Will there ever be a safe vaccine?

[simon43]

8 minutes ago, Stiddle Mump said:

Dear me Simon. Thought better of you. Because you don't want to discuss, you revert to silly-billy one-liners.

 

Off to the joke section with you.

There is nothing to discuss.  I'm a scientist, trained for 7 years in critical thinking and the Scientific Method.  Granted, although I teach all streams of science to my young students, I'm not a medical doctor.  But I understand enough about virology and the immune system to know when someone is talking total bolox 🙂

[newbee2022]

2 hours ago, Stiddle Mump said:

No joking Sir. Just pointing out that most of what the white-coats tell us about disease is completely wrong. My explanations are much closer to the truth

 

Nature has the answers we seek. And the answers are free for all to enjoy good health. Just have to open yer mind.

 

 

Open your mind? That would be wonderful. Can you?🤓🤓🤓

[gamb00ler]

1 hour ago, BeastOfBodmin said:

since even the vaccine prompts an immune response, and then of course the body is supposed to produce and store memories of antibodies to the vaccine.

Proteins from deactivated virus particles are the actual component of most vaccines that prompts the human immune system to produce antibodies.  They often use those viral remains because they contain the exact proteins needed to 'educate' the immune system to recognize when the live virus enters the body.

 

Most vaccines do not create a mild infection.  They only stimulate an immune system response to the presence of foreign proteins and the likelihood of an actual infection is very low.  When people experience the immune response to the vaccine they often misinterpret it to be an infection.

[newbee2022]

2 hours ago, Lacessit said:

Another post of sheer BS from the OP and a quack with no qualifications. FFS, he's a chiropractor.

 

Go to Afghanistan or Pakistan, and get natural exposure to polio, or Laos for malaria.

 

See how you naturally manage then.

Thank you. I was afraid already to be in a mad house blog.

Good, that I'm retired. I don't know what I would do with such idio*** patients.

[bubblegum]

Not according to you. Obviously

[rumak]

1 hour ago, xylophone said:

There are some good posters on AN and a few other nutters apart from those in the categories mentioned above, and IMO the website has certainly gone downhill since the early days of ThaiVisa some 20 years ago.

 

I feel exactly the same as you do ..... except the people that you think are nutters I believe, from my reading and from personal observation , are the ones that post the most credible sources and intelligent comments.

The "other side"  almost 100% choose bias media sites to copy and paste.   Most of the covid narrative is now believed by many , even some here,  that at first were dead set on throwing alternative thinkers into concentration camps,  to be misleading or downright false .

Of course,  since you have no intention of reading the hundreds of sources given here that do not fit your thinking...... the question must be asked " why are you crazy enough to keep clicking on these threads ? )

[Dcheech]

Dr. Kevin Stillwagon, a chiropractor for more than 40 years and a pilot for more than 3 decades who left his career as a pilot due to mask mandates ...

A chiropractor?!!       Why is it always Chiropractors? 

[save the frogs]

12 hours ago, Stiddle Mump said:

Yes! I'm more than challenging it; I'm putting forward a credible alternative.

 

Well, I tried homeopathy for a cat allergy once and it worked.

 

Based on similar principle to vaccine. Contains a dose of poison to stimulate the immune system. 

 

 

[rattlesnake]

4 hours ago, transam said:

"The Bible"..................🤣

 

Which one........?   🤣

 

Ask Newton… or Louis Pasteur.

 

 

[Hummin]

1 hour ago, simon43 said:

There is nothing to discuss.  I'm a scientist, trained for 7 years in critical thinking and the Scientific Method.  Granted, although I teach all streams of science to my young students, I'm not a medical doctor.  But I understand enough about virology and the immune system to know when someone is talking total bolox 🙂

and here is the problem. People trust guys who claim they know better than the scientists who actually work within the very specific problems. 
 

And of course believe these scientists trying kill people instead of helping them. 

[rattlesnake]

1 hour ago, simon43 said:

I'm a scientist, trained for 7 years in critical thinking

 

How many Covid shots did your 'critical thinking' lead you to take?

[Lacessit]

36 minutes ago, rumak said:

 

I feel exactly the same as you do ..... except the people that you think are nutters I believe, from my reading and from personal observation , are the ones that post the most credible sources and intelligent comments.

The "other side"  almost 100% choose bias media sites to copy and paste.   Most of the covid narrative is now believed by many , even some here,  that at first were dead set on throwing alternative thinkers into concentration camps,  to be misleading or downright false .

Of course,  since you have no intention of reading the hundreds of sources given here that do not fit your thinking...... the question must be asked " why are you crazy enough to keep clicking on these threads ? )

Can you explain why unvaccinated COVID patients are 6-7 times more likely to need admission to an ICU?

 

What are your own scientific qualifications?

 

The most prestigious scientific journals are Nature, Science, Cell, NEJM and The Lancet. The only time what could be described as an anti-vax article was published in one was The Lancet, retracted in 2010 after Andrew Wakefield was found to have falsified data to support his claims of vaccines causing autism. He was struck off the medical register.

 

These hundreds of sources - which are peer-reviewed, have evidence-based research, and have a scientific consensus?

