what money is taxed 2024 ?

[Jingthing]

5 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

Re your 5 MB example, the tax advisor folks have been saying the same kind of thing about Thai property purchases.

 

If you move in 5 MB THB of otherwise non-exempted foreign funds in a year where you're a Thai tax resident (180+ days of presence in the calendar year), you're gonna be on the hook for Thai tax on that amount.

 

In the real estate example, their typical response/answer has been to say, leave Thailand so that you're NOT going to be present for 180+ days in that calendar year, then you can bring in all the foreign funds you want without Thai taxation.

 

Of course, that notion doesn't work so well if one is sick and/or hospitalized, and not likely to be relocating countries for 6+ months!!!

Agreed. If you did want to leave to avoid being a tax resident during the large medical expense that would only sometimes be possible based on the timing.

For example in the seventh month of a stay in Thailand you did the remittance, you would owe the next year regarless.

Some might be tempted to just leave Thailand altogether. So then it would be down to ENFORCEMENT. Would/could Thailand go after such people after they've left if they have nothing left in Thailand? I don't know. But one thing they COULD eventually do is to require tax clearances to leave. In which case in the medical crisis example, the survivor if they couldn't pay could end up in Thai prison for not paying.

Big fun!

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

20 minutes ago, JimGant said:

FATCA reports income, not remittances. You think FATCA was reworded to accomodate weirdo countries like Thailand and Malta, the only two countries that tax remittances, not income per se. Nope. FATCA only looks at income -- to include Thailand and Malta.

 Thanks Jim... that's a good point!

 

I probably should have used a CRS country instead of a FATCA country like the U.S. in that example. As I understand it, CRS countries like Thailand and various European ones also are/can be sharing data on a wide range of financial stuff, including foreign remittances and income, financial transactions, earnings, etc.

[JimGant]

4 hours ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

Rather than simply omitting any mention of those, since the online Thai tax forms for 2024 reportedly provide no ability to report TAX EXEMPT remittances, he's been saying that his firm plans to attach a document file with the online filing reporting the TAX EXEMPT remittances and the basis for them being tax exempt.

Carden's a friggin' snake oil salesman. He's the one, as you remember, advertised to US tax payers that, if you're here for over 180 days (i.e., a tax resident), you can cash-in your Traditional IRA tax free -- no US, no Thai taxes, because of how he interprets the wording of the DTA. Bonkers, really -- move to Thailand and cash in your tax deferred Traditional IRA tax free ....? Seemingly, however, he's gotten away with this scheme, as the IRS has bigger fish to fry. Not sure how he manages this now, with Por 161 in effect...

 

Anyway, keep Carden at arms length, and more.

[NoDisplayName]

1 hour ago, oldcpu said:

In regards to the quality of hospitals in different South East Asian countries. Singapore and Thailand have the best hospitals.

 

After that, in order of decreasing quality are Malaysia, Philippines,  and Vietnam. So if leaving Thailand,  but staying in South East Asia,  that may be a consideration.

 

 

I'd go to India for medical again.

Less expensive than Thailand, no concerns over tax on remittance for surgery, and the hospital food is awesome.

[NoDisplayName]

1 hour ago, Jingthing said:

Panama for example no taxation on non Panama income or assets.

 

Might as well move back to the US in that case, as Panama will soon be the 58th state.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

7 minutes ago, JimGant said:

Carden's a friggin' snake oil salesman. He's the one, as you remember, advertised to US tax payers that, if you're here for over 180 days (i.e., a tax resident), you can cash-in your Traditional IRA tax free -- no US, no Thai taxes, because of how he interprets the wording of the DTA. Bonkers, really -- move to Thailand and cash in your tax deferred Traditional IRA tax free ....? Seemingly, however, he's gotten away with this scheme, as the IRS has bigger fish to fry. Not sure how he manages this now, with Por 161 in effect...

 

Anyway, keep Carden at arms length, and more.

