ?

 

Take individuals like Richard Barrow, for example, along with others who have actively worked to improve conditions, making life more convenient for everyone. A notable improvement is the relaxation of the TM28 requirements, which many people voiced their concerns about and helped to bring about change.

[Noah K]

22 hours ago, Noah K said:

You don't charge foreigners more, you charge everyone the same price, and give locals a discount. I know it's the same thing, but it is an easier pill to swallow. Disney has been doing it for decades 

Show your Thai ID and receive a discount. I'm a retired foreign expat, and I have a Thai ID. See how easy this is? Why are they making it so difficult? Set a price for everyone, then offer a discount for locals. Every Thai I know has an ID card.

[Luuk Chaai]

On 12/6/2024 at 9:58 AM, Neeranam said:

When playing Royal Melbourne Golf Club with my Aussie friend(who lives in Thailand), I was charged 5,000 baht more. 

It is not discrimination, stop moaning.

Discrimination is when I(a white Thai) am not allowed the Thai price at a local golf course because of the colour of my skin, or when I am not allowed to buy a condo as they don't want farang there. 

Plenty of golf courses charge higher entrance fees to "NON" town/local residents)

[transam]

3 hours ago, PJ71 said:

hahahahhahahahahahhahahahahahahhahahahaahhahaha

 

day #2 of hilarity.

You must be still fretting over that elusive yellow book..............

[Hummin]

On 12/6/2024 at 8:47 AM, lordblackader said:

The problem with the article isn't that tourists are charged more; it's that people living and working in Thailand and paying taxes have to pay up to 900% more. Try charging a Thai living in a Western country who is paying income tax and who has the local equivalent of Social Security 900% more to enter a park - all hell would break loose, and you'd never hear the end of how racist and discriminatory it was. 

It happens all over the world, get over it. Especially remote places, locals have free entrance and parking, tourists pays the bill.

 

 

[MalcolmB]

13 hours ago, thesetat2013 said:

You are confused... the cost of anyone who does not go to the university in their own state is also charged this higher fee. Not only for international students. 

Yes, dual pricing.

[PJ71]

17 minutes ago, transam said:

You must be still fretting over that elusive yellow book..............

hahahhahahahahhahahaha

[richard_smith237]

19 minutes ago, Hummin said:

On 12/6/2024 at 8:47 AM, lordblackader said:

The problem with the article isn't that tourists are charged more; it's that people living and working in Thailand and paying taxes have to pay up to 900% more. Try charging a Thai living in a Western country who is paying income tax and who has the local equivalent of Social Security 900% more to enter a park - all hell would break loose, and you'd never hear the end of how racist and discriminatory it was. 

It happens all over the world, get over it. Especially remote places, locals have free entrance and parking, tourists pays the bill.

 

In contrast to the majority of Western nations, differential pricing is not typically determined by nationality but rather by residency status. Nationals of any country are eligible for resident rates when they can demonstrate their residency within the country.

 

Thus, the practice of dual pricing, as observed in Thailand, is not a global norm.

 

 

[Hummin]

3 minutes ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

In contrast to the majority of Western nations, differential pricing is not typically determined by nationality but rather by residency status. Nationals of any country are eligible for resident rates when they can demonstrate their residency within the country.

 

Thus, the practice of dual pricing, as observed in Thailand, is not a global norm.

 

 

I have to give right, but still, we talking about Thailand, and we knew before we choosed to become citizens here. Those western who work and live here permanently, do also useally make more money than Thais for same work? I do not say it is true for everyone, but it is for most. 

 

Anyway, in my experience, half of the places gives you local prices if you got the pink card. At least those places I have visited the last two years. 

[Evil Penevil]

Dual pricing is by no means unique to Thailand. It occurs in the U.S. and just about every other country with tourists.  The big difference between U.S. and Thai dual pricing is that in the U.S., it's based on local residency rather than nationality.  It's illegal in the U.S. to give discounts or other favorable treatment solely on the basis of race or nationality, but it's OK to give discounts based on residency.

It's a more common practice in the U.S. than many realize.  The neighborhood in which I lived in New York City was visited every day by thousands of tourists as well as tens of thousands of commuters who worked in the area.  Full-time local residents with apartments or rented rooms within in the area were given considerable discounts (10% at grocery stores, 20% or more at bars, restaurants, shops and services like hairdressing and dry cleaning).  Residents got a discount card from the management of the buildings where we lived.  That way the local businesses could charge "outsiders" higher prices while full-time locals paid less.

Here's another example from a road trip I took.  The Chesapeake Expressway is a stretch of highway of only 16 miles and I paid $8.00 to use it, over 10 times more than a local resident would pay.

Only residents of the state of Virginia with a Virginia driver's license are eligible for the discount member rate. The state cranks up the rate on weekends because thousands of tourists use the Chesapeake Expressway on their way to a major U.S. tourist destination, the Outer Banks in North Carolina.

