China tells airlines to suspend Boeing jet deliveries

[Gweiloman]

13 hours ago, thesetat said:

Do you realize that most Chinese people earn less than 1000 USD per month to live on? That is the average salary for a full time job. Some make even less. Any price increases will surely hurt them quite a lot. Especially to the average person struggling to pay their bills and save a little money. 

When I worked there, I was making more than 3 times the salary than the other local teachers. 

 

I sure as hell hope you weren’t teaching them economics or accounting. Taking a figure of USD1,000/mth means absolutely nothing by itself. In econs (and in real life too actually), there is something known as “cost of living”. In simple layman terms, if things in country A costs half as much as in country B, then a worker in country A will enjoy the same standard of living as a worker in country B even earning half the salary.

 

 I hope this is clear for you…

[Gweiloman]

8 hours ago, thesetat said:

It could also backfire on China if the US finds other places to export what the US needs basically making the need to trade with China minimal if non-existent. There are lots of countries that will see this as an opportunity not only to produce and export more to the US but also it may bring more allies that teeter between US and China alliance. Take for example greenland decides to begin exporting some of the rare earth minerals that they have such a surplus with even more than china has. 

Surely you mean to say “ if the US finds other places to export import what the US needs”. What were you teaching the Chinese kids in China?

 

The problem for the US is that there is no alternative for them. China dominates manufacturing at an affordable price. Shutting down trade with China is going to be catastrophic for America’s economy. Xi knows that, the whole world knows that, except for those idiots in the States.

 

 

 

[Gweiloman]

7 hours ago, josephbloggs said:

So that's two deflections now. 

No attempt at answering a simple question. Why is that?

That’s what he does when he realises he has lost the argument. Don’t be surprised if he him responds with a “you lose”.

[thesetat]

42 minutes ago, Gweiloman said:

I sure as hell hope you weren’t teaching them economics or accounting. Taking a figure of USD1,000/mth means absolutely nothing by itself. In econs (and in real life too actually), there is something known as “cost of living”. In simple layman terms, if things in country A costs half as much as in country B, then a worker in country A will enjoy the same standard of living as a worker in country B even earning half the salary.

 

 I hope this is clear for you…

It is clear you know little about Chinese economics

[wadman]

59 minutes ago, Gweiloman said:

I sure as hell hope you weren’t teaching them economics or accounting. Taking a figure of USD1,000/mth means absolutely nothing by itself. In econs (and in real life too actually), there is something known as “cost of living”. In simple layman terms, if things in country A costs half as much as in country B, then a worker in country A will enjoy the same standard of living as a worker in country B even earning half the salary.

 

 I hope this is clear for you…

 

"thesetat" has absolutely no clue what he is talking about. He thinks that the tariff war will make prices rise in China for those earning 1000 USD or less there. 

 

I am currently in China (leaving for Indonesia later today), and I can tell you for a fact that even before the tariff war, prices of manufactured goods had been going DOWN. Partially because factories get more efficient at making things, but the bigger reason is that everybody buys their stuff online now. And if you think shopping on Temu, Alibaba was cheap (before Trump cancelled the de minimis), wait until you see how low prices are in China. 

 

Cost of labor has been about steady. So going out for a meal, say, isn't getting cheaper, as that directly involves labor in the restaurant. Mind you, even the restaurants are getting more efficient (cutting costs). You no longer have a waiter taking your order. Instead you scan a QR code with your phone, up pops the menu, and you order from there, and pay through the app too. So a lot of labor saved there. 

 

1. In terms of direct buying: the 1000 USD earner in China won't be directly buying a lot of goods imported from the US, as he simply can't afford it.

 

2. In terms of indirectly buying: China used to buy soybeans from the US. The far majority of this was in the form of animal feed, to feed their pigs as the Chinese do love their pork. But there are plenty of alternatives to US soybeans, China can buy it from Brazil, Russia, etc. China can also buy rapeseed meal from India instead, to feed their pigs.

 

So the 1000 USD worker does buy pork, but it won't be going up in price due to the tariff war.  Quite on the contrary, the tariff war does cause economic pain for China, so people have less money overall. Less money = less demand = prices go down. That may sound good for the consumer, but remember that they have less money, so overall it is still economic pain.