 

And yet, he's been one of the most visible and active expat Thai tax figures opining on all this stuff, appearing before the Pattaya Expats Club and in various other presentations/interviews.... He's providing information, but he's also heavily pitching his company's paid services to prospective clients.

 

[TheAppletons]

14 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 Thanks Jim... that's a good point!

 

I probably should have used a CRS country instead of a FATCA country like the U.S. in that example. As I understand it, CRS countries like Thailand and various European ones also are/can be sharing data on a wide range of financial stuff, including foreign remittances and income, financial transactions, earnings, etc.

 

  It's been posted before but CRS reports year end account balances (along with name, account number.)  That's it.

 

  It doesn't (in general) report individual transactions unless specifically requested or somehow otherwise flagged.

[JimGant]

4 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

And yet, he's been one of the most visible and active expat Thai tax figures opining on all this stuff,

Yeah, a real Elmer Gantry.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

8 minutes ago, TheAppletons said:

 

  It's been posted before but CRS reports year end account balances (along with name, account number.)  That's it.

 

  It doesn't (in general) report individual transactions unless specifically requested or somehow otherwise flagged.

 

What some of the expat tax consultants have been saying is that Thailand will have the ability to do an annual exchange of info with other CRS countries, and they've described that as potentially very far encompassing, going beyond just bank account stuff.  But I'm just repeating what they've been saying. CRS is not my personal area of knowledge.

 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

Another niggly detail I've been coming across is the whole area of tax exemption for LTR visa holders. I've seen it described here and elsewhere as a blanket exemption for bringing in foreign source income.

 

But now, both Siam Legal and another tax advisory firm have both been limiting that, advising that the tax exemption for LTR holders ONLY applies to remittance of foreign income earned from the PRIOR year... and not the current year, like if someone was transferring their salary every month as it was earned.

 

Example, per Siam Legal:

 

 

https://youtu.be/syQXa8gcVfE?t=1915

 

Meaning, the TRD seems to be interpretting the LTR exemption in the same, prior year way that they used to treat all foreign remittances, that they were tax-free as long as they were earned in the prior year (and not the current year).

 

 

[TheAppletons]

7 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

What some of the expat tax consultants have been saying is that Thailand will have the ability to do an annual exchange of info with other CRS countries, and they've described that as potentially very far encompassing, going beyond just bank account stuff.  But I'm just repeating what they've been saying. CRS is not my personal area of knowledge.

 

 

  From Eurobank's FAQs regarding CRS reporting:

 

 "The minimum information that financial institutions are obliged to report to the tax authorities regarding holders of a reportable account are:

Full name
Address
Tax identification number (TIN)
Tax residency
Account number
Balance or value of the account at the end of the relevant calendar year or other corresponding period
Any interest or other payments deposited into the account"

 

https://www.eurobank.gr/en/faqs-common-reporting-standard-crs#:~:text=Information included in the CRS&text=Tax identification number (TIN),year or other corresponding period

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

1 minute ago, TheAppletons said:

 

  From Eurobank's FAQs regarding CRS reporting:

 

 "The minimum information that financial institutions are obliged to report to the tax authorities regarding holders of a reportable account are:

Full name
Address
Tax identification number (TIN)
Tax residency
Account number
Balance or value of the account at the end of the relevant calendar year or other corresponding period
Any interest or other payments deposited into the account"

 

https://www.eurobank.gr/en/faqs-common-reporting-standard-crs#:~:text=Information included in the CRS&text=Tax identification number (TIN),year or other corresponding period

 

I'll note, your excerpt above opens with the terminology of those being the "minimum" that FIs are required to report...

 

I've been clipping the various tax advice opinions that the various local folks have been putting out. I'll try to go back and find the CRS-related post that I was recapping above... Of course, that doesn't mean that the advice/guidance they're giving is accurate/correct!

 

[JimGant]

4 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

But now, both Siam Legal and another tax advisory firm have both been limiting that, advising that the tax exemption for LTR holders ONLY applies to remittance of foreign income earned from the PRIOR year.

