My Thai Tax Office Tax Filing Experience...

[WingNut]

Earlier this week, I visited my local district tax office to request filing a tax return for the 2024 tax year (Thai year 2567). I explained that I am a retired resident of Thailand and that I transferred some of my overseas income into my Thai bank account last year, which is the income I would like to report. However, the total amount I transferred in 2024 was below the minimum income threshold for tax liability, so no tax is due.

 

The tax officer informed me that filing a return is now required if you reside in Thailand for more than 180 days during the calendar year, even if no tax is owed. While I was already aware of this new requirement, her mention of it confirmed that the district office is up-to-date on the changes to personal income tax reporting for residents, which we all know began as of last year. She further explained that filing, even without any tax due, is also beneficial in case I am questioned in the future. Having a copy of my tax return will serve as evidence of compliance and help avoid possible penalties for failing to file in the future in case any questions arise. It would also help to avoid possible problems with visa extensions in case the Immigration Department ever starts requiring copies of tax return filings in the future to obtain a visa extension on the basis of retirement.

 

The first step was to cancel my old Thai tax ID number (which was issued about 15 years ago) and update it to match the Thai ID number on my new Thai pink ID card. This required filling out a form, submitting a few photocopies of passport, visa, and Thai pink ID card, and took about 20 minutes to complete. Next, she prepared my tax return for me based on the figure I provided to her for the amount I transferred into my Thai bank account in 2024. The officer recommended also submitting bank statements showing all of my incoming transfers for the calendar year. Although attaching the bank statements isn't compulsory, she said it could help avoid potential audits and save me time in the future. After finishing preparing the tax return, I then went to the bank to obtain the necessary statements for the months that I had incoming transfers. I now plan to return to the tax office to file the return, along with the newly obtained supporting bank statements.

 

Since the funds I transferred in are from overseas income that has already been taxed, I asked if I could claim the tax already paid if, for example, I exceed the tax-free threshold with additional transfers in 2025. She confirmed that I could, as long as I provide documentation from the overseas income source showing the income and the amount of tax already paid/withheld. She also directed me to the relevant section on the PND 90 personal income tax form, which I believe is page 4, section 11, line number 13 where one can enter in the amount of tax credits and/or tax withheld overseas to apply to one's Thai tax liability in Thailand. This would help reduce or potentially eliminate any Thai income tax liability on overseas income transferred into Thailand which has already been taxed overseas.

 

I'm still undecided about whether I'll transfer in more money this year than I did last year, which would then require me to include additional documentation for my overseas income source and taxes already paid if I do. I'll make a decision as the year progresses, but at least I now know they seem to honor the double taxation treaties. There's also a section on the tax form it seems (as noted above) where I can claim a credit for any taxes paid and withheld overseas. It's at least reassuring to know, if it comes to any of this, that I can potentially claim credit for any overseas income tax already paid.

[Sheryl]

Thank you for sharing this. However in your case it appears your remittances were assessable, even though no tax due.

 

For people like myself whose remittances are all  non-assessable , most reports from tax offices say not to file.  Which does not jibe with "must file if a tax resident". 

 

Further,  there is no way on the current tax forms to indicate non-assessable income. 

[WingNut]

19 minutes ago, Sheryl said:

Thank you for sharing this. However in your case it appears your remittances were assessable, even though no tax due.

 

For people like myself whose remittances are all  non-assessable , most reports from tax offices say not to file.  Which does not jibe with "must file if a tax resident". 

 

Further,  there is no way on the current tax forms to indicate non-assessable income. 

 

Thank you Sheryl. My income is not from a retirement income source or a pension, so I assume that is why my remittances are assessable. What types of income are generally non-assessable?

 

If it were me I would still try to file by telling the tax office that you want to file a tax return in order to have a record of reporting the income you remitted into Thailand in 2024, thus to avoid any penalties in the future for not filing.

 

It surprises me though that there is no way on the current tax forms to indicate non-assessable income. Although this all sounds tricky, there has to be some kind of solution for all of this as I assume many others will be facing the same issue.

[Moonlover]

24 minutes ago, Sheryl said:

Thank you for sharing this. However in your case it appears your remittances were assessable, even though no tax due.

 

For people like myself whose remittances are all  non-assessable , most reports from tax offices say not to file.  Which does not jibe with "must file if a tax resident". 

 

Further,  there is no way on the current tax forms to indicate non-assessable income. 