[BangkokReady]

8 hours ago, josephbloggs said:

So that's two deflections now. 

No attempt at answering a simple question. Why is that?

 

The topic is the tariff/trade war between America and China.  My comment was about the effects of the tariffs of America and China on their economies.  Why would it be weird or deflective to suggest that you need to think about the American tariffs when asking about the Chinese tariffs?

 

As I said, use your brain a little.

[Lacessit]

1 hour ago, Cryingdick said:

Good luck getting them certified., It's not just Boeing it is also  Airbus.. Hard time to build planes that won't  fly to the majority of the world.

 

China has 48,000 km of high speed rail, with more under construction. 70,000 km planned by 2030.

 

High speed trains can have between 500 and 1600 passengers.

 

It doesn't need as many aircraft as America does.

[BangkokReady]

46 minutes ago, Gweiloman said:

That’s what he does when he realises he has lost the argument. Don’t be surprised if he him responds with a “you lose”.

 

You were unable to explain or provide evidence for anything you claimed.  You have no idea how to interact with people and made no effort to do so.  You just said to ask AI.

 

That's basic.

 

You lost.

[Gweiloman]

1 hour ago, thesetat said:

It is clear you know little about Chinese economics

Why don’t you enlighten us then? Unless you know little about anything?

 

I recently returned from a 2 week holiday in China over Christmas and New Year. I couldn’t believe how cheap most things were, from 5 star hotel accommodation to excellent food to transportation by Didi or high speed rail. A fraction of the cost compared to my last trips to Europe and Japan.

[GammaGlobulin]

7 hours ago, RayC said:

 

What is this common situation which the EU and US share? How should the EU react in the light of the US's imposition of tariffs and anti-European rhetoric and actions? What is this shortsightedness on the European part. What price will we pay?

 

Questions. Questions.

 

The Biggest Question of all is how to solve the China Problem.

Or, is it already too late?

 

[Gweiloman]

Just now, GammaGlobulin said:

 

The Biggest Question of all is how to solve the China Problem.

Or, is it already too late?

 

What is the China Problem? And who has this problem?

[thesetat]

7 minutes ago, Gweiloman said:

Why don’t you enlighten us then? Unless you know little about anything?

 

I recently returned from a 2 week holiday in China over Christmas and New Year. I couldn’t believe how cheap most things were, from 5 star hotel accommodation to excellent food to transportation by Didi or high speed rail. A fraction of the cost compared to my last trips to Europe and Japan.

You can not base your knowledge as a tourist. It may be a fraction of the cost as a foreigner travelling.  I lived there 5 years. Paid rent and electric.. Minimum spending without drinks and women or other pleasantries cost me over 6000 CNY a month.  That does not include food or clothing.  My friends who still live there are now paying even more. His average monthly bill is over 7000 RMB.. Without travel or fun. 

[GammaGlobulin]

3 hours ago, Lacessit said:

How is Trump going to stop Airbus from selling its aircraft to China? You think the French will listen to him?

 

All Trump needs to do is to threaten AirBus Europe with raising Tariffs to 500-percent, for EU aircraft, unless they cooperate in ceasing all dealings with China, and China Gov.

This is no laughing matter.

 

[wadman]

1 minute ago, thesetat said:

You can not base your knowledge as a tourist. It may be a fraction of the cost as a foreigner travelling.  I lived there 5 years. Paid rent and electric.. Minimum spending without drinks and women or other pleasantries cost me over 6000 CNY a month.  That does not include food or clothing.  My friends who still live there are now paying even more. His average monthly bill is over 7000 RMB.. Without travel or fun. 

 

That's because you lived like a laowai (foreigner) with laowai tastes and standards. Locals live significantly cheaper. In Shenzhen city, a typical starting wage in a restaurant is around 5000 rmb (=682 USD), people live just fine on this. Find shared accommodations for 700-1400 rmb per month, phone bill 59 rmb, eat cheap meals, buy very cheap consumer goods online.

 

As an actual, real world example: I am paying 79 rmb (= 10.78 USD) per month for my mobile phone account + wired high speed internet. That's about 1 McDonald's meal in America.

