Problems with submitting Tax Return

[ericbj]

Early March I visited the local Tax Office to request a TIN.  Some difficulty communicating as no one spoke more than a few words of English; although this was resolved to some extent by their translation software.  However I was told that as I had neither employment in Thailand nor a business here I do not need to pay income tax.  And therefore do not require a TIN.

I replied that as a retired person on a long-stay visa who remits cash from abroad to my Thai bank account as and when needed, my understanding is that I must declare the total remitted since it is substantially in excess of 60K baht.  I showed my bank account passbook to prove the transfers made over the past year.

Much time passed without my request for a TIN being granted, before finally being asked to return another day.

 

On Thursday 13 March, I secured the assistance of a Thai friend who is a professional interpreter to accompany me to town on a second visit to the Tax Office.  This time it was possible to prevail upon them to issue me with a TIN.  They also gave me a Personal Income Tax Form #91 to complete.
As this was in Thai it was incomprehensible to me, but I managed to obtain an English language version from the Tax Office web-site.

Although not difficult to complete (once one understands what is required after careful study of the downloaded documentation) it took me several days of study and more than one fudged attempt before the Form was successfully filled in.

 

Upon filling in the details -- total remittances less (195K + 60K) baht -- I realised that my taxable income was well within the tax-free band of up to 150K.  So decided to claim back 2.6K baht of withholding tax on interest received on term-deposits.  For this I would need to submit, together with my Form #91 and its Exemptions Appendix, a Withholding Tax Certificate issued by the Bank.

Unfortunately, I was told by the Bank that they do not issue such certificates; that one must complete them oneself by visiting a web-site whose URL they provided:  https://www.rd.go.th
And this despite the Tax Office's documentation stating
"The payer is also required to issue you with a withholding tax certificate similar to this form below:
[image of form]
"If the payer refused to issue a withholding certificate, the payer is subject to a criminal penalty."
I have no idea whom the web-site belongs to, nor what it concerns, as it is in Thai.  But it does not appear to belong to my Bank.

 

Today, 31 March, I visited the Tax Office in town, once again accompanied by my Thai friend, with Income Tax Form + Exemptions Appendix + my bank book with the deposit account entries.

They refused to accept the papers submitted saying that I am not eligible to pay tax because I am not employed in Thailand and have no business here.  And they added that as a foreigner I am not entitled to claim reimbursement of Withholding Tax.

Of course I have nothing in writing to prove that the forms were submitted but rejected.  Nor of the grounds for rejection.

 

Maybe I should try an online submission as there are still a few days left for that.
(I have been discouraged from attempting doing it on-line by the difficulty experienced in the past when completing French Revenue Declarations on-line, as opposed to the paper version)

[rattlesnake]

17 minutes ago, ericbj said:

However I was told that as I had neither employment in Thailand nor a business here I do not need to pay income tax.

 

It's pretty clear, isn't it? The Thai authorities are telling you to drop it and keep your money.

 

Of course, if you keep insisting on paying, eventually you will find someone who will be willing to take your money from you, but why do such a thing?

[NoDisplayName]

36 minutes ago, ericbj said:

Unfortunately, I was told by the Bank that they do not issue such certificates;

 

Of course they do.  (which bank?)

At Bangkok Bank and Krungsri, simply take your passbook(s) to the teller for the certificate.  Takes 5 minutes to prepare.

 

Are your remittances taxable here?  If not assessable, you don't declare them.  Check your DTA to confirm.

 

Just go online, make an account, fill in your personal information, then fill in your PD 91 with bank tax info.  Upload a photo of the bank certificate.  Whole process takes 15 minutes at most.  The online system will do the computations for you and will fill out the exemptions page as well.

 

The online form is in Thai only.  Other posters use chrome to translate.  I cut 'n paste into google translate.  Ah, you have a Thai friend who can help. 

 

https://efiling.rd.go.th/rd-efiling-web/login

 

As long as you're going to the trouble, if you were a tax resident in prior years, you can do late returns for 2022 and 2023 and get refunds if you provide bank certificates (also available from your bank free of charge).  Will cost you one 200-baht late filing fee.

 

If you're coming up on the deadline and don't have the bank letter, go ahead and e-file.  It will be accepted, but you'll get a text message in a week or so requesting the paper.  You can upload later, at a different webpage.

 

https://efiling.rd.go.th/rd-efiling-web/authen/MTA2

[anrcaccount]

Much more trouble than it’s worth, for a mere 2600 THB.