 Non-U.S. citizens who live in Virginia can get the Expressway discount and the same applied to the "resident discount cards" in NYC neighborhoods.  It's a common practice everywhere in the U.S. with major tourist attractions.  When I was a child, my family lived close to a U.S. national park.  Local residences got free admission to the park.

I believe Thailand should give foreign residents who work and pay taxes in Thailand the same price as Thais, but I don't think it is a big problem and certainly not racism.

[Tomtomtom69]

5 hours ago, richard_smith237 said:

 

How would you know ???....      take a read on the Thai forums such as Panthip.com and you'll see just how much the Thai's complain about the very same things we 'foreigners' do..     the overlap of comments is quite astonishing and often highlights how closely aligned attitudes across cultures are.

Many Thai's on such forums are also quite outspoken about the 'dual pricing' against foreigners.

 

I know very well. Thais know they can't complain about things that happen in Laos (except on a forum once they get back home) but dual pricing at tourist attractions in Laos is not something they complain about when they're so cheap anyway. Even for foreigners, we're talking 5000 Kip (vs 2000 for locals) something like that, not a big deal. 

[Tomtomtom69]

4 hours ago, Noah K said:

Show your Thai ID and receive a discount. I'm a retired foreign expat, and I have a Thai ID. See how easy this is? Why are they making it so difficult? Set a price for everyone, then offer a discount for locals. Every Thai I know has an ID card.

You don't have a Thai ID if you're not a Thai citizen.

 

You may have some sort of identification issued by the Thai government such as a Thai driver's license or pink non-citizen ID, but neither of these prove Thai citizenship. Actually, the latter proves that you're not Thai. 

[VR333]

On 12/6/2024 at 9:58 AM, Neeranam said:

When playing Royal Melbourne Golf Club with my Aussie friend(who lives in Thailand), I was charged 5,000 baht more. 

It is not discrimination, stop moaning.

Discrimination is when I(a white Thai) am not allowed the Thai price at a local golf course because of the colour of my skin, or when I am not allowed to buy a condo as they don't want farang there. 

The Royal Melbourne Golf Club is an elite, private Members’ club. If you don't mind waiting ten years, the joining fee alone is nearly $20k AU, plus an annual sub of about $6K. As an Australian, If I'm from outside Victoria, I would be paying $500 for a guest round.  Guest fees are based on residency. 

 

As for Thailand, I  vote with my feet. I'm not paying x10 to visit some waterfall. Double, no problem but not ten times. Maybe if I were on my first trip overseas, it would be different, but I've traveled a lot, seen plenty of wonderful sights. When I spent a long time in the US, I liked the National Parks pass you could buy that let you into all of their many spectacular parks for one yearly fee. 

[Phillip9]

National parks in Thailand aren't worth visiting even if they were free.  The few nice ones are so crowded that they have been destroyed.

 

So just skip the parks and don't stress out about the extra fee.

[Tomtomtom69]

11 hours ago, mdr224 said:

If enough people refuse to pay a different price to the point where thailand was losing money, it would change. And i believe with the internet that this is possible

 

I agree to a certain extent, but keep in mind, that given countries like Singapore also practice dual pricing (though only in a very limited number of settings) it's hopeless to expect a much poorer country like Thailand to give up on it altogether.

 

The best we can hope for is that some private establishments end the practice, that public hospitals might eventually end it as well (or only apply it to tourists) and for most other dual pricing venues, there will be more regular "fee free" days, such as around the New Year, and residency based pricing at others. We can also hope that in future, rather than using racial profiling, ALL visitors to any dual pricing venue will be required to furnish proof of Thai citizenship, failure to do so means paying the foreigner price. This is exactly the way they do it in Malaysia, Taiwan and certain other countries - you show proof of local citizenship, else you pay the standard price (they don't call it a "foreigner price" there). 

 

The Grand Palace, being a site of national significance, is likely to continue charging only foreigners and extend free entry only to Thai nationals on a more or less permanent basis. I think as long as the foreigner entry fee is dropped down to like 100 or 200 Baht and they actively enforce the Thai fee free entry option by requiring anyone claiming to be Thai to prove it via way of their national ID card or passport or birth certificate (for young children) this is OK. 

Again, while I don't like dual pricing in any form, with Singapore and Taiwan (2 rich countries) imposing it, there's zero chance Thailand will completely eliminate it, regardless of the economic impact on Thailand you mentioned above. 

[Balance]

On 12/6/2024 at 8:47 AM, lordblackader said:

The problem with the article isn't that tourists are charged more; it's that people living and working in Thailand and paying taxes have to pay up to 900% more. Try charging a Thai living in a Western country who is paying income tax and who has the local equivalent of Social Security 900% more to enter a park - all hell would break loose, and you'd never hear the end of how racist and discriminatory it was. 