[wadman]

11 minutes ago, GammaGlobulin said:

 

The Biggest Question of all is how to solve the China Problem.

Or, is it already too late?

 

 

10 minutes ago, Gweiloman said:

What is the China Problem? And who has this problem?

 

IMO, the China problem is that the Chinese (or any other non-white country) may not overtake America in terms of living standards (individually) or power (as a country).

 

[GammaGlobulin]

10 minutes ago, thesetat said:

You can not base your knowledge as a tourist. It may be a fraction of the cost as a foreigner travelling.  I lived there 5 years. Paid rent and electric.. Minimum spending without drinks and women or other pleasantries cost me over 6000 CNY a month.  That does not include food or clothing.  My friends who still live there are now paying even more. His average monthly bill is over 7000 RMB.. Without travel or fun. 

 

The Chinese are leaving in droves.

Many want to get out, but it is not easy.

They do not like the China Schools with the enforced study of XiJingPing Thought, and all the wasted time this involves.

The Chinese education system has become torture for many young students.

And, much of what they are learning is pointless.

And, when they graduate, these days....few jobs.

It's a nightmare there, but many on this forum, TV, still want to go there.

TV must have turned COMPLETELY RED while I was not looking.

But, why are so many members on TV so rabidly supportive of China?

Are they communists, or something?

 

 

[GammaGlobulin]

3 minutes ago, wadman said:

 

 

IMO, the China problem is that the Chinese (or any other non-white country) may not overtake America in terms of living standards (individually) or power (as a country).

 

 

But, UK is no longer white.

And, the USA will soon bee non-white.

So then...problem solved?

 

[wadman]

1 minute ago, GammaGlobulin said:

 

But, UK is no longer white.

And, the USA will soon bee non-white.

So then...problem solved?

 

 

Still a whole lot whiter than China.

[thesetat]

8 minutes ago, wadman said:

 

That's because you lived like a laowai (foreigner) with laowai tastes and standards. Locals live significantly cheaper. In Shenzhen city, a typical starting wage in a restaurant is around 5000 rmb (=682 USD), people live just fine on this. Find shared accommodations for 700-1400 rmb per month, phone bill 59 rmb, eat cheap meals, buy very cheap consumer goods online.

 

As an actual, real world example: I am paying 79 rmb (= 10.78 USD) per month for my mobile phone account + wired high speed internet. That's about 1 McDonald's meal in America.

You speculate a lot for someone who 1, do not know me or how I live. 2, do not know much about China and speculate based on your tourist visit. 3. Know nothing about the working people in China. 

 

 

[thesetat]

7 minutes ago, GammaGlobulin said:

 

The Chinese are leaving in droves.

Many want to get out, but it is not easy.

They do not like the China Schools with the enforced study of XiJingPing Thought, and all the wasted time this involves.

The Chinese education system has become torture for many young students.

And, much of what they are learning is pointless.

And, when they graduate, these days....few jobs.

It's a nightmare there, but many on this forum, TV, still want to go there.

TV must have turned COMPLETELY RED while I was not looking.

But, why are so many members on TV so rabidly supportive of China?

Are they communists, or something?

 

 

They say ignorance is bliss. That would probably be your answer. 

Most people only see what the news shows them and forget that any news coming from inside China is changed to show them in a good way. Completely altering the real facts. I lived there 5 years and know how hard it is to live for the Chinese. Even as a married couple, both have to work 2 full time jobs to pay bills and have money to save for their kids. Or one job that requires them there for 12 to 14 hours. 

 

For a foreigner visiting, they see the good side, Pretty malls with people happily walking around. But the underside not seen by tourists is a hard life already. As you said, kids study 12 hours a day and when they complete their schooling it is very difficult to find work. China is actively trying to stop people from leaving China. My friend who is a teacher there says China took all the Chinese teachers passports for fear they will not return. He has tried several times to get it back but to no avail. 

[placeholder]

3 minutes ago, GammaGlobulin said:

 

But, UK is no longer white.

And, the USA will soon bee non-white.

So then...problem solved?