 

Stop, think and you’ll know what to do next. 
 

 

 

 

[topt]

3 hours ago, anrcaccount said:

Stop, think and you’ll know what to do next. 

He was lucky they didn't just charge him 5k baht like some other's have mentioned......

[Felton Jarvis]

9 hours ago, ericbj said:

Early March I visited the local Tax Office to request a TIN.  Some difficulty communicating as no one spoke more than a few words of English; although this was resolved to some extent by their translation software.  However I was told that as I had neither employment in Thailand nor a business here I do not need to pay income tax.  And therefore do not require a TIN.

I replied that as a retired person on a long-stay visa who remits cash from abroad to my Thai bank account as and when needed, my understanding is that I must declare the total remitted since it is substantially in excess of 60K baht.  I showed my bank account passbook to prove the transfers made over the past year.

Much time passed without my request for a TIN being granted, before finally being asked to return another day.

 

On Thursday 13 March, I secured the assistance of a Thai friend who is a professional interpreter to accompany me to town on a second visit to the Tax Office.  This time it was possible to prevail upon them to issue me with a TIN.  They also gave me a Personal Income Tax Form #91 to complete.
As this was in Thai it was incomprehensible to me, but I managed to obtain an English language version from the Tax Office web-site.

Although not difficult to complete (once one understands what is required after careful study of the downloaded documentation) it took me several days of study and more than one fudged attempt before the Form was successfully filled in.

 

Upon filling in the details -- total remittances less (195K + 60K) baht -- I realised that my taxable income was well within the tax-free band of up to 150K.  So decided to claim back 2.6K baht of withholding tax on interest received on term-deposits.  For this I would need to submit, together with my Form #91 and its Exemptions Appendix, a Withholding Tax Certificate issued by the Bank.

Unfortunately, I was told by the Bank that they do not issue such certificates; that one must complete them oneself by visiting a web-site whose URL they provided:  https://www.rd.go.th
And this despite the Tax Office's documentation stating
"The payer is also required to issue you with a withholding tax certificate similar to this form below:
[image of form]
"If the payer refused to issue a withholding certificate, the payer is subject to a criminal penalty."
I have no idea whom the web-site belongs to, nor what it concerns, as it is in Thai.  But it does not appear to belong to my Bank.

 

Today, 31 March, I visited the Tax Office in town, once again accompanied by my Thai friend, with Income Tax Form + Exemptions Appendix + my bank book with the deposit account entries.

They refused to accept the papers submitted saying that I am not eligible to pay tax because I am not employed in Thailand and have no business here.  And they added that as a foreigner I am not entitled to claim reimbursement of Withholding Tax.

Of course I have nothing in writing to prove that the forms were submitted but rejected.  Nor of the grounds for rejection.

 

Maybe I should try an online submission as there are still a few days left for that.
(I have been discouraged from attempting doing it on-line by the difficulty experienced in the past when completing French Revenue Declarations on-line, as opposed to the paper version)

Meanwhile, a "concierge service" in Bangkok is posting scare messages about 200 thousand baht fines and jail time if you fail to file or get a tax identification number.  I am very interested in staying out of jail and not incurring fines that I am unable to pay. Any advice??

[samtam]

9 hours ago, NoDisplayName said:

 

Of course they do.  (which bank?)

At Bangkok Bank and Krungsri, simply take your passbook(s) to the teller for the certificate.  Takes 5 minutes to prepare.

 

Are your remittances taxable here?  If not assessable, you don't declare them.  Check your DTA to confirm.

 

Just go online, make an account, fill in your personal information, then fill in your PD 91 with bank tax info.  Upload a photo of the bank certificate.  Whole process takes 15 minutes at most.  The online system will do the computations for you and will fill out the exemptions page as well.

 

The online form is in Thai only.  Other posters use chrome to translate.  I cut 'n paste into google translate.  Ah, you have a Thai friend who can help. 

 

https://efiling.rd.go.th/rd-efiling-web/login

 

As long as you're going to the trouble, if you were a tax resident in prior years, you can do late returns for 2022 and 2023 and get refunds if you provide bank certificates (also available from your bank free of charge).  Will cost you one 200-baht late filing fee.

 

If you're coming up on the deadline and don't have the bank letter, go ahead and e-file.  It will be accepted, but you'll get a text message in a week or so requesting the paper.  You can upload later, at a different webpage.