 

13 minutes ago, WingNut said:

 

Thank you Sheryl. My income is not from a retirement income source or a pension, so I assume that is why my remittances are assessable. What types of income are generally non-assessable?

 

If it were me I would still try to file by telling the tax office that you want to still file a tax return in order to have a record of reporting the income you remitted into Thailand in 2024, thus to avoid any penalties in the future for not filing.

 

It surprises me though that there is no way on the current tax forms to indicate non-assessable income. Although this all sounds tricky, there has to be some kind of solution for all of this as I assume many others will be facing the same issue.

Thank you sharing your experience @WingNut. I have a similar Dilemma as @Sheryl. In my case I have a mixed bag of assessable income of about 390K (pre taxed pensions) plus a non assessable UK government pension of 438K.  So my logic says they only need to know about the former, i.e. 390K.

 

It obviously does make sense to get oneself registered for the reasons that you stated Wingnut, but I'm still in a quandary about what I should actually declare. If, as Sheryl says there is no provision for non assessable income then obvious answer would seem to to be just enter the assessable income, 

 

And there was me thinking that 79 years old I could put all this crap behind me!

[Sheryl]

Yes, entering only assessaboe income seems the solution but for some of us that would mean a virtually blank return which is highly likely to result in being called in for questioning....in my case by a provincial RD hhst is beyond uninformed on matters expatriate. 

 

@WingNut foreign remittances of savings accrued before 2024 ard non-assessable.  Beyond that it depends on the terms of the  tax treaty between  Thailand and the tax resident's country of  nationality and these vary greatly. 

[chang50]

Disclaimer this is not tax advice just my recent experience.In my case I went to Jomtien to get a TIN and ended up unexpectedly filing a tax return as I had a yearly bank statement with me detailing all my remittances to Thailand which actually saved me a return trip and I ended up paying a very small amount of tax. I had remitted money to Thailand from my UK pensions one private which I had paid tax on in the UK and my old age pension.However they refused to even consider the Thai UK dta which I thought would have reduced my liability to zero giving me the impression it was better not to argue.They also dismissed one debit card purchase from a UK bank.I suspect just like immigration offices policies will vary from office to office or even between individual officers.I left with mixed emotions glad to have the experience over with but also feeling my case was possibly not properly dealt with.

[NoDisplayName]

2 hours ago, WingNut said:

The tax officer informed me that filing a return is now required if you reside in Thailand for more than 180 days during the calendar year, even if no tax is owed.

 

This appears to be incorrect, unless she was directing the statement solely to your situation.  That's just part of the rule, which includes a couple of "ands", like "and" must remit assessable income, "and" the assessable remittances must exceed 60/120K baht.  (There may be a threshold for reporting Thai sourced income as well.  I dunno.)

 

2 hours ago, WingNut said:

She also directed me to the relevant section on the PND 90 personal income tax form, which I believe is page 4, section 11, line number 13 where one can enter in the amount of tax credits and/or tax withheld overseas to apply to one's Thai tax liability in Thailand.

 

This is also questionable, as that entry seems to pertain only to particular Thai tax credits, those being for tax paid/withheld as reported on PN93 and PN94, and the withholding tax for Thai-sourced interest/dividends reported in section 1 of the PN90. 

 

I've seen nothing in writing that foreign tax credits can be entered there.  I can't see it being used when filing online, as the calculations in section 11 are automated by the system.

 

It might be a necessary workaround for TRD offices to manually manipulate the entries, as no other method of taking foreign tax credits has been found.

 

**OPINION ONLY, NOT ADVICE.  NOT AN EXPERT**

[NoDisplayName]

19 minutes ago, Sheryl said:

Yes, entering only assessaboe income seems the solution but for some of us that would mean a virtually blank return which is highly likely to result in being called in for questioning....in my case by a provincial RD hhst is beyond uninformed on matters expatriate. 

 

Null returns should be commonplace for many expats remitting only non-assessable funds.

 

I've submitted three in Bangkok (two in person, one online), and four recently (Korat) online.  No remittances declared.  Only income was Thai interest and dividends, all withholding tax refunded.

 

None of the TRD officials was interested in non-assessable income, and told me no need to file unless wanting a refund.  I've had a couple of messages through the online system, the first last July asking for passport and bank withholding statement, and the latest a couple weeks ago requesting marriage certificate (joint filing) and bank withholding statement.