Read the LTR thread. I think you'll find that BOI -- the LTR visa folks -- have snuffed the notion that only prior year income is exempt from taxation. Their say on LTR visas, and the tax exemptions derived from, certainly should hold more sway than Siam Legal. Again, all these firms reaching out to hold your hand, and pocket book, re new tax regulations -- should be discounted accordingly.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

Interesting commentary from Siam Legal on the prospective legality of all this stuff TRD is putting forward, because it's largely based on regulatory statements not supported by underlying actual legislation. Sounds like Siam Legal is looking for a would-be client to challenge this whole new tax regime:

 

 

 

https://youtu.be/syQXa8gcVfE

 

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

3 minutes ago, JimGant said:

Read the LTR thread. I think you'll find that BOI -- the LTR visa folks -- have snuffed the notion that only prior year income is exempt from taxation. Their say on LTR visas, and the tax exemptions derived from, certainly should hold more sway than Siam Legal. Again, all these firms reaching out to hold your hand, and pocket book, re new tax regulations -- should be discounted accordingly.

 

 Of course, BOI has a vested interest in making THEIR product as appealing to buy as possible.

 

In the end, it's not what the BOI says, or what Siam Legal says, but what kind of tax regime the TRD puts forward and tries to enforce that will matter.

 

Like so many things on this whole topic, there are many entities putting out many different details and interpretations of how this or that aspect of things is going to/supposed to work. No wonder, so many of us are confused and unsure of where we stand.

 

 

[oldcpu]

42 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

Another niggly detail I've been coming across is the whole area of tax exemption for LTR visa holders. I've seen it described here and elsewhere as a blanket exemption for bringing in foreign source income.

 

But now, both Siam Legal and another tax advisory firm have both been limiting that, advising that the tax exemption for LTR holders ONLY applies to remittance of foreign income earned from the PRIOR year... and not the current year, like if someone was transferring their salary every month as it was earned.

 

Example, per Siam Legal:

 

 

https://youtu.be/syQXa8gcVfE?t=1915

 

Meaning, the TRD seems to be interpretting the LTR exemption in the same, prior year way that they used to treat all foreign remittances, that they were tax-free as long as they were earned in the prior year (and not the current year).

 

 

 

And a phone call to the Thai Revenue Department will remove that incorrect interpretation.  One of our forum members checked with the RD tax department. No tax on remitted forum income for LTR visa holders.  The Royal Decree is worded that way because when filing annual Thai tax returns one is always referring to the previous tax year.

 

However those tax advisory companies don't want to go the extra check to confirm their error (by contacting the Thai RD).  Why?  Because clarifying is not in their financial interest as they may lose a potential frightened LTR visa holder as a client, where the LTR visa holder (and the Tax Advisory companies) did not bother to check with the Thai RD help line (or read the Forum user's post who noted what the THAI REVENUE department confirmed)

 

(Edit - I refer specifically to LTR-WP, LTR-WGC, and LTR-WFTP visa holders)

 

Some seem to take a joy out of posting misinformation - without taking the time to check themselves.

.

 

[oldcpu]

26 minutes ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

 Of course, BOI has a vested interest in making THEIR product as appealing to buy as possible.

 

In the end, it's not what the BOI says, or what Siam Legal says, but what kind of tax regime the TRD puts forward and tries to enforce that will matter.

 

Absolutely and Thai RD confirmed. NO TAX on remitted foreign income for LTR visa holders.  NO CAVEATS in that confirmation by the Thai RD. (Edit - I refer specifically to LTR-WP, LTR-WGC, and LTR-WFTP visa holders)

 

That information has been posted a number of times already on this forum in different threads.

 

[1FinickyOne]

On 1/15/2025 at 12:03 PM, kimothai said:

These are already taxed in America.

What I read once, was that you might owe a tax on the difference between rates, if the Thai tax rate is higher...  as most, I have paid different tax rates on different income and then put them in the bank - long standing bank accounts - how would anyone know if I spent my capital gains from 1995 or my dividends from 2018? The money sent here was not likely from last years profits but from long held accounts that have been invested and reinvested through the years...