 

https://efiling.rd.go.th/rd-efiling-web/authen/MTA2

 

I e-filed yesterday, or rather my Thai assistant did. I had the copy of the bank certificate to upload for WHT, but apparently it couldn't be accepted. The status page showed receipt of the filing, and that if documents were required, they could be uploaded then, (later). It was of course all in Thai, so I could read whether there was a facility to upload the bank's certified tax certificate.

[ericbj]

9 hours ago, NoDisplayName said:

 

Of course they do.  (which bank?)

At Bangkok Bank and Krungsri, simply take your passbook(s) to the teller for the certificate.  Takes 5 minutes to prepare.

 

Are your remittances taxable here?  If not assessable, you don't declare them.  Check your DTA to confirm.

 

Just go online, make an account, fill in your personal information, then fill in your PD 91 with bank tax info.  Upload a photo of the bank certificate.  Whole process takes 15 minutes at most.  The online system will do the computations for you and will fill out the exemptions page as well.

 

The online form is in Thai only.  Other posters use chrome to translate.  I cut 'n paste into google translate.  Ah, you have a Thai friend who can help. 

 

https://efiling.rd.go.th/rd-efiling-web/login

 

As long as you're going to the trouble, if you were a tax resident in prior years, you can do late returns for 2022 and 2023 and get refunds if you provide bank certificates (also available from your bank free of charge).  Will cost you one 200-baht late filing fee.

 

If you're coming up on the deadline and don't have the bank letter, go ahead and e-file.  It will be accepted, but you'll get a text message in a week or so requesting the paper.  You can upload later, at a different webpage.

 

https://efiling.rd.go.th/rd-efiling-web/authen/MTA2

 

Many thanks for that info.  Shall endeavour to act on it.

 

Did take the bankbook to the bank and we spoke with both a cashier and the bank branch manager. Latter is a friend of my Thai friend, both born and educated in Thailand of Burmese (Karen) parents.

Unfortunately my friend is frequently very occupied with work and other activities, and also sometimes away, so can only call upon her from time to time.

[topt]

1 hour ago, Felton Jarvis said:

Meanwhile, a "concierge service" in Bangkok is posting scare messages about 200 thousand baht fines and jail time if you fail to file or get a tax identification number.  I am very interested in staying out of jail and not incurring fines that I am unable to pay. Any advice??

As long as you are not deliberately avoiding paying taxes that are due I believe the official fine is a whole 2000baht......it has been referenced on here in the past. To-date no-one has reported hearing anyone being fined - Thai or foreigner. 

 

Considering how many people have already said their tax office refused to give them a no. it seems like a pure scare tactic to try and drum up business.  If you actually owe a reasonable amount then of course you should be filing.........

 

So up to you what you should do.........

 

[Moonlover]

11 hours ago, rattlesnake said:

11 hours ago, ericbj said:

However I was told that as I had neither employment in Thailand nor a business here I do not need to pay income tax.

 

 

11 hours ago, rattlesnake said:

 

It's pretty clear, isn't it? The Thai authorities are telling you to drop it and keep your money.

 

Of course, if you keep insisting on paying, eventually you will find someone who will be willing to take your money from you, but why do such a thing?

 

'Life is really simple but we insist on making complicated'.

 

                                                                                     Confucius

 

(I wonder if he ever had to pay taxes)

[Ben Zioner]

11 hours ago, ericbj said:

Early March I visited the local Tax Office to request a TIN.  Some difficulty communicating as no one spoke more than a few words of English; although this was resolved to some extent by their translation software.  However I was told that as I had neither employment in Thailand nor a business here I do not need to pay income tax.  And therefore do not require a TIN.

I replied that as a retired person on a long-stay visa who remits cash from abroad to my Thai bank account as and when needed, my understanding is that I must declare the total remitted since it is substantially in excess of 60K baht.  I showed my bank account passbook to prove the transfers made over the past year.

Much time passed without my request for a TIN being granted, before finally being asked to return another day.

 

On Thursday 13 March, I secured the assistance of a Thai friend who is a professional interpreter to accompany me to town on a second visit to the Tax Office.  This time it was possible to prevail upon them to issue me with a TIN.  They also gave me a Personal Income Tax Form #91 to complete.
As this was in Thai it was incomprehensible to me, but I managed to obtain an English language version from the Tax Office web-site.

Although not difficult to complete (once one understands what is required after careful study of the downloaded documentation) it took me several days of study and more than one fudged attempt before the Form was successfully filled in.