[simon43]

12 minutes ago, rattlesnake said:

 

How many Covid shots did your 'critical thinking' lead you to take?

Since I am older and have compromised lungs, I was happy to have 2 covid shots while I was living in Laos during the covid period. These shots helped my immune system to 'recognise' the Covid virus (all viruses have a different and recognisable shape/structure).  I am fully aware that a vaccination does not stop one becoming infected with the virus, but that the symptoms of that virus should be greatly diminished, compared to those who have not been vaccinated.

 

Indeed, after relocating back to Thailand, I did get Covid, (according to the 7/11 test kits).  I had a mild fever for only 1 day and then recovered and subsequently tested negative.  I'm grateful that I had been vaccinated in Laos.

[Red Phoenix]

6 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

Can you explain why unvaccinated COVID patients are 6-7 times more likely to need admission to an ICU?

 

Your statement is based on US data from a published mid 2022.  We are 3 years later now. 

The jab campaign started December 2020, and so the study is based on data from the first 1.5 years of the scamdemic, when hospitals did all kind of dirty tricks to boost Covid-vaccine uptake.  

[transam]

Just now, Red Phoenix said:

 

Your statement is based on US data from a published mid 2022.  We are 3 years later now. 

The jab campaign started December 2020, and so the study is based on data from the first 1.5 years of the scamdemic, when hospitals did all kind of dirty tricks to boost Covid-vaccine uptake.  

Are you the bloke that tries to brainwash others with all that kinda cr@p, or are you one of those who fell for it, hook, line and sinker............?  

[rattlesnake]

13 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

Can you explain why unvaccinated COVID patients are 6-7 times more likely to need admission to an ICU?

 

What are your own scientific qualifications?

 

The most prestigious scientific journals are Nature, Science, Cell, NEJM and The Lancet. The only time what could be described as an anti-vax article was published in one was The Lancet, retracted in 2010 after Andrew Wakefield was found to have falsified data to support his claims of vaccines causing autism. He was struck off the medical register.

 

These hundreds of sources - which are peer-reviewed, have evidence-based research, and have a scientific consensus?

 

Is that the same Lancet which published a fake paper in order to eliminate HCQ and allow the Emergency Use Authorisation of the mRNA shots?

 

 

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/jun/04/covid-19-lancet-retracts-paper-that-halted-hydroxychloroquine-trials

[rattlesnake]

23 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

The most prestigious scientific journals are Nature, Science, Cell, NEJM and The Lancet. The only time what could be described as an anti-vax article was published in one was The Lancet, retracted in 2010 after Andrew Wakefield was found to have falsified data to support his claims of vaccines causing autism. He was struck off the medical register.

 

This should be of interest to you:

 

After decades of aggressively promoting vaccines of all kinds, Dr. Stanley Plotkin, the world's leading vaccinologist, is finally coming clean about the fact that vaccine safety has never been robustly studied as he has long claimed.

 

A paper he co-authored that was published in The New England Journal of Medicine (NEJM) on July 6, 2024, reveals that no vaccine has ever been properly studied either before or after their release.

 

https://www.naturalnews.com/2024-07-18-pro-jab-apologist-admits-no-vaccine-safety.html

[Lacessit]

5 minutes ago, Red Phoenix said:

 

Your statement is based on US data from a published mid 2022.  We are 3 years later now. 

The jab campaign started December 2020, and so the study is based on data from the first 1.5 years of the scamdemic, when hospitals did all kind of dirty tricks to boost Covid-vaccine uptake.  

Actually, my statement is based on Australian data. How strange two countries should report the same statistic, but according to you it is all part of a global conspiracy.

 

Hospitals were under tremendous strain because COVID patients were crowding out accident victims in the ICU's. The last thing they needed was anti-vaxxers.

 

Please explain why people who reject public health measures should be given priority in treatment. IMO they should be at the back of the queue.

 

 

[rattlesnake]

19 minutes ago, simon43 said:

Since I am older and have compromised lungs, I was happy to have 2 covid shots while I was living in Laos during the covid period. These shots helped my immune system to 'recognise' the Covid virus (all viruses have a different and recognisable shape/structure).  I am fully aware that a vaccination does not stop one becoming infected with the virus, but that the symptoms of that virus should be greatly diminished, compared to those who have not been vaccinated.

 

Indeed, after relocating back to Thailand, I did get Covid, (according to the 7/11 test kits).  I had a mild fever for only 1 day and then recovered and subsequently tested negative.  I'm grateful that I had been vaccinated in Laos.

 

Scientific data is increasingly indicating that the Covid shots actually impair the immune system. This should be of interest to you:

 

A new study titled, Post-vaccination IgG4 and IgG2 class switch associates with increased risk of SARS-CoV-2 infections, marks the seventh study to show an increased risk of infection after mRNA injection while also revealing the likely underlying mechanism behind this phenomenon

[…]

These findings suggest a potential association between IgG4 induction by mRNA vaccination and a higher risk of breakthrough infection, warranting further investigation into vaccination strategies to ensure sustained protection.