I think the motive for charging more is simply collecting more, and money from foreign tourists is low-hanging fruit. Westerners tend to want to know where the money is going—to more tea money, to needed projects, or to invest in projects to increase attendance, for example. When a museum in America wants to add more space to display new art, it advertises the project, gets media attention, and generally builds a Buy-In for people to donate. People with extra money who can afford to donate to a project can also be recognized.  Projects do not have to be big; improving or building new trails, building new restrooms, and renovation projects, for example.  

[lavender19]

They just can't help themselves. Any chance to rip the falang off

[pacovl46]

13 hours ago, mdr224 said:

If enough people refuse to pay a different price to the point where thailand was losing money, it would change. And i believe with the internet that this is possible

Theoretically yes. Practically, there’s too many people who don’t care about dual pricing and they pay whatever is asked for because it’s more important to them to have that experience than being stingy. After all they’re here on holiday and want to see stuff. 

[pacovl46]

8 hours ago, Noah K said:

Show your Thai ID and receive a discount. I'm a retired foreign expat, and I have a Thai ID. See how easy this is? Why are they making it so difficult? Set a price for everyone, then offer a discount for locals. Every Thai I know has an ID card.

Work permit is enough as well. I used that to get into Khao Yai for 80 Baht instead of the 400. 

[BangkokHank]

18 hours ago, gaucan said:

not everything centered around ur white tw4t ass, and certainly not thailand. 

 thais think its wrong to overcharge u ? tell me u r here first time without telling me u r here first time. But since im so nice and amazing I'll explain their actual thoughts : Oh, this Thai just trying to feed his family, so its ok to overcharge this stupid falang, they earn like 5k usd a month anyway so this is nothing to them. And most importantly u dont PAY TAXES HERE.

AND

its written in thai cuz most thais cant read ANY english duh, can u see further from ur nose?

 

u know nothing about thais and thailand and they dont give a <deleted> about u either, u r walking atm.

 

pack up and go vietnam and get drunk with other white trash there.

 

First of all, anyone reading your response, myself included, would conclude that you have serious mental issues. Help is available for people with your condition. You can ask about it on the health forum of this website.

 

I didn't say that Thais THINK it's wrong to overcharge people based on their race. I said that they KNOW that what they're doing is wrong - which I conclude from the fact that in this situation (and pretty much ONLY in this situation), they use Thai numerals for themselves and Arabic numerals for us - on the same sign. Why do you suppose that is? And do you really think that there is person in Thailand who can't read Arabic numerals? Tell me that you're here for the first time without telling me you're here for the first time.

 

And are you saying that ALL foreigners earn more than ALL Thais? There are a LOT of Thais who earn more than farangs earn. But the price people are charged at national parks is based on race rather than income. Of course Thais have the right to discriminate against foreigners with their policy of dual pricing. But we don't have to like it - and we don't have to go to places that discriminate based on race.

 

Also, the decision to charge foreigners more than Thais is made by the Thai government, and not by the Thai fellow who is trying to feed his family.

 

And how do you know that I don't pay taxes in Thailand?

 

Finally, I have lived in Thailand for 23 years, but right now I happen to be in Vietnam on vacation. But I don't drink alcohol. Anyway, how do you know that I'm White trash? I could be another color trash.

[Hummin]

30 minutes ago, pacovl46 said:

Theoretically yes. Practically, there’s too many people who don’t care about dual pricing and they pay whatever is asked for because it’s more important to them to have that experience than being stingy. After all they’re here on holiday and want to see stuff. 

I wish my country was more like Thailand when it comes to work permits, visas, dual pricing, and generally rights when it comes to become citizens. To easy to milk our system while we who are born in the country have no special beneficial rights superior to any other groups. 

 

Thailand do the right thing, protect their valuable land, and citizenship. No work permit, get legal visa for stay, and pay extra for what is considered national parks etc.

[GammaGlobulin]

I have never paid any dual pricing...during my many years in Thailand.

Not sure why.

 

[scottiejohn]

1 hour ago, GammaGlobulin said:

I have never paid any dual pricing...during my many years in Thailand.

Not sure why.

 

Because you never leave your home according to previous posts being the recluse that you claim to be even though you also claim to hang around the University area!

[GammaGlobulin]

11 minutes ago, scottiejohn said:

Because you never leave your home according to previous posts being the recluse that you claim to be even though you also claim to hang around the University area!

 

That must be it.

The uni never charges me extra to enter the campus.

Don't know why.

They should, maybe, in order to add to their meager income.

 

[scottiejohn]

6 minutes ago, GammaGlobulin said:

 

That must be it.

The uni never charges me extra to enter the campus.

Don't know why.

They should, maybe, in order to add to their meager income.

 

Another pointless response that does not address my post/the OP!

[Gknrd]

Used to go to the parks with my Chinese friend. He could not speak a word of Thai. Where I could speak some Thai.. They looked at me and charged me the foreign rate, looked at him and charged him the Thai rate. He used to tease me all the time about it.