 

Upon filling in the details -- total remittances less (195K + 60K) baht -- I realised that my taxable income was well within the tax-free band of up to 150K.  So decided to claim back 2.6K baht of withholding tax on interest received on term-deposits.  For this I would need to submit, together with my Form #91 and its Exemptions Appendix, a Withholding Tax Certificate issued by the Bank.

Unfortunately, I was told by the Bank that they do not issue such certificates; that one must complete them oneself by visiting a web-site whose URL they provided:  https://www.rd.go.th
And this despite the Tax Office's documentation stating
"The payer is also required to issue you with a withholding tax certificate similar to this form below:
[image of form]
"If the payer refused to issue a withholding certificate, the payer is subject to a criminal penalty."
I have no idea whom the web-site belongs to, nor what it concerns, as it is in Thai.  But it does not appear to belong to my Bank.

 

Today, 31 March, I visited the Tax Office in town, once again accompanied by my Thai friend, with Income Tax Form + Exemptions Appendix + my bank book with the deposit account entries.

They refused to accept the papers submitted saying that I am not eligible to pay tax because I am not employed in Thailand and have no business here.  And they added that as a foreigner I am not entitled to claim reimbursement of Withholding Tax.

Of course I have nothing in writing to prove that the forms were submitted but rejected.  Nor of the grounds for rejection.

 

Maybe I should try an online submission as there are still a few days left for that.
(I have been discouraged from attempting doing it on-line by the difficulty experienced in the past when completing French Revenue Declarations on-line, as opposed to the paper version)

Honestly, I'd say go home and on the way stop at 7/11 to 3 or 4 of those large Heinecken cans, enjoy your evening (mispelled it evenong).

[robz]

Next time: google: thailand personal income calculator

Thai tax system is easy. Problem is that the PND90 is in thai.

If you don't want to submit alone, use a tax-submitting service (about 15k Baht).

[CMBob]

12 hours ago, ericbj said:

Unfortunately, I was told by the Bank that they do not issue such certificates; that one must complete them oneself by visiting a web-site whose URL they provided:  https://www.rd.go.th

I have had zero issue in obtaining interest withholding statements from both Siam Commercial Bank and Bangkok Bank.  And they are used to providing these documents (i.e., I've done this a few times before and there's never any confusion or questioning as to what I am requesting).   Just tell them what you want and for what years and typically the forms are provided in 5-10 minutes.

I've filed returns for both 2566 and 2567 and received back checks refunding the 15% withheld from bank interest.  No problem.  

 

[digger70]

Problems with submitting Tax Return

 

No Tax File Number , Not filing a tax form .

On a Pension .If they want Tax  they have to come and Ask for it or wait a few years till they know what they are doing and when they've sorted out all the problems.   😇

[Kinok Farang]

Most ex-pats have spent a lifetime trying to avoid paying as little tax as possible on their hard earned cash.

Wait until they pursue your dosh.If ever.

[Bubbha]

17 hours ago, ericbj said:

Maybe I should try an online submission as there are still a few days left for that.

It's very easy to do. Figure out to use your internet browser to translate every page to English.

[treetops]

17 hours ago, Felton Jarvis said:

Meanwhile, a "concierge service" in Bangkok is posting scare messages about 200 thousand baht fines and jail time if you fail to file or get a tax identification number.  I am very interested in staying out of jail and not incurring fines that I am unable to pay. Any advice??

 

Don't believe what a "tax pimp" puts on the internet in an attempt to separate the gullible from their money.

[Andycoops]

18 hours ago, robz said:

Next time: google: thailand personal income calculator

Thai tax system is easy. Problem is that the PND90 is in thai.

If you don't want to submit alone, use a tax-submitting service (about 15k Baht).

You can download the English version off the TRD website, as I did.

A simple process.

[Somrak]

I did ASK the RD ones and they told that peoples from my country, CH, do not have to pay taxes. 😉

I know that This IS wrong. But i will Sure Not Go ASK again.

[PomPolo]

I had a problem submitting my tax return also, given my new filing system discussed with another poster the other day it was filed in the trash can.

[robz]

3 hours ago, Andycoops said:

You can download the English version off the TRD website, as I did.

A simple process.

 

Okay, seems to be new. Around 10 years ago, when I started paying taxes, I believe it was only in Thai. Since then, I’ve had a CPA handle it and I just check the figures.