 

https://www.thefocalpoints.com/p/breaking-study-covid-19-mrna-injections

[DezLez]

12 minutes ago, rattlesnake said:

A paper he co-authored that was published in The New England Journal of Medicine (NEJM) on July 6, 2024, reveals that no vaccine has ever been properly studied either before or after their release.

 

https://www.naturalnews.com/2024-07-18-pro-jab-apologist-admits-no-vaccine-safety.html

Please show a specific quote from your link where Dr. Stanley Plotkin, is claimed to have specifically made that statement.

[rattlesnake]

4 minutes ago, DezLez said:

Please show a specific quote from your link where Dr. Stanley Plotkin, is claimed to have made that statement.

 

“… prelicensure clinical trials have limited sample sizes [and] follow-up durations” and that “there are not resources earmarked for postauthorization safety studies.”

[DezLez]

Just now, rattlesnake said:

 

“… prelicensure clinical trials have limited sample sizes [and] follow-up durations” and that “there are not resources earmarked for postauthorization safety studies.”

Where his his name directly linked to that statement. Please proved the full link!

[DezLez]

7 minutes ago, rattlesnake said:

 

Scientific data is increasingly indicating that the Covid shots actually impair the immune system. This should be of interest to you:

 

A new study titled, Post-vaccination IgG4 and IgG2 class switch associates with increased risk of SARS-CoV-2 infections, marks the seventh study to show an increased risk of infection after mRNA injection while also revealing the likely underlying mechanism behind this phenomenon

[…]

These findings suggest a potential association between IgG4 induction by mRNA vaccination and a higher risk of breakthrough infection, warranting further investigation into vaccination strategies to ensure sustained protection.

 

https://www.thefocalpoints.com/p/breaking-study-covid-19-mrna-injections

Nothing specific, just maybes above!

eg;

 

"warranting further investigation"  by whom?
"These findings suggest a potential association"  with what: 
"likely underlying mechanism" or maybe not"
 

[rattlesnake]

1 minute ago, DezLez said:

Where his his name directly linked to that statement. Please proved the full link!

 

The link is in the article I posted, but here you go. You need to create a free NEJM account to access the full paper:

 

https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMp2402379

[Red Phoenix]

7 minutes ago, Lacessit said:

Actually, my statement is based on Australian data. How strange two countries should report the same statistic, but according to you it is all part of a global conspiracy.

 

Hospitals were under tremendous strain because COVID patients were crowding out accident victims in the ICU's. The last thing they needed was anti-vaxxers.

 

Please explain why people who reject public health measures should be given priority in treatment. IMO they should be at the back of the queue.

The Australian figures of much higher ICU for the non-vaccinated were based on two reports, one issued based on data from September 2021 and one from January 2022.  

Covid-jabbing started in Australia mid/end February 2021.  

So the data were collected during the 1st year of the scamdemic, and we are 3.5 years later now.  

And yes, also in Australia Public Health and hospitals did all kind of dirty tricks to boost Covid-vaccine uptake.  

[rattlesnake]

8 minutes ago, DezLez said:

Nothing specific, just maybes above!

eg;

 

"warranting further investigation"  by whom?
"These findings suggest a potential association"  with what: 
"likely underlying mechanism" or maybe not"
 

 

The critical thinkers who actually apply the scientific method understand the implications… and those who are trapped in a turmoil of ego-driven denial purposely don't.

[DezLez]

15 minutes ago, rattlesnake said:

 

The critical thinkers who actually apply the scientific method understand the implications… and those who are trapped in a turmoil of ego-driven denial purposely don't.

So you agree that the piece, like everything else you tin foil brigade post is all conjecture and not based on proven facts!

[DezLez]

42 minutes ago, rattlesnake said:

 

The link is in the article I posted, but here you go. You need to create a free NEJM account to access the full paper:

 

https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMp2402379

So if this is such a world breaking news item why can you not provide a free link.

Until you do your whole post is meaningless at if it were true it would be posted on numerous trustworthy outlets.

AI cannot find them!

type this into ai;

"latest vaccine statements by  "Dr. Stanley Plotkin,""

[Lacessit]

18 minutes ago, Red Phoenix said:

The Australian figures of much higher ICU for the non-vaccinated were based on two reports, one issued based on data from September 2021 and one from January 2022.  

Covid-jabbing started in Australia mid/end February 2021.  

So the data were collected during the 1st year of the scamdemic, and we are 3.5 years later now.  

And yes, also in Australia Public Health and hospitals did all kind of dirty tricks to boost Covid-vaccine uptake.  

You keep clinging to the later later narrative like some kind of talisman.

 

Of course there are less COVID cases now. Even in the ignorant USA, vaccine uptake rates are 70%. 95% in Australia.

 

Plus the attenuation of the COVID variants, delta was the most harmful.

 

Public Health in Australia had 963 deaths per million population. In the USA. the death rate was 3493 per million.

 

So the hospitals would have been better off having more patients with no vaccines?

 

That logic just demonstrates how <deleted> in the head you are.

[rattlesnake]

18 minutes ago, DezLez said:

So you agree that the piece, like everything else you tin foil brigade post is all conjecture and not based on proven facts!

 

Same conjecture and scientific qualifications as the ones you religiously follow when they say what you want to hear.