 

False

 

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_the_United_Kingdom

 

USA population broken down by race:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_the_United_States

[GammaGlobulin]

12 minutes ago, wadman said:

 

Still a whole lot whiter than China.

 

For now.

 

[wadman]

2 minutes ago, thesetat said:

You speculate a lot for someone who 1, do not know me or how I live. 2, do not know much about China and speculate based on your tourist visit. 3. Know nothing about the working people in China. 

 

 

 

1. You are saying you and your friends are living on 6000 - 7000 rmb a month, without any "extras". I'm telling you that locals can easily live cheaper than that. I have given you some actual, current pricing in cost of living items. 

 

2. I can guarantee that I know a whole more about China than you. I have been kicking around in China for the past 22 years. 

 

3. Again, I can guarantee that I know more about the working people in China than you. Having worked with them, dealt with them, done business with them.

 

Based on your claims, it seems you have taught a few years in China, and think you know everything about it. Do you even speak and read/write Chinese? It's true what they say: it's not the know nothings that are dangerous, it's the ones with a little bit of knowledge but think they know a lot.

[GammaGlobulin]

2 minutes ago, placeholder said:

False

 

Do you always take EVERYTHING you read so very literally?

Run Spot Run.

After the third grade, readers begin to read in a more nuanced way.

We learn about things like understatement, hyperbole, satire, irony, and other means of expression that can deliver the message that might not be possible in a totally literal way.

I wonder if some here might have a problem understanding irony.

 

[GammaGlobulin]

3 minutes ago, wadman said:

Do you even speak and read/write Chinese?

 

Yes.

Of course.

OBVIOUSLY.

And, for many, many years, too.

 

[wadman]

3 minutes ago, GammaGlobulin said:

 

For now.

 

 

I don't foresee a mass migration of white people into China now or in the future. Do you? So America and the UK will be whiter than China for a very, very long time.

[Lacessit]

25 minutes ago, GammaGlobulin said:

 

All Trump needs to do is to threaten AirBus Europe with raising Tariffs to 500-percent, for EU aircraft, unless they cooperate in ceasing all dealings with China, and China Gov.

This is no laughing matter.

 

Europe is already telling Trump to go sit on a pineapple, rough end up.

 

The French have been on America's case ever since Servan-Schreiber published his book "The American Challenge" back in 1967.

 

They think of America as barbarians with no culture. Given Trump's antics, it's difficult to disagree with them.

 

 

[GammaGlobulin]

1 minute ago, wadman said:

mass migration of white people into China now or in the future

 

Impossible.

No white person would want to live there, under XI.

But, if XI and the other commie bandits were put 6-feet-under...

Then, there would be tons of white people who would move there.

 

[GammaGlobulin]

1 minute ago, Lacessit said:

Europe is already telling Trump to go sit on a pineapple, rough end up.

 

The French have been on America's case ever since Servan-Schreiber published his book "The American Challenge" back in 1967.

 

They think of America as barbarians with no culture. Given Trump's antics, it's difficult to disagree with them.

 

 

 

Speaking of pineapples, they are no longer produced in America, Hawaii.

I think they have been outsourced to Beijing, or some place.

The French are the barbarians, these days, particularly the Parisians.

 

 

[Gweiloman]

40 minutes ago, thesetat said:

You can not base your knowledge as a tourist. It may be a fraction of the cost as a foreigner travelling.  I lived there 5 years. Paid rent and electric.. Minimum spending without drinks and women or other pleasantries cost me over 6000 CNY a month.  That does not include food or clothing.  My friends who still live there are now paying even more. His average monthly bill is over 7000 RMB.. Without travel or fun. 

Some expats live here in Thailand on 20,000 baht a month. Some spend that on just electricity alone. How much it costs you bear very little relevance. Were you living in a first tier city? Do you eat local or western food? Do you own a car or take the subway?

 

 I went as a tourist but stayed some time in a friend’s apartment in Chongsan. He lives in Melbourne but couldn’t tell me how his utilities bill (water, electricity, internet) costs him as the amount is too insignificant.

 

What I do know is that good high quality Chinese food such as roast quail, Peking Duck, fresh fish, oysters etc costs less than it does in Chiang Mai and Bangkok.