[Moonlover]

24 minutes ago, Sheryl said:

Yes, entering only assessaboe income seems the solution but for some of us that would mean a virtually blank return which is highly likely to result in being called in for questioning....in my case by a provincial RD hhst is beyond uninformed on matters expatriate. 

 

@WingNut foreign remittances of savings accrued before 2024 ard non-assessable.  Beyond that it depends on the terms of the  tax treaty between  Thailand and the tax resident's country of  nationality and these vary greatly. 

I don't you think you actually have a problem Sheryl. Did you watch the video I posted on Tuesday? In it the MD of Tax Talk was asked whether those whose remitted assessable income was below the tax threshold need to file a tax return. He stated, quite clearly that they did not And a senior legal officer from TRD did not contradict him! (View the video from about 28 minutes if you don't care to watch it all)

 

So I guess from that and @NoDisplayName' comment above, you've no need to sweat about it.

 

 

[NoDisplayName]

3 hours ago, WingNut said:

can enter in the amount of tax credits and/or tax withheld overseas to apply to one's Thai tax liability in Thailand

 

3 hours ago, WingNut said:

I now plan to return to the tax office to file the return,

 

It appears that you have remitted ASSESSABLE income, subject to taxation in Thailand.  Technically, you do need to file if over the 60/120K threshold, even if no tax due. 

 

Not same-same as @Sheryl, as her remittances are non-assessable.

 

This is the second report of a TRD officer saying to use section 11, line 13 to claim a foreign tax credit.  The other claimant doesn't even have a TIN so nothing submitted there.

 

You also have not yet submitted a return claiming a foreign tax credit, and will NOT claim a tax credit as you have no tax due.  If/when you do file, please return with a report as to whether your return included a foreign tax credit. 

 

And are you sure your pension is assessable?  You'd have to read your DTA to find out.  The solution, as has been the case for decades, is to only declare assessable remittances on your return.  Taxation is an honour system, and the taxpayer self-determines what income is assessable.  Thus no provision on the tax forms to deduct non-assessable income.

 

**OPINION ONLY, NOT ADVICE.  NOT AN EXPERT**

[biervoormij]

When you did all this for the filing what language did you communicate with. My Thai would not be up to the level required and I doubt my local RD office will have the English level either.

 

The money I remit to Thailand is not from income but from savings but have no idea if they will accept my foreign bank account totals as proof.  I don't plan to attempt to file for 2024 but may attempt to file next year for 2025 because I will be remitting a lot more than the 100K baht that I did in 2024.

 

 

[Sheryl]

2 hours ago, NoDisplayName said:

 

Null returns should be commonplace for many expats remitting only non-assessable funds.

 

I've submitted three in Bangkok (two in person, one online), and four recently (Korat) online.  No remittances declared.  Only income was Thai interest and dividends, all withholding tax refunded.

 

None of the TRD officials was interested in non-assessable income, and told me no need to file unless wanting a refund.  I've had a couple of messages through the online system, the first last July asking for passport and bank withholding statement, and the latest a couple weeks ago requesting marriage certificate (joint filing) and bank withholding statement.

Situation with my provincial tax office (a province with almost no foreign retirees) could not be more different. 

 

2 years in a row  I filed returns with just interest income . It was disaster. RD had never seen such a   thing, never heard of a retired foreign person living in Thailand and refused to believe it was even possible: I must, according to them, be working here.  Interrogation went on for several unpleasant days. After which I stopped trying to get interest witholding back. 

 

 

[WingNut]

Thank you, everyone, for your feedback. Sorry for my lengthy reply to follow, but I’ll do my best to address all your questions in one go and then share a few additional thoughts I’ve gathered after reading everything you’ve all written. Of course, anything I decide to do with my tax situation is based on my own circumstances and is not necessarily the right approach for others, so none of this is intended to be advice, just sharing my ideas.

 

Now that I understand there’s no specific section on the tax form to claim taxes already paid on overseas-earned income (such as using section 11, line 13 to claim a foreign tax credit), I’ve now decided to avoid transferring any money this year that exceeds the tax-exempt threshold. Instead, I’ll transfer in only the maximum tax-free amount, as I did last year, and reassess the situation moving forward. I wouldn’t want to find myself in a situation next year where I unexpectedly owe a bunch of taxes on money I transferred in this year. Hopefully, by 2026, there will be clearer guidelines on how to claim foreign taxes already paid under double taxation treaties and then maybe I will bring in more again in the future.

 

I now have a better understanding of what qualifies as non-accessible income. Since my income is not from a pension, it is entirely accessible. Additionally, while savings accumulated from prior years may be considered non-accessible and not subject to tax in Thailand, I wouldn’t personally attempt to claim money brought in as past savings to avoid taxation. That seems like a gray area I’d rather not try to navigate with the possibility of the claim being outright rejected, even with proper bank documentation, so I’ll avoid doing that going forward as well.

 

It seems risky though not to file a tax return at all, especially for the next few years, even if all of one’s income is considered non-accessible. If I were in that situation, I’d still attempt to report a certain amount of it as accessible income if at all possible, keeping it below the taxable threshold, but in order to at least demonstrate compliance with filing and avoid drawing unnecessary attention otherwise.

 

I’ve heard of people who exclusively use overseas debit cards and carry only cash in and out of the country, never using local banks or transfers. However, I don’t think that’s a viable long-term strategy either. Making inward transfers and declaring some income seems like the best approach, as otherwise, one might risk being questioned about how they sustain themselves in Thailand without any reported income at all, no local bank balances, and no inward transfers. Of course, there are legitimate reasons for handling finances this way that are not illegal, but I believe it’s a conversation best avoided by simply following expected standards, transferring some money in, and filing a tax return. That’s just my perspective and the approach I would take in that situation but again, everyone’s situation is different.

 

As for the bank statements the tax officer suggested I submit, my bank only provides monthly statements, not annual consolidated ones. Initially, I only requested statements from the bank for the months with incoming transfers, assuming that would be sufficient. However, I later realized that submitting only selected months might raise questions later about whether I’m withholding information about incoming transfers from the other months not submitted. To avoid any suspicion, I’ll request the remaining statements from my bank and then submit all 12 months of statements as supporting documents when I file my tax return.

 

I also decided not to request a tax refund for the interest withheld on my bank interest earnings in Thailand from last year. Given the small amount I’d receive, I believe it’s best not to draw any unnecessary attention in that area. In my opinion, the effort isn’t worth the potential scrutiny and diminishing returns.

 

Regarding the language I used when speaking at the tax office, I conducted all discussions in Thai, as I’m fortunate to be proficient enough to do so. To be honest, I’m not sure how far I would’ve gotten though if I had been attempting to discuss these matters with them in English.

[NoDisplayName]

8 minutes ago, WingNut said:

It seems risky though not to file a tax return at all, especially for the next few years, even if all of one’s income is considered non-accessible. If I were in that situation, I’d still attempt to report a certain amount of it as accessible income if at all possible, keeping it below the taxable threshold, but in order to at least demonstrate compliance with filing and avoid drawing unnecessary attention otherwise.

 

Yes, but now you're planning to intentionally file an incorrect return.  What happens if your return is chosen at random for audit?  How do you answer why you only declared enough of your remittances to be under the taxable limit?

 

That would send up the red smart flags, indicate tax evasion, and would potentially trigger a 5-year audit.

 

11 minutes ago, WingNut said:

I wouldn’t personally attempt to claim money brought in as past savings to avoid taxation. That seems like a gray area I’d rather not try to navigate with the possibility of the claim being outright rejected, even with the proper bank documentation, so I’ll avoid doing that going forward as well.

 

This fortunately is one of the few areas that has been clearly defined.  Savings prior to Jan 01,2024 is non-assessable.  There are questions as to how that would be interpreted in relation to brokerage accounts, but if you have an actual savings account with a balance shown on a Dec 2023 statement, you're golden.

 

**OPINION ONLY, NOT ADVICE.  NOT AN EXPERT**

[NoDisplayName]

41 minutes ago, Sheryl said:

Situation with my provincial tax office (a province with almost no foreign retirees) could not be more different. 

 

2 years in a row  I filed returns with just interest income . It was disaster. RD had never seen such a   thing, never heard of a retired foreign person living in Thailand and refused to believe it was even possible: I must, according to them, be working here.  Interrogation went on for several unpleasant days. After which I stopped trying to get interest witholding back.

 

Have you tried to file online?

 

Get your bank withholding statement, take a photo, crop the JPEG.  Upload when you file.  Refund letter you take to Krung Thai (unless your bank lets you link pink ID to your account for PromptPay) should arrive in a couple weeks.

 

If you read Thai, filing should take you ten minutes.  Twenty if you have to cut-n-paste into google translate.